Starting Tempestus - 750

[Yentzer]

I really want to start a scions army because their lore is awesome and i love the models and they will fit nicely with my guard army!

 

So, i want to start small (750 points say) but when i had a go at writing an army list i quickly discovered i had no idea where to start! Scions are so different to every army i have,

 

With that in mind would you please give me some advice on how to run them, units to use etc...

 

Thanks in advance :)

[WarriorFish]

I'm moving this to the barracks proper, as this isn't an army list question really and you'll get more help there too.

Stormies are very cool and fortunately we have some commanders well versed in them who'll be able to give you some detailed help. For my part; they're a glass hammer not for the faint hearted. Stick to their strengths and you can build a capable force - keep your unit count up and take advantage of special weapon upgrades and squeeze every rule for all you can get!

Multiple small units (MSU) is generally the best way, as this lets you leverage their advantages while reducing the costs. Striking in close to the enemy is dangerous work after all, so mitigating potential loses is a good idea. There's more to be said but I will leave that to the experienced Stormtrooper generals I look forward to seeing your progress, have you got a colour scheme planned out for them?

[Yentzer]

Ah thanks very much, I wasn't quite sure where to put this so thanks for that, but don't worry I know all about the MSU glass hammer approach I'm an ex dark Eldar player!

 

Colour scheme wise i'm torn between painting them in the same way as my Cadians so they fit with the rest of the army, or have them with black armour and dark grey fatigues like a proper spec ops force!

[librisrouge]

At 750 points, I think you need to decide ahead of time how much mech you're wanting. Their transport isn't cheap, even if it does pack a decent punch. If you don't double down on it, you'll only have 1-3. You also might want to consider the formations. I'm pretty sure the ground attack one fits in 750, if you keep the upgrades cheap. You won't have Obsec but you will blast them off the table.

[march10k]

yah, the "I love the smell of promethium in the morning" force of 'Apocalypse Now'-style airmobile stormtroopers is like 950, bare minimum, if you want to actually tote around a few special weapons.  At 750, honestly, I'd go for a little over 500 in infantry, and then add a firestorm redoubt with a pair of battle cannons.  the FRD is pretty stout in 750 no matter what else is going on, but with stormtroopers, it has the added bonus of covering for our shortcoming, which is long ranged shooting.  I would probably go with a command squad with four volley guns to shoot from inside the bunker, then add dual-melta five man squads to deepstrike until I couldn't fit any more (er...three of them?), then use leftover points to first upgrade one squad to plasma, then add bodies to it.  Deepstrike everything but the command squad.  Have fun!

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

Ah thanks very much, I wasn't quite sure where to put this so thanks for that, but don't worry I know all about the MSU glass hammer approach I'm an ex dark Eldar player!

You'll feel right at home then. While Stormies are similar to Dark Eldar in a lot of ways, namely the fast moving and hard hitting infantry, they are uniquely guard in flavor. I don't run MSU too much, preferring my stormies to be large killer units. I tend to face a lot of MEQ forces, so I get a ton of mileage out of the hotshots, and I usually take plasma guns, as the most versatile option. I really favor delivering my stormies by air or deepstrike, to really take full advantage of the DS/MTC rules combo. Unfortunately, they seriously lack in the orders department, when you take into account that they completely lack senior officers in their own book. That significantly limits you on orders, because their orders are really quite good. One thing to really consider for MT, is allies. If you intend to play them you might want to consider allies, because the only support you get from the 'dex itself is taurox primes and valkyries.

 

 

Colour scheme wise i'm torn between painting them in the same way as my Cadians so they fit with the rest of the army, or have them with black armour and dark grey fatigues like a proper spec ops force!

The great thing about treating them like spec ops, is that you can make them any paint scheme and it fits, since spec ops will wear whatever they need to get the job done (unless it's filthy xenos armor).  I use Kasrkin, so they look the same as the rest of my army.

 

In the end you need to plan out your force, and how you intend to use your stormies. Are you planning to draw them from C:AM, or C:MT? Both definitely have shortcomings, but on the plus side, C:MT makes a better ally for any force.

 

[march10k]

 

Colour scheme wise i'm torn between painting them in the same way as my Cadians so they fit with the rest of the army, or have them with black armour and dark grey fatigues like a proper spec ops force!

The great thing about treating them like spec ops, is that you can make them any paint scheme and it fits, since spec ops will wear whatever they need to get the job done (unless it's filthy xenos armor).  I use Kasrkin, so they look the same as the rest of my army.

 

In the end you need to plan out your force, and how you intend to use your stormies. Are you planning to draw them from C:AM, or C:MT? Both definitely have shortcomings, but on the plus side, C:MT makes a better ally for any force.

 

 

My air cav are pretty close to my metal cadians in paint scheme...my gound assault are pretty close to the air assault, but somewhat different from the cadians.  The thing is, the iar assault glory boys are possible additions to an IG list, but what do ground-based stormtroopers really bring? Sure, taurox primes have a little more offensive firepower, but AV11 is pitiful compared to AV12, and that's a huge difference, a far greater difference than the difference in firepower.  AP3 lasguns are nice, but AP3 is common enough to make stormtroopers non-essential.  So air/drop stormies are useful, but primes and walking stormies are so overwhelmed by options in the IG codex.  So there's no need for my gorund stormies to conform to my IG paint scheme, they'll never be fielded outside of a pure C:MT list...

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

I get what you're saying March. My Kasrkin get used more as carapace vets than anything, since they are cheaper to run. I like having the hotshots, but stormies are just too costly to be taken in 10 man squads.

 

I mostly just field my stormies in lists that use them as old school stormies, like elysians where I can infiltrate them. I'd be happier with elysians if I eeither had drop sentinels or if they could take armored sentinels.

[Ubique]

Hi, I've built my force around MT and I like them. Like everyone said, you can either run a bunch of MSU or some beefed up units; I'll give you one little list just to illustrate:

 

*all squads 5-man, comes out to 745 pts.

 

2xMT Command Squads

-Vox, 3xHotshot Volleyguns

 

2xMT Scion Squads

-Vox, Plasma Pistol, 2xPlasma Guns

 

2xMT Scion Squads

-Vox, 2xMeltagun

 

1xMT Scion Squad

-Vox, 2xFlamer

 

So as a base force, it's got a lot of DS special weapons and you should get orders off given the voxes and the two command squads. In a 1500 pt game, that's half your force. You can imagine in turn 2 dumping 7x units onto one flank right into cover; might cause your opponent some headaches.

[duz_]

Personally I prefer something along the lines of

 

1-2 CCS w/ 4 plasma or 3 plasma + medic

1+ 5x man squads w/ 2 melta

0-1 5+ man squad

 

Plasma in CCS means they can benefit from TL or PE order

 

The point of the base 5+ man squad is so they can be given the sniper order for anti MC fire

 

I like fast obsec taroux primes

But they are expensive

 

Best to make the armaments like for like

 

So TL autocannons w/ the ML or battle cannon variant and TL HSVG with the gatling cannon

 

Min/max msu all the way

[Yentzer]

Wow, thanks for all the help! I think i have a better understanding of what i want now since my IG force is fully mech with virtually no air support! So i will go with the deep strike/valkyrie scions. I like the idea of a suicidey drop squads deepstriking in behind enemy lines, so i will probably base my list on something like that, 

 

I shall post my first attempt at an army list shortly (in the AM army list section) as I know this might not be the best place,

[duz_]

Try and get your hands on one of the boxsets for a good discount on the models :)

[WarriorFish]

Get the box sets from an online reseller for more of a discount ;)

[Emicus]

Having 5 troops selections you can also consider 2x CAD to make one of those troops a third HQ selection (another source of orders)