Codex: Space Marines 2.0 speculation & discussion

[Marshal Vespasian]

Hol :cuss I just now realize how much more murderous my Leviathans twin storm cannon arrays just became.

 

Re landraider: And maybe terminators gain the ability to charge directly from it after moving? Pretty please gw?

[Marshal Reinhard]

I feel vindicated when i said, way back whenever it was, that the "Reiver lieutenant" would be on the same datasheet as the regular phobos lieutenant.

 

Also with the shadowspear version being revealed to be a "Incursor Lieutenant, I wonder if there's gonna be a "Infiltrator lieutenant" option on the datasheet. Or is that too similiar to the Incursor setup perhaps?

[redmapa]

I think the Devastator doctrine will make Assault Cannon Razorbacks really good again, hell the Heavy Bolter ones sound really tasty too!.

 

I wonder what role Incursors will be, as a troop choice they do sound amazing but I dont expect them to be that, maybe Fast Attack. They are a bit choppy, their shooting seems decent and those mines will be top stuff to place in objectives, Im so hyped for this I dont really mind not having a real close combat unit! I can just flood the board with Marines!.

[momerathe]

Dakka repulsors at AP -2 are going to be filthy.

[Toxichobbit]

I think the Devastator doctrine will make Assault Cannon Razorbacks really good again, hell the Heavy Bolter ones sound really tasty too!.

 

I wonder what role Incursors will be, as a troop choice they do sound amazing but I dont expect them to be that, maybe Fast Attack. They are a bit choppy, their shooting seems decent and those mines will be top stuff to place in objectives, Im so hyped for this I dont really mind not having a real close combat unit! I can just flood the board with Marines!.

 

 

Dakka repulsors at AP -2 are going to be filthy.

 

That's assuming that Doctrines apply to vehicles. I'd like them to, but as of yet it hasn't been explicitely stated.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

TFCs at AP-2? *laughs in bionic*

[Joukernaut]

Eliminators holding a flank will absolutely deny any form of deep strike assault vs marines. Then park some infiltrators up front and deep strike assault will not affect us any longer.

[Dark Legionnare]

"Tactical doctrine"

AP -2 Bolt Rifles on my usual 20+ Intercessors at my shop is probably going to make for lots of angry folks.  Same with the Hellblasters having basically default "no save anymore" against anything 3+ or under in the game, that's not in cover.

Can't even begin to imagine how angry it would make folks if doctrines effect vehicles too. Repulsor is spewing a hell of a lot of AP- heat at that point.

I may be in the minority here, but the doctrines seem a bit too powerful to me.  Perhaps that's just my local playgroup and the effect my Star Phantom's force primaris-only force already has each game talking, but the new stuff/rules are neat.  Excited for custom chapters again, means I won't have to run my Phantoms as Raven Guard by default anymore.

[Happy-inquisitor]

Eliminators holding a flank will absolutely deny any form of deep strike assault vs marines. Then park some infiltrators up front and deep strike assault will not affect us any longer.

 

Careful there, if they have an ability to deny overwatch that eliminator ability will not have a chance to do anything.

 

It still could be awesome but keeping those eliminators for sniper duties in which case I'm not sure I even want the bolt carbine in there. I think we need to see the full datasheet to make decisions on anything other than they look really good if the points stay the same.

[MeltaRange]

Salamander Impulsors will be hard to shift with a 3+, ignore -1AP, a 4++.  Love it.

[Claws and Effect]

 

 

Eliminators holding a flank will absolutely deny any form of deep strike assault vs marines. Then park some infiltrators up front and deep strike assault will not affect us any longer.

It still could be awesome but keeping those eliminators for sniper duties in which case I'm not sure I even want the bolt carbine in there.

I'm taking the bolt carbine in every squad. Hitting and wounding T4 characters on 2s every turn is nice. Makes the other guys in the squad mini Vindicares.

[CaptainMarsh]

 

 

Eliminators holding a flank will absolutely deny any form of deep strike assault vs marines. Then park some infiltrators up front and deep strike assault will not affect us any longer.

It still could be awesome but keeping those eliminators for sniper duties in which case I'm not sure I even want the bolt carbine in there.

I'm taking the bolt carbine in every squad. Hitting and wounding T4 characters on 2s every turn is nice. Makes the other guys in the squad mini Vindicares.

 

TBF, you don't need to take the Carbine to use that ability. That seems to be a base ability rule.

[Claws and Effect]

 

 

 

 

Eliminators holding a flank will absolutely deny any form of deep strike assault vs marines. Then park some infiltrators up front and deep strike assault will not affect us any longer.

It still could be awesome but keeping those eliminators for sniper duties in which case I'm not sure I even want the bolt carbine in there.

I'm taking the bolt carbine in every squad. Hitting and wounding T4 characters on 2s every turn is nice. Makes the other guys in the squad mini Vindicares.

TBF, you don't need to take the Carbine to use that ability. That seems to be a base ability rule.

True, but the Sgt has to give up his own shooting to do that. If he's not going to be shooting his gun it might as well provide some other benefit.

[Captain Idaho]

Devastators with Missile Launchers just broke the game lol. Cheaper Lascannons against all targets less than T8, yet can nuke infantry with AP-1.

 

Yum.

 

Then there are Hurricane Bolters...

 

"

I may be in the minority here, but the doctrines seem a bit too powerful to me. Perhaps that's just my local playgroup and the effect my Star Phantom's force primaris-only force already has each game talking, but the new stuff/rules are neat. Excited for custom chapters again, means I won't have to run my Phantoms as Raven Guard by default anymore.

Marines are pretty underwhelming without the Doctrines rules so I think most people will disagree.

 

After all, Astra Millitarum vehicles get Orders.

[Dark Legionnare]

Devastators with Missile Launchers just broke the game lol. Cheaper Lascannons against all targets less than T8, yet can nuke infantry with AP-1.

 

Yum.

 

Then there are Hurricane Bolters...

 

"

I may be in the minority here, but the doctrines seem a bit too powerful to me. Perhaps that's just my local playgroup and the effect my Star Phantom's force primaris-only force already has each game talking, but the new stuff/rules are neat. Excited for custom chapters again, means I won't have to run my Phantoms as Raven Guard by default anymore.

Marines are pretty underwhelming without the Doctrines rules so I think most people will disagree.

 

After all, Astra Millitarum vehicles get Orders.

True!  They do have to have a Tank Commander to do so though, and said Tank Commander can be targeted for removal, whereas the doctrines are just "forever." But I digress.  It's just a gut feeling, because I don't seem to have any "underwhelming" issues with my Star Phantom lads. That could just be the dice gods favoring me in my couple games with them and my lack of exposure to more brutal SM counters than what the local group has to bring against me.

 

Definitely won't say said doctrines "surely" are, just seem like they have the potential to be tuned to some bonkers stuff! 

 

Though, what you mentioned with the ML devs, it definitely opens a lot of doors that were logically closed before (Why ever take ML vs a Lascannon if you've got the available anti-armor-role points to take the latter), which is awesome. I like that effect.

 

I'll definitely enjoy giving them a whirl, and seeing what cool stuff they allow. 

[Ishagu]

Infiltrators just became more appealing. They get the aura from a Phobos Captain no matter where they deploy. Efficient troops in shooting and combat, glad I've got 20 of them ready to go!

 

Now we can screen any armies with the appropriate units alongside Eliminators, Orks and GSC will e hard countered.

[SkimaskMohawk]

If eliminators are still capped at 3, then they'll still struggle at killing characters. Veteran stalker intercessors can gun them down though

[BolterZorro]

I honestly think that eliminators in more than 3 per unit are OP, killing a vehicle or hero per turn with such a unit is not fun. (And I am a primaris with phobos/eliminator player).

For balance purpose, Eliminators shouild be caped at 3. So, spam more than one unit or call an assassin ;-) (I think that 2 units is the way to go: one with riffle, one with lazgun)

[BitsHammer]

On a different note, with all these rules changes I don't think Marines are getting a points drop anywhere in the new book and some stuff is likely going to get a small points hike.

[CaptainMarsh]

If eliminators are still capped at 3, then they'll still struggle at killing characters. Veteran stalker intercessors can gun them down though

That depends on a few factors. Going up to S5, the Executioner Round on Turn 1 will be S5, AP-3, Dd3 damage with a MW on a 6. If you play, say, Salamanders, you have a not insignificant chance of wounding all three times. Many characters have Invulnerables, many do not, but even the ones that do will clench up a little at that type of firepower. At 72* pts for a unit of 3, they shouldn't be expected to always one-round a character but they certainly have the ability to.

[Captain Idaho]

@ Dark Legionnare: Yeah totally. Heavy Bolters in Tactical squads, Missile Launchers in Devastators and maybe our vehicles like Whirlwinds and Predators just jumped up the danger stakes.

 

I can't wait for next weekend!

[SkimaskMohawk]

Thats definitely true, a Sally squad can kill geq support characters in one turn on average and threaten marine ones. But at the same time, Sally veterans with stalkers on average actually kill that marine character, albeit at the cost of command points.

[Ishagu]

Eliminators might be capped at 3, but it doesn't make that much sense for them to be.

 

Units are either 5-10 or 3-6 with Victrix Guard and Lieutenants being maxed at 2.

[Oshikai]

I am torn on the Look of the Primaris Units. On the one side I really like the sleak modern Design, especially the Infantry like Intercessors, Infiltrators and Hellblasters. On the others side I am starting to miss the Gothic Themes that drew me to Astartes. Struggling to bring those diverting Thoughts in my brain together.

[Sete]

I am torn on the Look of the Primaris Units. On the one side I really like the sleak modern Design, especially the Infantry like Intercessors, Infiltrators and Hellblasters. On the others side I am starting to miss the Gothic Themes that drew me to Astartes. Struggling to bring those diverting Thoughts in my brain together.

Just do as I do, ignore the kits you dont like.

 

I'm going for a core of intercessors, redemptors and impulsors.

Can easily go to 1500, and use old marine bling to pimp them up.

 

With these new rules, I can easily replace Crusader Squads for intercessors, and can model a cheeky chainsword on a few models around.