Unified feedback for the new FAQ

[SinnerBeta]

 

Hey guys, I see no thread about this so I wondered if we perhaps could discuss any DA related suggestions and feedback for the FAQ. Once we agree on some main points we could each send them from our emails saying we're representing the B&C Dark Angels community to show these are things we all want to have looked at. Any opinions on the idea ?

[Helycon]

Make the Nephilim an actual air superiority fighter!

Stalker and Hunter could do with a bit of a buff.

Lower the CP for Orbital bombardment.

Add sargeant combi weapons on bikes.

Buff the RWBK grenade launcher; just the Stratagem isn't enough to take it really.

Buff Landraiders.

Buff Terminators.

 

Just some of the things that popped into my head :D

[FlamingDeth]

Can land speeder storms and scout bikes take options from the index, even though though DA didn’t have access to those units in the index list?

[SinnerBeta]

@Helycon

 

Those are balance suggestions, not covered by a FAQ. Wait for the next Chapter Approved.

[Interrogator Stobz]

Here’s a FAQ, can GW actually balance things?

 

Just being cheeky, but I agree that the next index is the real solution to the poor costs given to units, equipment and strategems.

[Helycon]

I'm pretty sure this was meant to be a balance update, whereas CA was supposed to be more points oriented.

[Komodo]

I would really like Deathwing to be either buffed, or dropped in cost. They are tough, resilent, but just don't have a punch to fight some Elite or HQ units. Deathwing Knights are pretty good, but I really miss that T5 they had when b-2-b. 

 

Deathwing assault strata ain't bad, but you have to reserve that 3 CP, which is a lot. it's just strange to use them to clear up the chuff, bolter dakka doesn't do much to tough, high save models. Also it's just cheaper to take Dark Talon, really, if you need that dakka. In fact, Talons are awesome (no wonder they are abused in current competitive meta). 

 

Inner Circle is kinda useless as it is now. From the fluff and the way it's worded I guess this is prepared to be used against Luther and the Fallen. At least extend it to whole CSM, Deathguard, 1k sons and buff it for FALLEN. (Kinda what they did with GK smite -- 1 mortal wound for all non-deamon, 3 for deamons)

 

Jink. 4++ is good, but make them shoot rapid fire weapons too. Heavy is heavy, but I can't image why you can shoot talons, but cannot shoot bolters, not that the biker is actually carrying it.

[G8Keeper]

Remove the Vengeance being unable to fire for the rest of the game if it overheats.

[sneakybamsen]

Remove the Vengeance being unable to fire for the rest of the game if it overheats.

 While I do agree that the vengeance isn't as awesome as it should be, it only takes wounds from the overheating. Others are just removed from play. I think they would be inclined to change both things if they were to make changes to it. They could make it a bit cheaper though :)

[G8Keeper]

 While I do agree that the vengeance isn't as awesome as it should be, it only takes wounds from the overheating. Others are just removed from play. I think they would be inclined to change both things if they were to make changes to it. They could make it a bit cheaper though

 

Whilst true, I think it's a bit of a hodge podge the way some units die (Azrael) and others are just wounded and there is by no means a standard to this rule.  I could live with the 3 mortal wounds each time the Vengeance overheats, just not losing the weapon altogether.  Coupled with your mentioned points reduction, as well as for all speeders, this would make me a happy little watcher.

[Project XXVIII]

I would definitely be interested in seeing some buffs to Terminators in general, but where does one strike up that topic on the B&C? Homegrown forum? It’s somewhat slow on response time,.. I mean no one else wants to see a Master of the Ravenwing on bike?!?

 

From a strict FAQ standpoint though;

 

Stormraven + Leviathan should NOT be a thing, it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

Master Strategist could use some clarification on where said warlord needs to be (boots on the ground, just being alive, not in reserve, etc) to activate the CP regen.

[Helycon]

I would definitely be interested in seeing some buffs to Terminators in general, but where does one strike up that topic on the B&C? Homegrown forum? It’s somewhat slow on response time,.. I mean no one else wants to see a Master of the Ravenwing on bike?!?

 

From a strict FAQ standpoint though;

 

Stormraven + Leviathan should NOT be a thing, it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

Master Strategist could use some clarification on where said warlord needs to be (boots on the ground, just being alive, not in reserve, etc) to activate the CP regen.

Master of the Ravenwing on bike already exists! It's Samael on Corvex. Ravenwing is the 2nd company and has no equal, same as Deathwing. Having another option for Samael besides Corvex and Sableclaw isn't useful really, since Corvex does everyting a bike does, but better.

 

Stormraven and Leviathan is a MASSIVE all eggs in one basket. If your opponent let's it happen, he deserves to be massacred by it, to be fair. And I'm not sure how it's different from a Leviathan Drop Pod at that point. Sure, it has no weapons or other transport capacity, but THAT can be used safely and unloaded at turn 1. 

 

I do agree on some clarifications of course. Some rules are just to vague and ambiguous. 

[FlamingDeth]

Options other than corvex or sableclaw are useful for people who play successor chapters. Jet bikes are sort of a unique piece of kit and I can’t imagine every successor having one.

[shabbadoo]

Need errata for the Power level of the Librarian in power armor (should be 7, not 8).

[solarisqc]

Give back the old relentless to Terminator and bike/Attack bike.(make the rules as always count as not moving if you don't advance when shooting)

 

This will buff Terminator and Attack bike heavy weapon for all chapter, and give a chapter tactic to the Dark angel unit that always move in the fluff (Terminator and bike)

 

This little buff will help Terminator and Attack bike become what they are in fluff: mobile weavy weapon platform!

 

If the rules give back the mobility to Terminator and Attack bike, DA become the only chapter with no chapter tactic for them, the simple fix to let them reroll 1 when they move make them a viable option vs all other chapter tactic that benefit those unit.

[Endgame]

Deathwing assault should be 1 cp if all models in the army have the Deathwing keyword.

 

Deathwing terminators should not get a -1 for firing heavy weapons. Right now Tartaros terminators are faster and with grenade harnesses and acs, they are more effective against almost all targets.

 

Venerable dreads should get the Deathwing keyword - they have probably been around enough to know a few things, but just as likely they were Deathwing before becoming a dread.

[Helycon]

Give back the old relentless to Terminator and bike/Attack bike.(make the rules as always count as not moving if you don't advance when shooting)

 

This will buff Terminator and Attack bike heavy weapon for all chapter, and give a chapter tactic to the Dark angel unit that always move in the fluff (Terminator and bike)

 

This little buff will help Terminator and Attack bike become what they are in fluff: mobile weavy weapon platform!

 

If the rules give back the mobility to Terminator and Attack bike, DA become the only chapter with no chapter tactic for them, the simple fix to let them reroll 1 when they move make them a viable option vs all other chapter tactic that benefit those unit.

To be fair, all chapters have this problem, bit just Dark Angels. It feels like a lot of units should have a similar rule. Nemesis Dreadknights have massive pistons coming out to support the arms and weapons. They suck due to not having relentless. People always run them as Grand Masters because of it, since they can reroll ones to boot (not to mention the aura).

 

I hope they review a lot of the units, but I agree that attack bikes and Land Speeders should be at the top of the list. Infantry, even TDA, not so much.

[solarisqc]

 

Give back the old relentless to Terminator and bike/Attack bike.(make the rules as always count as not moving if you don't advance when shooting)

 

This will buff Terminator and Attack bike heavy weapon for all chapter, and give a chapter tactic to the Dark angel unit that always move in the fluff (Terminator and bike)

 

This little buff will help Terminator and Attack bike become what they are in fluff: mobile weavy weapon platform!

 

If the rules give back the mobility to Terminator and Attack bike, DA become the only chapter with no chapter tactic for them, the simple fix to let them reroll 1 when they move make them a viable option vs all other chapter tactic that benefit those unit.

To be fair, all chapters have this problem, bit just Dark Angels. It feels like a lot of units should have a similar rule. Nemesis Dreadknights have massive pistons coming out to support the arms and weapons. They suck due to not having relentless. People always run them as Grand Masters because of it, since they can reroll ones to boot (not to mention the aura).

 

I hope they review a lot of the units, but I agree that attack bikes and Land Speeders should be at the top of the list. Infantry, even TDA, not so much.

 

I agree with you, i forgot to add all Walker and monster to the list (dreadnought, wraithlord, dreadknight, sentinel, hellbrute, carnifex, etc)

 

They need to add a rule for unit that are/was design with the role of moving and firing heavy weapon (TDA is the only infantry with this fonction since they was introduce in the game/fluff)

 

My point is any rule like this need to include not moving in the description to not penalise DA for moving with ''relentless'' unit losing the benefit of grim resolve.

[Helycon]

 

 

 

Give back the old relentless to Terminator and bike/Attack bike.(make the rules as always count as not moving if you don't advance when shooting)

 

This will buff Terminator and Attack bike heavy weapon for all chapter, and give a chapter tactic to the Dark angel unit that always move in the fluff (Terminator and bike)

 

This little buff will help Terminator and Attack bike become what they are in fluff: mobile weavy weapon platform!

 

If the rules give back the mobility to Terminator and Attack bike, DA become the only chapter with no chapter tactic for them, the simple fix to let them reroll 1 when they move make them a viable option vs all other chapter tactic that benefit those unit.

To be fair, all chapters have this problem, bit just Dark Angels. It feels like a lot of units should have a similar rule. Nemesis Dreadknights have massive pistons coming out to support the arms and weapons. They suck due to not having relentless. People always run them as Grand Masters because of it, since they can reroll ones to boot (not to mention the aura).

 

I hope they review a lot of the units, but I agree that attack bikes and Land Speeders should be at the top of the list. Infantry, even TDA, not so much.

I agree with you, i forgot to add all Walker and monster to the list (dreadnought, wraithlord, dreadknight, sentinel, hellbrute, carnifex, etc)

 

They need to add a rule for unit that are/was design with the role of moving and firing heavy weapon (TDA is the only infantry with this fonction since they was introduce in the game/fluff)

 

My point is any rule like this need to include not moving in the description to not penalise DA for moving with ''relentless'' unit losing the benefit of grim resolve.

Bikes all have this issue, so it's a tactical decision to keep them standing still and benefit from Grim Resolve. It's not going to be added I think, and not necessary at that.

[solarisqc]

DA Bike are the only bike that need to stand still to keep chapter tactic, all other chapter can move and keep chapter tactic bonus. It's just a bad design that DA bike need to stop moving to keep the chapter tactic bonus that all chapter get to use even if they move.

 

Adding ''relentless'' to bike will fix Attack bike for everyone and and let DA bike do what they are design to do... move!

[Helycon]

DA Bike are the only bike that need to stand still to keep chapter tactic, all other chapter can move and keep chapter tactic bonus. It's just a bad design that DA bike need to stop moving to keep the chapter tactic bonus that all chapter get to use even if they move.

 

Adding ''relentless'' to bike will fix Attack bike for everyone and and let DA bike do what they are design to do... move!

Or, they are the only bikes that get to get into position and reroll ones after they get there and hold the fort. Glass half full or half empty ;)

[Project XXVIII]

Narthecium,.. so let’s say Apoth Jim is hanging around Tact Squad Alpha,.. and unfortunately Squad Alpha suffers a casualty. Due to some orders from command, Squad Alpha is to hook up with Squad Beta a few inches away.

 

Now Apoth Jim REALLY wants to save his battle brother from Squad Alpha. Under which scenario is Apoth Jim allowed to due his duty for the Chapter;

 

1) Apoth Jim tells Squad Alpha’s Serg to stay put so he can attempt to bring their battle brother back.

 

2) Squad Alpha “snakes” out from the position of the fallen brother, staying in Squad coherency but allowing Jimmy to make his roll.

 

3) Squad Alpha and Jim both move, and Jim can make his roll so long as he’s within the specified distance to Squad Alpha at the end of Jim’s move.

 

This may have been already answered somewhere else, but every game I’ve played involving an Apoth, this discussion has popped up. For the record, I’ve always played under option 1, but I can also see option 2 being viable.

[BrotherChris]

Terminators need to get some buffs in general. No one plays them because they're overcosted for what they do.

 

Here are some of my ideas (it would be great to see at least one of those implemented):

1. Toughness 5
2. buffing stormbolter with -1 AP
3. making stormbolter act as pistol type weapon when within 1" of enemy model.
4. at least slight reduction in points cost.

[Hantheman]

 

Terminators need to get some buffs in general. No one plays them because they're overcosted for what they do.

 

Here are some of my ideas (it would be great to see at least one of those implemented):

• Toughness 5
• buffing stormbolter with -1 AP
• making stormbolter act as pistol type weapon when within 1" of enemy model.
• at least slight reduction in points cost.

Yeah. There is literally no reason they’re not toughness 5 and inceptors are.

[Helycon]

 

 

Terminators need to get some buffs in general. No one plays them because they're overcosted for what they do.

 

Here are some of my ideas (it would be great to see at least one of those implemented):

• Toughness 5
• buffing stormbolter with -1 AP
• making stormbolter act as pistol type weapon when within 1" of enemy model.
• at least slight reduction in points cost.

Yeah. There is literally no reason they’re not toughness 5 and inceptors are.

Gravis armour makes them T5. TDA bestows a 2+ and 5++. That is the case for all toes of Astartes armour.

 

Bumping up storm Bolters to AP-1 will make Grey Knights squeel with joy O think. Not happening, the collateral will be too severe.