Ekim_Trub Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 THE SABLE HAWKS CHAPTER NAME: ..............SABLE HAWKS.FOUNDING: .................. THIRD. CHAPTER WORLD: .............NONE, FLEET BASED. FORTRESS MONASTERY/FLAGSHIP: ........THE HUNTER OF SHADOWS. GENE-SEED (PREDECESSOR): ... RAVEN GUARD. KNOWN DESCENDANTS: .........NONE. "Attack, re-deploy, then attack again." The plan is to have the Chapter stem from the remnants of an Assault Company that formed the core of one of the Nomad-Predation Fleets that Corax exiled before the Dropsite Massacre at Isstvan V, and here's the rough plan for how I envision it. However, I am struggling to get it beyond being a list of ideas and formed into something resembling an IA. The fleet began to use the name 'Sable Hawks' to distinguish themselves from the old XIXth Legion & from the Raven Guard from which they were exiled. (General feeling amongst the fleet after the Battle for Gate 42 was that Horus saw the XIXth as nothing more than a disposable tool to further the glory of his own Legion, whereas Corax viewed them as nothing more than a constant reminder of his traumatic past.) They drew the name from an ancient Terran myth that spoke of ominous "Black Hawks" that would descend upon the enemies of the old Tyrants to deliver their wrath. These mythological creatures were said to bring with them the Tyrants most elite warriors, highly trained hunters from which escape was almost impossible.(This ties into the XIXth's role prior to the great Crusade as the Emperor's hidden hand of vengeance, tasked with hunting down those who would rather flee than bend the knee.) The fleet was formed from the remnants of an Assault Company noted for their use of gunships to launch lightning assaults upon the enemy. Although originally made up entirely of Terrans, battlefield losses had seen about 40% of their number replaced with Deliverance-born Legionnaires.Reason for exile: Corax saw them as a reminder of the regime he had overthrown, due to their wholesale slaughter of the enemy and their refusal to accept any surrender once hostilities had began as well as their casual disregard for the lives of civilians on the battlefield. When the news of Horus' betrayal reached the fleet, it was brought by to them through a chance encounter with a Mechanicum fleet when they were forced to seek refuge in the Kasio System from warp storms. The Mechanicum Priests had declared for Horus and sought to turn the fleet to the Warmasters cause, however, they had no intention of being involved in any war between a Father & his Son(s).This was until they heard the details of the massacre at Isstvan V. Hearing how their brothers had been deceived, butchered then hunted like animals by those they had once called friend & ally enraged the fleet. Rage soon became action, and the Sable Hawks attacked the Mechanicum fleet without warning, leading to a swift and decisive capture of their ships. With emotions running so high, the ships were scoured clean of all life save for the most high ranking Priests who were captured for interrogation. Upon investigation, the data-stacks & holds of the ships would divulge a horrific secret- the traitor Mechanicum had created heretical creations that fused both machine & warpborn flesh. Furthermore, there was details of numerous Forge Worlds practising this blasphemous work. The news of their Legions demise and the discovery of these heretical creations led to a massive debate amongst the fleet, one that almost led to open war, for some of the Sable Hawks wanted to rush back to Deliverance to aid their brothers in their darkest hour, whereas others wanted to launch a campaign against the corrupted Forge Worlds before they could unleash their foul creations upon the Imperium. After much debate, (& a few fights?) they decide to honour their exile, but as loyal servants of the Emperor & Imperium, they would make it their mission to destroy these heretical Forge Worlds and their works wherever possible.(This allows me to evolve them into relic hunters, seeking out the lost & ancient tech from the time of the Great Crusade that would be devastating in the hands of the Imperium's enemies.) Like most Chapters of the Adeptus Astartes, the Sable Hawks do not regard the Emperor as a God but as a man, however they do offer him reverence as both the founder and master of the Imperium. Instead, it is their Primarch, Corvus Corax, whom they place their hearts and souls in, offering him reverence for the great warrior, tactician, leader and hero he was. (I was thinking that they maybe sought to change their brutal ways after their exile, and in time earn Corax's forgiveness/respect?) As the Sable Hawks bear the gene-seed of the Raven Guard, and they too suffer from the problems associated with it, such as a missing Mucranoid and Betcher's Gland.(Or do they? I currently cannot find any definitive information stating that the gene-seed of the XIXth Legion/Raven Guard was damaged in any way prior to Corax's tampering post-Isstvan.) The true size, strength and capabilities of the Sable Hawks fleet is not recorded, but they are known to possess at least two Strike Cruisers ('Nightspear' & 'Darkstar') as well as the vast and ancient Battle Barge, the 'Hunter of Shadows', a ship capable of housing the entire Chapter if required to. Known to date back to the hallowed days of the Great Crusade, the 'Hunter of Shadows' houses numerous hangars and flight decks as well as a vast array of bombardment and defensive weapons. However, possessing so many hangars and flight decks comes at the expense of having ship-to-ship weaponry, instead the 'Hunter of Shadows' is forced to depend upon escort ships & boarding actions to defeat enemy ships. Like all sons of Corax, the Sable Hawks are patient and analytical, striking with speed and precision only when they have determined an enemy's weakness. They regard themselves as the masters in the use of air assault tactics, believing no other Chapter is capable of matching their expertise and skill in fighting from Gunships. Typically, a Sable Hawks assault will be carried out in "three waves". Wave 1: Recon squads infiltrate the battlefield to perform "eyes on" recon and to perform sabotage or ambushes. They may be used to help coordinate air or artillery strikes if required. Wave 2: The Chapter uses attack craft such as Fire Raptors and Storm Talons to establish air superiority by eliminating both enemy aircraft and air defences. Simultaneously, gunships such as Storm Eagles (and recently Stormravens) deploy the vanguard Infantry Squads who will carry out the mission as required or if secure the area to establish a LZ for further forces to be deployed safely. The gunships will provide CAS for the Infantry at this time to prevent them being overpowered.Wave 3: If needed, Thunderhawk Gunships will be used to deliver further Infantry Squads and/or supplies and equipment, while TH Transports will deliver any armoured support needed by the forces on the ground. On the rare occasion that the infantry squads find that their Gunships are unavailable to provide air support, they will instead look to deploy Dreadnoughts, Predators and Sicarans to provide the needed mobile fire support. Although the Sable Hawks heavily favour this style of warfare, they are still Adeptus Astartes and will utilise any tactic required in order to secure victory in the Emperor's name. The razing of Megiddo Prime:(At some point during the Scouring.)When the hive world fell to a Chaos Cult that had infiltrated the planets defence forces, the Sable Hawks answered the threat by deploying the entire Chapter to eradicate the traitors. However, it soon became clear that the rot of chaos had spread deep into the general populace after Cmdr. Abnus Habrok was killed by a group of suicide bombers hidden amongst rescued civilians. The death of their Chapter Master led to the Sable Hawks to fall into a state of unbound rage that resulted in them destroying every major hive in order to enact their vengeance. Waaagh! Skullkikka: (Early to mid M.40.) A Bad Moon Warboss famed for the large amount of Meganobz in his warband, Skullkikka's victories over many outlying planets in Segmentum Tempestus saw his ranks swell quickly into a large Waaagh! which saw itself moving core-ward until the intervention of the Sable Hawks. Once again, the entire Chapter was deployed to combat this threat to the Imperium, and thus began a long & arduous campaign lasting 15 years resulting in heavy losses for the Sable Hawks, with less than 300 Battle-Brothers surviving. The Sable Hawks are to all intents and purposes a Codex Chapter, structured into ten Companies as it dictates. However, they have expanded the structure of each Company to better suit their own requirements. Each Battle Company now permanently maintains a recon squad who help gather intel for the Company and operate as saboteurs and skirmishers. Their inclusion enables the Company to operate as independent battle forces without the need of Chapter support for extended periods of time. It is also of note that the Chapter's Forges are still capable of producing mk.VI 'Corvus' Power Armour as they exclusively wear this pattern of armour. They seemingly only possess Tartaros-pattern Terminator Dreadnought Armour as well- presumably favouring it because of its enhanced mobility. (Presumably due to their capture of the Mechanicum ships early in their history, or down to their raiding of Forge Worlds?) Captain Ehrlen Vaako:Captain of the 3rd Company, a warrior as renowned for his skill with a sword as he is for his quiet demeanour, which he famously used to slay the Ork Warboss Skullkikka.First Chaplain Kaitrin Vraal:Current leader of the Sable hawks following the loss of the Chapter Master and several other members of the Chapter Command in the campaign against Waaagh! Skullkikka. Wields the artificer-wrought war mace "Ossifrage" in battle. The Sable Hawks use a call and response between the Commander and Troops as their battle-cry; "For the Emperor!","For Corax!" As always, any & all critique is welcomed, as is advice on how to draw their origins into something other than a list of ideas.Thanks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 FOUNDING: .................. THIRD. A thought to consider and expand upon in the article - why is the Chapter a Third Founding entity and not a Second Founding one? Not that I am advocating moving the Founding up, just that there needs to be a nod or a statement as to why, if the Sable Hawks did indeed fight during the Heresy. Maybe they did not come back to the Imperial authorities until the time of the Third Founding. Maybe they came back earlier but were mistrusted until they proved themselves. Maybe it was something else. The plan is to have the Chapter stem from the remnants of an Assault Company that formed the core of one of the Nomad-Predation Fleets that Corax exiled before the Dropsite Massacre at Isstvan V, and here's the rough plan for how I envision it. However, I am struggling to get it beyond being a list of ideas and formed into something resembling an IA. The fleet began to use the name 'Sable Hawks' to distinguish themselves from the old XIXth Legion & from the Raven Guard from which they were exiled. (General feeling amongst the fleet after the Battle for Gate 42 was that Horus saw the XIXth as nothing more than a disposable tool to further the glory of his own Legion, whereas Corax viewed them as nothing more than a constant reminder of his traumatic past.) Should this be from the fallout of Battle for Gate 42 or maybe a smaller, less notable incident previous? Using Gate 42 may seem like a useful reference but it is probably quite notable in itself and therefor overshadows the origins of your own group with the emergence/origins of others. Also something to consider is that many of the Terrans that were exiled in the aftermath of Gate 42 belonged to the Warrior Lodges, so this is an element that should definitely rear it's head if you stay the course. (I was thinking that they maybe sought to change their brutal ways after their exile, and in time earn Corax's forgiveness/respect?) I dunno. I think it may be more in keeping that they kept their brutal ways. I think a good avenue to explore would be a love/hate relationship with Corax. He is their father, genetically, and they cannot forget this but he did exile them. Maybe they even remember him as unnecessarily merciful or humanitarian. When was the last time we saw a Chapter, DIY or otherwise, that disliked their gene-father? As the Sable Hawks bear the gene-seed of the Raven Guard, and they too suffer from the problems associated with it, such as a missing Mucranoid and Betcher's Gland. (Or do they? I currently cannot find any definitive information stating that the gene-seed of the XIXth Legion/Raven Guard was damaged in any way prior to Corax's tampering post-Isstvan.) The safe route would be to toe the line and continue to have missing organs. I don't really see why there would be any major change between the HH Raven Guard and the post-scouring Raven Guard (besides the failed proto-astartes Raptors). However, if you think you can explain it well enough, then have at it. I'm sure if you run it by the Liber, we'll point out what works and what does not. :) Hope that helps. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4346653 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 The Gate 42 was battle where the remaining terran-born RavenGuard were killed. The other terrans were at this point already exiled and after the battle the presence of terrans in the ranks of legion was practically null. ~ At least, that's what I understood. The reverence of Corax is a little odd. It was he, who send them to exile after all. And if they were made up of Terran veterans, they certainly do not owe him anything. Carcharadons are descendants of these nomad-predation fleets, so it's your clue. Sending aircraft to deal with anti-air defences is just asking for trouble. Also, what you describe in combat doctrine is method of deployment not really combat doctrine. As for relic-hunters theme... They should either witness or be subject to their horryfying potency. Maybe they happen to come across streak of devastated planets and after following the trail they encounter the perpetrators - The Dark Mechanicus employing some kind of techno-arcana from the days of Dark Age of Technology. After dealing with them, in the most gruesome and painful way of course, the Sable Hawks realise that traitors have no qualms in using forbidden and nightmarish weapons just to achieve their goals and, obviously, they need to be stopped before they destroy everything... or something like that. ~ NightrawenII Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4346880 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekim_Trub Posted March 26, 2016 Author Share Posted March 26, 2016 Thank you for the replies, means a lot.Olis: I went with the 3rd Founding as I felt GW had the 2nd pretty locked down and wasn't wanting to meddle with the established lore.Instead of using the Battle for Gate 42 as a reference point, I had toyed with the idea of having them 'elsewhere' (with another expedition/a Rogue Trader/another Legion?) at the time of exile, so they were exiled later. Or maybe say they were one of the first exiled? This is something I will have to explore further.My line of thinking regarding their relationship with Corax was to avoid the obvious "Daddy issues" angle, and instead go with the idea that they instead went out their way to seek their Father's approval. I reasoned it would be possible for them to have potentially understood their exile.I think you are right, and in the case of their gene-seed, I will take the safe option and have them suffer the same issues as the Raven Guard.NightrawenII: Unfortunately, I am going on information taken from the internet as I do not own the FW books yet. (I really should sell a child to rectify this, lol.)Their ranks were not entirely comprised of Terrans, around 40% were Deliverance-born, which I would of thought would have helped soften their view of the Primarch. Also, not all the Terrans were exiled, some stayed with the Legion post-exile, so there is the chance that not all the Terrans were bloodthirsty brutes.I had thought to do try and provide a balance to the Carcharodons- where they embraced their brutal ways fully, the Sable Hawks saw Corax's disapproval so instead they sought to change their ways?I will need to further explore their combat doctrine to be honest, but I had imagined that their Scouts would help in dealing with anti-air defences, as well as the Sable Hawks having access to some Kiavahran stealth tech which would help bypass the defences or at least avoid detection long enough for them to strike.The relic-hunters theme is one I am keen to pursue with them (as you said I should do ages ago), and is one I shall have to expand upon further once I get the basics of the Chapter established. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4346925 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysimachus Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 The geneseed thing is tricky, as far as I'm aware the problems with the RG seed did start with Corax's attempts to rebuild the Legion after Istvaan? So the Carcharodons don't suffer with the problems the RG do as they left prior to the massacre and never went back? So the same would be true for other Nomad fleets? But of course that doesn't make much sense that there'd be all this pure geneseed knocking about and the RG haven't ever requested to use some of it to renew/replace their own stockpiles. That said, I'm not sure how many Nomad fleets there are suggested to be, but I guess if they all felt the same way as the Carcharodons then they probably wouldn't be inclined to share? Maybe you could make it that they wanted to be accepted back? Perhaps the Hawks nomad fleet took on the DarkMech to retrieve these horrific weapons, but they refused to use them against anyone else and destroyed them, maybe taking sizeable losses in the process (so they won't be bringing back loads of pure geneseed with them). Then they come home and their choices convince Corax that they're not the brutes he thought all the Terrans were. He takes them back and then they're around to be part of the 3rd Founding? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4347406 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted March 29, 2016 Share Posted March 29, 2016 @Burt The point about Carcharodons is that they are XIXth Legion prior to the discovery of Corax. The Terran legion was not exactly RavenGuard, this is not isolated case, as almost all legions were transformed by their Primarch and influx of new culture in their ranks. The Terrans were recruited from pseudo-Mongol slaver-tribes and as fatherless legion fought under command of Horus, who treated them practically as a Chapter of his own Luna Wolves. All of this left mark on them. The Battle of Gate 42 is notable by the fact that the all influences of old legion died here. IMHO, you are contradicting the lore; Why would Corax exile the Deliverance-born Legionaries alongside the Terran-born? + The Terrans suffered horrific casualties in what was basically frontal assault, the ratio would be most likely, 80~90% of Deliverance-born. The seventh book, Retribution, says that after the campaign against the Unsighted Kings the RavenGuard Legion contributed to the several fleets dispatched in the Ghoul Stars region and these cast-offs apparently formed blackshield Ashen Claws during Horus Heresy. Also, the Moritat - see their Lexicanum entry. ~ NightrawenII Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4348843 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekim_Trub Posted March 29, 2016 Author Share Posted March 29, 2016 Lysimachus: It was my understanding that the Carcharodons shared the same genetic issues as the Raven Guard (darkening hair & eyes, and paling skin with age), so perhaps the XIXth Legion had problems with their gene-seed long before Corax's meddling?We know that there was at least seven Nomad-Predation Fleets, as Shade Lord Arkhas Fal was given command of the 7th Fleet.I did want to try and go with the idea that they wanted to try and earn Corax's respect/trust, as I thought this would make for a more interesting concept than the expected "Daddy sent us away, so we hate him!"NightrawenII: Maybe this idea for their origins won't work then, it was just I thought that it might of been a good way to set them up as relic hunters and explain them having access to older equipment.The Deliverance-born Marines were exiled alongside their Terran brothers, because they had embraced their bloody/brutal ways, so Corax tarred them all with the same brush so-to-speak. I wasn't aware of how horrendous the losses were at Gate 42 as I am only going on what I have read online, and I had said a 60/40 ratio, as I had thought of maybe having them elsewhere and not having participating in that battle. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4349288 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 The Raven Guard genetics seem to me to be twofold. There are the Primarch-inherited physical traits unique to the sons of the Raven, the alabaster skin and onyx hair and eyes, and then there was the experimental disaster that led to the highly degenerative, mutative gene-seed that makes recruitment so difficult. As for Terran nomad-predation fleets . . . Well, it is true that those Terrans exiled from the XIX were of nomad-predation fleets, but not all nomad-predation fleets were exiled XIX Legionaries. It's a fleet pattern that the Terran XIX were just one example of. There is plenty of room for Deliverance-born nomad-predation fleets beyond just exiles, just as there is room for other Legions to have outlying nomad-predation fleets. That said, Kaedes Nex is a thing. Condemned murderer granted a pardon by Corax so long as he "limited his targets to those chosen by his new master." Makes it seem like Corax was, well, perhaps uncomfortable with the likes of his Terran sons and the like-minded from Deliverance. But perfectly capable and willing to use them, as long as he was in total control. The Terrans weren't, really, and so their exile makes sense from Corax's way of thinking. What if Kaedes Nex wasn't the only pardoned Deliverance-born? What happens when Corax loses confidence in his control? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4349627 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekim_Trub Posted March 30, 2016 Author Share Posted March 30, 2016 Must admit, I have found my confidence in this origin story to be heavily dented now. As I currently cannot afford to buy the relevant FW books to get the information I need for myself, I think I may have to abandon this project till a later date. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4350208 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Placing a project on hiatus, if you've hit a wall, is not necessarily a bad thing. Sometimes leaving something on the back burner, waiting for the right inspiration, can let you come back with a fresh look at the article. On the other hand... you might forget it exists. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4350221 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekim_Trub Posted March 30, 2016 Author Share Posted March 30, 2016 The problem is, I have been hitting the proverbial wall for years now, I just struggle to get to a point of completion with my IA- I can come up with a load of facts & ideas, but just cannot turn them into a complete article. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4350270 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Welcome to the Liber Astartes. You can check out any time you like, but you can't ever leave. :p There is no problem with shelving incomplete articles for later inspiration. Some of our brothers have incomplete articles that have existed for years, and been revived time and again. 90% of the DIYs I have posted or plan to post were conceptually born before I even joined the B&C, half a decade ago. A few of the ones I have posted are "complete," but I failed to meet my own expectations for the articles and still consider them works in progress. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4350323 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Dude, it was 10,000 years ago. Yeah, it's important event which sets the Sable Hawks on the due course, but when/how it happened is of no consequence. You can develop your Chapter and then add the origin story. No one said, you cannot shape 'cause' to suit the 'effect'. ~ NightrawenII Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/320802-ia-sable-hawks-another-attempt/#findComment-4350549 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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