HH Series ending soon. Siege will be another series

[Scribe]

I dont get how new people can use this to 'get in easier'. Its book one of the END of the horus heresy. What is the Horus Heresy you ask new person? Well read these other 50 books...

 

Its like numbering the next Star Wars film episode 1 and hoping no one asks why it starts 2/3 into a story.  All the marketing gimmicks dont change the fact that this is NOT  a self contained narrative. Not unless they purposefully write the first 'Siege'  book as a recap of the other 50 ( not that i put it past them at this point). 

 

If they wanted the  HH series to be lighter then they should not have put in every random piece of paper they had in the numbered series. But instead planned ( i know how much they dislike it) accordingly 25 books ago. 

 

Heck if they REALLY wanted to make it more streamline they could remember the series now and cut off the fat of it. 

 

To me, personal opinion and all that, the vast majority of the HH series is unnecessary AT BEST if not damaging to the core of the story. There are very few books that are must read touchstones. 

 

Maybe that changes in the fullness of time, but right now? No. So I get it. There is a psychological effect at looking at a series and going 'where are the other FIFTY PLUS books'. 

 

The Siege can easily be self contained. We knew the major plot points what, 20 years ago? You dont need all that fluff with Garro, you dont need that fluff with the Perpetuals, you dont need that fluff with near everything Shattered Legions, and you dont need AT ALL, the entire Vulkan arc to 'get' the Heresy.

 

Now again, maybe they wrap everything up and give all these side plots some actual meaning, but...I find that very unlikely.

 

I'm glad they are starting it over. Hopefully they can stay on target this time.

 

* Note: Opinions are mine, if you liked those other books thats great, I could have done with 10 books, instead of 50.

[Mellow]

If they had perhaps made the HH series a series of novels that were more substantial ... i.e. more along the size lines of the Game of Thrones books then the series could potentially have been done in 12 novels. Cutting a lot of the rubbish out and if necessary having multiple authors contribute to each larger novel. So if a novel is made of 3 large sections have 3 authors write each part and ensure they are all given a "start" and "finish" point and also a "must include" list.

 

I personally hope the siege series would be covered in 2 to 3 novels. The most annoying thing about the whole HH for me is that it has dragged on and on. I mean over 50 novels and we're still not done. That makes is totally impossible for a potential new customer to pick up the series and get into it. Just look at examples of Harry Potter. 7 books doesn't seem so bad. 50 ... god. Too many. 

[bluntblade]

Meaning you'd have French's prose suddenly switching to Thorpe? No ta.

[b1soul]

I don't see how rushing through the Siege via two to three novels is a good idea...just because BL wasted time on diversions like Nemesis, Vulkan, and Imperium Secundus.

 

BL has already made what should have been short into something long. I don't want BL to compound that error by making what ought to be long into something short.

[bluntblade]

Some egregious moments have resulted from BL hastily tying up things like the Cabal and the Shattered Legions.

[Scribe]

I don't see how rushing through the Siege via two to three novels is a good idea...just because BL wasted time on diversions like Nemesis, Vulkan, and Imperium Secundus.

 

BL has already made what should have been short into something long. I don't want BL to compound that error by making what ought to be long into something short.

 

2 or 3 books? I'd have no issue with that. Honestly I hope for at most like REALLY MOST, 10. If its longer than 10, its just more stuff that is fully irrelevant (Shattered Legions, Vulkan, Garro) to the core story.

 

EDIT: In fact.

 

1. Entry and void war in the Sol System, ends with making planet fall.

2. DG vs WS at the Space Port.

3. The total collapse of the EC as a military force.

4. The Siege (aka Iron Warriors book) with the fall of the gate as Khârn TAKES THE BREACH. This also has the Angel and Angron stare down.

5. Battle within the Palace.

6. Emperor destroys Horus (with Angel getting killed).

 

Thats all I really need to see, and you could even combine books 1/2, 3/4 and 5/6.

[Rob P]

Really Praetorian of Dorn should have been the (and would have been an excellent) first book in a siege series.

 

I tend to agree that it shouldn't be rushed after the slog we've had to get to this point, but I don't disagree with what Scribe says immediately above. It could be done in 3 books. 10 seems a lot.

 

Still think it's daft and don't quite understand what was said earlier about hardcore fans not being bothered. To be honest, after spending money on a 50+ book series (which I think is pretty hardcore) it feels like a kick in the teeth to those that have invested in the series and who will now find that it does't actually conclude within the series.

 

I don't necessarily agree that we will have an issue about recognition of characters without HH pre-reading, because, to be fair, Horus Rising didn't spoon feed us who the characters were. And, having read a lot of the Lincoln Rhymes books, I've seen how an author can easily weave in the important character traits and info to get a reader up to speed (where needed).

[Lord_Caerolion]

So it all ends on a random number and before the end of the event the series is named for?

 

The series we've been reading is called the Siege of Terra?

[Scribe]

There is also the issue of there being finite 'key' events, and...tiers between Authors.

 

More books = more likely to have something done less than ideal.

 

Wraight French and ADB.

 

That's all I want.

[b1soul]

Fewer books also means you could get Kyme, Swallow, and Thorpe

[Orwell84]

Fewer books also means you could get Kyme, Swallow, and Thorpe

 

<shrug> Different strokes. Kyme I agree isn't somebody I particularly want to read, but Thorpe I've actually found more palatable than McNeill. Maybe that's just me liking the Raven Guard more than the Thousand Sons though.

 

Still, ADB, French, Wraight and maybe Abnett have been the consistently best authors IMHO, with Haley as a runner-up (for now - depends on how Titandeath and any future siege works turn out).

[mc warhammer]

agreed with rob p, if they want to market the siege as a jumping on point, even with 50 books of prior continuity, they can still write it in a way that makes it easily accessible to a new reader. happens in comics and tv all the time

[Scribe]

Fewer books also means you could get Kyme, Swallow, and Thorpe

 

I would like to think BL isnt so blind to reality.

[b1soul]

I would like to think that too

[Kelborn]

How many different authros did we have in the Heresy? 10?

 

I assume that everyone will get at least one chance to write about, either via a short, a novella or a full novel.

[Ascanius]

it feels like a kick in the teeth to those that have invested in the series and who will now find that it does't actually conclude within the series.

 

This is presumably more histrionic than you intended to sound. A kick in the teeth, really?

 

"The Horus Heresy" printed on the front of the books is just a brand. So, too, will be "The Siege of Terra". The books still tell the one (very big) story whether or not they're branded the same way.

 

This is really no different from when they stopped numbering Star Trek movies after Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country and instead just used subtitles from Star Trek: Generations onwards, or the way that Drizzt Do'Urden's story is told (badly) across a number of (very bad) novel trilogies with different names.

 

How many different authros did we have in the Heresy? 10?

 

Even if you count those who've written full novels, leaving aside short story contributions:

 

Dan Abnett, Graham McNeill, Ben Counter, James Swallow, Mitchel Scanlon, Mike Lee, Aaron Dembski-Bowden, Gav Thorpe, Nick Kyme, Chris Wraight, David Annandale, Guy Haley, John French = 13.

 

You do get 10, however, if you exclude those who haven't written a novel for the Heresy since the early years, i.e. Counter, Scanlon, and Lee.

[DarkChaplain]

Dan Abnett, Graham McNeill, Ben Counter, James Swallow, Mitchel Scanlon, Mike Lee, Anthony Reynolds, Gav Thorpe, Matthew Farrer, Aaron Dembski-Bowden, Nick Kyme, John French, Chris Wraight, Rob Sanders, Guy Haley, David Annandale, Andy Smillie, Josh Reynolds, Laurie Goulding, Robbie MacNiven, Ian St. Martin.... am I missing anyone?

[Indefragable]

I'm just expecting them to do the thing they did with the Primarchs: Horus Heresy logo, subtitle / logo added for The Siege of Terra arc, that's it. Same style otherwise.

 

 

I've thought on it, and all I can think is this.

 

'Heresy? That series is too long to jump into where do I even start'

 

No problem, just jump in at Book 1 of the Siege of Terra!

 

The HH essentially collapsed under its own weight?

 

 

 

I don’t get why it matters if the books say ‘Horus Heresy’ or ‘Seige of Terra’ on the cover?

 

To the hardcore fans? Its meaningless. Thats why I wondered about it myself. To someone new? Its easier to buy a book 1, than it is to see 'book 56' and go 'well no way I'm buying 55 other books, forget it'.

 

 

 

Please don't mess this up, BL.

 

 

To use my favorite restaurant analogy: at a certain point, you need to stop adding salt and paprika and ketchup and mustard and sriracha and stuff to a dish to "fix" it and just put it aside and start over.

 

My instincts tell me that the HH series got out of hand, even to BL's own perspective, and as such they are reigning things in a bit for the finale. I think they learned their lesson and the community feedback was too loud and obvious not to have been heard.

 

A sub-series with a defined scope, schedule, and common pool of events, dialogue, and characters for each author to draw upon

 

I would like to think that The Beast Arises was a lab experiment for this very reason. They now can compare the good/bad/ugly of the HH alongside the good/bad/ugly of a more limited series like TBA and pick out the best parts.

 

 

Considering that the Siege of Terra is the defining moment of the Horus Heresy, and arguably the entire HH series was background material to get us to this point, it makes sense that they want to spin it off a bit. As others have pointed out, it also makes marketing/sales sense (though it may be painful in some ways).

 

I am hopeful overall. I just hope it's done right*

 

*who defines this is a different matter

[Taliesin]

I was present there as well, it was quite a surprise to see this announced.

Later in the day there was the Doom of the Death Guard seminar with Swallow and some guy from Games Workshop and they appeared unaware of the fact that Siege of Terra has been rebranded into its own series. Swallow probably knew but wouldn't confirm and the other guy had no idea.

 

What I wanted to know is how many Siege of Terra novels we will see next year. I think we'll see at least 3, the opening trilogy by French, Haley and Thorpe, and possible more.

Looks like all of the guys are working on the novels now.

 

They were at pains to point out that this is not going to go on as long as the Heresy series was but that's a no brainer that tells us nothing.

Personally I am sticking with my prediction that there will be seven Siege of Terra novels. From the seminar I could not glean if Swalllow has another HH novel upcoming, it actually didn't seem like it,it felt like Buried Dagger was a big novel for him and his last novel in the series.

[Ascanius]

I was present there as well, it was quite a surprise to see this announced.

 

Missed opportunity to phrase this as "I was there, the day Black Library killed the Horus Heresy series . . ."

[betrayer41]

I think I saw somewhere that  ADB was kicking it off? Please correct me if im wrong though, I don't want to spread false info.

 

BUT if this is true then.......  

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Wow what a super rip-off... milk that cow GW .

[Roomsky]

I'm not even worried, for the simple reason it means authors and storylines I don't care for will probably have containment books I can skip, rather than bleeding into the subjects I actually want to read about. I enjoyed Unremembered Empire, but anyone reading through my shelf would probably be confused about where exactly Crazy Vulkan came from, there being a total lack of Vulkan Lives anywhere nearby.

 

I would have preferred a trilogy if it was a straightforward, Sons of Horus perspective tail like the opening trilogy, but there's too much to close off. The more excuses they have to add length, the better I'm sure those much anticipated reads will be. 

[mc warhammer]

my collection is probably similar to yours...quite a few gaps that i'm happy to never fill

[Kinstryfe]

Wow what a super rip-off... milk that cow GW .

How is this any more of a rip-off than making the same number of novels under the Horus Heresy banner? This is exactly like comic fans getting upset when a new #1 launches because something changes with a book. It's literally still Spider-Man having wacky adventures, so it doesn't matter if it's Spider-Man #917 or The Webtastic Wacky Adventures of Spider-Man #8. This is being upset because a rose has another name, but it's still the same flower. If they'd said the HH was such a success they were gonna do 50 more books about the Seige then yeah, that's reason to be annoyed, but the rest is just branding.