Bukimimaru Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 I had a quick search of the SM forums and I couldn't see this as a topic yet, so i thought I'd make a thread about our new Primaris Eliminators. How are people finding them? Are we keeping them with their standard loadouts or is it worth spending the extra points for the Las fusils? I run a pure Primaris army and we have anti-infantry units coming out the wazoo, but outside of the Repulsor we have very little in the way of decent anti-tank. Before I build my new models, I was wondering if people thought the Las-fusils were worth their very steep points cost. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero88 Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 If you are only running one squad with Fusils, I'd attach a Phobos Libby with them to cast shrouding and soul sight Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5394785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link2edition Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 I modeled mine with the sniper rifles, Going to try them out tonight.I run a mix of primaris and firstborn though, so I already have anti-tank options. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5394787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bukimimaru Posted September 23, 2019 Author Share Posted September 23, 2019 If you are only running one squad with Fusils, I'd attach a Phobos Libby with them to cast shrouding and soul sight I run Black Templars, so no Librarians for me I'm afraid. >_< Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5394788 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandragola Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 It hugely depends on which chapter you're running. For BT Primaris-only force then las-fusils are probably a good bet, but you will probably also want some hellblasters and suppressors. Otherwise I think the bolt sniper rifles are great. They have more synergy with things like Ravenguard and Imperial Fist rules than las fusils do. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5394860 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy-inquisitor Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 The las fusils look really cool but limited as I am to just 3 units of these bad boys I think I am taking sniper rifles all the way. Now admittedly that is an easier decision playing Crimson Fists but the sheer flexibility of the weapons is superb. Three units with sniper rifles will be pretty much first thing on every list once I get them built. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5394930 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link2edition Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 It seems to me like Devastators fill the anti-tank role better, that's why I am keeping the sniper rifles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395007 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCE1981 Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Played against an Ironhands list with 3 units of Sniper Eliminators. Luckily I got first turn and took two units out. I forgot about the last unit, they did 3 wounds on my Gravis Chapter Master before I took them out. The Sniper Rifles are no joke. As Ravenguard, 3x Sniper Rifles in a Squad are going to hurt! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395176 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracos Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Las-fusils make Heavy Plasma Incinerators useless They cost almost exactly the same points per model and the Eliminators are such a step above Hellblasters it's ridiculous. Why GW why? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395177 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainMarsh Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 The Bolt Sniper Rifles give you an excellent capability you otherwise lack at the same level of effectiveness. The same can not be said of the Las-Fusils. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Heavy Plasma Incinerators were never a really good choice to begin with so if Las-fusils weren't better there would be no point in taking them either. Personally since I play Blood Angels and often end up in melee I'm probably going with the Sniper variant. Characters aren't harder to kill in melee but they are often harder to reach. The buff to Aggressors definitely helps with that decision too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395245 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemondish Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Las-fusils make Heavy Plasma Incinerators useless They cost almost exactly the same points per model and the Eliminators are such a step above Hellblasters it's ridiculous. Why GW why? Heavy plasma have always been pretty weak, but in their defense, most matched play games limit you to 3 units of Eliminators. With the bolt sniper rifle acting as a pretty potent character hunter above and beyond sniper scouts, it becomes a little hard to commit to the fusil for me. I think that helps Hellblasters maintain a position in the running. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395276 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'm Heckus Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Any thoughts on the instigator Bolter on the sergeant? D2 AP -1 and lets you retreat from charges after firing overwatch. If you plan to have him forego shooting for the +1 hit/wound anyway it doesn't seem bad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 In a unit of Snipers any time unless you dislike the thought of killing off the Sergeant first or want the slightly less average damage output in hope to get those sweet damage spikes of a potential 4 more damage. In a unit of Las-fusils I'd rather have the higher potential damage output I think. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395436 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link2edition Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Any thoughts on the instigator Bolter on the sergeant? D2 AP -1 and lets you retreat from charges after firing overwatch. If you plan to have him forego shooting for the +1 hit/wound anyway it doesn't seem bad. It costs more than the sniper rifles, and isn't as deadly. I say give them all snipers and put them where they are unlikely to be charged. Even though he will be guiding fire most of the time, sometimes you NEED that third shot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395457 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemondish Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Any thoughts on the instigator Bolter on the sergeant? D2 AP -1 and lets you retreat from charges after firing overwatch. If you plan to have him forego shooting for the +1 hit/wound anyway it doesn't seem bad. It costs more than the sniper rifles, and isn't as deadly. I say give them all snipers and put them where they are unlikely to be charged. Even though he will be guiding fire most of the time, sometimes you NEED that third shot. Any amount of rerolls also make it more reliable to shoot with him rather than always guide. That will be true if you have a phobos captain sniping nearby, or you're Iron Hands. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395463 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracos Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 .... or Master Artisans Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395545 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemondish Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 .... or Master Artisans Yep! Totally forgot about that one. Bolter Fusillades as well, provided you're using the sniper rifle. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395561 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluflash Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 I thought I read the 50% increase in mortal wounds on Mortis rounds exceeds the potential of the third shot even with Master Artisan/Re-roll 1's to hit. Anyone personally crunched the math recently? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395641 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 I thought I read the 50% increase in mortal wounds on Mortis rounds exceeds the potential of the third shot even with Master Artisan/Re-roll 1's to hit. Anyone personally crunched the math recently? Matter of fact, I did just recently. ^^ The average damage output of a full unit of 3 Eliminators against various targets. Mortal wounds are included (yes, the MW on a 5+ with the sergeant buff is factored in). At some point it just becomes a question of when is reliable reliable enough and you rather want more potential damage instead? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395644 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluflash Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Thanks!! Master Artisans should approximate Cap + Lt, but slightly less reliable, yeah? Choice of rerolls is a pain to math out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395661 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy-inquisitor Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 I thought I read the 50% increase in mortal wounds on Mortis rounds exceeds the potential of the third shot even with Master Artisan/Re-roll 1's to hit. Anyone personally crunched the math recently? Matter of fact, I did just recently. ^^ The average damage output of a full unit of 3 Eliminators against various targets. Mortal wounds are included (yes, the MW on a 5+ with the sergeant buff is factored in). At some point it just becomes a question of when is reliable reliable enough and you rather want more potential damage instead? Interesting. I did some working out for Crimson/Imperial fists and going with the Chapter Master was quite nice there. I calculated With Chapter Master + Lt vs Space Marine Captain -> 3.24 Same but when unit has moved -> 2.91 My concern was to avoid the unit being too static and being vulnerable to bits of LOS blocking shutting them down. With Fists bonus hits on 6s and a chapter master they were quite resilient to that -1 penalty. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5395703 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormLion Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 Why not take 2 Las and a sniper or vice versa? I'm planning on trying it out once I get mine. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5396491 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 Why not take 2 Las and a sniper or vice versa? I'm planning on trying it out once I get mine. Because with just one unit of either you won't feel the needed impact in a game. You will want at least two units of a type so they can do their job properly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5396593 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 Any thoughts on the instigator Bolter on the sergeant? D2 AP -1 and lets you retreat from charges after firing overwatch. If you plan to have him forego shooting for the +1 hit/wound anyway it doesn't seem bad. The +1 to Hit/Wound is not as good as an extra shot in most cases. BUT the ability to fall back from charges is really useful against melee armies. If running with Las Fussils, I would say that the points saved by giving the serg and Instigator are probably worth it. For Snipers, I am not so sure as you are not saving points. Combined with some Infiltrators though you can seriously mess with any units that want to get into melee. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/358655-eliminators-weapon-options/#findComment-5396772 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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