Mixed Heavy Weapons

[beat_ronin]

Hail fellow Guardsmen!

 

This is my first post here, although I'm not a new player. I played RT as a little kid (though that was more "pew-pew!" than proper playing). I started playing Guard and Inquisition as a grown-up at the tail end of 4th edition, and all through 5th, but 6th and 7th got too crazy for me. 8th seems like a fun edition I can get behind, so I'm back, and I always thought this seemed like a forum with a great attitude. So here I am.

 

Anyway, like I said I have a few editions sloshing around in my head (not to mention memory loss due to age!) but I'm thinking you can mix up heavy weapons teams in heavy weapons squads now? Everything can split fire right? I can't remember if you used to have to take three of the same weapon teams or if it's just what everyone did because it wasn't that effective to mix them up in the past. But now it looks like you can, and maybe it's not a bad idea. A couple of autocannons with a heavy flamer to discourage opportunistic chargers a little bit?

[Brother_Angelus]

The heavy flamer isn't in the heavy weapons list available to HW teams. It's just a specific upgrade item for command squads and veterans, unfortunately.

 

Mixed squads are fine in principle but for the sake of orders, buffs, and positioning, it probably pays to run matching units? For longevity you might want to run your expensive lascannons/autocannons with lots of expendable friends in infantry units, and have weapons teams bring cheaper options and chip away at stuff without drawing too much attention.

 

p.s. hello fellow Canberran.

Edited July 14, 2017 by Brother_Angelus

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Welcome!  I hope you enjoy your time here - and share pictures. :)

 

As for whether to split heavy weapons, yeah, I guess you can do that now.  Can't put a heavy flamer in the squad, though, as its not in the Astra Millitarum heavy weapons list - all units that can take one say so explicitly.  That said, I think there may be some value in putting different weapons in the same squad:

 

1.  If your opponent's always target your squad with (say) lascannons first, you can spread them out between several squads allowing more to survive to subsequent rounds.

2.  On tables with lots of terrain, you can cover more fire lanes with a particular weapon - if that weapon was all in one squad, you could only cover one.

 

There may be other reasons, but they don't come to me right now.

 

Still not sure whether its worth it - my gut feeling is just to take more squads with the weapon you want, rather than spreading them out mixed in with other weapons.  But that may be previous editions talking to me... you've certainly given me something to think about.

 

Inquisitor Psychologis Ruminahui

[Withershadow]

Heavy flamer is not the best idea, but rather than running 2 3x autocannon teams and 1 3x lascannon squad, I put 2 autocannons and one lascannon in each squad.

[beat_ronin]

See that's what I was talking about with the memory! I just kind of assumed you could take heavy flamers. Not that it's been an option for ages now I think about it.

 

@Brother_Angelus hey there, we may have met IRL. I don't play in stores much though, how about you? Went in a couple of Heresy events at 3D6 last year and I'm hoping to play more 30 and 40k this year.

 

@Dr_Ruminahui cheers for the welcome :) I fully intend to post pics, I'm big into the painting and modelling aspects of the hobby, being a part time Inquisition player! And your thoughts seem pretty sound to me, especially no. 1.

 

@Withershadow yeah, that seems like a good idea.

 

Dang, it's been ages since I've written on a forum. Going to have to remember how to quote people properly for next time!

[Brother_Angelus]

@Brother_Angelus hey there, we may have met IRL. I don't play in stores much though, how about you? Went in a couple of Heresy events at 3D6 last year and I'm hoping to play more 30 and 40k this year.

I'm northside, so my regular haunt is Jolt in Mitchell. Last time I spent any time at 3D6 was a Battlefleet Gothic event, which was organised by Dono too.

 

Maybe see you around once my BA or catachans are 8th edition ready.

Edited July 14, 2017 by Brother_Angelus

[NatBrannigan]

I've stumbled upon a Lascannon and 2 Autocannons being quite good by accident (I have 5 Autocannon teams and a Lascannon team so didn't have much choice! The orders you'll want to use on them (re-roll 1's to hit and re-roll 1's to wound) are just as effective for most Heavy Weapons so now we can split fire there's no reason not to mix them all together in the same squad. Not necessarily better, but probably not worse either.

 

It also means you can remove whatever weapon is no longer required, so if all vehicles are dead, get rid of the Lascannon.

 

the only teams I wouldn't mix up are Mortars. These should really be hidden away out of line of sight so it would be a waste to stick anything else in there.

[WarriorFish]

Welcome to the B&C ronin :tu: Mixing HWS weapons is something you can do now with split fire, so aside from mortars as Nat mentions some variety can be advantageous. For example you can dot your lascannons around so a single squad isn't a more obvious target as well as make it harder to avoid LoS from at least some. It also means you can pick the cheaper weapons as a casualty for further advantage.

 

A mono-weapon squad may benefit more from orders, as they're usually issues with something in mind (e.g. freem that tank) but it's probably more of a preference thing in the end. Mostly it's just nice to have HWSs be useful :P

[Mitchverr]

Well if you go krieger you can take heavy flamer squads (interesting concept) for the heavy weapons.

 

Overall I guess it comes down to what points you have and what you need, I could see 2-1 combo of autocannon and lascannon being interesting to use. But yeah, I would keep mortars seperate :)

[NatBrannigan]

Plenty of other ways to take Heavy Flamers. I don't know if it's an error that will be fixed in the codex but it seems that Veteran Squads can now take 3 Special weapons AND a Heavy flamer for example. And a Heavy weapon if you so desire.

[FallenSoldiers]

I like this idea of spreading the Lascannons around.  I never liked having my HWT of 3 Las targeted and obliterated right away because it's such an obvious threat.  I'm going to have to tinker with the idea of maybe 2HB + 1 LC per squad.  I'd go for Autocannons, but I'm not sold on them.  I loved them in 7th, but now with wounding T4 on 3's and doing 2 damage each (vs a 1 damage marine) it seems like an "eh" option for the points it costs now.  Maybe I'm overlooking something?

 

I'm trying out a list with 2 HWT.  One is mortars and one is missile launchers.  I'm hoping to hide one behind terrain and the other in a building or forest and pray they're overlooked for juicier targets for a turn or two....

[NatBrannigan]

My 3x Autocannon team took out a Dreadnaught in 2 turns. Lucky I know but they've been reliable at stripping wounds off lighter vehicles. Also decent against Terminators and the like where the -1 Rend and 2 damage gives you a decent chance of killing a couple. As far as I'm concerned if my Autocannons kill a couple of Terminators anything else is just gravy!

[Withershadow]

Let's be real, an autocannon team is only 14 points, making them back is easy.

 

The 2 wounds is bigger than it seems, with Primaris, Terminators, and Nurgle dudes runnIn around.