Unit of the Week: Terminators

[Gen.Steiner]

"Memory of things seen on the internet"?

I dunno, man, I can't point to anything and go "THERE" but I'm fairly certain there's some kind of Terminator analogue unit that wears Gravis armour and has heavy flamers and rocket packs mentioned in Dark Imperium(?) or wherever the Reivers first showed up.

[Acebaur]

What ratio are you guys running your assault TDA as with regards to Claws vs Hammers? And are you deep striking them or still running them in a LR?

[Captain Idaho]

That's an interesting question. Ways I sees it, the penalty to hit and no more striking last means Terminators need more powerfists to ensure they get decent amounts of hits.

 

For my Cataphractii Terminators, I'm using 8 in a squad with 3 Lightning Claws and 5 fists/chainfists. The Claws get shot first.

[Race Bannon]

For my part, generally, all claws on one squad. This removes choice as they are all equal. Depending on the situation, I may go 3 TH, 2 LC. Deployment will need some work as I have not used TDA much in 3 editions (having effectively skipped one :( ), yet initial tests suggests the CC dudes are better suited to LR transport.

 

Gun dudes teleport where they are needed. I mean, it's the only way to fly.

[Kua]

IIRC this question occurred in the thread once.

I’d say slightly more TH+SS than DLC, like 3+2 for a 5 man squad. DLC termis are most of all ablative wounds for the real fighters, unless you are hit with something high-pen in which case you can try you SS 3+ to save one more body.

[SgtOrion]

I like the look of lighting claws on Deathwing squads. They don't pay a premium, so come in pretty cheap. (Just shy of 40p each) I've been tempted to try running a squad of 10 with lightning claws just for fun. I think if you're deepstriking assault units, you might want to build around it. The librian can cast veil of time on one squad and you can burn a command point on another for charge range. Deepstriking several squads at the same time should improve your chances of getting at least someone into combat. Deepstriking a single unit seems more suited to something like vanguard vets that have mobility to catch someone next turn if they fail the charge. 

 

 

BoLS has an image up of the primaris aggressors that were discussed earlier. I hope these aren't "replacing" terminators. I just want true scale indominus armor. http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/07/40k-primaris-aggressor-reiver-boxes-leaked.html

[Hooj]

I recently bought Tartaros teminators, whats good loadout or how do you play them guys? Also is Reaper autocannon any good?

[Alcyon]

I'm struggling a bit with the role of Tactical Terminators still. I was very excited for them to be good in this edition, 16 bolter shots and an Assault Cannon are pretty good against T3/4 infantry out of the teleporter, even with a 3+ save. But the Power Fists are rough with the 4+ to hit. Only 4 attacks will hit on average, granted they're 83% to wound against MEQ (T4) and still 66% to wound anything T5-7 including most vehicles, but that's still only 5-6 or so total wounds against ideal targets, before armour saves (models with only 1 wound are going to waste PF d3 wounds.)

 

A Chaplain is a huge help, granting a 75% chance to hit from WS 4+. I guess if you can set up your deep strike so you're shooting infantry but eventually charging something T4-7 with multiple wounds, that's the ideal. But then if you're landing, shooting, likely failing your charge, next turn a savvy opponent is going to move away and you'll want to Advance to charge them, wasting your guns. The benefit of forcing a vehicle or other Heavy Weapon unit to move isn't to be ignored, though.

 

It seems like it'd be much better if Tactical Terminators had the option of Power Swords with their Storm Bolters, which'd make them a more focused anti-infantry unit with the 2+ to shrug off small-arms fire. As it stands, I think I'll only be taking Assault Terminators, and then only in an LR or Stormraven. There's just too many other better mobile firing options, and I don't think the flexibility seems worth it.

[Race Bannon]

Didn't they usually hit on a 4+ in previous editions?  I mean against MEQ wasn't that the norm? 

[Volt]

I recently bought Tartaros teminators, whats good loadout or how do you play them guys? Also is Reaper autocannon any good?

It's a reaper autocannon, of course it's good.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Didn't they usually hit on a 4+ in previous editions? I mean against MEQ wasn't that the norm?

True, but on the charge you had a higher attack volume.

[Captain Idaho]

Also you have to compare your combat capacity to your opponent's units. Hitting on a 4+ when you're up against units that hit on 3+.

[Acebaur]

Keep in mind that it's not 75% with a chaplain. Rerolls happen before modifiers so any 3's you roll can't re re-rolled because they are hits. 

[Alcyon]

Keep in mind that it's not 75% with a chaplain. Rerolls happen before modifiers so any 3's you roll can't re re-rolled because they are hits. 

 

I think you're right, but this does boggle the mind (totally counterintuitive.) Anyone know why they decided to do this? I'm sure there's a reason.

 

Correcting the math here, it's 50% to hit plus (33% chance of a re-roll)(50% chance of the re-roll being a success) = 66.5%, meaning four Power Fists on 2-attack base Veterans will hit an average of 5.32 times, wounding a T4 model 4.44 times and a T5-7 model 3.5 times.

[Race Bannon]

 

Didn't they usually hit on a 4+ in previous editions? I mean against MEQ wasn't that the norm?

True, but on the charge you had a higher attack volume.

Wasn't that mitigated by Power Fists striking last though? The initial volume available could be reduced depending on certain variables.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

 

 

Didn't they usually hit on a 4+ in previous editions? I mean against MEQ wasn't that the norm?

True, but on the charge you had a higher attack volume.

Wasn't that mitigated by Power Fists striking last though? The initial volume available could be reduced depending on certain variables.

Which in turn was mitigated by the 2+ save.

[Acebaur]

 

 

 

Didn't they usually hit on a 4+ in previous editions? I mean against MEQ wasn't that the norm?

True, but on the charge you had a higher attack volume.

Wasn't that mitigated by Power Fists striking last though? The initial volume available could be reduced depending on certain variables.

Which in turn was mitigated by the 2+ save.

 

 

Which was laughable with only 1 wound and the massive amounts of AP2 floating around ;)

 

@alcyon: my only guess would be that because with all the re-rolls for everything and the better to hit ratio they needed to do something to tone it down a touch. 

[Alcyon]

For sure, toning it down is fine, but I think the save benefits of TDA still aren't worth it in the large part for 8th and SB/PF is still not a good weapons combo. It's rough that most ex-AP4 weapons now make TDA into Power Armour, and there are plenty of other ways to take Bolter firepower. 

[Captain Idaho]

I like having 4 shots per model after teleporting. Given how powerful infantry can be this edition, particularly Orks and Tyranids, having a unit of 8 Terminators dropping in and giving out 32 shots is amazing.