RandomMarine Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 So I play IH but I saw the post in a fb group and of made me pause for thought and I think his argument stands up.Ferrus Manus was objectively the best Primarch. He was everything the Emperor wanted in a son.He was an effective leader.He took Worlds intact and with high technology ready to go.He was ready to listen to the administrstum and had no desire to rule.He would address problems bluntly and logically and recognized internal problems when they arose.He was no statesman. He had no desire to rule the galaxy. He would never have the same charisma as his brothers. But he never tired. In his words:"Rest? We were not made to rest; we go on, unflinching, unstoppable, unending in our strength. The Emperor did not make us for such mortal concerns as hearth and home, vanity or contemplation; we are his engines of war, his hammers, beating out the fabric of existence into a vessel fit for Mankind to inhabit." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 I dunno, those aspects kinda reminds me of Dorn. Who, I hasten to add, was the one primarch the Emperor chose to guard the throneworld. He was the one to be trusted with the keys to the house because he was the one who was unflinchingly loyal, to a fault. ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyCrow Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 · Hidden by Brother Casman, June 5, 2017 - too political Hidden by Brother Casman, June 5, 2017 - too political Ferrus Mannus was obviously the best Primarch not only for all the reasons quoted above, but also because of his innate political qualities. Not only was he legit equipped to win a handshake with D.J. Trump, but he also was Maggie Thatcher without the velvet gloves. *** *** This comment is for friendly funny purposes and is in no way representative of a political opinion that would be considering any political entity of M2 better at managing an Imperium than Roboute Guilliman. Link to comment
Scribe Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Ferris would be a top pick imo yes. It's arguable for a few to be included in the discussion, but if the goal is effective and efficient conquest removed of all restraint and human concerns, Iron Hands are a solid choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogWelder Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 While I may disagree with your assertion, I think another interesting aspect of Ferrus was that he never looked for affection or love from the Emperor. Horus, Guilliman and Sanguinius always thought of him as a caring father and were shocked and deeply upset whenever he did something that indicated otherwise. In the new Dark Imperium novel, Guilliman greatly resents the Emperor as it is revealed that he always thought of the primarchs as tools not sons. The emotional reaction to the revelation was so strong I thought he was about to walk up to the Golden Throne and punch the Emperor's head off. Fortunately, he seems to channel this frustration into something constructive ie: Empire building. I don't think Ferrus would have had much of a reaction to the Emperor not considering him his son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 While I may disagree with your assertion, I think another interesting aspect of Ferrus was that he never looked for affection or love from the Emperor. Horus, Guilliman and Sanguinius always thought of him as a caring father and were shocked and deeply upset whenever he did something that indicated otherwise. In the new Dark Imperium novel, Guilliman greatly resents the Emperor as it is revealed that he always thought of the primarchs as tools not sons. The emotional reaction to the revelation was so strong I thought he was about to walk up to the Golden Throne and punch the Emperor's head off. Fortunately, he seems to channel this frustration into something constructive ie: Empire building. I don't think Ferrus would have had much of a reaction to the Emperor not considering him his son. Indeed, Ferrus would have looked at it objectively. 'Of course we are tools, we were all created for a purpose, and to be 'human' is not that purpose.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Krash Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Beautiful write up. You also forgot possibly the best looking besides Fulgrim and Sanguinius. Or course this is probably subjective Krash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obscura Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Ferrus was a head above the rest of his brothers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_son_of_Dorn Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 The Emperor is a tool of his own will. He left his sons in charge because he knew they could do what he couldn't. Be human, figuratively. I always wonder what the Emperor planned to do after sticking magnus on throne though, scuba frizbe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronin_cse Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 I prefer Primarchs that still have their head attached....surprised I'm only the second to mention this ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 The Emperor is a tool of his own will. He left his sons in charge because he knew they could do what he couldn't. Be human, figuratively. I always wonder what the Emperor planned to do after sticking magnus on throne though, scuba frizbe? I don't think this is true. The Emperor could be all things to all people. If the Primarchs are tools, he gets Magnus to direct from the Throne, while a shard of Magnus does Magnus things in spirit form, and the Emperor works on the next step of bringing Humanity into the circle psychic races. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Ferrus was a head above the rest of his brothers. That's not cool, bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Aiwass Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosjetka Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Not sure where the "takes worlds intact" comes from but otherwise I'd agree with Olis and say that sounds an awful lot like Dorn. Who will know is objectively the best Primarch. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 I prefer Primarchs that still have their head attached....surprised I'm only the second to mention this I think we're talking about when they were all one big happy* family still. *definitions vary So I play IH but I saw the post in a fb group and of made me pause for thought and I think his argument stands up. Ferrus Manus was objectively the best Primarch. He was everything the Emperor wanted in a son. He was an effective leader. He took Worlds intact and with high technology ready to go. He was ready to listen to the administrstum and had no desire to rule. He would address problems bluntly and logically and recognized internal problems when they arose. He was no statesman. He had no desire to rule the galaxy. He would never have the same charisma as his brothers. But he never tired. In his words: "Rest? We were not made to rest; we go on, unflinching, unstoppable, unending in our strength. The Emperor did not make us for such mortal concerns as hearth and home, vanity or contemplation; we are his engines of war, his hammers, beating out the fabric of existence into a vessel fit for Mankind to inhabit." I don't necessarily agree, but I like your point and I'll run with it for a bit. For me, if only for narrative reasons, I think Ferrus should be one of the "best" Primarchs because then it makes his loss felt all the more, especially in the opening moments of the Heresy. There's a great moment in Vengeful Spirit.... (paraphrasing from memory)...where Horus says that Ferrus is the only one of his brothers that can appreciate war the same way Horus can. Other Primarchs know battle, or fighting, or brawling, or logistics or empire-building and so forth, but--in Horus's eyes--only Ferrus and Horus get how all those individual instruments combine into the orchestra of war. I thought it was an awesome moment of insight into that great uptapped well of character that is Ferrus. There's also the fact that I've mentioned a few times in other threads how Ferrus commands seven Legions at Isstvaan...as far as we know, that's the greatest single command outside of Warmaster Horus and Big E himself. That says something. I do also like how you point out that he seemed to have a certain self awareness. I always liked the Primarchs (and characters in general) who display that character trait. "I'm a prima donna. I'll admit that. What I can't stand about Monty is that he won't admit it!" -General George S. Patton, Patton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 I love Manus. I actually agree that Manus is possibly the 2nd choice Primarch. Clearly the Emperor regarded Horus as he's favourite choice. He wasn't just a motivator of his brothers. I'd like to point out that Manus was one of 3 commanders who lead the Great Crusade in its initial stages - alongside Horus and the Emperor himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obscura Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 That's not cool, bro. Relax, don't lose your head over a joke. :3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jokaero weaponsmith Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 One thing that has always interested me about Ferrus but has never been touched on as far as I know is the keys of hel. The emperor I believe trusted Ferrus above all others to guard forbidden technology not just from the admech, the imperium but his brothers. This forbidden tech contained tech that had been tainted by the warp whispering it lies to draw Ferrus in. And if my lore is true Ferrus trained each of his newly found brothers . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SickSix Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 I dunno, those aspects kinda reminds me of Dorn. Who, I hasten to add, was the one primarch the Emperor chose to guard the throneworld. He was the one to be trusted with the keys to the house because he was the one who was unflinchingly loyal, to a fault. ^_^ Yet Ferrus was picked to lead the attack at Istvaan. I agree that Ferrus was everything you would want in a warrior son. He is at the top of 'most ideal'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Aiwass Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 Yet the lot of you seem to keep forgetting Sanguinius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SickSix Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 Sanngy is too in touch with his feelings. Too human. Ferrus would be the guy you want. He's going to follow orders and not feel bad about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Aiwass Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 So are Curze, Angron, Perty... All of them were tools. Sangy was the most human, yet willingly died. Charismatic, loyal, among the best warriors, a natural leader, yet fierce and proud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight of the Raven Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 Ignoring the witlords who graduated top of their class in originality school with a meme distinction, if primarchs are to be considered tools, Ferrus Manus is indeed among the best. Possibly even the only one at the top since he apparently was the only one who realized what his purpose was. He doesn't wish for his creator's love and I doubt he'd care about getting forgotten a few millenia down the line, so the Davin gambit wouldn't have worked on him. It's still Rogal Dorn who's literally incapable of being disloyal (and not in the 'I choose what loyalty to my father means' way the Lion displays) according to either Black Library or Forge World's own authors, though I don't remember during which event they said that. But Ferrus is up there in the incorruptibility sphere, possibly because he doesn't want anything for himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCagh Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 Horus says it should have been Sanguinius that was made Warmaster. So I would say that puts him above Ferrus in Horus' mind. However, both are counted in Guilliman's 'dauntless few' (along with the Lion and Russ I think) so he's certainly in the discussion. Also, wasn't Sanguinius given command of the forces of Terra during the siege? Also, Kurze and Angron both realized their purpose, but no one ever talks about them being the 'best.' I'm not sure that is the best metric to judge them by Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 Ferrus was a head above the rest of his brothers. Lol, that was priceless! SJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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