The Lords of Silence

[Tyrannicide]

Anyone care to drop some details on the White Consuls?

[Vesper]

Anyone care to drop some details on the White Consuls?

Most of the Chapter left Sabatine to defend Cadia during the 13th Black Crusade. The characters haven't heard of them since. Sabatine is home to serious civil unrest the remaining forces are unable to quell since defending the fortress monastery remains the priority.

Sabatine is then invaded by the Death Guard and the Word Bearers, the White Consuls fight a losing battle to the end, culminating with the death of their Chapter Master in the bowels of their fortress monastery.

Edited September 15, 2018 by Vesper

[Tyrannicide]

Thanks, Vesper!

 

Is there any insight into their Chapter culture?

[1ncarnadine]

Thanks, Vesper!

 

Is there any insight into their Chapter culture?

 

The thing that springs to mind immediately is that they practice having two Chapter Masters at the same time. One defends the fortress monastery, and one attends their response force. The one that dies in LoS is of course the sitting home world Chapter Master. I think that info was available before in the Deathwatch RPG, but it was news to me while reading this book :P

Edited September 15, 2018 by LetsYouDown

[Marshal Loss]

I think it (twin chapter masters) pre-dates the Deathwatch RPG, albeit only by a year or so - one of the (many) great things about this book is that the plot ties together with Anthony Reynolds' excellent Word Bearers novels. Dark Creed shows what happens to most of the White Consuls, while Lords of Silence has the perspective of those left on their homeworld. Really love how Wraight was able to incorporate (and not invalidate) so much older work. It's an achievement on par with ADB's exploits.

[Ascanius]

I loved that stuff, too, Marshal Loss.

[SkimaskMohawk]

I think it (twin chapter masters) pre-dates the Deathwatch RPG, albeit only by a year or so - one of the (many) great things about this book is that the plot ties together with Anthony Reynolds' excellent Word Bearers novels. Dark Creed shows what happens to most of the White Consuls, while Lords of Silence has the perspective of those left on their homeworld. Really love how Wraight was able to incorporate (and not invalidate) so much older work. It's an achievement on par with ADB's exploits.

Oh man, I was just about to come in here and ask how it maintained the stuff from dark creed.

 

I'm picking this up for sure

[Kilofix]

Changing topics for a second.

 

Is anyone surprised Eliathada isn’t an absolute choking fug like Barbarus and isn’t also just a Nurgle Garden? I mean it has civilization, farms, pilgrims, etc.

[b1soul]

Re Chaos...

 

Supposedly everything is canon and nothing is canon in BL, so no authourial interpretation of Chaos is wrong or fails to "get it"

[Scribe]

Re Chaos...

 

Supposedly everything is canon and nothing is canon in BL, so no authourial interpretation of Chaos is wrong or fails to "get it"

 

Nah. When I went on my pilgrimage when certain posters claimed that this new 40K was 'less grim' I found the opposite. The setting endures, exactly as it has been, if not even worse. Chaos has not changed in any meaningful way in its representation or underlying concepts, since I came into the game around 3rd. Liber Chaotica remains the 'truth' as far as I'm concerned, and I've seen nothing to indicate otherwise.

[b1soul]

There is no absolute truth in the 40K sandbox...authours are free to play around with various ideas

 

Thought that was the official BL stance

[DukeLeto69]

There is no absolute truth in the 40K sandbox...authours are free to play around with various ideas

Thought that was the official BL stance

I had that impression also. There must be some parameters that authors have to work within (such as the nature of the four known chaos Gods).

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I’m sure there is a minimum set of standards that must be met.

[Marshal Rohr]

Authors are free to write what they want, and it’s just as valid as any other piece of lore. That is Black Library’s stance.

[Scribe]

There is no absolute truth in the 40K sandbox...authours are free to play around with various ideas

 

Thought that was the official BL stance

 

That's certainly the surface level take, but its not sufficient to describe how the setting (which IS a setting) exists and functions, and is communicated via books.

 

Idea's are played around with, retcons (Iron Hands, Black Templars anyone?) and thats fine. When people make hilariously outlandish statements however and try and buttress them with 'the setting is open and there is no truth' well thats just people reaching for a conclusion that supports their own warped view of the setting.

 

I'd love for people to show otherwise, but I looked, at the dawn of this 'new era' which...is very much like the previous era, only with bigger Marines.

 

Nothing has changed about the fabric of 40K. It has not gained any 'noble bright' attributes. It is 40K.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Authors are not free to write whatever they want - that is simply ridonkulous !!!

[Marshal Rohr]

Yes, they are. 

[Scribe]

Yes, they are.

Well then how lucky we are, that I've not seen a book playing out the What If fever dreams we see around here eh?

 

Almost like there are themes and touchstones within a shared setting that are simply understood by those who create for it. ;)

[b1soul]

IIRC..."nothing is canon, everything is canon" is a principle supported by ADB and other BL writers

 

Yeah, no BL writer is gonna make Chaos into rainbows and butterflies...but within a very rough framework (a dimension based on the emotions of the galaxy's sentient beings), authours can do whatever they want

[Scribe]

It certainly is something ADB has mentioned many times. What a wonder it is, that the vast majority of fiction falls within what the majority of the community would agree is canon.

[bluntblade]

There may not be Rules, but Wraight has written about how writing for an IP means you have a lot of established lore to take into account so you don't upset too many people or produce something that isn't verisimilitudinous (yeah, I've been waiting for a chance to use that).

[b1soul]

Frankly, my favourite version of Chaos has always been Abnett's Primordial Annihilator

[Marshal Rohr]

It’s really not controversial to say the authors are free to write whatever they want to write about. Insisting there are some kind of ‘Rules to Be Here’ is wrong since every author has said there are none.

[Petitioner's City]

Frankly, my favourite version of Chaos has always been Abnett's Primordial Annihilator

 

Me too!!!! And how he presents Chaos as far more diverse - and not beholden to the tabletop range of Chaos - has always been such a pleasant feature of his writing, something which ofc applies to also how he writes the Guard, how he writes the Inquisition, how he writes Elder, how he writes everything. I wish other writers could ... get away(?) with this, or be let loose?

 

It’s really not controversial to say the authors are free to write whatever they want to write about. Insisting there are some kind of ‘Rules to Be Here’ is wrong since every author has said there are none.

 

Except for explicitly corporeal sexual content - @ADB has written about having to take an orgasmic reaction from his Night Lords books. 

 

I also think with regards to the universe, common sense with regards to the IP's conventions applies, but that this common sense is light touch presumably. However, all our theorising is ... just that, theorising. We need proof, but even then it would only be a snapshot, reflecting an individual moment. Doubtless with changes at BL, changes to its place in GW, changes with editors, and changes with authors over now two decades means that there has probably been several different policies, procedures or simply preferences if not official policies with regards to how authors 'use' the setting or pay heed to IP conventions. 

Edited September 19, 2018 by Petitioner's City

[Marshal Rohr]

Didn’t ADB self-censor that part, too? IIRC, he said he pulled it out himself, no one said ‘Aaron do this or be damned’.