Aothaine Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 So, for a close combat army: Gallant Avenger or RFBC with reaper or gauntlet Valiant Warglaive For a shooty army Crusader Castellan Helverin Thermal or Avenger with melee Which is better for CC army: House Cadmus or Mortan? Ranged is better with Vulker, Hawkshroud, or Raven? I need to decide what direction Im going with my army, and go full in on that. I own a Warden and Crusader, and just bought renegade. Oh, and two warglaives. Don't leave out house Mortis for both ranged and melee armies. There is a strong argument for the 6++ save and the stratagem that lets your knight stand back up then spend one more cp to have it be full profile again before it wades back into the enemy. It is currently the house that is contending with Hawkshroud for me. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but are Freeblades not allowed to take Relics if your Warlord isn't a Knight? As far as I am aware you cannot take relics for any army unless your warlord is from the same army. I could be wrong though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I'm wholly disappointed we can't make the most of our Armiger love by physically being made to not have/convert/proxy a Preceptor until "later this year", it's a poor showing on GW and they should be fully prepared for the onslaught of 3rd party bits. If they hadn't learned from having rules without an available model before Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysere Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 So, for a close combat army: Gallant Avenger or RFBC with reaper or gauntlet Valiant Warglaive For a shooty army Crusader Castellan Helverin Thermal or Avenger with melee Which is better for CC army: House Cadmus or Mortan? Ranged is better with Vulker, Hawkshroud, or Raven? I need to decide what direction Im going with my army, and go full in on that. I own a Warden and Crusader, and just bought renegade. Oh, and two warglaives. Don't leave out house Mortis for both ranged and melee armies. There is a strong argument for the 6++ save and the stratagem that lets your knight stand back up then spend one more cp to have it be full profile again before it wades back into the enemy. It is currently the house that is contending with Hawkshroud for me. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but are Freeblades not allowed to take Relics if your Warlord isn't a Knight? As far as I am aware you cannot take relics for any army unless your warlord is from the same army. I could be wrong though. Very Wrong indeed. All you need is access to your stratagems and you can take relics, and in the knights case even add a warlord trait. You just pay CP for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiñaColada Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I wouldn't mix and match Armiger personally, if you're taking 2 I'd take 2 of the same time to maximise the efficiency at 1.75k why have 8 sweep attacks when you can have 16 or why have 4d3 shots when you can have 8d3 shots? Eh, I don't really agree with that. The armiger would be backup to the gallant and the helverin would probably stick closer to the preceptor. Depending on which type of army I'd face the preceptor might be moving forward quickly and at that point the helverin would have to adjust. I'd argue this offers more flexibility than 2 of a specific armiger. Not like there isn't any overlap in preferred targets between the knights. Maybe that won't work but I'm willing to try it out, I think it'd work better than doubling down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banis Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Does anyone know if Canix rex gets the mentor rule like the preceptor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Eh, I don't really agree with that. The armiger would be backup to the gallant and the helverin would probably stick closer to the preceptor. Depending on which type of army I'd face the preceptor might be moving forward quickly and at that point the helverin would have to adjust. I'd argue this offers more flexibility than 2 of a specific armiger. Not like there isn't any overlap in preferred targets between the knights. Maybe that won't work but I'm willing to try it out, I think it'd work better than doubling down. That's fair, though if it's taken into consideration what's available to us in a knight, I wouldn't take a warglaive if I have a gallant, and would be less likely to take helverin if my knights were dakka'd up to the eyeballs It's all horses for courses though and things work differently for us all ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiñaColada Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 That's fair, though if it's taken into consideration what's available to us in a knight, I wouldn't take a warglaive if I have a gallant, and would be less likely to take helverin if my knights were dakka'd up to the eyeballsIt's all horses for courses though and things work differently for us all Sure, I'm not trying to say that this would be the strongest build you could make. But a warglaive (especially if you manage to keep it close to the preceptor) has some pretty decent shooting and the sweep attack has made them decent against light/medium & elite infantry. The helverin just works well against 3 wound models, which from what I gather aren't considered common but I sure see quite a few of them. Knights are always going to come down to specialised vs generalist builds. I'm erring a bit more towards generalised, where multiple units can help out in different places. That flexibility comes at a price of efficiency though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Strike Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Is there any reason for me to own three crusaders? I can rip the avenger off my warden and attach a thermal cannon in it's place and build my two 'renegade' knights as Crusaders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendent Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 So, for a close combat army: Gallant Avenger or RFBC with reaper or gauntlet Valiant Warglaive For a shooty army Crusader Castellan Helverin Thermal or Avenger with melee Which is better for CC army: House Cadmus or Mortan? Ranged is better with Vulker, Hawkshroud, or Raven? I need to decide what direction Im going with my army, and go full in on that. I own a Warden and Crusader, and just bought renegade. Oh, and two warglaives. Don't leave out house Mortis for both ranged and melee armies. There is a strong argument for the 6++ save and the stratagem that lets your knight stand back up then spend one more cp to have it be full profile again before it wades back into the enemy. It is currently the house that is contending with Hawkshroud for me. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but are Freeblades not allowed to take Relics if your Warlord isn't a Knight? As far as I am aware you cannot take relics for any army unless your warlord is from the same army. I could be wrong though. Very Wrong indeed. All you need is access to your stratagems and you can take relics, and in the knights case even add a warlord trait. You just pay CP for it. Do we have any idea if you have access to the Stragems if you're doing something like taking a Castellan in a Superheavy Auxiliary Detachment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucidNinja Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 No and what I want to know the most Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendent Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 No and what I want to know the most I've been combing the internet looking for any sign. The only video I've found that actually shows each page is strikingscorpion82's, and at the link below the relevant text is visible but not legible in the top left corner under the heading "Strategems" https://youtu.be/5ZII_xblylU?t=3548 It's making me anxious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stray Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Is there any reason for me to own three crusaders? Yes. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucidNinja Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 No and what I want to know the most I've been combing the internet looking for any sign. The only video I've found that actually shows each page is strikingscorpion82's, and at the link below the relevant text is visible but not legible in the top left corner under the heading "Strategems" It's making me anxious. Me too brother. I tried CSIing it with a screen shot but the camera is too far away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stray Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 So, for a close combat army: Gallant Avenger or RFBC with reaper or gauntlet Valiant Warglaive For a shooty army Crusader Castellan Helverin Thermal or Avenger with melee Which is better for CC army: House Cadmus or Mortan? Ranged is better with Vulker, Hawkshroud, or Raven? I need to decide what direction Im going with my army, and go full in on that. I own a Warden and Crusader, and just bought renegade. Oh, and two warglaives. Don't leave out house Mortis for both ranged and melee armies. There is a strong argument for the 6++ save and the stratagem that lets your knight stand back up then spend one more cp to have it be full profile again before it wades back into the enemy. It is currently the house that is contending with Hawkshroud for me. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but are Freeblades not allowed to take Relics if your Warlord isn't a Knight? As far as I am aware you cannot take relics for any army unless your warlord is from the same army. I could be wrong though. Very Wrong indeed. All you need is access to your stratagems and you can take relics, and in the knights case even add a warlord trait. You just pay CP for it. Do we have any idea if you have access to the Stragems if you're doing something like taking a Castellan in a Superheavy Auxiliary Detachment? You can :) I've been looking into this today. Strats work based off keywords alone generally. As long as the detachment is an Imperial Knight detachment (an Aux is, because it contains nothing but the Knight) you're fine. If you on the other hand, took a Knight as a LoW choice in say an Ad Mech detachment, you would not get to use Knight strats - because you're not in an Imp Knight Detachment. You could use Knight of the cog etc though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucidNinja Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I want to be wrong but the space marine codex says "if your army is battleforged and includes any Space Marine Detachments (excluding Auxiliary Support Detachments) you have access to stratagems..." Wait a super heavy auxiliary detachment isn't a support detachment, optimism rises! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendent Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I want to be wrong but the space marine codex says "if your army is battleforged and includes any Space Marine Detachments (excluding Auxiliary Support Detachments) you have access to stratagems..." Wait a super heavy auxiliary detachment isn't a support detachment, optimism rises! That's how every faction I've checked so far works, but Knights are also a pretty unique army so it could be different. I just want a Castellan with a 4++ and Cawl's Wrath. Is that truly so wrong? Probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aothaine Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I'm wholly disappointed we can't make the most of our Armiger love by physically being made to not have/convert/proxy a Preceptor until "later this year", it's a poor showing on GW and they should be fully prepared for the onslaught of 3rd party bits. If they hadn't learned from having rules without an available model before Death Guard had to wait awhile for one of their models. Honestly.. I don't think that GW giving players time to actually purchase and build units for their army is a bad idea. Personally, I am planning on having a knight army ready to go by the LVO 2019. But I'm not going to go buy $800 worth of models in one go. I'll be testing things out and moving stuff around. The fact that we are only missing one model from our codex is impressive, as Canis Rex is stated to be releasing in a few weeks. Most people will understand that a model is not currently available and allow you to proxy as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucidNinja Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Same here Pendent, I'd even forgo the 4++ for the +1cp trait if needed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 All the relic sections lead with "If your army is led by <FACTION KEYWORD> Warlord..." You need a warlord for that factions relics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aothaine Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 All the relic sections lead with "If your army is led by <FACTION KEYWORD> Warlord..." You need a warlord for that factions relics. Thought so. I'm wondering if you are exempt from that with IK due to the stratagem that specifically states a knight becomes a character and can take a relic though. I don't think it can... but I am curious. A good question to send GW for sure though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyriks Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Previous FAQ ruled that using strats allows you to take relics from factions besides the Warlord's. This would be no different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendent Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 All the relic sections lead with "If your army is led by <FACTION KEYWORD> Warlord..." You need a warlord for that factions relics. Your warlords detachment gets a free relic and then any further detachments can use command points to buy more if they so desire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysere Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 All the relic sections lead with "If your army is led by <FACTION KEYWORD> Warlord..." You need a warlord for that factions relics. That is only in regards to the free relic you get. Stratagems are seperate and useable. This has been covered in FAQs past so it's not even arguable at this point. So yes you can take that lone knight and give them a relic and a warlord trait. It's nice that you can actually have fun with a lone knight rather than needing three just to have any special rules now. Just a shame that pure knights will be a bit tight on CP but oh well. That's fixable by GW in the future if they want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 In that case; 11/10 would Exalted Court a Valiant with Sanctuary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Mkay, well, house hawkshroud with relic avenger on my crusader, then I will use two of my CPs to make my gallant a character with a warlord trait to boost his output and the relic gauntlet with another CP. Then I will have 4 CP left. Other codices have a restriction that a model may not carry more than one Relic. Does anyone know if this applies to Knights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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