b1soul Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Found these general spoilers of questionable provenance... The book begins with a visit to Khan Terra after his stay and conversation with the Emperor. Khan is dissatisfied with this conversation, he does not like the idea of the Imperium, that he is given orders and gives an army without a soul. However, he swore an oath and will follow it. Khan is introduced to his army - Star Hunters, and his new fleet. Khan is unhappy and orders to completely remake the fleet, betting on speed. From the very beginning of the book, Khan is shown as a primarch who is not very friendly towards the representatives of the Imperium. He wants to escape from Terra and regain his freedom, so he spends less time on Terra than all the other brothers. The book reveals the character of Khan and his Legion, their love for independence and hostility to the Imperium. The book also raises the problem of psykers in the legions. White scars are proud of psykers in their ranks and believe that this is normal (in contrast to Mortarion and Perturabo). As the narrative progresses, this question will be raised in relation to all the primarchs and legions. The book does not focus on the only significant for the primarch battle, like the previous one, but captures a fairly extensive period of time: from the first visit of Terra to the Ullanor triumph shortly before Nicaea, when the White scars go to war with the orcs at Chondax - which allows us to show the evolution of the legion and the primarch. The book rather well shows the transition of the Terran legion to the legion of the Primarch and his homeworld. Assimilation is such that the Terrans really start behaving like the White Scars. In short, Khan uses psykers in the legion and is proud of it, does not like the Imperium and follow its decrees (even the Emperor's decrees). Unlike other legions and primarchs, it shares its strength, giving its commanders more freedom and independence. Other primarchs try to meet with him and talk, but Khan is quick and keeps slipping away. The primarchs even have a small competition, who will first meet with Khan. This honor falls to Sanguinius. This will be Khan's first meeting with one of his brothers and the beginning of a discussion about Nicaea. Ullanor strongly disappoints Khan. He does not believe in unity and believes that the Emperor leaves his sons. He does not like that Horus sees him only as a hunter for xenos. Disappointed, he wants to leave the Imperium. He tells Horus that if he calls, Khan will come, but this is more a formality than the truth. Esugei Khan acknowledges that even if Horus calls them, the Scars will be far away and will not respond. He wants to clean the Chondax from the orcs and stop all communication with the Imperium in order to remain alone, regain freedom and leave the Imperium to follow its path. The book shows the connection of the White Scars and Sons of Horus, including the boxes offered to Hasik. We all know how this will end in a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Huh... The evolution of the Legion would ne cool. Can't believe the rest. Scars did show it differently. Would reckon quite a lot of what was made by Chris himself. :/ It is known that the terran V was called Sons of Thule, for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Where is "Sons of Thule" from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandlemad Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 Retribution, the FW book. No detail beyond that, though as it was an ancient term for vaguely Iceland/Greenland/Scandinavia area, you could maybe tie it in with where Torghun was recruited from on Terra. Sounds interesting, if true. Kind of surprising that it dovetails with Brotherhood of the Storm so closely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 If it’s all made up, it’s reasonably clever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 B1soul, here you go: http://wh.reactor.cc/post/2331145 After rereading it and considering BotS and other Scars' fluff, it fits. But what about Magnus? Scars showed us a close bondship between him and the Khan. I get the feeling that this one might become the most interesting Primarch novel, imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 @ Sandlemad Hopefully we get to see some interesting and major contrasts between pre and post Khan Vth Legion. A lot of room to fashion some really compelling fluff I'd say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draakur Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 Wow. The Khan/Scars are sounding pretty strongly divergent here. If this proves accurate the Khan is even more autonomous and kind of "other" when compared to his brothers than I'd expected. This all feeds basically perfectly into the feel and character of my Scars successors, in their attempts to exemplify all the traits they believed most represented the Warhawk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 it would make it more interesting than exactly 9 disloyal and exactly 9 super loyal primarchs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 We've already got Magnus as a conflicted traitor, with most of the other traitor Primarchs having their own reasons for turning, with varying degrees of loyalty to Horus. Good to see they might be giving variation to the Loyalists too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 @Kelborn Thanks, I missed that. Ironic that the WS may have startes out as an army of Torghuns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taliesin Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 My glorious copy has been ordered. Had to shell out for the limited edition on account of how good this looks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manchu warlord Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 If this book is largely going to talk about the creation of the Librarius department, their may well be canon conflict. In the novel Descent of Angels, as the 1st legion finally reunites with its missing Primarch, we see a Dark Angels librarian, "Israfael" arriving at Caliban. Now, according, to the lexicanum (no idea where it gets the source from), it says that the Lion was discovered before the Khagan. So if the Khagan was discovered after the Lion, that would mean the Librarius project will come into service well after that. Yet, here, we have a librarian that appears before the appointed time of the creation of the Librarius department... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Not the first time they changed things around after Descent of Angels. Even the Legion's name came from a different direction after ForgeWorld got their hands on it. Israfel had a role in later DA novels too, so he's very tough to retcon, especially considering that Zahariel, the primary pro/antagonist in the Caliban events so far, is a student of Israfel and got Librarian training before he even left Caliban, and later on had a conclave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Yeah...that is a bit of contradiction, but not really significant enough for me to care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 That, and they're saying that the Khan was opposed to the Project, in favour of "the mysticism of the Stormseers", despite the fact that all previous background has said that Magnus, Sanguinius and the Khan were basically the co-creators of the Project, with Magnus as Lead Developer, as it were. The White Scars even spoke at the Trial of Nikaea in favour of the Librarian Project, but against Magnus. I'm hoping this new change is wrong, as it basically sounds like they want to treat the White Scars Stormseers the same as the Space Wolves and their Rune Priests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandlemad Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 We do know though that the Khan and Magnus had radically divergent ideas about what an astartes psyker program would look like, and that the eventual librarius project was a compromise between them and quietly influenced by Sanguinius’s Baalite ideas. This could easily be Magnus putting the initial ‘psykers do what they want!’ idea to the Khan, who opposes it. The book could then cover that period of disagreement, modification and collaboration between the three primarchs - the Khan wants something more restrained, more stormseer-like - until we get the eventual librarius project that spread through the legions during the crusade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Yup...likely the Khan thought any Astartes psyker project should be modeled after the teachings of the Stormseers, who emphasise restraint. He might think only his legion could exercise the necessary restraint. He might initially be very wary of a psyker program spearheaded by Magnus and his more knowledge is more power attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Do you guys know, if LEs are only obtainable via the BL homepage? I'm tempted to get my hands on this one as crown jewel of my collection but as I don't own a CC, BL is not an option for me. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Yup...likely the Khan thought any Astartes psyker project should be modeled after the teachings of the Stormseers, who emphasise restraint. He might think only his legion could exercise the necessary restraint. He might initially be very wary of a psyker program spearheaded by Magnus and his more knowledge is more power attitude. It wouldn't surprise me if there's an element of Stormseers are not psykers cultural difference/misinterpretation going on. "Use the Warp? No....these guys look into the storms." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandlemad Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 I dunno, Yesugei was always pretty clear-eyed about the fact that they were drawing on the warp. They know it's treacherous and home to actively malicious entities, but tragically couldn't get the Thousand Sons to realise this and exercise restraint or moderation. The shame is really that other legions dismiss the Chogorian ways as savagery or mysticism when in fact it's an eminently pragmatic and moderate approach to dealing with the warp and psykana. That Magnus and the wider Imperium don't understand this for completely opposite reasons is a source of frustration. Yesugei was hyper-aware and fairly prickly about how the IH and Salamanders in Scars perceived his weather magic as primitive storm-scrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashur Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 I dunno, Yesugei was always pretty clear-eyed about the fact that they were drawing on the warp. They know it's treacherous and home to actively malicious entities, but tragically couldn't get the Thousand Sons to realise this and exercise restraint or moderation. The shame is really that other legions dismiss the Chogorian ways as savagery or mysticism when in fact it's an eminently pragmatic and moderate approach to dealing with the warp and psykana. That Magnus and the wider Imperium don't understand this for completely opposite reasons is a source of frustration. Yesugei was hyper-aware and fairly prickly about how the IH and Salamanders in Scars perceived his weather magic as primitive storm-scrying. That might be a reason to explain why the Khan decided after Ullanor to leave the Imperium. Tha librarian project was in a way, an attempt by the Khan to mix imperial institutions with chogorian traditions, to have his culture mold at least a small part of an imperium he so disagrees with. When Nikea put an official end to the librarians, he might have concluded that no matter how much he tried, the imperium and him will always be at odds, no matter the subject. I hope this book delves into this themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluntblade Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 He doesn't know the verdict by the time of Scars, and nothing Yesugei thinks or does suggests any notion of the Scars quitting the Imperium. More that the Khan's back doing what he's most at ease with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taliesin Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Do you guys know, if LEs are only obtainable via the BL homepage? I'm tempted to get my hands on this one as crown jewel of my collection but as I don't own a CC, BL is not an option for me. :/ Only through BL or Games Workshop.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Loss Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Pay came through and I ordered the LE. Really looking forward to this, Wraight's Scars are always a treat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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