CCCP IV: Poll Thread and Initial Discussion (The Taurans)

[Woe to the Vanquished]

One of the things I like about the Warhammer 40,000 timeline is the impending damnation of your soul at any moment. Take a little too much pride in your accomplishments and Slaanesh or Khorne are ready to claim your soul. Look into the conspiracies a little too closely, and not only do you find they are true, but you'll find that you are part of them and that your soul is twisting in Tzeentch's grasp. Half of the Legions, noble of birth and mighty of deed, turned and were damned forever. It's a tantalizing line for all Astartes to tread. 

 

The Taurans could be that chapter that has walked the fine line more than once. Theres a reason the Ecclesiarchy is wary of messing with Astartes chapters. That lesson was taught by the Wolves to Goge Vandire's army during the Age of Apostasy, but it can't be the only harsh lesson they've learned. Maybe the Taurans bloodied the Emperor Botherers before that during the Nova Terra Interregnum. 

 

Whatever ends up happening with the Taurans, I think there a nice wrinkle would be an ongoing distrust, bordering on outright hostility, between the Tauran Astartes and the Holy Ecclesiarchy to this day. I also think that this MAY have a knock on effect of the Chaplain Corp being somewhat more idiosyncratic and concerned more with the Chapter cult than they are with Ecclesiarchical orthodoxy. Humility, piety, and sacrifice take a back seat to honor, strength through sacrifice, and deeds of valor. In diametrical opposition to the Holy Synod, a Tauran Astartes and their serfs encourage initiative and glory through feats of valor rather than minding one's station.

 

The Taurans have a hard time fitting in with the Imperium as it exists. They undoubtedly are a force for good, but they just can't fit in. Any time they work closely with all but the most independent of Imperial organizations, friction inevitably builds until the Taurans eventually withdraw to avoid a repeat of their Diaspora. Only organization like the Rogue Traders or Explorator Fleets and barely established colonies are places where the Taruans are freely welcomed. Like Don Quixote or Massai migrant herders, the Taurans are struggling to hold on to a tradition or a code of ethics that no longer exists and may have never existed. At one time, they raged against this and struggled to MAKE the galaxy conform to their vision. Now with the wisdom of millennia on crusade, they realize they are unique and a fish out of water in the Imperium at large so they stick to the frontiers. Unlike old Terra, there is no shortage of frontier where the dispossed and the unwanted can go to find their fortune and etch their names in the stars. 

 

-Vae Victis

[Zhiv]

I mean, there is still a stark division between the Ecclesiarchy and the adeptus astartes - many whom see themselves carrying the Emperor's (secular) work.  Which raises the question, how do the Taurans see the Emperor?  Divine or merely a father figure?  I would be inclined to think the latter.  This is also the reason the ecclesiarchy tends to avoid marines - they don't want to see another schism happen.  Marines serve the Emperor - and that's enough.

 

Chaplains being focused on chapter cult is not particularly strange, in fact, it's more common that way!  Also, a chapter on a penitent crusade might not be able to send away chaplains and techmarines to be trained elsewhere. 

[Brother Lunkhead]

Hello all..... lots to cover and little time to do it …… soooo here we goooo…..

 

 

Greetings.  It's a long haul for few organs, but sillier things have been done, I have to admit. I also agree that if and if we are going to stick to that, it should be explained - what happened to their founding chapter that they could or would not provide ALL of the initial cadre.  This could also potentially create ties and debts of honor that the chapter still carries.  It's the 'hawk principle again'.  If it is mentioned, it ought to matter - why else bring it up?

 

Here I thought they torched their fortress monastery before heading to their penitent crusade. Ashes to ashes, dust to dust - leaving no attachments to this world.  Both work and both work with the elephant's graveyard, with the marines returning to leave trophies - or tokens of loyalty. Maybe entering a such sanctum is privilege or maybe all the neophytes who became full marines are made to walk through the myriad relics, with chaplains and librarians reciting the chapter's history?

 

Speaking of things, how would religious cannibalism feel on such a chapter? Since they claim trophies, would they also claim the flesh and eat it to know their foes as per the organ that allows that?

 

If it is mentioned, it ought to matter - why else bring it up?

 

Fair enough..... lets extrapolate then...…. Crimson Fist cadre are brought in on the founding to ensure that training is well rounded to include heavy weapons tactics and combined arms (armor and such) and that the Tauran don't become a copy of the White Scars tactics-wise. Their mandate is very specific and they are not present to unduly influence traditions and culture. The return of Crimson Fist organs to the chapter given the difficulty in doing so would be seen as a grand gesture and help cement respect between the Tauran and Crimson Fists...… not silly at all in their eyes.

 

Burning down their fortress monastery after the penitent crusade would symbolize that the Tauran are no longer a garrison chapter but are in charge of their own destiny. They will defend the Imperium as they see fit. They are no longer tied to old oaths and obligations, but are reborn.

 

Speaking of things, how would religious cannibalism feel on such a chapter? Since they claim trophies, would they also claim the flesh and eat it to know their foes as per the organ that allows that?

 

Hmmmm…….. I'm a bit uncomfortable with this because...…. well...….. I don't like cannibalism  ……. wish I had a better argument than that, but I don't. I understand the case by case tolerance of this practice in the Imperium and a number of very loyal SM chapters engage in it to one extent or another but my first thought was of the Sons of Malice and their rather unsavory cannibal rituals..... just can't get that out of my mind. I suppose based on our past discussions and cultures we might base the Tauran on, none had cannibalism as part of their traditions. I also think that given the strained relations with the Imperium this practice would give their enemies too much fodder for persecution...…. and although I don't see the Tauran as squeaky clean and noble bright like the Ultramarines I do see them as noble. I'm wondering if perhaps we might find something edgy but non-cannibalistic within Tauran ritual to give them a darker feel. Well.... that's my two cents on the issue 

 

Woe to the Vanquished

 

One of the things I like about the Warhammer 40,000 timeline is the impending damnation of your soul at any moment. Take a little too much pride in your accomplishments and Slaanesh or Khorne are ready to claim your soul. Look into the conspiracies a little too closely, and not only do you find they are true, but you'll find that you are part of them and that your soul is twisting in Tzeentch's grasp. Half of the Legions, noble of birth and mighty of deed, turned and were damned forever. It's a tantalizing line for all Astartes to tread. 

 

The Taurans could be that chapter that has walked the fine line more than once. Theres a reason the Ecclesiarchy is wary of messing with Astartes chapters. That lesson was taught by the Wolves to Goge Vandire's army during the Age of Apostasy, but it can't be the only harsh lesson they've learned. Maybe the Taurans bloodied the Emperor Botherers before that during the Nova Terra Interregnum. 

 

Whatever ends up happening with the Taurans, I think there a nice wrinkle would be an ongoing distrust, bordering on outright hostility, between the Tauran Astartes and the Holy Ecclesiarchy to this day. I also think that this MAY have a knock on effect of the Chaplain Corp being somewhat more idiosyncratic and concerned more with the Chapter cult than they are with Ecclesiarchical orthodoxy. Humility, piety, and sacrifice take a back seat to honor, strength through sacrifice, and deeds of valor. In diametrical opposition to the Holy Synod, a Tauran Astartes and their serfs encourage initiative and glory through feats of valor rather than minding one's station.

 

The Taurans have a hard time fitting in with the Imperium as it exists. They undoubtedly are a force for good, but they just can't fit in. Any time they work closely with all but the most independent of Imperial organizations, friction inevitably builds until the Taurans eventually withdraw to avoid a repeat of their Diaspora. Only organization like the Rogue Traders or Explorator Fleets and barely established colonies are places where the Taruans are freely welcomed. Like Don Quixote or Massai migrant herders, the Taurans are struggling to hold on to a tradition or a code of ethics that no longer exists and may have never existed. At one time, they raged against this and struggled to MAKE the galaxy conform to their vision. Now with the wisdom of millennia on crusade, they realize they are unique and a fish out of water in the Imperium at large so they stick to the frontiers. Unlike old Terra, there is no shortage of frontier where the dispossed and the unwanted can go to find their fortune and etch their names in the stars. 

 

-Vae Victis

 

 

Zhiv

I mean, there is still a stark division between the Ecclesiarchy and the adeptus astartes - many whom see themselves carrying the Emperor's (secular) work.  Which raises the question, how do the Taurans see the Emperor?  Divine or merely a father figure?  I would be inclined to think the latter.  This is also the reason the ecclesiarchy tends to avoid marines - they don't want to see another schism happen.  Marines serve the Emperor - and that's enough.

 

Chaplains being focused on chapter cult is not particularly strange, in fact, it's more common that way!  Also, a chapter on a penitent crusade might not be able to send away chaplains and techmarines to be trained elsewhere. 

 

I think the idea of the Tauran having an especially hostile relationship with the Ecclesiarchy fits well, but we will need to flesh this out. 

 

"The Taurans have a hard time fitting in with the Imperium as it exists. They undoubtedly are a force for good, but they just can't fit in. Any time they work closely with all but the most independent of Imperial organizations, friction inevitably builds until the Taurans eventually withdraw to avoid a repeat of their Diaspora. Only organization like the Rogue Traders or Explorator Fleets and barely established colonies are places where the Taruans are freely welcomed." 

 

I think this generally works but I don't think the Tauran have any problem with this fact. As far as they are concerned that's other people's problem, not theirs. I see them as not having a lot of use for most aspects of the Imperial machine.

 

"Which raises the question, how do the Taurans see the Emperor?  Divine or merely a father figure?  I would be inclined to think the latter." 

 

I agree.... although the Tauran are spiritual (based  mostly on more animistic beliefs) they do not see the Emperor as divine.

 

It might be just my misinterpretation but there seems to be some (a very little bit if any) confusion concerning the Chaplaincy. Space Marine chaplains are responsible for enforcing chapter orthodoxy and ensuring Space Marines are free of taint. They have absolutely no connection to the Ecclesiarchy. Novice chaplains are trained by the chapter Reclusiam. To my knowledge only Tech Marines receive initial training outside of the chapter. Space Marine chaplains probably have more animus towards the Ecclisiarchy than anyone.

 

In my next post I'll throw out my two cents concerning the Tauran chapter world.

 

Cheers 

[Brother Lunkhead]

Double post time

 

I'm currently reviewing everything we've done with the Tauran to date. I am building a summary of what we've agreed on through July 2018 and integrating what we've proposed since November. I have time open this coming Tuesday, so my plan is to post this summary then. In the mean time, if anyone has more ideas and comments on what we've done to date please please please post them. I'll try to integrate everything in my Tuesday post.

 

Pax

[Brother Lunkhead]

Oooops…. Triple post time Bit of family emergency sucked up my time so I'll get the summary out as soon as I can. On the bright side this gives folks more time to comment and pitch additional ideas.  

[Zhiv]

Pitching for ideas?  I have few.

 

Relics.

Since the chapter is -retentive about proving itself and piling trophies on its former homeworld, mayhaps some of the marines (chaplains?) also bear trophies as relics or emblems of honor. I am not talking about using eldar or ork weapons, but trophies taken like this fellow...

 

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-hsqDV5r1qIc/UkoawjOiteI/AAAAAAAAC6s/3lRw4vVE80s/s1600/twv.jpg

Orc teeth, eldar gems, tyranid claws. Emblems of wars won - symbols of redemption.  

 

Speaking of redemption, maybe those died in the service would be known as redeemed, having paid the ultimate price. However, I am not sure about this. After all marines are trained for surgical strikes - but they are born to die in the desperate last stands.  However this could explain their distaste for dreadnoughts - not living, not dead. Somewhere between redemption and sin.

[Brother Lunkhead]

I like the idea of wearing trophies It makes total sense.

 

Redeemed? Could you extrapolate on that please? I'm not sure where this fits in. Depending on the nature of their penitent crusade (what actually brought the Tauran to this and if they see it as just punishment or just a point to prove) perhaps this might apply to those involved in the crusade. I don't see the Tauran as holding on to any guilt or need to be redeemed after the penitent crusade. As I understand from our discussions, the Tauran at that point feel no more obligation to the Imperial machine..... or that could simply be me reading to much into the subject  

[Zhiv]

I like the idea of wearing trophies It makes total sense.

 

Redeemed? Could you extrapolate on that please? I'm not sure where this fits in. Depending on the nature of their penitent crusade (what actually brought the Tauran to this and if they see it as just punishment or just a point to prove) perhaps this might apply to those involved in the crusade. I don't see the Tauran as holding on to any guilt or need to be redeemed after the penitent crusade. As I understand from our discussions, the Tauran at that point feel no more obligation to the Imperial machine..... or that could simply be me reading to much into the subject  

 

So penitent crusade -  a crusade to wash of their sins in the eyes of the Emperor / Imperium.  if and if the punishment is just, they would see it as a chance to redeem themselves, perhaps? To prove themselves to the Emperor. What would make better proof than giving one's life for the cause?

 

I mean, I might have missed things too!  But if they don't care about the Imperial machine, why call it penitent crusade?  Or is the p. crusade just a sham - a cover for their self righteous operations.  If so, then why pile trophies on their home world? What are they trying to prove and to whom? 

 

Yeaah, I know I ask a lot of open ended questions.  

[Brother Lunkhead]

Perhaps the Penitent Crusade (PC) is the crucible in which the Tauran mature. In the beginning they are a contrite young chapter, just beginning to understand the consequences of their hubris. By the end they have matured, but also understand the deep corruption within the Imperium. They understand that they are just one small chapter, powerless to make any big changes in the system that is for all practical purposes the only game in town. They form and maintain alliances when they must, but keep their distance when they can. They come out of the PC confident in their abilities, but tempered by wisdom gained the hard way. They are more than a bit cynical when it comes to the Empire of Man as it exists, but still believe fervently in the Emperor and his cause.

 

Anyway, that's how I see it ……. comments and questions?

[Zhiv]

So basically

 

Young chapter - hubris

Crisis -  up - penitent crusade.

Homeworld  up ?

Lots of adventures among the stars, epic battles and heroic deeds!

A more mature, grown chapter - disillusioned. 

Now aloof, partially to avoid the Imperial politics.  

 

That sounds good to me, but... that would not explain why they would return to their home world? What are they trying to prove and to whom?  Or are the character histories located on the home world so that they would not be lost?  Maybe some events are written in stone so that they would never be forgotten?  Or maybe carved into the trophies?

 

*Chaplain picks up Tyranid skull, dusts it and begins to read* 

 

"Fifty seventh year of the 38th millennium brother Captain Cadmus led the 2nd and 4th company to the world of Adries as the tendrils of the xenos reached for its vast fields. Under his command...." 

 

*Meanwhile initiates listen, enraptured* 

[Brother Lunkhead]

Thanks for the feedback Zhiv…… looks very interesting...… and before I forget these were some ideas you had that would be great fluff.

 

      ".....elephant's graveyard, with the marines returning to leave trophies - or tokens of loyalty. Maybe entering a such sanctum is privilege or maybe all the neophytes who became full marines are       made to walk through the myriad relics, with chaplains and librarians reciting the chapter's history?"

 

     

      "*Chaplain picks up Tyranid skull, dusts it and begins to read* 

 

   "Fifty seventh year of the 38th millennium brother Captain Cadmus led the 2nd and 4th company to the world of Adries as the tendrils of the xenos reached for its vast fields. Under his     command...." 

 

   *Meanwhile initiates listen, enraptured*"

 

Lest I forget...… I meant to mention the first quote a couple of posts before...… both very vivid. A keeper I think.

 

Sooo…… the Tauran chapter world ___________. As they survey their new world, the Tauran are drawn primarily to two warrior cultures. 

 

One is the Iberians. Late medieval in culture and technology, on the cusp of a Renaissance. They are a sort of melding of Moorish and Spanish knightly traditions and are the high point of planetary civilization. Most other cultures are early agrarian or nomadic herding peoples. The Iberians have subjugated many of these people into their empire with one major exception, the Maasai.

 

The Maasai are a nomadic herding people, fierce warriors of the plains, and fiercely independent. They have no interest in empire but merely wish to maintain their way of life, which they will defend to the death. Rather than attempt to subjugate these people as they have done to so many others, the Iberians grant the Maasai great autonomy and hire the Maasai warriors as mercenaries. Thus they complement their mighty knight cavalry with an equally mighty Maasai infantry.

 

From these two cultures the Tauran draw the bulk of their novitiates in the years before the penitent crusade.

 

Any way...… that's how I see it 

[Zhiv]

Most chapters recruit from monocultures and indeed we have several stories of marines recalling their lives before. Would two distinct social classes not create disharmony?  I mean, we do have brainwashing.  After which the   become the  .

 

 

Anyhow, I thought that the masai and the Iberian knights were both models for the chapter's warrior ethos and there was maybe an idea of combining those. i.e. that those ideas were not regarding the native people of the homeworld-that-was but more about how Taurans fight?  Mind you, most chapters fight in very generalized manner - and few of the canon chapters tap into any particular warrior culture (White Scars being a notable exception!) so I am not sure we need to tap literally into aforementioned warrior cultures, but more... just draw bits and pieces from them?

[Brother Lunkhead]

The Tauran have to draw their cultural ideas from somewhere. It might as well be their chapter world. As you pointed out, the White Scars draw from their chapter world. Even the Ultramarines take something of the Ultramar culture to heart. The Dark Angels as well. I think the melding of warrior ethos, religious ideas and traditions from the Iberians and Maasai work well. Most if not all potential friction should be smoothed out through chapter indoctrination and orthodoxy enforcement by the chaplains of the Tauran Reclusium.

 

I'm not saying they draw everything from those cultures, just what they find useful, bits and pieces as you say. As far as how the Tauran fight, they may be inspired by the spirit and way these cultures fight, but melded into a more modern combined arms approach. As I see it, it's from their founding and evolution on their "new" chapter world the Tauran build their core culture that they eventually take to the stars.

[Brother Lunkhead]

Sooooo…… Wrapping up some real world problems and starting to collect and summarize what we've come up with so far. There's really a lot of great stuff people have come up with, so I hope everybody who's interested will take the time to review all of the posts before or after (or both before and after) I post my summary.

 

The summary will list both ideas we have finalized and those that are still open for discussion. I should have something posted by EoD this coming Wednesday. Thanks for your patience.... and it's not to late to post your two cents

[Servant of Dante]

So I’ve just skimmed the last few pages since I last posted here. I’ll try to keep up going forward but I suppose I can’t promise anything, as my interest in all things 40K, especially those outside the purview of the Ministorum, wax and wane, and so do the frequency and length of my visits to this forum :P

 

So, I saw some mention of being especially at odds with the Ministorum. One easy way of doing this would be having a transient attitude toward places and things. Sure, the Taurans can probably appreciate reverence for saints, since many of their traditions revolve around their fallen, but the Ministorum also places great weight on holy relics and holy sites. The Taurans might be willing to sacrifice a world regardless of what material was on it if it served the greater campaign, while the Ministorum would defend any planet of spiritual significance (birthplace or death place of an important saint, resting place of some relic (especially if it’s immobile), etc) to the death. Additionally, the Ministorum will go to ridiculous lengths to recover lost relics, the value of a human life pales in comparison to, say, the original writings of an Imperial Saint, especially if they are/were a big deal.

 

All digressions aside, if the Taurans have a history of snubbing the Ministorum’s efforts to either defend holy places or recover relics it would put them at odds with the Ministorum quite quickly. Close ties to the Administratum or Mechanicus would also do that, since both organizations are longstanding political and ideological rivals of the Ministorum. And of course an irreverence for the Emperor as divine never hurts, though many Marine chapters have that.

[Brother Lunkhead]

Greetings all Here's my summary of what we have for the Taurans. It's in outline form with listings of what we've decided on as well as ideas we've discussed. So without further ado, I give you the Taurans…… thus far

 

"The Taurans have long been cloaked in mystery, their crusading fleets appearing only rarely in Imperial histories. Still they honour the tithes, sending staunch Veterans  to stand the Long Vigil amid the Deathwatch's ranks is typical of this Chapter's steady character."

                                                                                                                                                                                                             - Codex: Deathwatch

 

 

CHAPTER NAME...…………. THE TAURANS

 

FOUNDING...………………... 4TH (M32) or 5TH (M35?) Several centuries before the Nova Terra Interregnum(?)

 

CHAPTER WORLD...……….. Pre-Nova Terra Interregnum:

                                                                                          - Chapter World: ____________(?)

CHAPTER NAME...…………. THE TAURANS

FOUNDING...………………... 4TH (M32) or 5TH (M35?) Several centuries before the Nova Terra Interregnum(?)

CHAPTER WORLD...……….. Pre-Nova Terra Interregnum:
                                                                                          - Chapter World: ____________(?)
 

                               ………….. Post Nova Terra Interregnum: Fleet based

 

FORTRESS MONASTARY.... Battle Barge "Iron Bull" (?)

 

GENE-SEED...……………….. White Scars

 

COMBAT TRAITS...…………. Cleans, Purify, Annihilate

 

STRENGTH...………………… (?)

 

BATTLE CRY/MAXIM...…….. (?)/"As upon the plains of Chogoris, so unto the void eternal."

 

 

Origins/Current Status

 

A chapter of the 4th or 5th founding, assigned to replace Astartes losses in Segmentum Pacificus, and initially trained and lead by a mixed cadre of White Scars, Rampagers, and Crimson Fists (cadre leaders and first chapter master)*

- Chapter not initially manned by veterans of mixed chapters, but a fresh face chapter made up of recruits from newly assigned home world*

- Involved in the Nova Terra Interregnum, aggressively protecting their neutrality from incursion by the Imperium or Ur-Council or both*

- Performed a 100 year penitent crusade as a result of actions during the interregnum resulting in a profound change in character of the chapter*

- The Tauran burn down the Chapter fortress (before or after the Penitent Cruasade) symbolizing a detachment from the past, but still lays claim to the      world as a holy chapter site.*

- Chapter  leaves it's homeworld, becomes fleet based, and almost completely drops out of Imperial record

- Chapter currently operates in the area of space known as Imperium Nihilus

 

 

Homeworld

 

Pre-Interregnum: Cadre assigned homeworld of _________, an agrarian world with a mixture of medieval and primitive nomadic cultures. Chapter recruits initially from the two dominant warrior cultures, the Iberians (Spanish and Moorish knightly culture) and the Maasai (nomadic herding culture).* 

 

Post Interregnum: Leaves homeworld after penitent crusade and becomes fleet based, crusading across the galaxy.* Fate of homeworld unknown at this time.*

 

Combat Doctrine

 

Known for the "Stampede" docrine whereby an enemy is worn down and corralled using hit and run tactics, then annihilated by relentless, overwhelming combined force of the entire chapter.

 

Organization

 

Only loosely codex compliant, companies often campaign independently and are therefore very self-reliant. Each company recruits and trains independently.* Battle companies make use of mostly razorbacks rather than rhinos as primary troop transport. Chapter unites as a whole for large campaigns and the major chapter ritual (march to the elephant's graveyard).

 

Beliefs and Traditions

 

The Taurans are an aloof chapter, deeply suspicious of Imperial institutions and their political machinations. They seldom form alliances, but when they do, bonds are deep and lasting.* The chapter is especially leery of the Ecclesiarchy.

 

Although the chapter does not believe in the divinity of the Emperor and tensions are high with the Ecclesiarch, the Taurans are deeply spiritual. Their spirituality is anima/animus in nature. There is a strong tie in the collective consciousness of the chapter with the strong spirits of certain places and persons both past and present.*

 

Librarians engage in throwing bone to determine certain chapter actions (whether or not to engage in certain campaigns, answer a call for aid, etc.).*

 

Taurans engage in ritual combat duals to resolve conflicts and gain advancement (  for example: two equally qualified brothers fight for the right of squad sergeant) in "The Arena".*

 

Every ___ years the Taurans rendezvous at a designated area in space and travel to the Chapter world for the Elephants' Graveyard ritual (somebody please come up with a better name than this). This ritual is all important and must be attended by every chapter member (Astartes and serfs alike). At the site of the fortress monastery, campaign trophies are laid down and the remains of fallen battle brothers (or a valued totem or piece of wargear if remains are not recovered) and serfs of note are laid to rest, their spirits set to guard the homeworld.* Librarians and Chaplains spread out among the trophies of past and present victories. Neophytes are gathered to these sites for the ritual of "The Telling". In this way, neophytes are bonded to the spirit of the Chapter and the Chapter world.*

 

Gene-seed

 

Although it's founding cadre was of mixed chapters, the Tauran gene-seed is that of Jaghatai Khan. This is evident in the character of the chapter.

 

Well that's the Taurans in a nut shell. I've intentionally left out detail to encourage folks to review the posts of this topic (it's only 14 pages, the length of a short short story). Please review before commenting.

 

We've been poking around this project for over a year, and still it draws interest. I personally would like to see it finished within the next two to three months. This is doable if we put just a little focus and effort into it. Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this project. Whether or not your ideas were added to the history of the Taurans, you've contributed greatly to the energy of this project, and for that alone we are grateful Thanks everyone

 

(?): Ideas mentioned but not discussed

 *  : Ideas discussed but no final decision on whether or not to add

[Zhiv]

That's a solid frame to build on. Here's what I have in my mind.

 

Stampede sounds more like 'carnifex rush'.  Instead we tap into the zulu parts for the horns and loins (well, hooves) imagery.

 

Combat Doctrine
Known for the Horns and the Hooves doctrine whereby an enemy is worn down and corralled using hit and run tactics, then annihilated by relentless, overwhelming combined force of the entire chapter. The fast elements such as land speeder and biker formations form the horns, relaying battlefield data to the fleet and the whirlwind batteries. Once the enemy is sufficiently weak a massive lighting attack is used to decapitate the enemy forces in the ways marines are meant to operate.

[Brother Lunkhead]

Greetings all...… left a few things out while writing the outline up between family distractions...… family and pets insist on undivided attention (what's up with that), so expect an edit or two.

 

Thanks for the input Zhiv….. sounds good to me

[Brother Cambrius]

-peers in-

 

Been a while again through the Warp Storms of Real Life. I'll read over what's been discussed since my last visit and add some opinions/ideas if required. Thanks for putting that short summary together Brother Lunkhead. :tu:

 

Cambrius

[Brother Lunkhead]

Thanks for the kind words Brother Cambrius…… Hope to see some interesting words from you soon

 

I'm throwing this out for everyone...…. Any thoughts on Tauran chapter structure. We will be looking at pre-galactic rift (prior to Primaris introduction to the chapter) and post-Indomitus Crusade (period of introduction of Primaris to full initial integration). Ideas for background fluff would be nice too. Keep in mind the self sufficient nature of the companies. Scout/training squads are integrated into the companies, rather than having a independent scout company.

 

Hope to see some interesting words from everyone...…. soon

[Zhiv]

Well, assuming somewhat regular company structure we would get

 

Your run-of-the-mill company would have

 

Company command with attached chaplains, techmarines and apothecaries 

4 squads of tacticals

2 assault squads - of whom mostly deploy on bikes and landspeeders

2 devastator squads - oh whom most deploy in small squads, mounted on razorbacks.

2 Initiate squads - of which at least one deploys on bikes or on land speeder storm.  

Armory detachment, mostly rhino's, razorbacks and whirlwinds.  

 

~roughly 100 marines.

 

I would keep the veterans as their own, distinct company.  Maybe needs a distinct name, maybe just 'Companions' to the chapter master.

 

Primaris...  adding primaris marines just makes for bigger companies, or then tacticals are shuffled to form more companies?

[Brother Lunkhead]

Thanks for the quick feedback Zhiv.

 

In your company structure, I'm curious as to why you reduce the number of tactical squads from six to four. As tactical squads are the primary workhorse of the company and all other units are there to support them (with some exceptions of coarse), why reduce their numbers? Do you see this as a necessary compromise since adding the scout squads draw on company resources and take up space otherwise used by two tactical squads. I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm just not clear on your thinking on this point.

 

I agree that the veteran company is distinct and should be separate. A distinct name I think would indeed be fitting.

 

On to the Primaris….. I think initially they would have their own company, drawn up along the similar lines as a traditional battle company. This would give the chapter the flexibility of practically using them in battle while at the same time figuring out how best they will fit within the chapter's combat doctrine. Once their position within the chapter is secure and a clear view on how they should be used is established they can be integrated into other companies based on attrition. 

 

Where do the Aggressors and Reivers fit in? Aggressors are "almost" Terminators and Reivers are...… well...… Reivers They are not neophytes and scouts, even though they can and do perform some of the functions as Scouts. Clearly, Aggressors and Reivers are more experienced Primaris marines, but are they veterans? I'm not sure..... thoughts?

 

An interesting side note concerning a Primaris battle company for those who are not up to speed on the BL end, in Guy Haley's Dark Imperium mention is made of the Ultramarine 11th (Primaris) Company. So, there is definitely precedence.

 

That's all I have time for now...… comments and questions are welcomed 

[Brother Cambrius]

Regarding company structure, I could see it being in the Codex format in their initial founding and years, but after the Novas Terra Interregnum and change in personality and becoming fleet based, they moved to a Clan style structure akin to the Iron Hands, with self-sufficient companies that rely on their own Scouts training and cadre of Veterans. There is still a central hub of command and a council of the Captains etc with the Chapter Master having the final say, but it'd add to their independent nature further if we went down this route.

 

With the arrival of the Primaris, I could see them being a separate part of these Companies (possibly call them Tribes?) that is a satellite group until they find their rightful use in the Taurans' style of warfare.

 

In terms of names for the Veterans, one idea that's popped in my head is "Bullguard".

 

Cambrius

[Brother Lunkhead]

Some sort of clan structure makes sense to me. So instead of company...… tribe, sept, confraternity, brotherhood?...… I like brotherhood

 

Bullguard sounds good for the chapter master's veteran company...… instead of an honour guard...… and that brings me to the chapter master. What should we call him? He should have a title befitting a tribal warrior king.

 

Are you saying that the Primaris should be directly attached to the battle companies, but a separate structure..... like a demi company?

[Brother Lunkhead]

Hail Brothers and Sisters of the Liber In order to get this ball rolling a little farther, I'm putting forth a very very rough draft of a chapter structure for the Taurans. I'm using a tribal structure that draws very heavily on the Iron Hands clan matrix found in the Iron Hands Clan Raukaan Codex http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/File:ClanRau.jpg

 

As I don't have a lot of time this is a very rough outline...… just something to start with.

 

                                                                                                      CHAPTER MASTER

                                                                                                                       |

LIBRARIUM                          FORGE                                                        BULL GUARD                                                                                                              RECLUSIUM

                                                                                                        (Veteran Company)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                     1ST BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                                         (Battle Company)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                     2ND BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                                         (Battle Company)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                     3RD BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                                         (Battle Company)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                     4TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                                         (Battle Company)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                     5TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                                          (Battle Company)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                                     6TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                                          (Battle Company)

                                                                                                                      |

                                                                                                     7TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                               (Tactical Reserve Company)

                                                                                                                      |

                                                                                                     8TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                               (Tactical Reserve Company)

                                                                                                                      |

                                                                                                     9TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                             (Fast Attack Reserve Company)

                                                                                                                      |

                                                                                                    10TH BROTHERHOOD

                                                                                           (Heavy Support Reserve Company)

 

 

                                                                                           BROTHERHOOD Battle Company

 

                                                     Brotherhood Commander(1) and Retinue (Command Squad - 2 Lieutenants, 1 Chaplain, Ancient, Champion)

                                                                                                                       |

              Apothecaries (2)                              Veteran Company (10 Veteran Marines [Terminator Armor Optional])                                Librarians (1 Codicier, 2 Lexicanum)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                    Tactical Squads (4 Squads 10 Marines Each)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                    Assault Squads (2 Squads 10 Marines Each)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                 Devastator Squads (2 Squads 10 Marines Each)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                 Scout Squad (1 Squad 1 Sergeant 9 Neophytes)

                                                                                                                       

                                                                                  The Aerie of New Brothers (Primaris Marines)

                                                                                                             1 Lieutenant

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                   Intercessor Squads (4 Squads 5 Primaris Each)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                      Inceptor  Squads (1 Squad 5 Primaris Each)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                      Hellblaster Squad (1 Squad 5 Primaris Each)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                          Aggressor Squad (1 Squad 3 Primaris)

                                                                                                                       |

                                                                                             Reiver Squad (1 Squad 5 Primaris)

 

Well, there you have it As I said, this is just a very rough outline. I don't expect a lot of love on this, so let's have some feedback. If you do like it (fat chance of that) tell me why and if you don't like it, tell me why and give an alternative idea.

 

Time marches on...… Let's get this done