Thousand Sons in Kill team

[Prot]

I'm a bit surprised we haven't seen too much on this in the forum, but I wanted to shed some light if anyone is interested...

 

I got to see the rulebook and found Thousand Sons to be potentially a super fun option. The Tzaangor was a bit more expensive than I thought... if I recall he's 7 points and is dual wielding or carrying a BP and chainsword.

 

The Rubric Marine comes in three flavours:

Rubric - Marine Gunner - Asp. Sorcerer.

 

The sorcerer (being the only 'normal' dude can move 6", the others are limited 5 as usual.)

 

Inferno Boltguns still come standard. The Sorc is armed with the Stave and may swap in the Warpflame Pistol. 

The 'marine' may take a warpflamer, and the gunner can do up a Soulreaper Cannon. One marine can take the Icon of Flame.

 

You still get Death to the false emperor, and All is Dust, and a 5++.

 

The Icon is a 12" mortal wound dispenser on a roll of 6.

 

The Aspiring Sorc has the ability to ignore the to hit roll negative modifier from receiving a flesh wound. And he knows "Psybolt". 

 

The army may be a bit limited but the ability is there to basically fill out the numbers with Tzaangors a bit, but a Poxwalker for example is a lot cheaper. Of course the Tzaangor is going to hit more often and has a pistol option (for free if I recall.)

[Quixus]

Are you sure the Sorcerer can't take a plasma pistol?

[Scammel]

Strikes me that Kill Team may be the ideal home for Rubrics, which often desperately wish they were facing nothing but mediocre infantry in typical 40k. They're effectively Terminators in a great many situations in KT.

[Kite Senet]

Are you sure the Sorcerer can't take a plasma pistol?

 

It's really weird, but from the previews I've seen, it's not listed among the options for the Aspiring Sorcerer. And, yes, this is odd in that it's even more restrictive than the T-Sons codex itself is.

[Raven1]

Are you sure the Sorcerer can't take a plasma pistol?

I have not seen it in any preview, but the option even if it's in the codex isn't in the box so you know can't have that.

 

I think Rubric marines will be in a good place too, tough and deadly boaters with good close combat support with Tzaangors.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Raven1

[yergerjo]

 

 

Are you sure the Sorcerer can't take a plasma pistol?

It's really weird, but from the previews I've seen, it's not listed among the options for the Aspiring Sorcerer. And, yes, this is odd in that it's even more restrictive than the T-Sons codex itself is.

How about a force sword?

[Kite Senet]

Here's my source:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345264-kill-team-returns/page-50?do=findComment&comment=5127045

 

No options for anything other than staves with the Aspiring Sorcerer. Indeed, the only melee options for the entire T-Sons faction are force staves, chainswords, and tzaangor blades, and of course the latter two are Tzaangor-only.

 

I'm quite curious as to what Specialists one should optimally give to their Rubricae. It looks like we have Leader (for the Aspiring Sorcerer), Heavy (for the Gunner), and Combat, Demolitions, and Veteran for the rest. Sadly, it doesn't look like we can have Rubricae medics hauling about urns of dust to re-fill their wounded comrades, but at least we can give that job to the Tzaangors!

Edited July 27, 2018 by Kite Senet

[WarriorFish]

This could be a good excuse for me to get some Sons painted up, I reckon they'll be a good elite list. Maybe suffering for numbers, but should be fun :)

[BitsHammer]

Looks like the Soulreaper stays good since we didn't lose our ignore penalties for moving and shooting heavies rule.

 

I'm thinking about a list with a Sorceror, a Rubric with a Flamer, a Rubric with a Soulreaper, a regular Rubric with Icon of Flame (you'll not I don't like having all my eggs in one basket and like to spread out my options), and the rest of my army being Tzaangors with blades (with a Brayhorn mixed in of course). Based on a batrep I've seen it looks like a solid TAC build with both melee and ranged options, and we can bank on the durability of Rubrics to do some work.

[Prot]

Yup I think that’s the basic fundamental list covered. I’m sure we’ll learn more and advanced specialization may change the builds a bit. I’ve seen Thousand Sons in action too and at this level it appears the mortal wound is nothing to sneeze at. The icon of flame just looks like pure fun.

 

Not sure about the Tzaangors though... it might be a good idea to have one or two pistols with chainswords.

[BitsHammer]

Yup I think that’s the basic fundamental list covered. I’m sure we’ll learn more and advanced specialization may change the builds a bit. I’ve seen Thousand Sons in action too and at this level it appears the mortal wound is nothing to sneeze at. The icon of flame just looks like pure fun.

 

Not sure about the Tzaangors though... it might be a good idea to have one or two pistols with chainswords.

I agree, anything that can give us Mortal Wounds can definitely help.

 

-1 AP is still a good thing, so perhaps a mix of the two? If we can run the Tzaangor character without the Leader option that'll make things interesting since that's a bonus attack (which always helps).

[Raven1]

I have been thinking that chaindword/autopistol might be worthwhile in this.

 

The options seem limited to what comes in the box with the exception of Tzaangors who have shields we can't use.

 

My current plan is a mix of the two options Rubrics and Tzaangors. Being a ranger and CC group. We'll se the book drops.

[BitsHammer]

I have been thinking that chaindword/autopistol might be worthwhile in this.

 

The options seem limited to what comes in the box with the exception of Tzaangors who have shields we can't use.

 

My current plan is a mix of the two options Rubrics and Tzaangors. Being a ranger and CC group. We'll se the book drops.

Use the shield to represent their invul save?

[Raven1]

 

 

I have been thinking that chaindword/autopistol might be worthwhile in this.

 

The options seem limited to what comes in the box with the exception of Tzaangors who have shields we can't use.

 

My current plan is a mix of the two options Rubrics and Tzaangors. Being a ranger and CC group. We'll se the book drops.

Use the shield to represent their invul save?

I don't need to use them, I was commenting on the choice to stick to the box contents with the exception of Tzaangors who come with more options than available.

 

.... which could very easily be included but whatever.

[Kite Senet]

At least the omission of bespoke shield rules is in line with the actual 40k rules; I personally prefer that they treat them the same in both games, so Kill Team can kinda-sorta act as a proper introduction to 40k. The disregard for the option for Tzaangors to carry Icons of Flame, despite their obvious inclusion in the box and their 40k ruleset, seems like a more glaring omission to me.

[Skerr]

I am excited for 1k sons in kill team, so glad we made the first cut, keeps Rubric sales and interest up as well.

 

I did mix in a shield or 2 per 10 man tzangoor unit just for aesthetic variation.

Edited July 28, 2018 by Skerr

[BitsHammer]

"What are the shields for?" 

 

"So my goat can smack your guy in the face and then stab him when he's stunned of course."

[Kite Senet]

To be fair, that is probably more accurate to what that size of shield would be used for, historically speaking.

[BitsHammer]

And explains not only why we get an extra attack, but why it's at a -1 AP as well.

 

EDIT: 

I got a digital copy of the book and have been pouring over it and this is what I'm looking at running for my Kill Team (plus a bunch of fluff generated for fun):

 

Fluff:

BACKGROUND: PATH OF FATE

Arch-coven: This kill team serves an exceptional

gathering of psychically gifted warriors.

 

MISSION: INEFFABLE PURPOSE

Firestorm: All must burn in the mutating fires of

Tzeentch, until nothing but glowing ash and writhing

flesh remains.

 

SQUAD QUIRK: MYSTERIOUS BOON

Ancient Dust: The Rubricae of this kill team have begun

to lose their grip upon reality, and occasionally pause or

wander as though lost.

 

NAMES

Sorceror: Thotmas Shen (Leader)

Rubric Gunner (Soulreaper Cannon): Apophitar Rhan

Rubric (Warpflamer): Ankhu P’Tra (Demolitions)

Rubric (Icon of Flame): Amonhep Kallisar

Twistbray: Phosis Takar (Combat)

Tzaangor (Brayhorn): Basteq Apophontar (Comms)

Tzaangor (Blades): Ankhu Basth

 

SPECIALISTS’ DEMEANOURS

Thotmas Shen (Leader): Unspeaking: Not a sound leaves this warrior’s lips, not

even a shout of anger or cry of pain.

Ankhu P’Tra (Demolitions): Ninefold Warrior: Everything this warrior does must

hark back to the sacred number of almighty Tzeentch.

Phosis Takar (Combat): Seething with Change: This warrior’s form writhes and

mutates in a constant state of flux.

Basteq Apophontar (Comms): Plans Within Plans: Nothing this warrior does is as it

seems, for their agendas are manifold and many-layered.

 

Honestly I love the idea of a group of Rubrics that kind of just space out or wander off for no reasons since that isn't something we've seen in the lore before, and the idea of one of them being locked into this loop of doing things in patterns of 9s was also amusing so I kept the quirk (though I swapped the roll with the combat specialist as mutation fits the Twistbray a lot more) and having a scheming comms specialist works considering some of the bonuses they can get if they manage to level up enough. 

 

Basically I love this fluff thing as it really inspires the army to be "your dudes" and creates modelling or conversion based opportunities that you may not consider normally. Like now I'm going to make sure my Twistbray has some mutations on his model (above and beyond normal levels) to represent his demeanor.

 

List:

Sorceror: Inferno Boltpistol, Force Stave

Rubric Gunner: Soul Reaper Cannon

Rubric: Warpflamer

Rubric: Inferno Boltgun, Icon of Flame

Twistbray: Tzaangor Blades

Tzaangor: Brayhorn, Tzaangor Blades

Tzaangor: Tzaangor Blades

Total: 99 points

 

If the Tzaangor Blades turn out to be less than helpful, it costs nothing to swap for autopistol/chainsword so the points totals won't change.

 

I decided to skip making the Gunner a Heavy specialist like I've seen in bat reps because thanks to All is Dust we're basically already given the level 1 of that that for free sans the tactic, and 1 extra shot wasn't enough to justify not getting a flamer that can wound easier (and flamers don't care about -1 to hit penalties for cover anyways). I went with a Twistbray firstly as it means 3 attacks normally, and 4 with Combat Specialist (I was considering that or Zealot but I suspect if he was a Zealot people would be charging him to keep from facing 4 S5 attacks with -1AP or just outright kill him the second he makes his move so I went with the flat +1 attack option since it's still helpful for him. Plus the combat tactic isn't bad, though I may try Zealot in the future).

Edited July 29, 2018 by Fulkes

[Prot]

I’ve had a blast making a Thousand Sons Kill Team. They’re named and they have a background, the whole nine yards.

 

I’m supposed to be hosting a campaign and it’s tempting to use the back story of the Thousand Sons Kill Team for the basis of the campaign.... a grand manipulation of sorts, a means to an end.

 

It does seem most Thousand Sons will look similar. But I’m putting Demo on my Flamer I think. It’s a good mix between elites and Tzaangors. Could be really fun.

[BitsHammer]

I’ve had a blast making a Thousand Sons Kill Team. They’re named and they have a background, the whole nine yards.

 

I’m supposed to be hosting a campaign and it’s tempting to use the back story of the Thousand Sons Kill Team for the basis of the campaign.... a grand manipulation of sorts, a means to an end.

 

It does seem most Thousand Sons will look similar. But I’m putting Demo on my Flamer I think. It’s a good mix between elites and Tzaangors. Could be really fun.

To be fair we need shooting and melee and our best shooting is on the Rubrics while the best melee is on the Goats, so it makes sense they'd look pretty similar.

 

That said, since there is no restriction on running a Twistbray without making him a leader, I don't see a reason why not to run one. An extra attack for a single point is well worth it.

 

The only downside I see in my list currently is that when models start gaining experience I may have to drop some things to make room for the specialists on the table in a campaign meaning I'd likely move the Icon of Flame onto my demo specialist and be ready to drop the basic Rubric instead. For pick up games though it's probably as optimized as it can get without being silly though.

[Raven1]

That said, since there is no restriction on running a Twistbray without making him a leader, I don't see a reason why not to run one. An extra attack for a single point is well worth it.

 

One of my big questions for the game was if I could do that and it looks like I can. So I definitely will. A specialism like combat or zealot with work nicely and comms on the brayhorn. It's good to see the Icon finally be appropriately pointed. Probably should be free though.

[BitsHammer]

 

That said, since there is no restriction on running a Twistbray without making him a leader, I don't see a reason why not to run one. An extra attack for a single point is well worth it.

One of my big questions for the game was if I could do that and it looks like I can. So I definitely will. A specialism like combat or zealot with work nicely and comms on the brayhorn. It's good to see the Icon finally be appropriately pointed. Probably should be free though.

 

I'll take a single point for the chance of mortal wounds over what it normally costs us. It's a much better deal in KT and in some respects I hope KT upgrade costs bleed over into 40k proper as well.

[Ahistorian]

I was really hoping for axes on the A.S. I have the perfect blade and was hoping to make Khayon and his brothers

[Raven1]

I was really hoping for axes on the A.S. I have the perfect blade and was hoping to make Khayon and his brothers

Its strictly what comes in the box. So even the plasma pistol is gone. Plus I think Khayon is a bit better than your average Aspiring Sorcerer.

 

A question I have from a roleplaying aspect are people adding demeanors and names to Rubrics and Tzaangors. I wonder how much of their former self is still inside the dust and how much an Aspiring Sorcerer cares about the Tzaangors he leads.