DeStinyFiSh Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 I am dropping the infiltrators from my list after the extra nerf, they got nerfed bad with 8th, and now loosing all those attacks. I will take another dunecrawler instead. Up to now they have been rather strong in 8th... despite the fact that thy cant hurt AVs so easily nothing has changed compared to 7th, but they can be placed as shock troops instead of infiltrate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorakitai Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 I am dropping the infiltrators from my list after the extra nerf, they got nerfed bad with 8th, and now loosing all those attacks. I will take another dunecrawler instead. Up to now they have been rather strong in 8th... despite the fact that thy cant hurt AVs so easily nothing has changed compared to 7th, but they can be placed as shock troops instead of infiltrate. A lot more has changed since 7th than vehicle killing ability. They have fewer attacks, even more so on the charge. Their attacks are worse at wounding toughness 4, which is ubiquitous. Neirostatic aura is shorter ranged and does next to nothing. They are far slower. They are more vulnerable to small arms (except tau ones, amusingly) while less vulnerable to things like scatter lasers. Finally, infiltrate works differently. If you want shock troops, bring electropriests. 10 corpuscarii will both outshoot and outfight infiltrators, and are more surviveable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogfender Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 So is anyone allying in some inquisitors or guard to piggy back some rides in or can skit/adm still not do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magos Takatus Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 If you want shock troops, bring electropriests. How appropriate. :p It does sound like Infiltrators were hit pretty hard. It's a shame because the Neurostatic Aurawas quite an interesting ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teun135 Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 (edited) "If you are using points, you only pay the points for the models you actually have in an understrength unit (and any wargear they are equipped with)." You quoted that wrong. Pg. 242 "Understrength Units"- "Each unit's datasheet will describe how many models make up that unit. Sometimes you may find that you do not have enough models to field a minimum-sized unit; if this is the case, you can still include one unit of that type in your army with as many models as you have available. If you are using points, you must still pay the points cost as if you had a minimum-sized unit, even thought it contains fewer models. An understrength unit still takes up the appropriate slot in a Detachment." EDIT: I did not see the errata before making this post. I see that I am wrong now. However, you can still only have 1 understrength unit of a given type in an army, so I don't think it will have that big of an effect in the game. Edited July 3, 2017 by Teun135 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger9gamer Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 So is anyone allying in some inquisitors or guard to piggy back some rides in or can skit/adm still not do that? I'm planning on getting some guard vehicles sometime soon. Probably going for something like 3 leman russ tanks, 2 taurus's and some custom made sabre platforms. also might bring some FW vultures or a Macharius vanquisher sometime in the future... also have the idea to use some tech thralls as guard squads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silentz Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 "If you are using points, you only pay the points for the models you actually have in an understrength unit (and any wargear they are equipped with)." You quoted that wrong. Pg. 242 "Understrength Units"- "Each unit's datasheet will describe how many models make up that unit. Sometimes you may find that you do not have enough models to field a minimum-sized unit; if this is the case, you can still include one unit of that type in your army with as many models as you have available. If you are using points, you must still pay the points cost as if you had a minimum-sized unit, even thought it contains fewer models. An understrength unit still takes up the appropriate slot in a Detachment." EDIT: I did not see the errata before making this post. I see that I am wrong now. However, you can still only have 1 understrength unit of a given type in an army, so I don't think it will have that big of an effect in the game. Yes, we are on the same page here. You can't take a unit of 1 vanguard and another unit of 1 vanguard... you'd have to form them into an (still understrength) 2 vanguard unit. People will still find a way to Game this somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swan-of-War Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 So is anyone allying in some inquisitors or guard to piggy back some rides in or can skit/adm still not do that? Ad Mech can't piggy back in other transports so far. That said, I do plan on allying a Vanguard of Militarum Tempestus: Command Squads and Taurox Primes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicHat Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Can only take 1 command squad for every commander in the detachment though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munocat Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 I am dropping the infiltrators from my list after the extra nerf, they got nerfed bad with 8th, and now loosing all those attacks. I will take another dunecrawler instead. Up to now they have been rather strong in 8th... despite the fact that thy cant hurt AVs so easily nothing has changed compared to 7th, but they can be placed as shock troops instead of infiltrate. A lot more has changed since 7th than vehicle killing ability. They have fewer attacks, even more so on the charge. Their attacks are worse at wounding toughness 4, which is ubiquitous. Neirostatic aura is shorter ranged and does next to nothing. They are far slower. They are more vulnerable to small arms (except tau ones, amusingly) while less vulnerable to things like scatter lasers. Finally, infiltrate works differently. If you want shock troops, bring electropriests. 10 corpuscarii will both outshoot and outfight infiltrators, and are more surviveable. With the loss of FNP, has made the surviving some what frustrating. In 7th we had 4 attacks for princept and 3 each for the rest when you bring the taser goads and pistol. Sad, I liked the units, have not tried the power swords versions in 8th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulGlaive Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Man the hit to infiltrators is a real bummer. I really wanted to run 2 squads and an Eversor or 2 (4-5 Ammonius 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeStinyFiSh Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 I am dropping the infiltrators from my list after the extra nerf, they got nerfed bad with 8th, and now loosing all those attacks. I will take another dunecrawler instead. Up to now they have been rather strong in 8th... despite the fact that thy cant hurt AVs so easily nothing has changed compared to 7th, but they can be placed as shock troops instead of infiltrate. A lot more has changed since 7th than vehicle killing ability. They have fewer attacks, even more so on the charge. Their attacks are worse at wounding toughness 4, which is ubiquitous. Neirostatic aura is shorter ranged and does next to nothing. They are far slower. They are more vulnerable to small arms (except tau ones, amusingly) while less vulnerable to things like scatter lasers. Finally, infiltrate works differently. If you want shock troops, bring electropriests. 10 corpuscarii will both outshoot and outfight infiltrators, and are more surviveable. True that, I blacked out most of the 7th rules already and only had the weapon stats in mind But still, up to now I have been realy impressed with the Infiltrators thanks to the new "Pop out 9" away without getting shot in advance" rule. Even with infiltrate and the +3" to every move it was hard to get a first turn charge of... or even get them into range for the Uzis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munocat Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 I ran the power sword version tonight, seems ok, the hit like old version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 Kastellans... I have 4 and 2 Datasmiths all with triple Phosphor, what would be best best way to run then? Two units of 2 or one big unit of 4? Advantages/ disadvantages of both? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeStinyFiSh Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 Kastellans... I have 4 and 2 Datasmiths all with triple Phosphor, what would be best best way to run then? Two units of 2 or one big unit of 4? Advantages/ disadvantages of both? 2x2 Benefits: If 1 unit gets tied up, you can get out of CC and shoot it with the other one. If there is 1 squat, there will be only 1 Kastellan be wounded and it can only be healed once. If you split them, there is a chance the opponent shoots at both squats, so that 2 can be healed by your Tech Priests / Datasmiths. And of course, you are more flexible if you need to spread them out. Disadvantage: You need 1 more Heavy slot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 I can deal with that disadvantage for sure ;) Taking a Battalion with the following for 97 Power and a total for 6 command points. Cawl Dominus - Stubber & Volkite 10 Vanguard - 3x Plasma, Taser, Phosphor Pistol, Omnispex 10 Vanguard - 3x Arc, Data Tether 10 Vanguard - 3x Aquebus, Data Tether 3 Breacher - Torsion Cannons 3 Destroyers - 2x Grav & Phosphor, 1x Plasma & Flamer 2 x2 Kastellan - 3x Phosphor 2 Datasmith Aegis Line - Quadgun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger9gamer Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 I can deal with that disadvantage for sure Taking a Battalion with the following for 97 Power and a total for 6 command points. Cawl Dominus - Stubber & Volkite 10 Vanguard - 3x Plasma, Taser, Phosphor Pistol, Omnispex 10 Vanguard - 3x Arc, Data Tether 10 Vanguard - 3x Aquebus, Data Tether 3 Breacher - Torsion Cannons 3 Destroyers - 2x Grav & Phosphor, 1x Plasma & Flamer 2 x2 Kastellan - 3x Phosphor 2 Datasmith Aegis Line - Quadgun in all honesty that heavy support slot is a huge disadvantage for when you want to run onagers too. even in the spearhead lists I make I still have to have 1 squad of 4 and 1 squad of 2 to keep all four onagers in my list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 Currently don't own any Onagers so not a huge problem yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steerpike_ Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 Kastellans... I have 4 and 2 Datasmiths all with triple Phosphor, what would be best best way to run then? Two units of 2 or one big unit of 4? Advantages/ disadvantages of both? Don't underestimate the potential for a datasmith getting sniped. Combining the Kastelans makes it much easier to change the protocol, as you still bring 2 datasmiths. There's no rule about not getting to try again with the second datasmith if the first rolls a one to change the protocol. The main con is that your screen needs to be rock solid, as it becomes twice as easy to tarpit the bunch in a unit of 4. (And it doesn't look like you are currently bringing enough infantry to make one) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicHat Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 A single datasmith can change 2 units, if within range of them of course. I am not sure on two datasmiths giving two chances though, the wording seems not as clear as other abilities in that regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steerpike_ Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 A single datasmith can change 2 units, if within range of them of course. I am not sure on two datasmiths giving two chances though, the wording seems not as clear as other abilities in that regard. Oh yeah you're right. The rule is a property of the robots, not the datasmiths. I really like datasmiths just in terms of their value as a screening unit with some bite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancerusso Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 A single datasmith can change 2 units, if within range of them of course. I am not sure on two datasmiths giving two chances though, the wording seems not as clear as other abilities in that regard. Oh yeah you're right. The rule is a property of the robots, not the datasmiths. I really like datasmiths just in terms of their value as a screening unit with some bite. Yes. They are my go to elite choice since they are relatively cheap for their wounds considering they have a 2+ save and can repair any multiwound ad mech model. I'll be using them for heroic intervention and brigade tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicHat Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Datasmiths Master of Machines can only repair Kastelan, but I still think he is alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Kastellans... I have 4 and 2 Datasmiths all with triple Phosphor, what would be best best way to run then? Two units of 2 or one big unit of 4? Advantages/ disadvantages of both? Don't underestimate the potential for a datasmith getting sniped. Combining the Kastelans makes it much easier to change the protocol, as you still bring 2 datasmiths. There's no rule about not getting to try again with the second datasmith if the first rolls a one to change the protocol. The main con is that your screen needs to be rock solid, as it becomes twice as easy to tarpit the bunch in a unit of 4. (And it doesn't look like you are currently bringing enough infantry to make one) Screen will be 20 Skitarii I suppose... As I'd like to keep the aquebus squad back. Good points though - I think I'll keep them in 2 units of 2 with Cawl nearby. Dominus will buff the Kataphron and some Skitarii while the rest move up as needed. I'm fully expecting to lose ahahah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancerusso Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Datasmiths Master of Machines can only repair Kastelan, but I still think he is alright. Are you sure? I haven't my book with me but I thought it just said model generically. Enginseers says just vehicles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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