[IRON GAUNTLET 2017] Kraxan

[Donkey Kong]

Chapter Heraldry, Image by Codex Grey (2009)

[Donkey Kong]

WORKING NOTES PLEASE READ THIS POST FIRST All of my updated notes are kept here.

AUTHOR'S FOREWORD IRON GAUNTLET 2017

With 2017 coming to an end, my new goal is to write 1000-1500 words similar to the Chapters of the Badab War pieces in Imperial Armour Volumes Nine and Ten not including Selected Battle Honours or any sidebars (Although I'm sure those will come later).

 

Commissar Molotov started the CCCPIV with the mantra: Be the change you wish to see in the Liber.

 

I think that the Index Astartes format has outlived its usefulness. It's too long and too clumsy for what should be a quick synopsis.

Following in the footsteps of Dan Abnett's Sabbat Worlds Crusade and Forge World's Campaign Books, I've found that Warhammer 40,000 is best explored and experienced in isolated and contained stories. This Chapter will be my first step in building a small corner of the universe to call my own.

With the exception of the Horus Heresy, I don't enjoy galaxy spanning conflicts (i.e. The Nova Terra Interregnum/ The Moirae Schism and The Age of Apostasy) in Warhammer 40,000. I think that they betray what should be the incomprehensible scale and inertia of the universe. 

 

Reconciling the Moirae Schism in a way that makes sense to me.

 

I want to write what Commissar Molotov's Castigators were for me when I first joined the Bolter and Chainsword. I want to write an article that is coherent and complete for a Chapter that has a distinct look and character and is indisputably 40k and that, hopefully, inspires others to want to do the same. Thank you for taking the time to read and comment.

 

CHAPTER NAME: ..........

FOUNDING: .......... 8TH [MID-M.34]

CHAPTER WORLD/ DEPLOYMENT/ HOMEWORLD: ..........

FORTRESS-MONASTERY: ..........

GENE-SEED (PREDECESSOR): .......... IRON HANDS

KNOWN DESCENDANTS: ..........

"Quotation"

- Somebody Important

 

ORIGINS

• 8th Founding (Mid-M.34).

HOMEWORLD

PATUGER [pat-oo-ge]/[pad-uh-gir] "Patuger" is derived from French "Patauger." Demonym Patugain/s.

• Patuger is a tropical, water world and under more ideal circumstances it may have been considered a paradise planet.

COMBAT DOCTRINE/ CHAPTER ORGANIZATION

• M.O. control space, destroy ships, and strand enemies.
• Ranks: Aspirant/ Neophyte, Brother, Sergeant, Lieutenant, and Commander. Captain is a job, not a rank. Any brother in command of a ship and a crew (usually a Lieutenant or Commander) is recognized as "Captain."
• Deployment: The Chapter is deployed in semi-autonomous patrols of one or more battleships/ cruisers plus escorts. Patrols are typically led by between 4 and 40 full fledged battle brothers, some greater number of aspirant hopefuls/ neophytes, and hundreds to hundreds of thousands of chapter serf crewmen.

CHAPTER CULT

• Cult Mechanicus. Machine Cult core tenets: The Quest for Knowledge. The Holy Trinity: Machine God, Omnissiah (God Emperor of Mankind), and Motive Force.
• The Chapter’s spiritual leaders are its Iron Fathers (Hybrid Chaplain/Techpriest).

GENE-SEED

• Iron Hands successors, Primarch Ferrus Manus. They're genetically stable.

MISCELLANEOUS DRAMATIS PERSONAE The Astral Reavers are used to having their (French-y) names mispronounced. In Prospero Burns Kasper Hawser uses a translator device that incorrectly interprets Bjorn the Fell-Handed’s name as "Bear," which Bjorn accepts as "close enough." Another character calling Thussaud, pronounced [tu-soh], [thew-sad] to a resounding shrug and "close enough" amuses me more than it should (probably because I’ve been pronouncing it the latter, wrong way for years).

• Given Names: Alphonse, Basile, Bastien, Blaise, Camus, Cedric, Constantin, Didier, Dimitri, Felix, Gauthier, Ghislaine, Guillaume, Hector, Henri, Ignace, Jean, Jeremie, Killian, Laurent, Leigh, Lucas, Mathias, Olivier, Pascal, Patrice, Quentin, Remi, Riviere, Sebastien, Yannick, ________.
• Surnames: Berger, Bergeron, Blanc, Bonheur, Bonhomme, Borde, Carre, Cavey, Chabot, Clavell, Cloud, Dameron, Danser, Dudigue, Duile, Dumas, Dupont, Durand, Fafard, Farand, Filoux, Fortescue, Foy, Freer, Gagnon, Gaines, Gange, Gillette, Groulx, Hazard, Hughes, Jund, Lamont, Odige, Mercer, Proulx, Proux, Pulver, Reiss, Roche, Rocher, Rousseau, Roux, Sabat, Sauvage, Thussaud, Tussaud, Vasseur, ________.

 

• Commander Gauthier Thussaud [tu-soh]/ [thew-sad].
• Commander __________ Filoux [fi-lou]/ [fe-loh].
• Leigh-Jean Proulx.

MOIRAE SCHISM M.35 ORIGINS SUBSECTION

• Sector ________ Points of Interest: 2 Forge Worlds with territories across the sector on industrial worlds, outposts, research stations, etc. Ecclesiarchy Shrine World, patron Saint ________ is a local hero from the Moirae Schism, memory eases relations between the Astral Reavers and Ecclesiarchy. Ordo Xenos Watch Fortress.
• Moirae Schism M35, Chapter's Defining Moment in History: Blasphemous messages from Forge World Moirae reach Sector ________ proclaiming the Ecclesiarchy's God Emperor and the Cult Mechanicus's Machine God to be one in the same. The Astral Reavers attack Hereteks on a Forge World territory under their protection. Alliances and battle lines are drawn. Civil war in Sector ________ lasts 2-3 hundred odd years plus holdout skirmishes.

MISCELLANEOUS GENERAL

• Chapter Name something associated with imperialism/ seizing/ taking Krakes? Portmanteau i.e. Relicators Relic + Relocator.
• Maldives.
• I need to come up with at least one quote for the Chapter. "Take what you can. Give nothing back." Pirates of the Caribbean (Phrase used when pulling a ship into dock, meaning to pull in as much slack as you can and don't let it go). "Nothing is beyond our reach." NROL-39 American reconnaissance satellite.
• CHAPTER ORGANIZATION Does the Chapter have a Chapter Master?
• CHAPTER ORGANIZATION Chaplains (Ecclesiarchy)
• Chaplains are a reverse of Techmarines in most other chapters. They are the outsiders. Emperor's Champion/ Moritat?
• Mermen. Horus Heresy Betrayal.
• Cyborg seal dog.
• Spyrer hunting rigs for a water world. My favorite idea is a Malcadon rig that can walk on water like a fishing spider. I also like the idea of a Jakara rig that can run on water like a basilisk lizard. Yeld suits should work fine because they fly. I'm not sure what to do with Orrus, Matriarch, and Patriarch rigs and I'm inclined to leave them out entirely.
• GrimDark Killzone Shadowfall Vekta City. Arrakeen, Dune.
• Endiger [ond-e-ge]/ [end-e-gir] "Endiger" is derived from French "Endiguer." Endiger's tallest spires reach into orbit and serve as docks for the Chapter Fleet.
• Necromunda House Gangs x Dune (1965) Fremen x Waterworld (1995).
• Most patugains live in bungalow shanties built atop Rafts, ancient stabilizing platforms built to withstand millennia of ocean wear with minimal maintenance, anchored in semi/circular colonies around islands or atolls with clear water lagoons which are used for aquaculture.
• Plants: Algae, Palm Trees, Seaweed, ________. Lagoon floors of rich, white sand used for aquafarming (algaeculture, seaweed, ________). Animals: Manatees, Penguins, Sea Lions, Seals ________. Sea Lions/Seals are domesticated for guarding, hunting, shepherding, etc. Manatees and Penguins are farmed.
• Patugains are best classified as techno-barbarians. Nobles go to war in Spyrer Hunting Rigs. Las weapons are relatively common. Patugains wear sophisticated swimsuits that enhance the wearer's form and speed (LZR Racer Speedo).
• Patugains (both men and women) are tall (6ft-6ft7in/ 183-200cm), broad shouldered, wingspan > height, longer torso/ shorter legs, big feet, flexible and wiry (Olympic swimmer build). Hands are slightly webbed (i.e. this or this).
• Patugain Techpriests belonging to the world's Cult Mechanicus (Similar to the Martian Orthodox Cult Mechanicus)  manufacture and maintain the technologies used in battle and needed for survival. The Cult Mechanicus is Patuger's common faith.
• GENE-SEED Which Iron Hands Chapter is the Chapter descended from? Prior to the 8th Founding, my only official options are the Brazen Claws, Iron Hands, or Red Talons. I want a Chapter organization more fractured and independent than the Iron Hands (The Iron Hands have their Clan Companies, the Red Talons and Brazen Claws are codex). I want Iron Father hybrid Chaplain Techmarines (Brazen Claws, Iron Hands, and Red Talons, all have Iron Fathers).

[Claws and Effect]

I would probably do the chapter organization slightly different from the Iron Hands, but still reminiscent of them.

 

Otherwise I like it thus far.

[Dosjetka]

 

Heraldry: Would the Heraldic Kraken look better in black instead of green?

It would definitely stand out more on pale green armour.

 

 

Preferred Armor: MKIII Iron Armor and MKVI Corvus Armor.

Why these two armour marks in particular? MK III has rarely, if at all, been produced since the Heresy. For MK VI, it might be more common but I'm pretty sure that very few are produced, what with MK VII being superior in many ways. The Astral Reavers being a 3rd generation Chapter (twice removed from their gene-seed source) would not, in my mind, have a ready supply of MK III. Couldn't they pioneer a reinforced version of the MK VII with thin plates of extra armour bolted onto the frontal areas (à la FW MK IV Destroyers) instead?

 

 

What are people from Patuger called? Patugois? Patugain?

Patugain sounds better to me.

 

 

Is Patuger a deathworld? Does it fit the description? If not, would it be more interesting as one?

It doesn't sound like a Death World (yet) and for the moment I don't think it would add much to catergorise it as such. Death Worlds are, according the Lexicanum, "[planets] in which the native flora and fauna has evolved into naturally aggressive and dangerous forms. These eco-systems are finely balanced between continual destruction and lightning-fast reproduction. Death worlds take many forms, ranging from jungle-covered hell-holes with carnivorous plants and animals to barren, volcanic wastelands racked by ion storms. [...] Humans can, and do, live on these worlds, but it is a never-ending struggle. On many death worlds it is as if the entire bio-mass of the planet were consciously motivated against human settlement - concentrating forces against intruders to destroy them. Death worlds with human settlements or colonies can have populations of 1,000 to 15,000,000. [...] Death worlds are not usually inhabited, and are nearly impossible to colonise but still need to be explored, which means the establishment of outposts and other support facilities." (Warhammer 40'000 3rd Edition rulebook)

A Death World would create a situation where your Chapter has a very low recruitment rate because there's so few people around to take in as aspirants so you'd have to find a workaround of some kind or not categorise Patuger as one.

 

 

Could Patuger be a Knight World with the major clans being descended from the Knight Households? What, if anything, would this add?

With water everyhwere? I doubt it. And it would add even less to the Chapter than having Patuger be a Death World, in my opinon.

 

 

The Chapter has 10 Fortress Monasteries.

Fortress Monasteries are massive fortresses designed for a whole Chapter. Seems a bit much for a Company, no? Also, while I understand that these chaps are Iron Hands successors, this isn't all that necessary, in my mind. You could have one Fortress Monastery split into ten distinct parts, each a territory in its own right, with honour duels if an Astartes from another Company tresspasses or something. They are supposed to be one Chapter and I honestly think that having one Fortress Monastery is the way to go. Having ten seems like it's just another "special snowflake" and doesn't add much, if at all.

 

 

“Patuger” is modified spelling of the French word “Patauger,” the translation of the English verb to “flounder” or “puddle” meaning to “struggle or stagger haplessly or clumsily in water or mud” or “dabble or wallow in mud or shallow water.”

That is neat. It hadn't crossed my mind.

 

 

I would like this to read as a conspiracy.

A conspiracy? Concerning whom? What is the end goal?

 

 

Identical to the Iron Hands. Is modification needed?

You already have a number of similarities with the Iron Hands (Clan Companies, seperate Fortress Monasteries, AdMech as close allies, and now a Chapter Council). I'd suggest pick two of those four. Also, how does the traditional love for metal over flesh appear in your Chapter? Is it a thing? If not, why not?

 

 

Captain Filoux

A "filou" is a dishonest man who seeks to steal from people. It's also a way of calling a smart/sly child. As a French speaker, it doesn't sound too good a name for a Space Marine, but that's your call.

 

I hope that helped somewhat. And sincere apologies that I didn't get around to providing you with feedbacks sooner, as promised in my PM's. I got distracted by a number of things then subsequently completely forgot. :sweat:

[Draakur]

Just a quick question KHK, have you used this Chapter symbol for another previous Chapter?

 

Various notes:

- Patugain or Patugan make the most sense to me

 

- liking the planet's mythos and potential mysteries

 

- I don't think making it a death world would add much, no

 

- some detail on landmass etc might help when you eventually get there. They're described as techno-barbarians but are on an ocean planet with a single continent's worth of swamp; where are they getting their raw materials for the 'techno' part?

 

- Bit of a random Q here, what's their stance on Dreadnoughts? Any lack or disdain or sll fine on that front?

 

- Re: Heraldry options: Kraken with a heap more eyes than the base symbol, Kraken with its tendrils ending in lightning bolts (I seem to have a huge thing with lightning bolts these days...), Kraken holding a trident, a side on 'Kraken Rampant' sort of rearing up, a Kraken wounded or bloodied somehow...

 

- I think some detail on character flaws, some downfalls and the like, would be handy. So far they strike me as a very cool, thorough, huge labour-of-love version of... a Mary Sue Chapter. Overwhelmingly huge Mechanicus support and all that entails regarding technology and geneseed and weapons, the pinacle of expertise in their chosen style of warfare, potentially housing a STC which would amp them up even more, etc.

 

I think there's possibly a culture of crushing ideas for even semi-powerful Chapters in the Liber before they grow, and let me be clear that I'm not doing that here - I like your guys :) I actually think you should leave all this stuff as is. But I think some balance, some character in there somewhere, might prove useful.

[NightrawenII]

Hello,

 

First thing first, is this everything you have on Chapter or not?  - Because there is a lot of things without proper expansion.

 

- Most obvious is their raison d'etre: to deal with Moraie Schism. ~ It took the Admech 2.000 years to eradicate this heterodoxy, yet your Chapter is sidetracked after a century.

- Self-styled masters of voidcombat... ~ Why? Mind you, I'm not questioning the choice of specialty, but the very reason of this specialty or rather expertise in the first place. It would mean the Chapter regularly engage in void combat.

- Patuger ~ You say the people living here can be divided into two groups, but you don't explain how this is related to the clans from which your Chapter recruits.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[Donkey Kong]

Thank you everyone for your feedback! I can't tell you enough how much I appreciate it.

 

Realityburn

 

I would probably do the chapter organization slightly different from the Iron Hands, but still reminiscent of them.

Otherwise I like it thus far.

 

 

I'm glad you like the Chapter thus far. I'll be doing more to differentiate them from the Iron Hands.

 

Dosjesk

 

It would definitely stand out more on pale green armour.

 

I'll have to play around with a painter app over the weekend.

 

Why these two armour marks in particular? MK III has rarely, if at all, been produced since the Heresy. For MK VI, it might be more common but I'm pretty sure that very few are produced, what with MK VII being superior in many ways. The Astral Reavers being a 3rd generation Chapter (twice removed from their gene-seed source) would not, in my mind, have a ready supply of MK III. Couldn't they pioneer a reinforced version of the MK VII with thin plates of extra armour bolted onto the frontal areas (à la FW MK IV Destroyers) instead?

 

My idea was that MKIII would be used when leading a boarding action, not necessarily the entire squad but just the man on point. My idea for MKVI was twofold, that it would be better for mobility and aesthetically I like the beakie helmet more than the MKVII. The reinforced armor sounds like a good solution to issues with MKIII.

Deathworld no

Knight World no

 

So, no. got it! There go the Pacific Rim references.   

 

Fortress Monasteries are massive fortresses designed for a whole Chapter. Seems a bit much for a Company, no? Also, while I understand that these chaps are Iron Hands successors, this isn't all that necessary, in my mind. You could have one Fortress Monastery split into ten distinct parts, each a territory in its own right, with honour duels if an Astartes from another Company tresspasses or something. They are supposed to be one Chapter and I honestly think that having one Fortress Monastery is the way to go. Having ten seems like it's just another "special snowflake" and doesn't add much, if at all.

 

My idea was that there wasn't enough solid land to support a large Fortress Monastery like that, but enough for the Companies to have smaller ones in their Clan Territory. Nothing here is really set in stone.

 

"Patuger" That is neat. It hadn't crossed my mind.

 

The funny things that happen when you chuck "puddle" into Google Translate and a verb  comes out the other side.

 

 

A conspiracy? Concerning whom? What is the end goal?

 

Concerning the Adeptus Mechanius with the end goal of turning the world upside down and shaking really hard until an STC pops out. I wanted it as justification for the Adeptus Mechanicus maintaining a presence on the world or even choosing to fortify it in the first place while the Ad Mech was in a middle of a civil war.

 

 

You already have a number of similarities with the Iron Hands (Clan Companies, seperate Fortress Monasteries, AdMech as close allies, and now a Chapter Council). I'd suggest pick two of those four. Also, how does the traditional love for metal over flesh appear in your Chapter? Is it a thing? If not, why not?

 

Ha! Don't forget the Iron Fathers. This is probably for the best. I'll keep the Clans and the AdMech and work something out with the Fortress. My only concern is that the Clan Companies and the Chapter Council go hand in hand well. I haven't given much thought to the bionic fetish. Nothing on the Red Talons indicates one way or another.

 

 

A "filou" is a dishonest man who seeks to steal from people. It's also a way of calling a smart/sly child. As a French speaker, it doesn't sound too good a name for a Space Marine, but that's your call.

 

That's interesting. The funniest thing about this is that "Filoux" was one of the earliest Characters I've had along with Thussaud. I changed the spelling from Filo to Filoux a while ago.

 

Draakur

Just a quick question KHK, have you used this Chapter symbol for another previous Chapter?

 

Same Chapter, different iteration. I was going to write a little introduction talking about how I've been working on and off on the Astral Reavers for almost 8 years before I posted everything up and fell asleep last night. All things considered, I should have finished that first.

 

- some detail on landmass etc might help when you eventually get there. They're described as techno-barbarians but are on an ocean planet with a single continent's worth of swamp; where are they getting their raw materials for the 'techno' part?

 

It probably wouldn't surprise you to learn that I haven't really sorted that out yet. I don't know what I want the world to look like technologically.

 

- Bit of a random Q here, what's their stance on Dreadnoughts? Any lack or disdain or sll fine on that front?

 

I imagine the Chapter has and uses Dreadnoughts, and honors their Ancients. I don't think I want them to be held in the same reverence the Iron Hands do.

 

- Re: Heraldry options: Kraken with a heap more eyes than the base symbol, Kraken with its tendrils ending in lightning bolts (I seem to have a huge thing with lightning bolts these days...), Kraken holding a trident, a side on 'Kraken Rampant' sort of rearing up, a Kraken wounded or bloodied somehow...

 

Thank you! I really like the Lightning Bolt Tendrils and Kraken Rampant, and I'll keep the others in mind.

 

- I think some detail on character flaws, some downfalls and the like, would be handy. So far they strike me as a very cool, thorough, huge labour-of-love version of... a Mary Sue Chapter. Overwhelmingly huge Mechanicus support and all that entails regarding technology and geneseed and weapons, the pinacle of expertise in their chosen style of warfare, potentially housing a STC which would amp them up even more, etc.

 

An earlier version more explicitly stated that the Chapter is notably lacking in heavy armor (tanks and the like) and that the Chapter was particularly bad when they did not have a mobility advantage. Should I bring that back or should I expand on character flaws? The STC isn't supposed to be an advantage, just interesting background noise. I'll certainly try and dial back.

 

NightrawenII

First thing first, is this everything you have on Chapter or not?  - Because there is a lot of things without proper expansion.

 

Yes and no. This is everything I have that I like in its most simplified form, as you've already noticed, without proper expansion (for a combination of reasons whether I thought it was unnecessary detail or I haven't put thought into it, probably more the former than the latter). Last time around I posted up a lot more, most of it filler, and it was a chore to read. This time, I thought I'd post up this skeletal version for ease of reading. I'll be working on a better middle ground.

 

- Most obvious is their raison d'etre: to deal with Moraie Schism. ~ It took the Admech 2.000 years to eradicate this heterodoxy, yet your Chapter is sidetracked after a century.

 

 

- Self-styled masters of voidcombat... ~ Why? Mind you, I'm not questioning the choice of specialty, but the very reason of this specialty or rather expertise in the first place. It would mean the Chapter regularly engage in void combat.

 

Is this too specialized? My idea was that the Chapter spent most of the Moirae Schism fighting in space, raiding space lanes, giving them that 2000ish years of experience there. In an earlier version I made the Chapter's claim to fame seizing a modest fleet's worth of traitor vessels by the end of the Schism. I imagined Patuger as an Adeptus Mechanicus project with the Chapter as an excuse, rather than a reason, for their presence on the world, so less of a sidetrack and more of a convenience for the Chapter.

 

 

- Patuger ~ You say the people living here can be divided into two groups, but you don't explain how this is related to the clans from which your Chapter recruits.

 

My idea was that the swamp people are a clan, leaving me with 9 more clans to come up with.

 

Thank you all again so, so very much! If there's anything I skipped over in my reply here, please know that I've read it and will keep it in mind. In the meantime, I'll be updating the second post and copying over some additional information.

 

EDIT: Quotes are hard.

[Claws and Effect]

If your guys specialize in void combat, it wouldn't be much of a stretch for their Fortress-Monastery to be located underwater.

 

Would certainly make it difficult to assail for those without some means of travelling underwater. Put one access point on land that is heavily guarded.

[NightrawenII]

 

Is this too specialized? My idea was that the Chapter spent most of the Moirae Schism fighting in space, raiding space lanes, giving them that 2000ish years of experience there.

No, just somewhat out of place.

 

I would imagine they would more resemble certain Chapter(s), who hunts its fallen members. The Hunter-Killer vibe rather than Boucanier... in space. The search&destroy being their mantra for the most time during their earlier days.

 

 

When I'm at it, you could use it as excuse to field some rare and/or exotic stuff - all of it spoils of war and trophies taken from apostates.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[Draakur]

On my phone so won't try to format my response...

 

- Yep, I thought I recognised them from years back. Ok.

 

- You're welcome re: heraldry ideas :) Some others, Kraken with stylised skull as a head rather than the normal shape, Kraken with some of its tendrils cut off, metallic Kraken with rivets/bolts...

 

- Thats not a bad way of balancing them if you're comfortable, sure. I find historical examples of how their flaws have actually impacted their reputation and progress through the years to be a useful descriptive mechanism here. Maybe they failed a powerful ally/someone they owed a debt to, due to inability to perform a clutch battlefield role? Something irreplaceable was lost and it tarnishes their honour to this day? Their tactical acumen/battlefield prowess was brought into question and now some Chapters point and giggle at them from across the playground? Or you could just look at other flaws and explore them more... /spitballing

[Donkey Kong]

If your guys specialize in void combat, it wouldn't be much of a stretch for their Fortress-Monastery to be located underwater.

Would certainly make it difficult to assail for those without some means of travelling underwater. Put one access point on land that is heavily guarded.

I've considered it before, but I was never a fan of making the Chapter's Fortress Monastery 'Sealab 2021.'

No, just somewhat out of place.

I would imagine they would more resemble certain Chapter(s), who hunts its fallen members. The Hunter-Killer vibe rather than Boucanier... in space. The search&destroy being their mantra for the most time during their earlier days.

When I'm at it, you could use it as excuse to field some rare and/or exotic stuff - all of it spoils of war and trophies taken from apostates.

~ NightrawenII

I think the Hunter-Killer vibe is an interesting one, very Ravenwing, but I would like to retain the Buccaneer traits. Can the two be easily reconciled?

I really like the idea of fielding rare and exotic wargear that the chapter 'liberated' in the Schism instead of having everything handed to them by the Mechanicus.

On my phone so won't try to format my response...

- Yep, I thought I recognised them from years back. Ok.

- You're welcome re: heraldry ideas Some others, Kraken with stylised skull as a head rather than the normal shape, Kraken with some of its tendrils cut off, metallic Kraken with rivets/bolts...

- Thats not a bad way of balancing them if you're comfortable, sure. I find historical examples of how their flaws have actually impacted their reputation and progress through the years to be a useful descriptive mechanism here. Maybe they failed a powerful ally/someone they owed a debt to, due to inability to perform a clutch battlefield role? Something irreplaceable was lost and it tarnishes their honour to this day? Their tactical acumen/battlefield prowess was brought into question and now some Chapters point and giggle at them from across the playground? Or you could just look at other flaws and explore them more... /spitballing

'Kraken with stylised skull as a head' Ha! Hail Hydra! Metal Kraken is in.

The historical failures are an excellent idea, and with NightrawenII's suggestion that the Chapter has rare and exotic wargear that was hard won from the the Moirae Schism, the Chapter would have plenty treasures to potentially lose.

In the meantime, I'll be updating the second post. With all of your suggestions, I have a lot of new material to work with. Thank you all again!

EDIT: I had a sudden stroke of inspiration, so I thought I'd subject you all to the visual catastrophe that is me attempting to draw. I doodled a symbol for the Chapter Apothecaries, with the big tentacles twisted into a Prime Helix, ideally that would be red. I made an attempt at a symbol for the Chapter Librarians with the horns on the Kraken. And I tried to plan out the "Thunder Kraken" heraldry with lightning bolts for tentacles including one with two big tentacles that look like a reject Mantis Warrior logo or Gatorade lightning bolts and two possibilities for how to position the lateral tentacles. Enjoy!

[Draakur]

You're killing it here, good stuff!

If I can give my own personal preferences here:

- I think 'yes' to the "horns bigger?" question for the Librarian symbol

- For the Apothecary symbol, are you saying there that you're trying to find a way to make the helix more obviously made up of the Kraken's tentacles? Cos if so I think I'd agree. Maybe having them curving in and out to cross over eachother, rather than at jagged angles at the sides like the typical helix, might help? Then have the tip of the tentacles still draping down the bottom crossing over each other, rather than just ending abruptly in the diamond?

- I personally like the far right lateral tentacles option, splaying out in all directions, the best Both because it looks a bit more intimidating I think, and it more closely resembles the original (not that any of these would need to of course, I just like that about it).

[Donkey Kong]

You're killing it here, good stuff!

If I can give my own personal preferences here:

- I think 'yes' to the "horns bigger?" question for the Librarian symbol

- For the Apothecary symbol, are you saying there that you're trying to find a way to make the helix more obviously made up of the Kraken's tentacles? Cos if so I think I'd agree. Maybe having them curving in and out to cross over eachother, rather than at jagged angles at the sides like the typical helix, might help? Then have the tip of the tentacles still draping down the bottom crossing over each other, rather than just ending abruptly in the diamond?

- I personally like the far right lateral tentacles option, splaying out in all directions, the best Both because it looks a bit more intimidating I think, and it more closely resembles the original (not that any of these would need to of course, I just like that about it).

Thanks Draakur! The horns on the Librarian definitely need to be bigger, and I think they should be moved down to where that first set of "spikes" is right above the eyes on the Kraken instead of the middle set. But, I'm happy with the concept which is really the best I can get out of these doodles. You're right on how you interpreted my Apothecary note. Rounded edges instead of jagged corners would make that better, and I agree with the tips of the helix (which I drew in my new doodle). I started off thinking that the three bolts all pointing downward was better, but I think the three directions is growing on me as well.

And, speaking of my second doodle, I can't really draw, but I can do basic shapes, so I have my messy "default" representation of the piece in the opening post, and my Apothecary version. So there isn't any need for people to interpret my handwriting, I have 2 ideas for what I want to do at the bottom to make it look like the primary helix is made out of tentacles, either the "moustache" which looks like an anchor at the bottom of the last intersection or the "cross" which replaces the final point with the two tendrils pointing upwards.

Another point that I should probably make is that the Apothecary Kraken is half an inch longer than the default one, which brings up implications on how exactly it's going to fit on a pad, whether it needs to be smaller, or if the apothecaries need to have one of the pads with a particularly long pauldron or if's a symbol that just goes on their breastplate.

I also got around to plugging the image Codex Grey gave me all those years ago into a painter (with catastrophic results that I don't feel proud sharing at all), and I can confirm that the Chapter Heraldry looks significantly better in black. And on the subject of colors, I imagine the Apothecary Kraken would be entirely red.

I've also been putting more into the second post, with a lot accumulating in the homeworld section which was one of my initial fears (I always write too much about too little in that regard). I'm still trying to iron out the aesthetic which is probably more important considering how big a role visuals play. And then the issues with the Chapter Organization and Fortress Monastery are still looming. It's nice to finally feel like I'm making progress though. Thank you all again!

[Draakur]

I do seem to like that wounded Kraken idea yes :D

 

Very cool :tu: Liking where you're going. Bits and pieces:

 

- I think the webbed toes etc is unnecessary, personally, and pushing the theme a bit far

 

- I love your breakdown of the planet's ecosystems and makeup, their culture and way of life, etc. You've achieved something quite vivid and captivating there even with fairly minimal notes-style writing, I like the planet a lot now. Bravo.

 

- Agreed on not making the Kraken just being a big gribbly on the planet they all worship/fear; again, there's such a thing as being too saturated with a theme IMO (ala Wolfy Wolf Space Wolves from Space who are Wolves riding Wolves wearing dead Wolves)

 

- The "family per clan" thing with all their intricacies and nuances can get tedious, being willing to flesh this out is a big commitment I think and can potentially detract from the IA, but this is a pretty personal one and obviously do this as you see fit. This is more just a thought of mine after trying similar things and finding that it all started to feel extraneous and long-winded; there's every possibility this was more my non-existent writing skills not holding the weight of the job.

 

- If not a wounded Kraken, what about something that symbolises being wounded, like the base Kraken symbol with one half the normal black, the other half red :P (Yes I'm really holding on to this and no I don't know why, please continue ignoring these suggestions lol I'm just enjoying them). Also what about an upside down Kraken? No idea what this would represent, it just came to me. More fuel for the fire anyway. 

 

Re: 'cross' vs 'moustache', I had moustache in mind when I was making my initial suggestion, and seeing these I think I still prefer that. Honestly though they both look fine, and you could go with the cross style and it'd still be looking boss. 

[NightrawenII]

Okey, time to be Evil.

>What was the Red Talons Chapter doing during the Moirae Schism? The only source I have is the 1d4Chan Wiki, but there isn't a citation and I can't corroborate it.

The Red Talons are specifically mentioned to have purged heretics in their own ranks.

Would a physiologic adaptation/mutation like webbed fingers and toes be too outrageous or extreme?

Well, no.

But you should ask yourself, whether would be the Chapter of Ferrus Manus geneseed, or indeed any Chapter, inclined to recruit supposed mutants.

For storytelling purposes, I want the people to be disproportionately civilized and knowledgable compared to their technology level, whatever it may be: Families with their own histories and heraldries, knowledge of space faring ships and humans on plants around other stars, etc.

planets

1. Some domesticated seal or sea lion used by the people as a pseudo work dog.

Could they be herders? - Manatee.

Back in 2003 there was a 'future documentary' on Animal Planet called 'The Future is Wild' (Looking back at it now, it's varying degrees of 'not good' and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone, but back when I was 8 and it was on television, I loved it) and one of the future animals was a funny looking squid-monkey creature called a squibbon (squid + gibbon, a little tree ape famous for branch swinging) that would swing through the trees using its tentacles. I thought it would be something cute to throw in.

Oh, I remeber those... Is it that episode which has the giant dragonfly harpooning hummingbird?

AUTHOR'S NOTE: The Swampland is new to this iteration of the Chapter. The swamp is a central point for multiple currents and waterways. The land is uniquely rich in resources (timber, clean fresh water, etc.) and the swamp people have an important political role. The swamp people control trade and the movement through their territory.

Control trade? How?

What is stopping the Sea people from taking whatever they want?

This reminds me of the situation on Chinese-steppe frontier. The Chinese were not that interested in what the nomads had. To their misfortune, the nomads were very interested in what the Chinese had. So, when the Chinese court has forbidden the border trade (which happened quite often), the nomads resorted to raiding, pillaging and/or outright war.

>Why is the Kraken so ubiquitous? Should it be tied into the legends in the History below, possibly defeating the betrayer? I would prefer to avoid simply having the Kraken be a big monster on the world that the people worship.

Errm.

The Astral Reavers should have heraldry before coming to Patuger, since it's century or so after their Founding. - You could say it's something picked on the way (or even after, you have 5.000 years of history to work with) somewhere else and brought with the Marines on Patuger.

>In one of the Forge World Horus Heresy books, Autek Mor, first Chapter Master of the Red Talons, landed on Medusa, took over a crawler and made himself lord, creating the Morragul Clan. Could the first Astral Reavers have done something similar on Patuger, adopting the Clan Heraldries as their own?

That's sort of wrong.

Ferrus Manus ordered the captains of Iron Tenth to fight and kill the leaders of Medusan clans, thus usurping their position in planet's society. Autek Mor did not 'create' the Morragul clan, but the (Ra'Guln) clan was named after him.

Edit:

The answer is yes. Though Autek Mor imprinted himself on the Morragul clan, not the other way around.

>Preferred enemy: Traitors and heretics. Iron Hands hate traitors. Red talons hate traitors. The Astral Reavers Chapter is founded to fight traitors. Pautgains have a legend about a betrayer drowning their world.

They were founded to fight apostates and heretics, but that's close enough.

~ NightrawenII

[Donkey Kong]

Thank you both again!

Draakur

I love your breakdown of the planet's ecosystems and makeup, their culture and way of life, etc. You've achieved something quite vivid and captivating there even with fairly minimal notes-style writing, I like the planet a lot now. Bravo.

I'm glad you like it! Thank you, that really means a lot.

The "family per clan" thing with all their intricacies and nuances can get tedious, being willing to flesh this out is a big commitment I think and can potentially detract from the IA, but this is a pretty personal one and obviously do this as you see fit. This is more just a thought of mine after trying similar things and finding that it all started to feel extraneous and long-winded; there's every possibility this was more my non-existent writing skills not holding the weight of the job.

I intended it to be like fealties with a powerful family and other families sworn to them. In one of the ideas I had before, the people on the planet were all descendants of uphivers, wealthy families that would have histories and heraldries. I'll be sure to take your warning and not get too tied up though.

I still have no idea why anyone would want a wounded anything as their heraldry. An upside down Kraken is probably more typical than the symbol I adopted from the Warhammer Fantasy Dark Elves (Lokhir Fellheart and the Black Ark Corsairs for the curious) however many years ago. And I agree that the moustache looks better than the cross. I'd rather use one over another than both.

NightrawenII

Okey, time to be Evil.

I wouldn't have you any other way!

But you should ask yourself, whether would be the Chapter of Ferrus Manus geneseed, or indeed any Chapter, inclined to recruit supposed mutants.

If Draakur didn't convince me before, you certainly have now.

Manatee

I love it!

Oh, I remeber those... Is it that episode which has the giant dragonfly harpooning hummingbird?

Yeah, probably, in all its 2003 quality CGI glory.

Control trade? How?

What is stopping the Sea people from taking whatever they want?

This reminds me of the situation on Chinese-steppe frontier. The Chinese were not that interested in what the nomads had. To their misfortune, the nomads were very interested in what the Chinese had. So, when the Chinese court has forbidden the border trade (which happened quite often), the nomads resorted to raiding, pillaging and/or outright war.

I imagined that the valuable trade routes and currents would be on bayous that cut through the swampland, putting it under the swamp people's control. My intention was for the swamp clan to be quietly one of the most powerful clans on the planet.

The Astral Reavers should have heraldry before coming to Patuger, since it's century or so after their Founding. - You could say it's something picked on the way (or even after, you have 5.000 years of history to work with) somewhere else and brought with the Marines on Patuger.

Definitely something to consider.

All typos and lore corrections noted. I'll be editing the second post. Thank you all again!

EDIT: Formatting

EDIT: More work put into the homeworld section. It really is a rabbit hole for me. While I love droning on about homeworlds, I think the most important thing for defining a Chapter is the Combat Doctrine followed immediately by the Chapter Cult, Organization, and Aesthetic so I am going to adjust my focus there in the meantime.

[NightrawenII]

 

 

Control trade? How?

What is stopping the Sea people from taking whatever they want?

 

This reminds me of the situation on Chinese-steppe frontier. The Chinese were not that interested in what the nomads had. To their misfortune, the nomads were very interested in what the Chinese had. So, when the Chinese court has forbidden the border trade (which happened quite often), the nomads resorted to raiding, pillaging and/or outright war.

 

I imagined that the valuable trade routes and currents would be on bayous that cut through the swampland, putting it under the swamp people's control. My intention was for the swamp clan to be quietly one of the most powerful clans on the planet.

But the trade happens when both sides of deal have something the other doesn't and want/need it. There wouldn't be much trade between the Sea people themselves, because they would have access to the same pool of resources. The situation with Swamp people is be entirely different though.

 

So there wouldn't be trade routes across the swamp, but with the swamp. And in such situation the Swamp people will need some kind of deterrent to keep the wolves at bay, so to speak.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[Donkey Kong]

But the trade happens when both sides of deal have something the other doesn't and want/need it. There wouldn't be much trade between the Sea people themselves, because they would have access to the same pool of resources. The situation with Swamp people is be entirely different though.

So there wouldn't be trade routes across the swamp, but with the swamp. And in such situation the Swamp people will need some kind of deterrent to keep the wolves at bay, so to speak.

~ NightrawenII

 

True. Is this something that can be remedied by differentiating the sea peoples, and having the tribes more specialized in their goods? i.e. the 'Metal Kraken' tribe has the best smiths and forgers and makes tools and weapons, another has access to the richest sand for farming, another has the best seals and manatees, etc.?

Drawing more from the ASoIaF/GoT Cronnogmen inspiration, the swampland in "The Neck" is a narrow stretch of land that is a chokehold for movement into and out of the north. The swamp itself is the deterrent, the marshes look like solid ground, and the animals living there are terrifying (crocodiles being the primary example). I know it sounds strange to want a "chokehold" on a planet that is entirely ocean, that marshes that look like false land wouldn't trick a population that is used to land not existing, and that if the platforms are simple timber rafts then the most valuable resource from the swamp is the trees of the swamp itself, but I think I can make it work. Another option for deterrents is the larger psyker population from the swampland, I mentioned before that I wanted the majority of the Chapter's librarians to come from here, the psykers before the Chapter came could control the land. For that matter, they could also be part of the reason why the swamp became so important in the first place, affecting the movement of water and growth of the swamp.

 

Another idea, is it feasible to move around the timeline, have Patuger discovered earlier, the events with the Magos play out the same (his search is deemed wasteful at the outbreak of the Moirae Schism), and Patuger is fortified, the first recruits are drawn from the planet and the planet is trusted to the Astral Reavers around their founding? It makes the Magos look more desperate to preserve a Mechanicus presence on the world. The Red Talons in the training cadre can have an established relationship with the Adeptus Mechanicus. The Chapter can draw its heraldry from the Patugains.

[NightrawenII]

True. Is this something that can be remedied by differentiating the sea peoples, and having the tribes more specialized in their goods? i.e. the 'Metal Kraken' tribe has the best smiths and forgers and makes tools and weapons, another has access to the richest sand for farming, another has the best seals and manatees, etc.?

It could, but it's the usual fantasy cliché.

 

Drawing more from the ASoIaF/GoT Cronnogmen inspiration, the swampland in "The Neck" is a narrow stretch of land that is a chokehold for movement into and out of the north. The swamp itself is the deterrent, the marshes look like solid ground, and the animals living there are terrifying (crocodiles being the primary example). I know it sounds strange to want a "chokehold" on a planet that is entirely ocean, that marshes that look like false land wouldn't trick a population that is used to land not existing, and that if the platforms are simple timber rafts then the most valuable resource from the swamp is the trees of the swamp itself, but I think I can make it work. Another option for deterrents is the larger psyker population from the swampland, I mentioned before that I wanted the majority of the Chapter's librarians to come from here, the psykers before the Chapter came could control the land. For that matter, they could also be part of the reason why the swamp became so important in the first place, affecting the movement of water and growth of the swamp.

Why would anyone want to go north?

Your problem is not the swamp itself, but rather the reason why would anyone want/need to travel through it.

 

 

Another idea, is it feasible to move around the timeline, have Patuger discovered earlier, the events with the Magos play out the same (his search is deemed wasteful at the outbreak of the Moirae Schism), and Patuger is fortified, the first recruits are drawn from the planet and the planet is trusted to the Astral Reavers around their founding? It makes the Magos look more desperate to preserve a Mechanicus presence on the world. The Red Talons in the training cadre can have an established relationship with the Adeptus Mechanicus. The Chapter can draw its heraldry from the Patugains.

The solution for heraldry is quite simple, it's actually shameful it hadn't occurred to me sooner.

If the kraken is symbol of Space Marines then that is... problem solved. Being as awesome as the Space Marines are, your average Joe the Barbarian would be totally in awe and adopt the symbol of these strange warriors as symbol of might and power.

 

If you want a little grimdark, only those families/clans/tribes who supply the Chapter with successful aspirants are allowed to wear it.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[Donkey Kong]

Why would anyone want to go north?

Your problem is not the swamp itself, but rather the reason why would anyone want/need to travel through it.

 

To trade? Or for the same reason the chicken crossed the road and people want to terraform and colonize the moon and mars, to get there and say we did. Although, yes, the swamp in GoT is more of a wall than a bridge. Problems, problems, problems.

 

The solution for heraldry is quite simple, it's actually shameful it hadn't occurred to me sooner.

If the kraken is symbol of Space Marines then that is... problem solved. Being as awesome as the Space Marines are, your average Joe the Barbarian would be totally in awe and adopt the symbol of these strange warriors as symbol of might and power.

 

If you want a little grimdark, only those families/clans/tribes who supply the Chapter with successful aspirants are allowed to wear it.

 

As elegant as that is, and it truly is, that would mean that there is a symbolic value to the kraken for the people to make that association. The current assumption is that Patuger is a world colonized in the Dark Age of Technology that hasn't been rediscovered by the Imperium up until this point. It also doesn't facilitate the clan variations that I would like.

 

Maybe there's another angle to look at this from in the Chapter Organization. Right now, I want 10 semi-independent clan companies that can all function as autonomous battle companies with their own internal recruitment and promotion. I also want those 10 clan companies to have their own unique clan heraldry in addition to the general Chapter heraldry. I would like to strike a balance between the Space Wolves cult of personality where the Great Companies are regularly changing entities that take up the heraldry of a new Wolf Lord with each change drawn from an existing group of local symbols (The Iron Wolf, the Sea Wolf, the Two Headed Wolf Badge of Morkai, etc. etc.) and the Iron Hands who have their Chapter identity and their set Clan identity. So, the Astral Reavers are first Astral Reavers with their Clan as a close second. How do I go about affecting the world to facilitate that outcome?

 

Also, any further thoughts on having the world discovered in tandem with the Chapter's Founding instead of ~100 years after?

 

[NightrawenII]

We are difficult customer, aren't we?

To trade? Or for the same reason the chicken crossed the road and people want to terraform and colonize the moon and mars, to get there and say we did. Although, yes, the swamp in GoT is more of a wall than a bridge. Problems, problems, problems.

Okey, the Almighty Why?

Why are swamp people so important that you want to keep them no matter the odds?

As elegant as that is, and it truly is, that would mean that there is a symbolic value to the kraken for the people to make that association. The current assumption is that Patuger is a world colonized in the Dark Age of Technology that hasn't been rediscovered by the Imperium up until this point. It also doesn't facilitate the clan variations that I would like.

Hmmm.

I sort of don't understand the reply here. So, two versions:

1 - Make the Space Marines with heraldry of kraken fight the betrayer and win. It doesn't matter, who they were... they could be group of blackshields from HH or simply unknown Chapter. Later, the history becomes legend and kraken becomes symbol of power, might and victory. The variation is simply facilitated by the fact that all (wannabe) powerful clans adopt it as their own symbol and you can't have the same heraldry as the guys you are most likely going to fight against... Can you? The Astral Reavers arrive at Patuger, hear the legend, get the gist of it and adopt the kraken either to fool the locals or as homage to unknown Astartes (or both).

2 - The Kraken was symbol of those (or their leader), who opposed the betrayer. After the victory and drowning the world the group fractured, either because of the usual squabbling among themselves or whatever, each adopting its own version of the original symbol. - Each could actually tell different version of story and blame the others for the Flood.

Also, any further thoughts on having the world discovered in tandem with the Chapter's Founding instead of ~100 years after?

Being tied to one area collides with them being founded to fight the Moirae heretics.

~ NightrawenII

[Donkey Kong]

We are difficult customer, aren't we?

Always. Besides, if I wasn't I'd lose you as my only commentator and be left arguing with myself, and that gets old quick. 'Help me NightrawenII, you're my only hope.'

Okey, the Almighty Why?

Why are swamp people so important that you want to keep them no matter the odds?

They're really not. If they're more trouble than they're worth, then I'll happily remove them and toss the idea on the now too tall pile of bad ideas that have been crossed the Astral Reavers. The swamp people are entirely new to this iteration. Before I settled on 'French' the Chapter was supposed to be far more 'multicultural,' sort of islander nations, port cities, crew of the Pequod from Ishmael to Queequeg. It gave them an entirely different character that I wasn't comfortable writing because it was all too much for very little pay off. I thought an interesting way to retain the idea was to have a majority population that was more or less homogenous (now the sea people) and a minority population or two that gave a small variation (I toyed around with the idea of eskimos around the poles, but I don't think it meshed well with a world that I wanted to be more tropical). Game of Thrones presented an interesting twist on this for me with the Crannogmen objectively as Northeners with very similar history but who are also also reclusive and separate.

2 - The Kraken was symbol of those (or their leader), who opposed the betrayer. After the victory and drowning the world the group fractured, either because of the usual squabbling among themselves or whatever, each adopting its own version of the original symbol. - Each could actually tell different version of story and blame the others for the Flood.

And that's perfect! I don't think I want the Clans accusing one another of descending from the Betrayer, but each one taking variations on the symbol and claiming descent from the hero (or maybe multiple heroes, or multiple heroes claiming to be The Hero) is perfect. For the first idea, I don't think I want to tie the planet into the Horus Heresy, but certainly the first Reavers hearing that this is a symbol of a hero who defeated the betrayers is perfect.

Being tied to one area collides with them being founded to fight the Moirae heretics.

Even if the world is entirely fortified and partially occupied by the Adeptus Mechanicus in the Chapter's absence and used primarily as a recruiting ground for the majority of those first millennia? I'm trying to address the issue of "who were the first Astral Reavers" with this one more than anything else.

[NightrawenII]

Always. Besides, if I wasn't I'd lose you as my only commentator and be left arguing with myself, and that gets old quick. 'Help me NightrawenII, you're my only hope.'

Well, of course. After all I'm the legendary Liberite, whose DIY-fu is legendary.

Even if the world is entirely fortified and partially occupied by the Adeptus Mechanicus in the Chapter's absence and used primarily as a recruiting ground for the majority of those first millennia? I'm trying to address the issue of "who were the first Astral Reavers" with this one more than anything else.

That's not it.

The Fleet-based Chapter would be able to move around the Imperium, and thus hunt the heretics wherever they hide, more easily than one with homeworld.

But you could say that nearby ForgeWorld XYZ was heavily involved in Moirae Schizm, was purged of the apostasy and the Chapter is here to make sure it doesn't slip into heresy yet again.

~ NightrawenII

[Nomus Sardauk]

Always. Besides, if I wasn't I'd lose you as my only commentator and be left arguing with myself, and that gets old quick. 'Help me NightrawenII, you're my only hope.'

Well, of course. After all I'm the legendary Liberite, whose DIY-fu is legendary.

Ne'er a truer word was spoken, we all stand in awe of your mythic skills and boundless wisdom. In fact, part of me has always wanted to see how my DIY Chapter, the Scarlet Sentinels, would stand up to your scathing scrutiny but the rest of me is deathly afraid to potentially see my work torn down and burnt before my eyes, like Rome before the Visigoth hordes...

[Donkey Kong]

The Fleet-based Chapter would be able to move around the Imperium, and thus hunt the heretics wherever they hide, more easily than one with homeworld.That's not it.

But you could say that nearby ForgeWorld XYZ was heavily involved in Moirae Schizm, was purged of the apostasy and the Chapter is here to make sure it doesn't slip into heresy yet again.

~ NightrawenII

I'd rather avoid the baggage of the Chapter trotting around the Galaxy hunting down heretics (Perhaps they could still send out task forces in the 2000 years that the conflict lasted). Perhaps a particularly Forge World dense Sector where the Moirae cult took hold in whatever arbitrarily designated area of space I can pick as my playground. I don't think I need to stretch that far to have even twenty or so to play with. If this map is anything to go by, the Calixis Sector from the Dark Heresy games has thirteen. Establishing the Chapter in a region of space also lets me more easily have a homeworld. So, instead of being founded to fight in the Moirae Schism, they could be founded to reaffirm the Adeptus Mechanicus Hold on Sector Whatever that has been deemed at risk for heresy. The Magos that finds Patuger can even be from one of those Forge Worlds.

The swamp people are still a thorn though. Do you think they don't provide enough and would be easier chucked?

Always. Besides, if I wasn't I'd lose you as my only commentator and be left arguing with myself, and that gets old quick. 'Help me NightrawenII, you're my only hope.'

Well, of course. After all I'm the legendary Liberite, whose DIY-fu is legendary.

Ne'er a truer word was spoken, we all stand in awe of your mythic skills and boundless wisdom. In fact, part of me has always wanted to see how my DIY Chapter, the Scarlet Sentinels, would stand up to your scathing scrutiny but the rest of me is deathly afraid to potentially see my work torn down and burnt before my eyes, like Rome before the Visigoth hordes...

It's really not so bad once you get used to the pain. Just remember "Fear is the mind-killer."