Praetorian of Dorn

[Petitioner's City]

Right im going to throw a spaniard into the works. It could be pure balderdash buuuut hear the theory out. For those that do not wish for spoilers dont read this next bit

 

the alpha legion have the necessary tools for cloning thanks to the raven guard/high probability they've seen what fabulous bile is up to, plot twist, although omegon felt the "death" is it not implausible that Alpharius had protocols for cloning in place given that we "know" guilleman kills someone he believes to be alpharius, also in hand with the information that it seemed apparent that omegons missions were directly at odds with alpharius (assumption that omegon wouldn't need to fight Bobby G)

 

 

 

I imagine Omegon will fall, perhaps in the same way his Captain Arkos falls...? Perhaps not. Also who knows if RG will fight & kill an Alpharius anymore - the old fluff is in flux.

 

[b1soul]

The old fluff is definitely in flux

 

So much has been changed, e.g. Collected Visions has been revealed to be a doctored history

[DarkChaplain]

Collected Visions still holds up for the most part. Heck, it even heralded the return of Torgaddon as Tormageddon. Still, it has been replaced by the reworked Visions of Heresy, which also references new events on top.

[b1soul]

I'm thinking about how it portrays the Khan and Russ as the closest of brothers

 

After Scars, CV could be read as the official history revised by Imperial historians to gloss over uncomfortable truths

[bluntblade]

Maybe that explains why by the Battle of the Fang, Wolves are using "until next winter" as a fond farewell.

[Guest]

 

Can someone give the death context ideally dorns reaction too.

 

[SchultzChaos]

Alpharius tries to draw Dorn into a trap on a space station (called Hydra, hah!) orbiting Pluto.

 

We don't get much reaction, as the scene is at the very end of the book. Dorn seems very determined to kill Alpharius, where Alpharius seems to try to talk Dorn over that he isn't really the bad guy. Dorn not just ignores all that Alpharius has to say, he maims him and then as Alpharius is stunned by the whole scene crushes his head.

 

What we get about the overall reaction of Alpharius death is that something impossible has happened (again). A demi-god has been killed, and the universe's sanity is crumbling around them. Dorn forbids anyone to talk about this deed and erases it from any and all accounts. Not even in death does Alpharius get any remembrance.

[Sandlemad]

 

Can someone give the death context ideally dorns reaction too.

 

 

You should read it yourself to get full context - the whole book is fantastic, top tier HH - but for a play by play...

 

Dorn straight up murders Alpharius. No angst, no hesitation, no regrets. It is a fantastic fight scene. Intense but probably the shortest primarch fight so far. We see it through Arcahmus's eyes.

 

Dorn and his terminator retinue teleport in to a storage vault on Pluto's moon where Alpharius and his lerneans are waiting for him. Alpharius has just half killed Archamus. Alpharius generously says that they should talk. Dorn looks him dead in the eye and orders his terminators to fire. That is the only thing he says in the whole fight. Alpharius is constantly talking to him while they duel, telling him to look around him, telling him he's already lost, telling him Terra is doomed. It's a good fight! Alpharius is not shown as anything less than a superlative warrior, Archamus is is in awe of some of his moves.

 

It ends with Dorn stepping into a spear thrust to his shoulder, grabbing the haft and hacking his chainsword right through Alpharius's arms. Alpharius jumps away, Dorn slashes open his torso. Alpharius falls and Dorn rams the spear right through his chest and holds him there, as the AL teleportation extraction starts, as Alpharius coughs blood and gasps. Dorn is staring right at him as he tries to talk and then right before Alpharius is teleported away, Dorn smashes his chainsword right down through his brother's skull. All that gets teleported away is a gory mess.

 

Dorn doesn't say a word, doesn't roar or swear oaths, doesn't so much as twitch or change his expression throughout. Keeps the death a secret, as it'd be bad for morale to know that a traitor primarch made it into the Solar system with his legion, even if he's dead.

 

 

Lotta good stuff in this book. If you're an Imperial Fists fan, you won't be disappointed. If you're an Alpha Legion fan, you won't be disappointed. Neither are shown as punks or perfect beings; the amount of effort the AL invest in their schemes (and have done since well before Istvaan, they have to seed new agents to bring their Terran infiltrators up to date) is shown, as is when it goes badly wrong for them. The name-switching and hidden identities of the AL is done better here than in any other work, with two (or maybe three?) fakeouts as to the identity of certain characters, but all done plausibly.

 

The book is replete with good nuanced consideration by both IF and AL of their enemies. We see IF legionaries look at the results of AL schemes and be shocked at how wasteful it is, all for pride.  We see others call out IF warriors for "wearing [their] humility as a crown". There a bit where an AL warrior envies the IF their straightforwardness and is scolded by his brother, saying they only do what's necessary.

 

We see Alpharius get a bitter dressing down from Dorn during the great crusade and actually get angry (probably my favourite scene):

 

 

‘Do not moralise at me, brother!’ spat Alpharius, and now it was his turn to flick from control to anger. ‘Would the deaths of all those you would have killed been acceptable because they died in open battle?’ ‘Yes,’ said Dorn. Alpharius held Dorn’s gaze. ‘I think we see the universe very differently, Rogal.’ ‘No. I do not think we see the same universe at all.’

 

 

 

John French, in the afterword, says this was originally inspired by The Lightning Tower. If you liked that, or Crimson Fist, you're going to like this. If you liked Rob Sander's The Serpent Beneath, you're also going to like this. That said the story it's most similar to, I think, is Abnett's Blood Games. A lot of espionage, a lot of escalation, very high stakes. It's a good 'un.

[DarkChaplain]

I really liked John's Afterword too. It speaks volumes about his passion for the Fists and Dorn, and the Alpha Legion, while also making his views of Rogal clear. It was also interesting to see how he joined the HH team in the first place.

[b1soul]

Major spoiler

 

 

 

Red gloss sheen on indigo-blue, and a demigod falling, his torso an open cave of meat and bone. The only sound the growl of Storm’s Teeth and the clang as Alpharius struck the deck, and began to rise, strength defying the red ruin of his body. Dorn still had the spear in one hand.

 

‘But... victory...’ Alpharius gasped.

 

Dorn rammed the spear through his brother’s chest. The tip punched through the power plant on the back of Alpharius’ armour. Alpharius’ mouth opened, his eyes wide. A great wash of blood poured from between his teeth. Dorn held him on the spear, the two so close that it seemed almost an embrace. The air around them was blurring like a heat haze as the blood struck the floor.

 

A high wail was rising with a coil of wind, which circled the pair. Alpharius’ mouth moved, forming words. Dorn was still for a second, his eyes blank and black in the carved stone of his face. Then he pushed Alpharius away. Snakes of light writhed through the air. The primarch of the Alpha Legion staggered, mouth still moving.

 

Rogal Dorn brought Storm’s Teeth around. The blade cut down through Alpharius’ skull, and then tore free in a spray of blood and a detonation of light.

 

Rogal Dorn, Praetorian of Terra, looked down at the corpse of his brother. Around him, the world turned. Groups of warriors appeared in fresh flashes of teleportation light. They spread through the vault, as the doors crashed open and Kestros ran in, and saw a sight that none would have believed. A moment that should have stopped the galaxy on its axis. A primarch dead at the hands of his brother, within sight of the world of their creation.

 

 

[Hrolf the Cunning]

This book sounds awesome = purchased

[HeritorA]

OK  - about the last chapters and one major event:

 

 

  Dorn did not kill Alpharius. Because that was not Alpharius  - it was an Alpha clone, made by AL librarians and genetechs using the same technology and genecipher stolen in 'Deliverance lost'. Actually all his fleet was manned by cloned legioners - that's make a lot of sense.

 

Knowing Alpharius - it was a great test for new clones from the laboratory. That's why 'fake Alpharius' spent a year in stasis. AL need time to put 'fake AL fleet' in place.

Remember - like in 'Serpent Beneath' it could have been a clone with Primarch blood. In this case - he was simply created from the Empras genetech and real Alpharius genome (which I think he provided to create an Alpha clone).

 

The death knelt Omegon felt is an echo from the pendant (that pendant so silently mentioned after alpha clone awakening).

 

So, it's 90 % that it's all was a threefold test  - to test genetech and cloning; to test Terra defences - and actually prepare them for Horus; to thin the ranks of Hydra and operatives net, while also verifying all the codes and ciphers for the future. All in all - 'Praetorian of Dorn' is one epic AL victory. 

 

Plus remember - that in all that time Alpharius has taken part in 'Serpent Beneath' from Mcneil in absolutely different corner of the Galaxy, thought with Magnus, striked at Paramar again and was on Mars.

 

And MAINLY - his fleet was crippled at Alaxxes ('Alpha') especially. It could not have been 'Alpha' at Interstellar gulf before Sol - cause it was not 'so' damaged.

 

 

 

[Augustus]

I see Dorn as the brother who always has to get in the last word.

 

I can buy that HeritorA.

[Emperor's Furor]

 

I was absolutely surprised at the end, it took a while but I managed to figure out Silonicus was Alpharius when he went superman on the Imperial Fists during the Ambush, but when Dorn and Alpharius finally come face to face, I figured Alpharius would end up teleporting out or something, up until Dorn chopped his hands off I still thought it would be like Corax and Night Haunter etc. How class was Dorn when he just declared fire when Alpharius tried to start an evil monologue.

 

Also I think I want to make an Imperial Fist successor where the chapter master's first name is always Archamus.

 

[A D-B]

OK  - about the last chapters and one major event:

 

 

  Dorn did not kill Alpharius.  

 

 

 

I bet he did.

 

[Emperor's Furor]

ADB you know you want to write about a chapter in honour of Archamus don't you :p

[Sete]

Ei wot. Chapter name Praetorians. ;)

The last page kinda confirms Dorns deed.

[A D-B]

ADB you know you want to write about a chapter in honour of Archamus don't you

I'll leave that for John, I think, if he ever chooses to go in that direction!

Ei wot. Chapter name Praetorians.

Admittedly one of my favourite words and historical resonances. Even yelled in Russell Crowe's voice, it has a certain something.

[Sete]

Black armour, purple clothing, Gold or Bronze Fist . Silver details.

 

Still one of my favourite movies.

Well gonna keep going at Path of Heaven.

[Guest]

 

You should read it yourself to get full context - the whole book is fantastic, top tier HH - but for a play by play...

 

 

I can't bring myself to read it, I really am not a fan of the AL... I really don't like their plot armour.

[Marshal Rohr]

Archamus will be killed by Abaddon shortly after Sigismund, and before he poisons Polux dressed as a Xenos in Talon of Horus 2: Everybody M2C likes Dies.

 

:P

[Kilofix]

Ending (Dorn) didn't surprise me. I mean, he's been through a lot already. See signature.

[mc warhammer]

on the one hand i get that this was a great way to give us a twist that we wouldn't expect while still keeping to the lore but does anyone else feel a certain loss from the potential inherent within LEGION and SERPENT BENEATH from this?

[Soldier of Dorn]

 

 

See, the way i figure it, perhaps it's best that Alpharius does in fact die.  The Alpha Legion is the many-headed Hydra, the Serpent with a Thousand Different Faces, but the entire fact that they had a Primarch present at all leading them works against that idea. With Alpharius dead, this frees them (not entirely, mind, since Omegon's still in the picture) to splinter into the thousand cells with a thousand different motives that they eventually become in the 41st millennium. This is the turning point, where they really begin their evolution into their particular brand of Chaos Space Marine. Perhaps it is a bit premature, since previously we had an "established" death for Alpharius fighting Roboute, but I do like the idea of it actually happening during the Heresy itself, for two reasons. Firstly, the way John French wrote it is incredible, and secondly, it proves that we can't be certain of anything that's going to happen during the Heresy. If another primarch can die, then it feels like (even if it's not strictly true) that nobody's safe again.

 

It may be, as some people said, that he didn't in fact die and that it was simply another double (of a more advanced sort in this case,) as the Alpha Legion is wont to do, and at least for me, that would be perfectly alright, being perfectly in character for the XX Legion. We might never really know the answer. But either way, even if this story has little impact on the overall narrative, it's still fascinating and beautifully written too.

 

A sidenote, also, though it may have held true for the old background, too: All throughout the Heresy and 40k, the Alpha Legion's mantra is: "I am Alpharius." If Alpharius is, indeed, dead, then that puts a entirely different spin on the phrase, changing the subtext, ever so slightly. Before Alpharius' death, it may have merely been a simple way of confirming the anonymity of the Ghost Legionnaires, a metaphorical device, but afterwards perhaps the Alpha Legion started meaning it in a more literal way: that Alpharius exists only in them anymore, and they carry on his works.

 

 

 

But that's just my opinion. I'm probably talking out my ass anyway. :P

[Lurking Hydra]

 

OK  - about the last chapters and one major event:

 

 

  Dorn did not kill Alpharius.  

 

 

 

I bet he did.

 

 

I dub thee Sir D-B, Slayer of Hope and Lord of the all the lands of Dreamcrushershireville.  Long may you reign.