FAQ release today.

[Holier Than Thou]

This is really disappointing. *Nom, nom, nom* <- I’m officially eating my words. Sorry for putting my trust in GW guys. I was 100% sure we wouldn’t get left out of an update this time around. Looks like I was dead wrong. Time to spam their email! Not even one codex specific change.. I can’t believe it

At least you're big enough to come on and admit you were wrong. We've not seen the same from the other posters who were griping at us to trust GW.

[Bjarni St.]

Does Gate of Infinity fall under new DS rule?

 

Maybe. It's not clear. There are conflicting sources supporting either view if you want to dig for it but all of them predate the distinction between redeployment from the table and coming in from reserves being meaningful past the start of the game so I'm not inclined to give them much weight. We'll have to await further clarification and until then it's basically up to TO or table interpretation.

[Capt. Mytre]

 

Does Gate of Infinity fall under new DS rule?

 

Maybe. It's not clear. There are conflicting sources supporting either view if you want to dig for it but all of them predate the distinction between redeployment from the table and coming in from reserves being meaningful past the start of the game so I'm not inclined to give them much weight. We'll have to await further clarification and until then it's basically up to TO or table interpretation.

 

 

For this to count for us, it would require us to die if we used either ability after the third turn. In the Eldar FAQ, there's a part that mentions that units that re-arrive via one of their skills does not kill them if it happens after turn 3. If that's the case, then our abilities would logically not count as "arriving", but re-arriving.

 

But who knows, this is GW we're talking about. I've seen stupider things in the last 24hrs by them.

[SyNidus]

Well, i hate to say that you were right. I am rather disappointed with the lack of a GK FAQ. But i've sent more emails and hey, you can too!

EDIT: On the plus side, Toby's No Retreat mono-GK build still works with some tweaking.

[STTAB]

Send emails to your plastic crack dealers instead of the FAQ email.

 

"With regards to the big FAQ, my purchases on hold untill GW rules team show they can balance gradually.

 

With list building, buying, building, painting being a slow and gradual process, I can not commit to a project when big swings in rules and points may invalidate a strategy the army was built around before the army is tabletop ready.

 

I require a larger degree of certainty of the games core mechanics and that changes will be gradual tweaks.

 

I hope we can do business again in the future"

 

I sent emails along these lines to my local GW store and an online retailer I use. The retailer replied that he was pretty pissed about the big FAQ as new units he had just finished will only see the table once, at a tourney this weekend.

[Capt. Mytre]

Send emails to your plastic crack dealers instead of the FAQ email.

 

"With regards to the big FAQ, my purchases on hold untill GW rules team show they can balance gradually.

 

With list building, buying, building, painting being a slow and gradual process, I can not commit to a project when big swings in rules and points may invalidate a strategy the army was built around before the army is tabletop ready.

 

I require a larger degree of certainty of the games core mechanics and that changes will be gradual tweaks.

 

I hope we can do business again in the future"

 

I sent emails along these lines to my local GW store and an online retailer I use. The retailer replied that he was pretty pissed about the big FAQ as new units he had just finished will only see the table once, at a tourney this weekend.

 

TBH, I'm fine with big changes. In fact, I want a reworked GK codex, not minor adjustments to it that doesn't solve the core issues.

 

The issue is, GW suck at rule writing. There is so much ambiguity to many of their rules, they don't have strict methods of writing rules, they don't use keywords or adjust individual special rules. They use the same generic rules across multiple armies and factions. They don't think about how their sweeping rules changes effect each army (see both the initial smite rule and the current deepstrike changes).

 

GW should have moved to a free rules system, and 8th edition should be in beta right now. Each army rules would also be free. Right now, it's a massive mess of 3+ books + pages and pages of printouts of changes and it hasn't even been a year since release. It took 7th ages to reach this stage.

[Gentlemanloser]

Why bother removing USRs and replacing them with individual Keywords, when everything is treated like a USR anyway?

[Danarc]

I sent a feedback to GW as some people from Italian GK community did. But I'm sure that it is useless since it is clear that GW think that GK are perfect balanced army. Even before this faq we had the less faqed army nevertheless we have some problem that are objective (e.g. twin heavy plasma cannon).

 

I'm quite disturbed by GK behaviour, and I think that no one can now blame us for our disappoint. 

[Matt_149]

Or you could not play the beta rules....

[skarn]

They simply do not care about monobuild gk, or gk at all.

Next year they will release a gk primaris kit. Then they will care.

[Waking Dreamer]

They simply do not care about monobuild gk, or gk at all.

Next year they will release a gk primaris kit. Then they will care.

GK seems like a very low priority...with a quick codex release and little changes since - though they'll be cashing in SoB next year definitely.

[Corvus Fortis]

So how do you think we should play with new beta-rules? Seriously, do you have ideas of the lists? I think, double GMNDK will be history. If we consider that GW mean only Deep Strike, not gate and such in beta-rules, double-stormraven with 3xstrikes and 3xinterceptors and GMNDK/draigo gating turn 1 to give them all rerolls seems to me only viable strategy. 

[Panzer]

You know ... if I were a pessimistic person I'd say GW is trying to phase out Grey Knights with how little support they get. The optimistic part of me tho says that GW might have planned something special with Primaris for GK and that's why we don't see anything happening for the current units and such a low effort Codex.

However I'm usually trying to be realistic and there I can only say ... I have literally no clue what's GW thinking about Grey Knights and where they want to go with them. It just makes no sense with the current informations we have.

[Danarc]

You know ... if I were a pessimistic person I'd say GW is trying to phase out Grey Knights with how little support they get. The optimistic part of me tho says that GW might have planned something special with Primaris for GK and that's why we don't see anything happening for the current units and such a low effort Codex.

However I'm usually trying to be realistic and there I can only say ... I have literally no clue what's GW thinking about Grey Knights and where they want to go with them. It just makes no sense with the current informations we have.

A planification with new PAGKP isn't in competition with a good and fair fix of our rule. 

I think that GW only base his work on tournament's feedback. Since GK is too weak and we are no more a well rounded army, no one use them with any results (in good or bad) and GW think that GK are a good and balanced army. 

This is my opinion but in this case GW shows that they are: 

- incompetent

OR

- in mala fides.

[Trevak Dal]

Crazy idea: purposely build lists around NOT using command points and strategems? Since they are Garbo any ways, take the fast attack heavy formation with some palys and :cuss em if they cant take a joke.

 

If crisis still had jsj, I'd take the elite heavy one and kill the bastards while they circle jerk with their get out of jail collect 200 dollars boardgame bs.

[Panzer]

 

You know ... if I were a pessimistic person I'd say GW is trying to phase out Grey Knights with how little support they get. The optimistic part of me tho says that GW might have planned something special with Primaris for GK and that's why we don't see anything happening for the current units and such a low effort Codex.

However I'm usually trying to be realistic and there I can only say ... I have literally no clue what's GW thinking about Grey Knights and where they want to go with them. It just makes no sense with the current informations we have.

A planification with new PAGKP isn't in competition with a good and fair fix of our rule. 

I think that GW only base his work on tournament's feedback. Since GK is too weak and we are no more a well rounded army, no one use them with any results (in good or bad) and GW think that GK are a good and balanced army. 

This is my opinion but in this case GW shows that they are: 

- incompetent

OR

- in mala fides.

 

 

Pretty sure they don't do exactly that or else I'm wondering why we don't see any Eldar issues adressed.

[Holier Than Thou]

You know ... if I were a pessimistic person I'd say GW is trying to phase out Grey Knights with how little support they get. The optimistic part of me tho says that GW might have planned something special with Primaris for GK and that's why we don't see anything happening for the current units and such a low effort Codex.

However I'm usually trying to be realistic and there I can only say ... I have literally no clue what's GW thinking about Grey Knights and where they want to go with them. It just makes no sense with the current informations we have.

That's terrible business practice though. We'll treat part of our customer base as second class citizens but when it suits us to release something for them they'll throw their money at us. More likely, they'll get so disgusted by the way they've been treated that they go elsewhere and give some other company their money.

[Panzer]

I never claimed it to be good practice. GW got a lot better the past 2-3 years but they still have lots to learn as we all know.

[Holier Than Thou]

I never claimed it to be good practice. GW got a lot better the past 2-3 years but they still have lots to learn as we all know.

I know, I meant to say that's terrible business practice so you're probably right. Haha

[Panzer]

Gotcha. :D

[Adeptus]

It's like I've said all along. GW are incompetent when it comes to balancing rules. The solution is to throw matched play oUT the window and come up with fun ways to play on your own.

[Panzer]

It's like I've said all along. GW are incompetent when it comes to balancing rules. The solution is to throw matched play oUT the window and come up with fun ways to play on your own.

 

It's called Narrative Play. Maybe you should try it out and all the different Missions and additional rules for it. ^^

[Gentlemanloser]

Narrative?  With facing 1000 extra points of summoned enemies a turn?  Unlimited non Smite Mortal Wound psychic Powers (so no Smite Nerf to help) and everyone get the most expensive upgrades for free?

 

No thanks.

 

The beta DS rules are more fun than trying to cope with any of that.

[Panzer]

Hey I'm not saying it's super balanced. It just fits what he described lol

Also you confuse Narrative Play with Power levels. You can play Narrative Play perfectly fine with Points as well.

[Helycon]

Narrative? With facing 1000 extra points of summoned enemies a turn? Unlimited non Smite Mortal Wound psychic Powers (so no Smite Nerf to help) and everyone get the most expensive upgrades for free?

 

No thanks.

 

The beta DS rules are more fun than trying to cope with any of that.

Narrative doesn't mean that. Narrative means you can play whatever you want. If you and your opponent decide to not have summons cost anything, than it's all good. If you decide you need to pay points to keep the balance, fine and dandy as well. The rules are made to make sure people from all over have a common set of rules. If your local group decides otherwise, that's your prerogative.