8th Ed BA Tactica.

[Helias_Tancred]

 

Special weapons on point spam.

 

Company vets with jump packs +1-2 captains. Load up on special weapons (meltas, IMO). Come in turn one, and deploy around the captain. Enjoy your feth-load of meltas rerolling ones (meaning it's fairly safe to overcharge if you want plasma instead) and take out nearly any priority target.

 

Plus the company vets give the captain look out sir! Plasma, might be better to go gunslinger plasma pistols on vanguard vets

(edit, missed company vets could take specials, not just combi)

 

VV are a point cheaper, two plasma pistols 1 point more than plasma gun. Less range, more zap. jump pack specials tho, BA company vets are unique. 

 

 

 Our V V can take inferno pistols too right?

[Ranwulf]

Some photos:

 

 

 

 

If you are using the Spearhead detachment, using mostly vechiles, you should know that is better to keep your armies a bit far away and DO NOT keep them in a line.As you see above, if you do, the chance of the enemy hitting two vechiles and stucking your army is HUGE -and even more - we didn't get stuck in CC with vechiles, now it makes such a difference that you do, because if you Fall Back, you LOSE your ability to shoot, making the unit basically useless. So mind your vechiles, and also, I suggest a flamer baal just to make sure the enemy is not that keen in getting into CC with you.

 

Dreads are good, the Furioso smashed through a squad of termies, but he was stomped by Magnus.,

 

Also, Psykers with smite are annoying, because Mortal Wounds can remove ALOT of wounds from your units.

 

Ran

 

Edit:Added the "Some Photos" part.

Edited June 3, 2017 by Ranwulf

[Chaplain Gunzhard]

This is really good guys. Question for you guys. How well will an assaulty BA list do without named characters?

 

Dante is my dude, and no offense to anyone here, but I just don't like Sanguinor and Astorath, nor do I like Mephiston's model.

 

So can I make a good assaulty BA list without these guys?

[Morticon]

This is really good guys. Question for you guys. How well will an assaulty BA list do without named characters?

 

Dante is my dude, and no offense to anyone here, but I just don't like Sanguinor and Astorath, nor do I like Mephiston's model.

 

So can I make a good assaulty BA list without these guys?

Yes. DC and Vanguard have amazing options for power weapons - even assault squads can get an eviscerator in other than a fist vet. 

But, the synergy is where its at.  Make sure you can get some other leader buffs in there.  

 

 

[dakkamasta]

I really like the idea of Vanguard Vets now. For the price of what a vanguard vet cost in our 7th ed. codex (with a jump pack), you now get a vanguard vet with a power sword/maul/lance. A 10 strong unit of vets now rocking power weapons is a legitimately useful unit now. Especially since with a priest nearby they're wounding most models in the game on a 5+ and cut through most armour, even terminators will be relying on a 5+. Always hitting on a 3+ is also a big deal.

 

Same thing with Death Company, however after seeing Lemartes' rules I just can't resist the idea of dropping him with two 10 man DC squads 9" away from the enemy and then charging everyone in with rerolls. BLACK RAAAAAAIIIIIIIIN!!!

 

Far too much negativity on some of these forums. I'm having a blast figuring out all these new tasty combos, and I'm loving the syngergy between units and characters to get the most out of their buffs. 

[durdle-durdle]

 

 

 

Plus the company vets give the captain look out sir! Plasma, might be better to go gunslinger plasma pistols on vanguard vets

(edit, missed company vets could take specials, not just combi)

 

VV are a point cheaper, two plasma pistols 1 point more than plasma gun. Less range, more zap. jump pack specials tho, BA company vets are unique.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 Our V V can take inferno pistols too right?

 

 

yepper, just they're really expensive.  you can take almost 3 plasma pistols for the cost of one inferno pistol.

 

had 2 more games today against tyranids, 1k points.

 

my list both times was as follows:

 

batallion detatchment:

-terminator captain w/ storm bolter and relic blade

-captain tycho (an odd choice, but i'll explain)

 

-2 tactical squads with combi melta sarge and melta specialist

     (2 assbacks)

-tactical squad with lascannon specialist (needed another troop and had no scouts)

 

6 sanguinary guard (one fist, all angelus bolters)

 

first game was against this list (roughly)

flyrant w/ stranglethorn (i think)

ground hive tyrant with scything talons

2x 30 man hormagaunt units

3x carnifexes

(i think another monster)

 

i went first:

turn 1:

captain and guard in reserves, tycho in an assback, lascannon tacticals in a ruin.

lascannon put 3 wounds on the ground tyrant, razorbacks moved up and killed 5 hormagaunts in one unit

 

his turn 1:

hormagaunts moved up and advanced (i didn't know they could do this and charge!  super fast!) but failed their charge.  the flyrant put out 3 wounds on an assback and moved within 5 inches of it (flying).  other hormagaunts and carnifexes were across the board because he thought i would bring in more units.

 

my turn 2:

tacticals jump out, and the captain and guard come in near the other unnamed monster.  tycho and meltas kill the flyrant dead.  lascannon puts 3 more wounds on the ground tyrant.  assbacks kill most of weakened hormagaunt unit (now out of synapse), and the rest flee in his turn.  other assback kills a handful of hormagaunts in other unit.  captain and sanguinary guard put a few wounds on unnamed monster, charge it, kill it handily.

 

his turn 2:

hormagaunts, carnifexes, and wounded tyrant move up and fail (really long) charges.  

 

we called it here as i could just keep backing up and gunning him down.

 

lessons:

-flyers go down to reliable shooting. even with the -1 to hit, tycho gave the 2 tactical squads reroll one's and i used a command point (to reroll a one on a d6 wound).

-the sanguinary guard and captain making the charge on the other thing was a long shot, but they murdered it.  d3 damage per wound is nice.  the warlord giving rerolls to the unit is pretty great too.

-the sanguinary guard should take plasma pistols instead of angelus bolters IMO.  the bolters are nice for shooting chaff, but i plan on using them as a heavy hitting assassin unit.  the pistols are better in that regard and can be shot in combat if the chance comes up (which seems to be happening alot)

-dual assbacks is great.  love it.

-tycho is an oddly good choice in this style of list i think.  he hits on 2's rerolling with his melta, and gives rerolls around him to the 2 tactical squads and the assbacks.  even if he uses both halves of his combi gun he's still very reliable.  he's cheap, and comes with a 2+ save.  an overall solid budget choice, i think.

 

we did a second game because i won too easily, i asked him to bring the 'ardest nidzilla list he had on hand.

 

second game he brought as follows:

-ground hive tyrant

-haruspex

-malceptor

-trygon

-3 carnifexes

-i think the flyrant too?  but it went down super early

 

my whole army shot down the flyrant turn 1.

 

his trygon came in turn one, and the carnifexes with it, boxing me into a corner (i forgot that was a thing).  he failed his charges with them though.  the other monsters moved up.

 

turn 2:

i focused on the ground tyrant who was like 7 nches from my whole army.  i wiffed horribly and my whole army shot + the captain and sang guard charged it to finally kill it off.

the razorbacks dropped a tactical squad and backed away from the carnifexes.

 

his turn 2:

the haruspex came in and charged the tactical squad.  the carnifexes got into position to charge next turn.  the malceptor psykered off a bunch of wounds from the empty razorback and charged it to finish it off.  

 

my turn 3:

the second razor stood still and tycho+ gang jumped out to fight the malceptor.  the captain got in 4" charge range of it.  the tactical squad continued to hold up the haruspex who was wiffing awfully.  the shooting took down half the wounds from the malceptor, and the combined charges of tycho, the captain, and the tactical squad just barely killed it.  the sang guard charged and killed a carnifex, then consolidated into the second carnifex.  

 

his turn 3: trygon charged the razorback, killed it.  third carnifex charged the tactical squad, killed them all.  haruspex murdered the tactical squad.  he wiffed the second carnifex, and i wounded it thoroughly.  

 

my turn 4: captain charged the haruspex and died after doing no wounds.  the sanguinary finished off the carnifex (but i'm down to 2 guard now).  all i have left is the lascannon tacticals, 2 guard, and tycho.  we called it here.

 

lessons:

-tycho's still awesome here.  rerolls for days for cheap on a tough body.  solid budget choice.

-sanguinary guard should take plasma pistols, not angelus bolters.  still solid assassin unit, killed 2 carnifexes by themselves.  keep them close to the warlord to make them super powerful.  

-don't charge a captain into a nearly full health monstrous creature who you don't understand, it's a bad idea.

-assbacks were still effective, though not as much.  still a solid take in my book, as long as you're not fighting a tailored army against you.  

-the relic blade is kind of meh, i think.  it still hit on 2's, but i think it's worth the minor downgrade in reliability for the thunderhammer.  3's rerolling 1's is still pretty reliable and the s8 vs s 6 + 3 straight damage vs d3 damage is probably more worth it.  

 

going forward:

i'm surprised how well i did both times honestly.  i thought i  would get slaughtered the second game (and the 1st 2 turns were against me).  i probably wouldn't play this list normally, but it seems fairly solid.  possibly trade out the sanguinary guard for terminators with an asscan?  idk.  maybe a twin auto/las sponsons pred?    overall i'm not disappointed.  soon i want to get some more jump pack guys in though.  i'm thinking a list roughly like this at 1k points

 

vanguard detatchment:

captain in terminator armor, karlaen loadout

2 company veteran squads of 5 with jump packs and meltas/plasmas

    still take their razorbacks as dedicated transports to be cheap chaff killers

maybe a land raider crusader of foot death company?  possibly with a tech marine inside?  with the captain nearby (or god forbid, dante), it becomes a whirring dakka machine, rerolling everything with like 40 shots per turn.  

[Jbird]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Plus the company vets give the captain look out sir! Plasma, might be better to go gunslinger plasma pistols on vanguard vets

(edit, missed company vets could take specials, not just combi)

 

VV are a point cheaper, two plasma pistols 1 point more than plasma gun. Less range, more zap. jump pack specials tho, BA company vets are unique.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Our V V can take inferno pistols too right?

 

yepper, just they're really expensive. you can take almost 3 plasma pistols for the cost of one inferno pistol.

 

had 2 more games today against tyranids, 1k points.

 

my list both times was as follows:

 

batallion detatchment:

-terminator captain w/ storm bolter and relic blade

-captain tycho (an odd choice, but i'll explain)

 

-2 tactical squads with combi melta sarge and melta specialist

(2 assbacks)

-tactical squad with lascannon specialist (needed another troop and had no scouts)

 

6 sanguinary guard (one fist, all angelus bolters)

 

first game was against this list (roughly)

flyrant w/ stranglethorn (i think)

ground hive tyrant with scything talons

2x 30 man hormagaunt units

3x carnifexes

(i think another monster)

 

i went first:

turn 1:

captain and guard in reserves, tycho in an assback, lascannon tacticals in a ruin.

lascannon put 3 wounds on the ground tyrant, razorbacks moved up and killed 5 hormagaunts in one unit

 

his turn 1:

hormagaunts moved up and advanced (i didn't know they could do this and charge! super fast!) but failed their charge. the flyrant put out 3 wounds on an assback and moved within 5 inches of it (flying). other hormagaunts and carnifexes were across the board because he thought i would bring in more units.

 

my turn 2:

tacticals jump out, and the captain and guard come in near the other unnamed monster. tycho and meltas kill the flyrant dead. lascannon puts 3 more wounds on the ground tyrant. assbacks kill most of weakened hormagaunt unit (now out of synapse), and the rest flee in his turn. other assback kills a handful of hormagaunts in other unit. captain and sanguinary guard put a few wounds on unnamed monster, charge it, kill it handily.

 

his turn 2:

hormagaunts, carnifexes, and wounded tyrant move up and fail (really long) charges.

 

we called it here as i could just keep backing up and gunning him down.

 

lessons:

-flyers go down to reliable shooting. even with the -1 to hit, tycho gave the 2 tactical squads reroll one's and i used a command point (to reroll a one on a d6 wound).

-the sanguinary guard and captain making the charge on the other thing was a long shot, but they murdered it. d3 damage per wound is nice. the warlord giving rerolls to the unit is pretty great too.

-the sanguinary guard should take plasma pistols instead of angelus bolters IMO. the bolters are nice for shooting chaff, but i plan on using them as a heavy hitting assassin unit. the pistols are better in that regard and can be shot in combat if the chance comes up (which seems to be happening alot)

-dual assbacks is great. love it.

-tycho is an oddly good choice in this style of list i think. he hits on 2's rerolling with his melta, and gives rerolls around him to the 2 tactical squads and the assbacks. even if he uses both halves of his combi gun he's still very reliable. he's cheap, and comes with a 2+ save. an overall solid budget choice, i think.

 

we did a second game because i won too easily, i asked him to bring the 'ardest nidzilla list he had on hand.

 

second game he brought as follows:

-ground hive tyrant

-haruspex

-malceptor

-trygon

-3 carnifexes

-i think the flyrant too? but it went down super early

 

my whole army shot down the flyrant turn 1.

 

his trygon came in turn one, and the carnifexes with it, boxing me into a corner (i forgot that was a thing). he failed his charges with them though. the other monsters moved up.

 

turn 2:

i focused on the ground tyrant who was like 7 nches from my whole army. i wiffed horribly and my whole army shot + the captain and sang guard charged it to finally kill it off.

the razorbacks dropped a tactical squad and backed away from the carnifexes.

 

his turn 2:

the haruspex came in and charged the tactical squad. the carnifexes got into position to charge next turn. the malceptor psykered off a bunch of wounds from the empty razorback and charged it to finish it off.

 

my turn 3:

the second razor stood still and tycho+ gang jumped out to fight the malceptor. the captain got in 4" charge range of it. the tactical squad continued to hold up the haruspex who was wiffing awfully. the shooting took down half the wounds from the malceptor, and the combined charges of tycho, the captain, and the tactical squad just barely killed it. the sang guard charged and killed a carnifex, then consolidated into the second carnifex.

 

his turn 3: trygon charged the razorback, killed it. third carnifex charged the tactical squad, killed them all. haruspex murdered the tactical squad. he wiffed the second carnifex, and i wounded it thoroughly.

 

my turn 4: captain charged the haruspex and died after doing no wounds. the sanguinary finished off the carnifex (but i'm down to 2 guard now). all i have left is the lascannon tacticals, 2 guard, and tycho. we called it here.

 

lessons:

-tycho's still awesome here. rerolls for days for cheap on a tough body. solid budget choice.

-sanguinary guard should take plasma pistols, not angelus bolters. still solid assassin unit, killed 2 carnifexes by themselves. keep them close to the warlord to make them super powerful.

-don't charge a captain into a nearly full health monstrous creature who you don't understand, it's a bad idea.

-assbacks were still effective, though not as much. still a solid take in my book, as long as you're not fighting a tailored army against you.

-the relic blade is kind of meh, i think. it still hit on 2's, but i think it's worth the minor downgrade in reliability for the thunderhammer. 3's rerolling 1's is still pretty reliable and the s8 vs s 6 + 3 straight damage vs d3 damage is probably more worth it.

 

going forward:

i'm surprised how well i did both times honestly. i thought i would get slaughtered the second game (and the 1st 2 turns were against me). i probably wouldn't play this list normally, but it seems fairly solid. possibly trade out the sanguinary guard for terminators with an asscan? idk. maybe a twin auto/las sponsons pred? overall i'm not disappointed. soon i want to get some more jump pack guys in though. i'm thinking a list roughly like this at 1k points

 

vanguard detatchment:

captain in terminator armor, karlaen loadout

2 company veteran squads of 5 with jump packs and meltas/plasmas

still take their razorbacks as dedicated transports to be cheap chaff killers

maybe a land raider crusader of foot death company? possibly with a tech marine inside? with the captain nearby (or god forbid, dante), it becomes a whirring dakka machine, rerolling everything with like 40 shots per turn.

Loving the info, thanks for sharing. Question with regards to Sang guard taking Plasma pistols, they are 7 pts compared to angelus bolter 9 pts, are you supposed to add the cost to the angelus pts, otherwise Plasma is a non brainer! It's not very clear in the wording. Edited June 4, 2017 by Jbird

[Silverson]

You just pay the price for the plasma pistol and that's it. They are just cheaper than angelus bolt guns

[durdle-durdle]

Also pro tip I realized we messed up. Fly units (like sanguinary guard) can jump out of combat and shoot normally but are still restricted from charging back in the same turn.

[NTaW]

Also pro tip I realized we messed up. Fly units (like sanguinary guard) can jump out of combat and shoot normally but are still restricted from charging back in the same turn.

Interesting. If they have pistols this is almost a moot point but if they have angelus bolters maybe it would be worth it?

 

Also worth it of course if you have a bunch of stuff close by that can help with some killin'.

[Chaplain Gunzhard]

 

Also pro tip I realized we messed up. Fly units (like sanguinary guard) can jump out of combat and shoot normally but are still restricted from charging back in the same turn.

Interesting. If they have pistols this is almost a moot point but if they have angelus bolters maybe it would be worth it?

 

Also worth it of course if you have a bunch of stuff close by that can help with some killin'.

 

 

Can you explain why pistols would be a moot point? ...all my SG are modeled with angelus bolters currently so I'm trying to find any silver lining there haha.

[durdle-durdle]

 

 

 

Also pro tip I realized we messed up. Fly units (like sanguinary guard) can jump out of combat and shoot normally but are still restricted from charging back in the same turn.

Interesting. If they have pistols this is almost a moot point but if they have angelus bolters maybe it would be worth it?

 

Also worth it of course if you have a bunch of stuff close by that can help with some killin'.

Can you explain why pistols would be a moot point? ...all my SG are modeled with angelus bolters currently so I'm trying to find any silver lining there haha.

They can shoot the pistols in cc, but not the bolters. So unless you just want the guard out of whatever combat they're in, you can shoot the pistols and carry on like normal.

[NTaW]

 

 

 

Also pro tip I realized we messed up. Fly units (like sanguinary guard) can jump out of combat and shoot normally but are still restricted from charging back in the same turn.

Interesting. If they have pistols this is almost a moot point but if they have angelus bolters maybe it would be worth it?

 

Also worth it of course if you have a bunch of stuff close by that can help with some killin'.

Can you explain why pistols would be a moot point? ...all my SG are modeled with angelus bolters currently so I'm trying to find any silver lining there haha.

Being able to jump away is almost a moot point if you have pistols. Jumping away with ABs could have some use because of their higher rate of fire, and allowing other units to shoot at who you were engaged with. Edited June 4, 2017 by NTaW

[helterskelter]

Anybody considered the sanguinary or terminator ancients? They've 5 wounds apiece plus wiggling the standard near their "parent" units (sanguinary guard starts as 4 dudes)

[dakkamasta]

Anybody considered the sanguinary or terminator ancients? They've 5 wounds apiece plus wiggling the standard near their "parent" units (sanguinary guard starts as 4 dudes)

 

Havn't gone crazy over the terminator, but the sanguinary ancient has good potential with large jump squads. Good for people who want to play classic 10 man Assault marine squads with a priest. Positioned right he can make 3 squads immune to morale which we only have to worry about for larger units. We only really worry about morale at 3-4 casualties and up, which for 4-5 man squads isn't an issue as you'll either be dead or have 1 model left. Could work well with DC aswell but Astorath does the same thing plus rerolls.

[Morticon]

Its appearing to me that small squads are the way to go. 

That being said, with the way it works for first turn, now - smaller squads mean more units, which means less chance to go first. 

(For those who havent seen yet, you alternate deploying units - and the player that places units last goes 2nd!!) 

 

[TheHarrower]

I have a Sanguinary Guard Ancient in my list with by Sanguinary Guard with a Sanguinary Priest. Giving that entire unit re-roll 1s to wound, immune to morale, +1 strength, and being able to heal wounded models or being back slain models is pretty big. Use The Sanguinor and have him as your Warlord for ultimate fun. You'd add in +1 attack, and the Sanguinary Guard would reroll hits. If you give the Sanguinary Guard Ancient and the Sanguinary Guard Death Masks units can get a possible -3 on enemy leadership. On Priests, Power Fist seems to be the way to go since they normally hit on a 2+. Power Fist still has them hitting on a 3+. Planning to pick up The Sanguinor. Don't have him current so I've been using Mephiston.

[Morticon]

Mask wording doesnt allow cumulative modifiers, sadly :(

Good catch with the fist on priest, though!!!

[TheHarrower]

Ah, my bad. Well, save the points on the mask for the Sanguinary Guard then. Just need it on the ancient.

[Xenith]

 

 

 

had 2 more games today against tyranids, 1k points.

 

Just a few things for next time:

Hormagaunts cannot advance and charge, thats genestealers.

Only a troop choice can come out of the trygon tunnel, not carnifexes.

 

Know your enemy and all that.

 

It seems like your friend is playing 8th ed with a 7th ed army. The tyranid rules have a lot to offer, and once he learns to take advantage of them and layer the bonuses, special rules and psychic powers he should prove a more tricky opponent. He should have been casting onslaught with both tyrants, for example, no more failed charges then. The horror + venomthropes means your unit hits on a 5+ now.

Edited June 4, 2017 by Xenith

[Silverson]

 

 

 

had 2 more games today against tyranids, 1k points.

 

Just a few things for next time:

Hormagaunts cannot advance and charge, thats genestealers.

Only a troop choice can come out of the trygon tunnel, not carnifexes.

 

Know your enemy and all that.

 

It seems like your friend is playing 8th ed with a 7th ed army. The tyranid rules have a lot to offer, and once he learns to take advantage of them and layer the bonuses, special rules and psychic powers he should prove a more tricky opponent. He should have been casting onslaught with both tyrants, for example, no more failed charges then. The horror + venomthropes means your unit hits on a 5+ now.

 

 

I was under the impression that two psykers can not cast the same psychic power in the same turn unless its smite. have i just miss read this?

[Xenith]

 

 

 

 

had 2 more games today against tyranids, 1k points.

 

Just a few things for next time:

Hormagaunts cannot advance and charge, thats genestealers.

Only a troop choice can come out of the trygon tunnel, not carnifexes.

 

Know your enemy and all that.

 

It seems like your friend is playing 8th ed with a 7th ed army. The tyranid rules have a lot to offer, and once he learns to take advantage of them and layer the bonuses, special rules and psychic powers he should prove a more tricky opponent. He should have been casting onslaught with both tyrants, for example, no more failed charges then. The horror + venomthropes means your unit hits on a 5+ now.

 

 

I was under the impression that two psykers can not cast the same psychic power in the same turn unless its smite. have i just miss read this?

 

 

Well, one Tyrant died, so the other could start casting :P

 

You're right of course, one cast of each power in a matched game. Really, this shouldn't be too much of an issue as most psykers can currently only cast 2 powers per turn, and they only know 2 including Smite, and you can only have 3 HQ choices in a batallion or whatever the force org is called. That means even if you take the max 3 psykers, they can each cast Smite, then each casts a different power from the race specific table.

 

 

Either way, the nid powers are strong, and they need to use them. Looking at it, the advancing and charging hormies could be explained by Onslaught being cast on them.

[vahouth]

Do the Inceptors have a place in BA lists?

At first glance I thought so, but then I took a look at their points cost.

What the what??? 75 points a piece?

 

Is it just me or their pricing is off the charts so they're pretty much worthless?

[Morticon]

Do the Inceptors have a place in BA lists?

At first glance I thought so, but then I took a look at their points cost.

What the what??? 75 points a piece?

 

Is it just me or their pricing is off the charts so they're pretty much worthless?

I dont know what they were thinking, but I dont rate them at all.  75 points for 2x T4, 3+ wounds.  

 

Nah, brah.  

 

For what? Look, the mortal wound thing is nice. The 6x S5 -1 shots per piece are nice - but EVERYONE will be packing as much heavy weaponry into their army as possible.   Dual-wound models are just as dead as single wound models.  Especially at 3+. 

 

In the near future, I see Infantry costs coming down.  They die far, far too easily at the moment. 

[Jolemai]

Worth stressing that Flyers are destroyed if they move off the board :/

Move on the board and move in squares as per seventh then?