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Company Ancient and the company banner questions


dread05

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Like I mentioned in my wip thread, I'm building two companies of the Blood Angels, probably The Blooded, and the Knights of Baal. While reading about Honour Guard in the wiki, I found this part :

 

"A commander who prefers to spearhead his strike force's attacks might well choose seasoned Assault Marines to form his bodyguard, or Battle-Brothers practiced with close-range special weapons, such as Flamers or Plasma Guns. Older and wiser officers instead select their Honour Guards to help create a visible anchor-point on the battlefield. Such officers go to war accompanied by their company's Standard Bearer and Champion, forming an easily identifiable and adaptable rallying point around which the battle inevitably focuses. A particularly respected officer can even call upon one of the Chapter's novitiate Sanguinary Priests to serve in his Honour Guard."

 

and I decided, I'd do both for my companies. One company got a squad of jump pack veterans with plasma guns as the honour guard of its captain. For the other company I'm trying to somewhat replicate the old command squad. So far I have:

 

1) a company champion acting as the Blood Champion.

2) a lieutenant, acting as the Warden of the Blood, ready to take the place of the captain if he falls in battle.

3) a sanguinary novitiate, as yet ubuilt, I'm waiting for a right handed chainsword to complete him.

 

What I'm missing is the company ancient. I've got all the parts to build one for more than a year now, but I'm hesitating, and the problem is the banner. There is no way I can free hand a company banner. I know that both the second and fourth companies had their banners officially revealed by GW. Is there any way to make that into a transfer sheet? There are some very pretty banners in the BA transfer sheet, but I'd rather not use them. I want it to actually be the company banner, you know? Not a banner that resembles the sanguinary guard's, cause all 6 of the banners in the transfer sheet are variations of that.

There was a tut in either the painting or modelling tutorial forums about printing out transfers for space marine standard bearers, I had a look but couldn’t find it, but swear it was there at some point. Once I’ve showered and eaten I’ll have annuva looksy and see if I can find it for you. If I can find it I’ll post a link.

Might be worth emailing gw - they pulled the ba decal sheet when dark imperium came out and in theory were going to release a new one. The previous one had some rather good sanguinius partial decals for banners - possible some new options will be out.

 

I ended up using the large grail icon for my company banner (5th co).

Might be worth emailing gw - they pulled the ba decal sheet when dark imperium came out and in theory were going to release a new one. The previous one had some rather good sanguinius partial decals for banners - possible some new options will be out.

 

I ended up using the large grail icon for my company banner (5th co).

 

I will do that actually! Dont think they'll help but its worth the shot.

  • 3 weeks later...

I have a habit of necroing my own posts it seems. I still havent built the ancient cause I cant decide his loadout. My logic says boltgun, but I dont have a single one left handed (I dont knowif they even exist) nor do I have the parts to convert one. My other ideas are 1)power sword 2)chainsword 3)power fist, for the rule of cool. He's part of what I'd call a fluff squad, I dont think I'll ever run him, but still, it would be nice to have him properly loaded.

Welp GW answered my mail. They directed me to their forge world trasfer sheet. How the IX legion decals will help me with my Blood Angels company banners, I dont know :tongue.:

 

Legion banner is a 10,000 year old relic that has been granted to your company ancient to carry into battle?

 

Welp GW answered my mail. They directed me to their forge world trasfer sheet. How the IX legion decals will help me with my Blood Angels company banners, I dont know :tongue.:

 

Legion banner is a 10,000 year old relic that has been granted to your company ancient to carry into battle?

 

 

:) I specifically asked them in my mail if they plan to release transfers for the 2nd and 4th companies, since GW has released the official banners of those companies in their products. They replied that I can check the forgworld IX legion transfer sheet. I just think they have premade answers to some questions, without really readying the mails.

 

 

Welp GW answered my mail. They directed me to their forge world trasfer sheet. How the IX legion decals will help me with my Blood Angels company banners, I dont know :tongue.:

 

Legion banner is a 10,000 year old relic that has been granted to your company ancient to carry into battle?

 

 

:smile.: I specifically asked them in my mail if they plan to release transfers for the 2nd and 4th companies, since GW has released the official banners of those companies in their products. They replied that I can check the forgworld IX legion transfer sheet. I just think they have premade answers to some questions, without really readying the mails.

 

 

I think its safe to say they wont. Second company banner has been in the literature for 20+ years and still no model. If I wanted to go this way Id make a GS press mould of the old land raider doors and add it to a plain company banner. 

 

EDIT:

 

Where'd you see the 4th co banner? i've never seen that in any GW artwork, just the 1st and 2nd...

I found this some time ago.

The first row shows known (from 2nd edition Codex Ultramarines) company designs and colors.

The second row interprets those codex designs into Blood Angels, using info from our known 1st and 2nd co banners, plus Tycho's (3rd co) banner.

gallery_93095_13468_25046.jpg

In general, the 5th company icon is taken from the captain's personal heraldry - for Tycho this is the broken wing, for Aphael, this is the chalice, for my 4th co, the lord adjudicator has a winged sword icon (so I can use ravenwing pads).

 

As we have also seen, there can be..knock off...versions of the banner featuring just a silhouette.

 

If you want to see a mock up of my 4th co banner, check the first post in my BA paint log. 

In general, the 5th company icon is taken from the captain's personal heraldry - for Tycho this is the broken wing, for Aphael, this is the chalice, for my 4th co, the lord adjudicator has a winged sword icon (so I can use ravenwing pads).

 

As we have also seen, there can be..knock off...versions of the banner featuring just a silhouette.

 

If you want to see a mock up of my 4th co banner, check the first post in my BA paint log. 

 

I've seen something similar, just with 4 green blood drops instead of one.

 

Apart from the 1st, I'm still in a pinch for my companies. I'm leaning towards representing the 2nd and the 4th because I like the names, the Blooded and the Knights of Baal, while I REALLY dont like the names of the 3rd and 5th, the Ironhelms and the Daemonbanes. Did Aphael survive the Devastation of Baal? My version of the 2nd's captain has a combi flamer instead of a plasma pistol. Maybe after the devastation, he switched to a more appropriate weapon for clearing hordes of tyranids, and he put on a rebreather to protect him from the fumes.

Aphael did survived the Devastation.

 

About the banner: I believe that the idea that banner gets heraldry from the captain leading it is fundamentally flaved. Many reasons for that.

Firstly, captaincy is an honor. An honor for the captain to lead the Company, not for the Company to be lead by a particular Captain. Sure captain may add something to the banner, but not redesign it totally just to honor himself. This is not the Blood Angels way as I see it. Not Sanguinius's way.

Tycho is usually given as an example for that kind of approach. But I see Tycho as an exception. In many ways. And he was not known for his humility.

 

Secondly, there are practical reasons also. Let's assume a typical lifespan of a Captain (after receiving captaincy that is) for 200 years. That would make 7 captains and 7 different banners for 1 company during Dante's rule alone. Across 10 millennia of BA chapter existence that makes at least 50 different banners and markings for a single Company!!

This would be most confusing for the chapter itself. And also does not play well with Space Marines being very traditional and valuing history.

And what about banners being priceless old relics?

 

I believe that banners were changing little across millennia. Captains came and went, but Companies endured longer and brought with them the heritage of glory. And banners were part of that.

In my opinion it were the captains adopting Company's heraldry more often then the other way around.

 

Dont get me wrong. I love what you did for the 4th Company banner Xenith. I believe it is really good heraldically and that GW should buy it from you.

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