Weregeld what happened to Russ? *spoilers*

[helterskelter]

 

 

Curze: Was so hungry as a kid he ate people

FTFY

[RikuEru]

Okay because the entire thread almost left me completely clueless regarding Weregeld's actual content and "worth"

 

...is it worth reading? Does it tell me more of Russ and the SW? Or is it among the works that are better forgotten?

[Scribe]

I've seen reviews of it being better than the majority of Gav's contributions, but also some that say it was really bad. So I cant really tell. :[

[MasterofMankind]

Okay because the entire thread almost left me completely clueless regarding Weregeld's actual content and "worth"

...is it worth reading? Does it tell me more of Russ and the SW? Or is it among the works that are better forgotten?

It's a RG, or rather, a Corax story first and foremost, and the SW are only there as a crutch really. Nothing would change if you replaced Russ with Vulkan.

 

As a Corax story I think it's a good finisher to the whole RG plotline started in Deliverance Lost, but the ending is pretty atrocious and the writing isn't all that great. if you can get it but it's not anything to die over.

[Biscuittzz]

 

 but the ending is pretty atrocious and the writing isn't all that great.

 

Welcome to Gav Thorpe. We're still waiting on a well written RG story. Nothing about them kicking ass or being superheroes, just a story that is actually written well. Don't hold your breath. 

 

Edit: The RG get spanked basically in Deliverance Lost,  but I wouldn't mind if it was written competently.

[bluntblade]

 

Okay because the entire thread almost left me completely clueless regarding Weregeld's actual content and "worth"

...is it worth reading? Does it tell me more of Russ and the SW? Or is it among the works that are better forgotten?

It's a RG, or rather, a Corax story first and foremost, and the SW are only there as a crutch really. Nothing would change if you replaced Russ with Vulkan.

As a Corax story I think it's a good finisher to the whole RG plotline started in Deliverance Lost, but the ending is pretty atrocious and the writing isn't all that great. if you can get it but it's not anything to die over.

I dislike the laziness that's implicit in using another Legion as a crutch. There's plenty of stuff an author can do with a supporting character from outside the book's main focus - Bion Henricos, Zephon and especially Arvida are some of my favourite Heresy characters, period.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Okay because the entire thread almost left me completely clueless regarding Weregeld's actual content and "worth"

 

...is it worth reading? Does it tell me more of Russ and the SW? Or is it among the works that are better forgotten?

 

From a Wolf point of view, not really. Maybe the upcoming Wolf Cull will bring more importance to the story, but as already said, any Legion and it's Primarch could be substituted in the place of the Vlka Fenryka and not miss a beat. If anything, seeing multiple Jarls surround the comatose Russ was somewhat embarrassing.

 

from a Raven Guard point of view, the only value it brings is that it effectively ends the RG's continual mistreatment at the pen of Thorpe. Other than that, Corax continues to make idiotic decisions and the Legion continues to follow him despite decisions being idiotic.

 

all my .02 of course, maybe others found more the story more satisfying.

 

WLK

[Kelborn]

 

 

Okay because the entire thread almost left me completely clueless regarding Weregeld's actual content and "worth"

...is it worth reading? Does it tell me more of Russ and the SW? Or is it among the works that are better forgotten?

It's a RG, or rather, a Corax story first and foremost, and the SW are only there as a crutch really. Nothing would change if you replaced Russ with Vulkan.

As a Corax story I think it's a good finisher to the whole RG plotline started in Deliverance Lost, but the ending is pretty atrocious and the writing isn't all that great. if you can get it but it's not anything to die over.

I dislike the laziness that's implicit in using another Legion as a crutch. There's plenty of stuff an author can do with a supporting character from outside the book's main focus - Bion Henricos, Zephon and especially Arvida are some of my favourite Heresy characters, period.

Then you might be interested in Wraights advent release. ;)

[bluntblade]

Tell me!

[b1soul]

i might be thick, but i don't automatically see that as an advantage. the primarchs that grew up fighting on feral worlds potentially faced threats as grueling as a gladiatorial arena.

Angron's whole schtick is being incredible at 1 on 1 combat (but terrible at commanding)

 

If Russ (or any other primarch) is equal to or better than Angron at single combat, that would take away Angron's one thematic point of excellence...Horus might be the one exception

 

It's like having another primarch be better than Dorn at siege defence

[mc warhammer]

 

i might be thick, but i don't automatically see that as an advantage. the primarchs that grew up fighting on feral worlds potentially faced threats as grueling as a gladiatorial arena.

Angron's whole schtick is being incredible at 1 on 1 combat (but terrible at commanding)

 

If Russ (or any other primarch) is equal to or better than Angron at single combat, that would take away Angron's one thematic point of excellence...Horus might be the one exception

 

It's like having another primarch be better than Dorn at siege defence

hmmm, i get what you're saying but i don't know if every primarch needs an unchallengeable schtick. dorn v perturabo at seiges. or ferrus v vulcan v fulgrim at forging. horus v guilliman at strategy. or, as recently demonstrated, dorn v alpharius at sneaky sneaky.

 

it does work well with the idea of the primarch zodiac and each brother being created with a purpose, but it's also a little silly, because you have to find 20 different and untouchable points of excellence to spread across the fraternity.

 

being a killing machine seems to be entry level for being a primarch in the first place. if angron does have a thematic point of excellence, i don't know if that's it. or if it is, whether having other primarchs rival him in it detracts at all

[Mellow]

He's literally unbeatable in 1 on 1. He is the close combat monster. That's partially why Khorne chose him. Only post Molech and The Emperor can beat pre-ascension Angron.

[Runefyre]

He's literally unbeatable in 1 on 1. He is the close combat monster. That's partially why Khorne chose him. Only post Molech and The Emperor can beat pre-ascension Angron.

In your opinion.

 

My opinion is while Angron may have a higher chance in a 1v1 against his brothers in most cases, he would still not have an assured victory.

 

I don't think there really is a NO.1 dualing Primarch. Every battle has different circumstances.

 

Angron is a tragedy. He's a brilliant mind stunted from the start by the nails (which do enhance his ferocity in battle), but looking at characters like Khârn I hold the opinion that without the nails they would rely more on tactics than brute force. Just my opinion though, don't have any really concrete evidence either way.

 

*sigh* I'm beginning to feel like this thread has more than run its course. But there are several conversations of interest here that should get their own thread imo.

[Marshal Rohr]

There is no point in arguing over 1v1 matchups. It's the definition of futile.

[ZebraM]

My primarch's stronger than your primarch.

[IronDrake28]

My primarch's stronger than your primarch.

But, my primarch's smarter than your primarch!

[Loesh]

I never got the impression that Angrons 'whole shtick' was that he was a glorified beatstick. His rage and slow degeneration into the rest of the legion is what turns the World Eaters into what they are, for better or worse. His identity becomes their identity, and shapes their battlefield prowess or lack thereof. From an unbiased point of view, you could see some value in the barbarism and traditions he has passed on.

 

From my personal very biased point of view: Angrons a colossal failure.

[bluntblade]

 

My primarch's stronger than your primarch.

But, my primarch's smarter than your primarch!

Our Primarch's totally above this kind of one-upmanship. But he's faster than yours so na na na na

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Any further discussion of canon, Dorn or anything not directly related to the topic will result in a closing of the topic and warnings being issued.

 

Please stay on topic

[Augustus]

The Lion also had to send part of his fleet under Corswain back to Caliban to pick up new recruits because they had taken big losses against the Night Lords and all. Too bad there was a schism brewing at home.

 

White Scars were bleeding themselves dry to the point the Khan almost threw the Legion away because the chance of getting to Terra was tiny and he'd rather go out fighting.

 

Imperial Fists also took massive losses at Phall - they did well up to a point, and then disengaged upon being recalled, taking big hits in the process and turning a winning battle into a costly stalemate.

 

Everybody got run into the ground, especially in the early phases. The Wolves simply are a Legion that won't let go and replenish for long. Even when Russ was at Terra, it was for necessary repairs and he was chafing at his inactivity. They wanted off the leash again, being out there snapping at Horus's heels.

 

The Ultramarines took stock of the situation and tried to secure their own space which was being crusaded in, with two Legions running amok. The Dark Angels tried to send for reinforcements and kept going after Curze while also taking it a little easier in the relatively safe Ultramar. The Blood Angels had suffered greatly at Signus and had some time to adjust before heading to Terra. The Raven Guard went back home to restore their numbers rapidly, recruiting new legionaries. The Imperial Fists had it "easy" without large-scale traitor interference for the most part, building walls for years before the first real assaults. The Salamanders were almost inconsequential past Isstvan, and were mostly assimilated by the other shattered legions.

 

But the Wolves never settled down. I am not clear on whether or not they went to the Fang after Prospero anymore; Kaspar was supposedly put into stasis under the Fang after Prospero, with him and the Wolf King being at Asaheim. But then it looked like Russ and co were still limping to Alaxxes first - though Kaspar hasn't appeared in any material since Prospero Burns iirc.

Any clarification from Laurie on this?

He sent the fleet to look for Russ. Corswain sent one battle barge iirc and conscripted transports to Caliban among with Belath. Big difference IMO.

 

The Wolves were in good enough shape to, along with the Lion, go on a rampage liberating worlds before closing in on Terra on Horus's behind and forcing his hand. That lead to the infamous duel. I imagine if Russ' forces were just scraps the Lion would have left them in his dust.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

well I wonder about that...even scraps led by a Primarch are scraps worth dragging along

[Augustus]

True. But there is priority of Terra first. Russ must have had some leverage to keep the Lion from leaving him behind as he liberated worlds along the way.

 

I will be severely disappointed if this story line is nixed. It's one of my favorite. Ronald setting aside differences, forcing Horus' hand only to be late. Wolf King does give some credence that eventually they will meet up again. So many awesome stories to be told.

 

So a Wolf, a Lion and a Raven walk into a bar... By bar I mean warzone :)

[b1soul]

hmmm, i get what you're saying but i don't know if every primarch needs an unchallengeable schtick. dorn v perturabo at seiges. or ferrus v vulcan v fulgrim at forging. horus v guilliman at strategy. or, as recently demonstrated, dorn v alpharius at sneaky sneaky.

There's a big difference between Angron and those other primarchs...

 

Angron is literally subpar at everything except smashing heads.

 

Take Russ for example, he's a good commander and a good fighter...he's nowhere near as limited as Angron. Russ is actually quite versatile.

 

Why is there a "need" for Russ to be Angron's equal in close combat, the only area where Angron shines?

 

That would just mean Angron has zero advantage over Russ. I don't think that's the point of Angron (or the WE).

 

The Nails take a lot from a warrior...but they also give the warrior a powerful boost in CC (their sole gift really).

 

The way I see it, Angron has a single advantage over Russ and other primarchs...Russ and other primarchs have advantages over Angron in every other area.

[mc warhammer]

 

hmmm, i get what you're saying but i don't know if every primarch needs an unchallengeable schtick. dorn v perturabo at seiges. or ferrus v vulcan v fulgrim at forging. horus v guilliman at strategy. or, as recently demonstrated, dorn v alpharius at sneaky sneaky.

There's a big difference between Angron and those other primarchs...

 

Angron is literally subpar at everything except smashing heads.

 

Take Russ for example, he's a good commander and a good fighter...he's nowhere near as limited as Angron. Russ is actually quite versatile.

 

Why is there a "need" for Russ to be Angron's equal in close combat, the only area where Angron shines?

 

That would just mean Angron has zero advantage over Russ. I don't think that's the point of Angron (or the WE).

 

The Nails take a lot from a warrior...but they also give the warrior a powerful boost in CC (their sole gift really).

 

The way I see it, Angron has a single advantage over Russ and other primarchs...Russ and other primarchs have advantages over Angron in every other area.

if you'd like to repost in a new topic, i'd be happy to continue there. i'll leave this here though in respect to the mod's warning

[HeritorA]

Okay because the entire thread almost left me completely clueless regarding Weregeld's actual content and "worth"

...is it worth reading? Does it tell me more of Russ and the SW? Or is it among the works that are better forgotten?

It's a RG, or rather, a Corax story first and foremost, and the SW are only there as a crutch really. Nothing would change if you replaced Russ with Vulkan.

As a Corax story I think it's a good finisher to the whole RG plotline started in Deliverance Lost, but the ending is pretty atrocious and the writing isn't all that great. if you can get it but it's not anything to die over.

Sadly, it is all true.

True. But there is priority of Terra first. Russ must have had some leverage to keep the Lion from leaving him behind as he liberated worlds along the way.

I will be severely disappointed if this story line is nixed. It's one of my favorite. Ronald setting aside differences, forcing Horus' hand only to be late. Wolf King does give some credence that eventually they will meet up again. So many awesome stories to be told.

So a Wolf, a Lion and a Raven walk into a bar... By bar I mean warzone

No Lion where sadly :(