Discussion on the new C:SM & Possible BT supplement

[Othniel's Blade]

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

[BitsHammer]

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

Maintainimg low expectations to prevent disappointment.

[Link2edition]

Do ya'll plan on taking "Marshal Law" now that the thunder hammer is twice as expensive?

[Acebaur]

Do ya'll plan on taking "Marshal Law" now that the thunder hammer is twice as expensive?

The burning blade is a good budget option replacement. 1 less strength and damage but better AP and no penalty to hit. And it's significantly cheaper.

[Sete]

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

Past experience.

How are you so sure we will receive anything else than rules?

[Ciler]

 

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

Past experience.

How are you so sure we will receive anything else than rules?

 

That's not what he's saying, tho.

[Sete]

 

 

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

Past experience.

How are you so sure we will receive anything else than rules?

That's not what he's saying, tho.

But it's obvious we still need the rules for our chars and units. So I didn't even put that into question.

[Marshal Vespasian]

Do ya'll plan on taking "Marshal Law" now that the thunder hammer is twice as expensive?

With teeth hell be 9 attacks in the charge with exploding 6es, so hell yeah. Maybe play the swordbrethren stratagem to make that ten and rerolling to wound

The burning blade mit be cool on a lieutenant or company champ combined with the Imperiums sword for that nice 2+ to wound marines or 3+ vs knights

Edited August 18, 2019 by Marshal Vespasian

[Othniel's Blade]

 

 

 

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

Past experience.

How are you so sure we will receive anything else than rules?

That's not what he's saying, tho.

But it's obvious we still need the rules for our chars and units. So I didn't even put that into question.

Everyone complained that Primaris was ruining their 'old marines' and Vigilus buffed not only a great thematic element and Index units. GW clearly states we have updated chapter tactics, at min, and has already given a stopgap including our unique units (for free, mind you!) and the internet is acting like we're about to be squatted.

 

Frankly, it's getting ridiculous. It may not be everyone's hopes and dreams turned reality, but we've not been written out of the lore.

[Ciler]

Indeed.

 

Since you brought Vigilus up, my local WS manager mentioned yesterday that the vigilus supplement has effectively been mooted by the new C:SM and that most if not all of it's content is in the codex, can anyone confirm ?

[Sete]

 

 

 

 

How are people still doubting that our chapter will receive anything at all? It makes no sense.

Past experience.

How are you so sure we will receive anything else than rules?

That's not what he's saying, tho.

But it's obvious we still need the rules for our chars and units. So I didn't even put that into question.

Everyone complained that Primaris was ruining their 'old marines' and Vigilus buffed not only a great thematic element and Index units. GW clearly states we have updated chapter tactics, at min, and has already given a stopgap including our unique units (for free, mind you!) and the internet is acting like we're about to be squatted.

 

Frankly, it's getting ridiculous. It may not be everyone's hopes and dreams turned reality, but we've not been written out of the lore.

Didn't see anyone saying we are getting squatted outside jokes.

But people are wondering where our rules are going to fit, and what kind of model support we will have. I think those are fair concerns to have. At least I am wondering what is in store for us, because like I said previously it's going to affect how I choose to follow my hobby choices in the future.

[Marshal Reinhard]

I just really really NEED to know wether we are going to get our first kit in decades, even if its just little update sprue or a single character... (Primaldus!)

[Sete]

I think Helbrecth should be the first one, being the High Marshall and leading by example ;).

Just imagine a plastic sword of the high marshalls.

I imagine the kit would sell well just for conversions.

Edited August 18, 2019 by Sete

[Ciler]

Yet at the same time, I could see Helbrecht as one of the pig-headed conservatives that would refuse on principle "do not alter the work of the emperor" etc etc.

 

If he gets primarized though I wonder if he gets his hand back.

[Sete]

Last codex artwork actually does not show his bionic hand. I brought that to GW attention and they hand waved it as "hes using his armour" although it goes against his character, because he refuses to cover his bionic arm.

[Kyliadan]

So, here's another piece of information that can fuel speculation about what might happen to the Emperor's Champion.

 

The Chapter's Champion, now an UM unit only, has the same stat line, except for 1 more LD and 1 more Atk. He either wields a master-crafted power sword or the champion's blade, this one giving him another attack. He has the same Martial Superiority rule as the company champion (fight first even if he did not charge), re-roll hits/wounds against characters, and another rule, Skilful Parry, which is a -1 to hit against him in melee.

 

All this for 20 pts less than the Emperor's Champion, at the cost of a less powerful weapon and no invulnerable save.

 

Edit : named characters in the UM supplement are forced to use their associated warlord trait.

Edited August 18, 2019 by Kyliadan

[Medjugorje]

I think Helbrecth should be the first one, being the High Marshall and leading by example .

Just imagine a plastic sword of the high marshalls.

I imagine the kit would sell well just for conversions.

As High Chaplain and THE BT who is best known to survive at any circumstances  -  it would make sense, lorewise and from marketing side, that it could be Grimaldus too...

 

But I would expect the emperors champion. No other model in our range is so often used as conversion for other chapter characters in my experience and no other model is so often played by BT players indeed.

[Medjugorje]

So, here's another piece of information that can fuel speculation about what might happen to the Emperor's Champion.

 

The Chapter's Champion, now an UM unit only, has the same stat line, except for 1 more LD and 1 more Atk. He either wields a master-crafted power sword or the champion's blade, this one giving him another attack. He has the same Martial Superiority rule as the company champion (fight first even if he did not charge), re-roll hits/wounds against characters, and another rule, Skilful Parry, which is a -1 to hit against him in melee.

 

All this for 20 pts less than the Emperor's Champion, at the cost of a less powerful weapon and no invulnerable save.

 

Edit : named characters in the UM supplement are forced to use their associated warlord trait.

If this is the norm - we can expect a character killer from hell ( not mention that the EC is already a very good characterkiller ). If he get a primaris treatment in this direction... he maybe has the potential to get  a threat even to characters like Abbi, Calgar etc...

[Sword Brother Adelard]

The Champion doesn't become Primaris by crossing the Rubicon, not in the same way that a named character does. It would just happen that one day, a Primaris marine, will receive the visions and become the Champion, the next time, it could be a Firstborn. It's not an event in the way that Grimaldus or Helbrecht would be.

[Medjugorje]

The Champion doesn't become Primaris by crossing the Rubicon, not in the same way that a named character does. It would just happen that one day, a Primaris marine, will receive the visions and become the Champion, the next time, it could be a Firstborn. It's not an event in the way that Grimaldus or Helbrecht would be.

i mean just by rules perspective... the rest is clear. But the question might be how GW will handle this lore in the future by converting this into the rules. 

 

From lore perspective ( i dont know how the primaris are written in this new codex) at the start of 8th edition - GW wrote that Primaris are so much stronger than Firstborn, but the most of them cant handle it / or have to learn to use that power. So maybe a chosen one, by the light of the emperor will grow up in power exponentially higher than any other marine ever could. 

Edited August 18, 2019 by Medjugorje

[Marshal Vespasian]

If they do a primaris EC that would make me buy and impulsor to let him ride with some assault bolt rifle intercessor vets.

 

I want that model.

Edited August 18, 2019 by Marshal Vespasian

[Acebaur]

Indeed.

 

Since you brought Vigilus up, my local WS manager mentioned yesterday that the vigilus supplement has effectively been mooted by the new C:SM and that most if not all of it's content is in the codex, can anyone confirm ?

Yeah, all the vigilus strats for intercessors are in the book. Including a version of Field Commander

[Sword Brother Adelard]

 

 

The Champion doesn't become Primaris by crossing the Rubicon, not in the same way that a named character does. It would just happen that one day, a Primaris marine, will receive the visions and become the Champion, the next time, it could be a Firstborn. It's not an event in the way that Grimaldus or Helbrecht would be.

i mean just by rules perspective... the rest is clear. But the question might be how GW will handle this lore in the future by converting this into the rules.

 

From lore perspective ( i dont know how the primaris are written in this new codex) at the start of 8th edition - GW wrote that Primaris are so much stronger than Firstborn, but the most of them cant handle it / or have to learn to use that power. So maybe a chosen one, by the light of the emperor will grow up in power exponentially higher than any other marine ever could.

I don't see the need for more than we have from the rules perspective.

 

Look at this way. If 8th had dropped with an EC, AND a Primaris EC, and the Primaris one had the same stats as the present one, and the firstborn EC one less wound and attack, people wouldn't have said the Primaris one was too weak compared to other Primaris characters, and still way in excess of a standard Primaris marine.

 

On your lore point, I don't recall anything like that on the drop of 8th,

[Ciler]

It would be neat to actually have rules for both a "regular" and primaris EC.

[Sete]

There is a picture of a BT intercessor in the imperial fists successors section that says he is a member of a crusader squad.

 

Perhaps the rules will be in the IF supplement, or maybe even a BT supplement of their own one day!

A good catch from robbiew.

The intercessor shown is part of a Crusader squad. A sign of things to come or an oversight?