The Siege of Terra: The Lost and the Damned

[Marshal Rohr]

Hmm. FW mentioned that the Astronomican was at least partly self-sustaining. I do wonder if Horus had any plans for it beyond his father's death.

My bad, I was responding to Moonreaper. I think while the Emperor was mobile and conscious it could be sustained like when he would go on campaign, but to destroy the Astronomican is to destroy the Emperor.

[karden00]

Yeah the nature of the Astronomican is a weird one. The Big E left terra all the time, especially during the Crusade.

[Indefragable]

Expeditionary Fleet Commander: “Master of Astropaths, take us home.”

 

Master of Astropaths: “....my lord, I cannot.”

 

EFC: “what do you mean, ‘you cannot?’ You have located the Astronomicon, have you not?”

 

MoA: “yes, my lord....I have...”

 

EFC: “then what’s the problem?”

 

MoA: “my lord, it says ‘went ‘round the corner. Back in 5 min.’”

[DukeLeto69]

Do i have always wondered why BL/FW/GW didnt make the Great Crusade & HH era even more distinct from 40k by not having either the Astronomicon or Astropaths (and both of these being part of Emps big plan - yes they went with Webway).

 

Imagine the complete paranoia of loyalists having to rely on ship bound couriers for communication and litrrally having no idea what is going on and where across Galaxy during HH.

 

Doesnt account for conquering Galaxy unless ships could only do short warp jumps or they had some other device - perhaps Primarchs and the Big E have power to act like “headlights” or “torches” illuminating the path through the dark?

 

Anyway just thought!

[MarineRaider]

You guys forgetting that E has the ultimate trump card parked a few steps from him, a 9 foot tall ebony Primarch with a Hammer. I think Horus views this as his possible trump card if needed.

[Moonreaper666]

You guys forgetting that E has the ultimate trump card parked a few steps from him, a 9 foot tall ebony Primarch with a Hammer. I think Horus views this as his possible trump card if needed.

There are as few problems with that:

 

-Horus can perma-kill Vulkan thanks to his new powers

-Blowing up Terra would hurt the Imperium more than it would hurt the Traitors

-One Atomic Bomb can neutralize Vulkan

-Chaos Sorcerers can send Vulkan into the Warp (or just use Vortex Weapons)

[mc warhammer]

yeah but only a big ork thingy in the future is gonna stop vulcan . so bomb away

[Moonreaper666]

yeah but only a big ork thingy in the future is gonna stop vulcan . so bomb away

Vulkan won't do grox when Terra/Astronomican/Emperor is gone along with Khan and Dorn. Imperial Fists and White Scars are extinct[b/] while the Traitor Legions simply rebuild their numbers free from Loyalist attacks. Warp Rift on Terra opens up which means Daemons all over the Solar System

 

The Traitors win the Heresy should Vulkan blow up Terra. Chaos Gods will teleport the Traitor Primarchs and Captains/Lieutenants away before the explosion. Great Scouring doesn't happen while the Ultramarines struggle to keep the Ultramar Empire alive. Mars is still under the control of the Dark Mechanicum

 

Orks, Eldar and Rogue Imperial Warlords whittle down the Loyalists through Attrition. Traitors retreat to their planets, rebuild and summon more Daemons. Eye of Terror Slave Wars don't happen either. Traitor Primarchs locate and kill the Emperor and the remaining Loyalist Primarchs. (Erebus kills Vulkan with the Shard of Erebus)

[RikuEru]

 

yeah but only a big ork thingy in the future is gonna stop vulcan . so bomb away

Vulkan won't do grox when Terra/Astronomican/Emperor is gone along with Khan and Dorn. Imperial Fists and White Scars are extinct[b/] while the Traitor Legions simply rebuild their numbers free from Loyalist attacks. Warp Rift on Terra opens up which means Daemons all over the Solar System

 

The Traitors win the Heresy should Vulkan blow up Terra. Chaos Gods will teleport the Traitor Primarchs and Captains/Lieutenants away before the explosion. Great Scouring doesn't happen while the Ultramarines struggle to keep the Ultramar Empire alive. Mars is still under the control of the Dark Mechanicum

 

Orks, Eldar and Rogue Imperial Warlords whittle down the Loyalists through Attrition. Traitors retreat to their planets, rebuild and summon more Daemons. Eye of Terror Slave Wars don't happen either. Traitor Primarchs locate and kill the Emperor and the remaining Loyalist Primarchs. (Erebus kills Vulkan with the Shard of Erebus)

But. We. Know. That. Vulkan. Survives.

...because he is in an entire other book series much later down the Timeline.

 

By now your hypothetical Chaos-Wins-Headcanons are bordering on annoying and not on-topic anymore. Atleast not for Black Library Subforum Threads.

 

Anyway...

 

Can't wait for the regular Hardback of this. Still weighing the decision if I want the Series in German or English...

[Taliesin]

Well folks it looks like Amazon has the Title & Synopsis up for Guy Haley's entry to the Siege of Terra! I had no idea where to drop this so figured let's keep things tidy and start a new thread specifically for this book...

 

-

 

The Horus Heresy: Siege of Terra: The Lost and the Damned

 

On the thirteenth day of Secundus, the bombardment of Terra began... With the solar defences overcome through the devastating strength of the Traitor armada and the power of the warp, Horus launches his assault on the Throneworld in earnest. After withstanding a ferocious barrage of ordnance, an immense ground war commences outside the Palace with every inch gained paid for in the lives of billions. The front lines are beyond horrific and the very air is reduced to poison and blood. Bodies are thrown into the meatgrinder but the outer redoubts cannot possibly hold for long, even with the loyal primarchs to reinforce them. For Horus has his own generals to call upon... Between the plague weapons of Mortarion and the fury of Angron, the defenders face a losing battle.

 

-

 

Can we tentatively assume that 2 books a year is the Siege schedule putting the end somewhere in the region of 2022?

Very much interested in this Haley book. I want to know who he will be focusing on and can't wait to see more ground war action.

 

I think they may release a HH book twice a year as of 2020, but there's a chance we will see Gav Thorpe's book at the tail end of 2019 perhaps I think.

Then 4 and 5 in 2020

6 and 7 in 2021

8 in 2022

Edited April 20, 2019 by Taliesin

[Marshal Rohr]

I thought Haley’s book was due in November?

[Taliesin]

No, the regular hardcover comes out in October, which means the LE will ver likely be out two months in advance, so around August I would assume.

[Lord_Caerolion]

 

yeah but only a big ork thingy in the future is gonna stop vulcan . so bomb away

Vulkan won't do grox when Terra/Astronomican/Emperor is gone along with Khan and Dorn. Imperial Fists and White Scars are extinct[b/] while the Traitor Legions simply rebuild their numbers free from Loyalist attacks. Warp Rift on Terra opens up which means Daemons all over the Solar System

 

The Traitors win the Heresy should Vulkan blow up Terra. Chaos Gods will teleport the Traitor Primarchs and Captains/Lieutenants away before the explosion. Great Scouring doesn't happen while the Ultramarines struggle to keep the Ultramar Empire alive. Mars is still under the control of the Dark Mechanicum

 

Orks, Eldar and Rogue Imperial Warlords whittle down the Loyalists through Attrition. Traitors retreat to their planets, rebuild and summon more Daemons. Eye of Terror Slave Wars don't happen either. Traitor Primarchs locate and kill the Emperor and the remaining Loyalist Primarchs. (Erebus kills Vulkan with the Shard of Erebus)

 

 

Ok, lets humour this wishlisting. Firstly, awful presumptive of you that the Chaos Gods, infamously uncaring of the vast, vast majority of their champions, would teleport away every Primarch, given they leave Horus to die once they realize his usefulness is over. Secondly, gonna be a bit hard for the Traitors to "retreat to their planets" given the Dark Angels have annihilated most of them, not to mention the fact that any explosion large enough to destroy Terra would severely damage at least a portion of the Traitor fleets, not to mention the losses that would be inflicted on the Legions themselves. Now, once that happens, they've got the Ultramarines fleet arriving incredibly shortly after, along with the Dark Angels and Space Wolves. Or are we also assuming, like the Chaos Gods conveniently teleported the Primarchs/lieutenants away, that they're also going to do the same with their entire fleets?

 

What you're forgetting is that the Traitors don't want to destroy the Imperium, they want to destroy the Emperor and take the Imperium. To do that, and have any sense of legitimacy to win over any still on the fence, they need the throne. Also, why would the Eldar fight against the Imperials? They want Chaos defeated just as much, if not more than the Imperials do. Slaanesh is literally their racial enemy.

[Moonreaper666]

 

 

 

yeah but only a big ork thingy in the future is gonna stop vulcan . so bomb away

Vulkan won't do grox when Terra/Astronomican/Emperor is gone along with Khan and Dorn. Imperial Fists and White Scars are extinct[b/] while the Traitor Legions simply rebuild their numbers free from Loyalist attacks. Warp Rift on Terra opens up which means Daemons all over the Solar System

 

The Traitors win the Heresy should Vulkan blow up Terra. Chaos Gods will teleport the Traitor Primarchs and Captains/Lieutenants away before the explosion. Great Scouring doesn't happen while the Ultramarines struggle to keep the Ultramar Empire alive. Mars is still under the control of the Dark Mechanicum

 

Orks, Eldar and Rogue Imperial Warlords whittle down the Loyalists through Attrition. Traitors retreat to their planets, rebuild and summon more Daemons. Eye of Terror Slave Wars don't happen either. Traitor Primarchs locate and kill the Emperor and the remaining Loyalist Primarchs. (Erebus kills Vulkan with the Shard of Erebus)

Ok, lets humour this wishlisting. Firstly, awful presumptive of you that the Chaos Gods, infamously uncaring of the vast, vast majority of their champions, would teleport away every Primarch, given they leave Horus to die once they realize his usefulness is over. Secondly, gonna be a bit hard for the Traitors to "retreat to their planets" given the Dark Angels have annihilated most of them, not to mention the fact that any explosion large enough to destroy Terra would severely damage at least a portion of the Traitor fleets, not to mention the losses that would be inflicted on the Legions themselves. Now, once that happens, they've got the Ultramarines fleet arriving incredibly shortly after, along with the Dark Angels and Space Wolves. Or are we also assuming, like the Chaos Gods conveniently teleported the Primarchs/lieutenants away, that they're also going to do the same with their entire fleets?

 

What you're forgetting is that the Traitors don't want to destroy the Imperium, they want to destroy the Emperor and take the Imperium. To do that, and have any sense of legitimacy to win over any still on the fence, they need the throne. Also, why would the Eldar fight against the Imperials? They want Chaos defeated just as much, if not more than the Imperials do. Slaanesh is literally their racial enemy.

Without the Astronomicon there is no way for the Loyalists to be as fast as Traitors when it comes to Warp Travel. Even individual worlds 'close' to each other would have a harder time sending supplies and reinforcements to each other

 

None of the Loyalist Legions are close to their home territories. Reinforcements from their homeworlds would take MUCH LONGER to reach their Primarchs

 

Traitors just need to find some place to rebuild their forces and survive the Loyalists coming in piecemeal (Daemons can overwhelm small groups of Loyalists). The LONGER the Traitors are NOT driven to the Eye of Terror the less likely they will lose. Eldar would have to DIRECTLY support the Imperium for both nations to survive. Orks would be the big winner as neither the Imperium nor Traitors can reinforce worlds attacked by Greenskins and Dark Eldar

[MarineRaider]

 

You guys forgetting that E has the ultimate trump card parked a few steps from him, a 9 foot tall ebony Primarch with a Hammer. I think Horus views this as his possible trump card if needed.

There are as few problems with that:

 

-Horus can perma-kill Vulkan thanks to his new powers

-Blowing up Terra would hurt the Imperium more than it would hurt the Traitors

-One Atomic Bomb can neutralize Vulkan

-Chaos Sorcerers can send Vulkan into the Warp (or just use Vortex Weapons)

 

In the last HH Book with Vulkan the E himself tells Vulkan his only mission for the duration is to guard the gate leading to the throne room and if things go bad to hit the detonator blowing up the golden throne and Terra itself...the E states it will kill everyone including friend and foe alike. So the E had a doomsday device ready if it came to Horus winning. 

[Kelborn]

I thought that THE gate was sealed at the end of MoM, denying the Emperor any chance of fullfilling his project?

[Lord_Caerolion]

It was sealed, but I believe the implication that the daemons were still on the other side with metaphorical battering rams, so to speak.

[bluntblade]

So Vulkan's there to ultimately have no impact on the plot. Because a fourth Primarch on the walls wouldn't be a useful force multiplier in every scenario that the Siege throws up...

[Marshal Rohr]

A Primarch without a legion is just a tall warrior.

[bluntblade]

And an inspiring general and master tactician. Edited April 30, 2019 by bluntblade

[DarkChaplain]

I thought that THE gate was sealed at the end of MoM, denying the Emperor any chance of fullfilling his project?

 

 

So Vulkan's there to ultimately have no impact on the plot. Because a fourth Primarch on the walls wouldn't be a useful force multiplier in every scenario that the Siege throws up...

 

 

The Gate is about as sealed as the walls of the Imperial Palace are impregnable. The Gate will come under siege, and pretty much has been since it's closure. Vulkan is there to hold it shut when the assault ramps up while the Emperor and his Custodian Guard are busy elsewhere - at this point, I'd expect a big climax for Vulkan at the height of the Siege, when the Emperor is preparing to engage Horus aboard the Vengeful Spirit. Combine it with Malcador's sacrifice, sitting on the Golden Throne until the Emperor's return, and you've got some big potential for both Malcador and Vulkan to struggle against the predators of the warp in the Imperial Dungeon. And remember that Magnus is back in the game now, too, and the last information he has to go on is that his final shard is somewhere in said Dungeon, and likely ignorant of Malcador's veil around Titan and, by extension, Ianius.

 

If by "ultimately having no impact on the plot" you mean that "they succeeded in their role, thus maintaining the status quo we remember", then sure, he didn't have any impact on the plot. Vulkan does not have to be an active combatant on the walls to make a difference to the war effort - and it is a war being waged on multiple fronts.

 

From the old Collected Visions:

 

 

The star of the Emperor gave the defenders respite enough that many were able to cross through the portal and retreat into the Imperial Palace. At first all of the tech-priests and workers were evacuated and then, reluctantly, the Silent Sisterhood and the Custodian Guard withdrew from the battle and into the Palace dungeons.

 

The gate would remain closed to the daemons for as long as the Emperor was able to power it from his throne atop the golden portal. Only the mightiest of psykers had power enough to do this and even then most would be exhausted and fail in a short time. Only the Emperor had the might to keep the gate closed permanently and for him the effort got harder as the daemonic forces gathered about him. For as long as the daemon horde threatened to breach the portal, the Golden Throne would be his prison.

 

 

Even just the switch between Emperor and Malcador on top of the Throne would be enough to weaken the defences sufficiently to give Vulkan something to do, I'd say. And seeing how, while Mal is the most powerful psyker on Terra besides the Emperor, he is the weaker one. He will struggle harder than the Emperor did, and in the end it'll likely be Vulkan who picks up the pieces that physically breach the portal, while Malcador is fighting on the psychic level.

[Kelborn]

Oooooohhhh

Vulkan defending Malcador so that the Emperor can face Horus. I like that idea. Perfect candidate to do so and if everything is screwed (either Emperor fails or he is overwhelmed), Vulkan presses the big red button.

 

"Vulkan..."
"Not now."

"Vulkan...I...I am failing..."

"I said NOT NOW!"

[bluntblade]

Ok, that seems fair.

[SpAcEGhOsT095]

Whatever that one Word Bearer, The Warmonger dude, did to his mentor might play a role in breaking the seal. Poor guy is alive and bricked up in a wall in an older part of the palace.

[MarineRaider]

Here is the quote. I personally love the last line.

 

“The talisman would magnify the power of the Throne to unleash cataclysm.

Vulkan blinked and it was gone, a part of the great mechanism, impossible to remove and forever waiting.

Staggering back down the steps, his immortal flesh reknit itself, his body regaining its vitality, until, by the time he reached the ­bottom, he was without injury.

Vulkan retreated from his father and the Throne.

His eyes went to the portal. It would fail – his father had seen it, and Vulkan knew what lay beyond. He stepped back until he stood in the shadow of the Eternity Gate and held Urdrakule across his body in both hands, an eternal guardian.

‘Let them come…”

 

Excerpt From: Nick Kyme. “Old Earth.” Apple Books.