BoomWolf Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Well, unlike traits abd relics, strats are decided mid game, so they make the same list more flexible, and better at adjusting to the table-and they are not nearly as limited as warlord traits and relics. They are still not going to be enough unless some of the are outright insane (like fated mutation that turn our traitless spawn from a niuesence to a terror), but they matter, if only for the fact you got more options to work with. Special Officer Doofy and Skerr 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463281 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyzariel Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Personally, I've lost all hope in anything good coming out. But I will still be buying the book and playing my Thousand Sons to the best I can with what I have. After all, even when I lose, it's all according to plan. Special Officer Doofy 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463286 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skerr Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) I agree that the strats are opportunities to be exploited. Circumstances are not always in our favor and/or our plans can often get foiled ("Curses!", "Drat!" and "Blast!") easily and suddenly the masterstroke strat gets screwed up though they are also often impactful and maybe tide turning when they go off. Its the same for our opponents so yalls thoughts on army wide core rules and static buffs are absolutely reasonable. We still might get something and perhaps their just holding back (trolling us,lol) giving GK and DA a false sense of security. I got buds in my small group that play GK and DA and I know these guys will be super happy. Perhaps GW is using misdirection focusing just on the new cults while allowing for some cool surprises. Maybe not. It is exciting for us to see some strats with great utility and possibilities compared to what we currently have and actually use. Edited January 17, 2020 by Skerr Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 I imagine we're just a few hours away from serious leaks hitting the internet. Screenshots of pages, etc. Then the youtubers .... that's a different story. So many of them really don't have a clue about Thousand Sons. I was hoping someone that is a known, truly active Thousand Sons player would get their hands on the preview copy from GW. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463360 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeinox Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) Welp, good job guys, you ruined my 18 page thing. Yes, it's your fault, not mine. In the current games, I drop Scarab Occult terminators in the teleport chamber as my first unit deployed. Do you think now, depending on mission and opponent of course, we might find ourselves using Risen Rubricae first to establish that hard point forcing someone to react to it with their deployments? Of course, it doesn't always have to show up just outside 9".. it can be the last unit and plop down someone as a "heck yeah, this looks safe and far away from everything" on an objective away from the main force. Edited January 17, 2020 by Archaeinox Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463372 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Welp, good job guys, you ruined my 18 page thing. Yes, it's your fault, not mine. In the current games, I drop Scarab Occult terminators in the teleport chamber as my first unit deployed. Do you think now, depending on mission and opponent of course, we might find ourselves using Risen Rubricae first to establish that hard point forcing someone to react to it with their deployments? Of course, it doesn't always have to show up just outside 9".. it can be the last unit and plop down someone as a "heck yeah, this looks safe and far away from everything" on an objective away from the main force. Well it's situational though, right? I recall it has to happen during your deployment. So if you deploy first it will really have little effect aside from acting like a psuedo infiltration. If you deploy second it will be more powerful in anchoring a spot on the board you know your opponent is perhaps weak in. I do this all the time with other armies. You close the gap between the infiltrators and another (strong/harrassment) unit and your opponent knows (sometimes) you are setting up a huge trade off. If they take the bait it can be a strong move. If not, you stake your claim on a section of the board and the beauty of having Crystal is you can decide to reallocate that asset if things go south. Risen Rubricae will be a good way of trying to secure the arrival of reinforcements like Scarab Occult. Sometimes, especially with a larger squad, there just enough going to be a 'good' spot for the Scarabs. Risen Rubricae can help with that to create the pocket. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463382 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeinox Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) I foresee an incredible amount of discussion and Tactica debate in the coming weeks when we have a full picture. I really can't wait. That full picture also includes fluff- I am genuinely excited for 1. any new artwork in the book and 2. what happens between the 3 factions at the END, specifically how the GK interact with the DA because they're the ones who asked the DA for help.. No way they would attempt to mind wipe them, right? ...Right...? ...Guys? What if a mind wipe gets rid of all their secrets. PLOT TWIST. nah. Seriously, I can't wait for the new background and I already have a campaign planned with some folks at the store. (By the way we are using Inkarnate map creator: GO LOOK AT IT. It's a website, not a download. You can even overlay grids and make hex maps. The free version is nice but I paid the $5 to upgrade) Edited January 17, 2020 by Archaeinox Prot and Dolchiate Remembrancer 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463385 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Actually I'm excited for the storyline too. The Eldar one was kind of boring, but I heard the Chaos one was good (I bought it but still haven't read beyond the rules). In 7th I really enjoyed what they did with a lot of the fiction with Magnus and his rise. I enjoy most of the Thousand Sons fiction so hopefully this is good as well. I'm only considering the Limited Edition because of the extra pictures and I think some unique stories? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463413 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeinox Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) Consider this: weren't there 4 short stories for RotD? There's 4 included in the ltd ed. It could be just those... lol. Don't do it mannnn. They need to make those more appealing like with psychic power cards and the like. They sell, so they will keep making them lazily Edited January 17, 2020 by Archaeinox Prot and Aasfresser 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463432 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolandTHTG Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Actually I'm excited for the storyline too. The Eldar one was kind of boring, but I heard the Chaos one was good (I bought it but still haven't read beyond the rules). In 7th I really enjoyed what they did with a lot of the fiction with Magnus and his rise. I enjoy most of the Thousand Sons fiction so hopefully this is good as well. I'm only considering the Limited Edition because of the extra pictures and I think some unique stories? The stories were just the website ones. Aasfresser and Prot 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463484 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeinox Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) https://www.games-workshop.com/en-NZ/Psychic-Awakening-Ritual-Of-The-Damned-Collectors-Edition-2020 Yeah I very much doubt we can look forward to the passive ability people keep hoping for since its only 10 pages of content. Nevertheless I'm still happy with the bone we got, there's some nice potential especially in casual play. Thousand Sons pg 76 Sons of Magnus pg 78 (probably a summary of our basic rules & Malicious Volleys + Hateful Assault) Cults of the Legion pg 79 (5 pages of somewhat mystery... nice) Stratagems pg 84 (nice. hopefully an entire page and not just a portion with a huge pic of a recycled sorcerer from 2004 hehe) Name Gen pg 85 (great, expected, but our legion is one of the easiest to come up with names for by its very nature lol) TS points values 86 (for what? chapter approved stuff copy/pasted?) Edited January 17, 2020 by Archaeinox Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463605 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahzek451 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Ooooo. Points costs. Totally possible it's a reprint, but still interesting nonetheless. Archaeinox 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463619 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreaterChickenofTzeentch Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Ooooo. Points costs. Totally possible it's a reprint, but still interesting nonetheless. Maybe for that rather conspicuous Soulgrinder? :) Prot and Archaeinox 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463629 Share on other sites More sharing options...
deTox Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Given how GW generally rolls, I expect to still see the point increases from CA to stay (DPoT and Tzaangor) but the decreases to Inferno Bolters and the ohter weaponery to magically reset to pre CA values...you know otherwise we would be too strong!! /s Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463634 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeinox Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 (edited) You know, I was thinking about the Infernal Fusillade strat a little more and many people are talking about how power that is when thrown into one unit. I think it's pretty incredible that: 1. Vets strat lasts until the end of the phase 2. Infernal Fusillade a 2nd unit if the damage from the first "shooting" of a unit was sufficient to do enough damage without having to commit to overkill. Example: 10 rubrics that dont move pop I.F. and VotLW against a dreadnought. They happen to wound it halfway, so you elect to shoot them again at the same target just to get rid of it since the overkill, if any, won't be wasteful. Am I correct in this? It's quite literally what I see Aggressor players doing in my area Edited January 18, 2020 by Archaeinox Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463658 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kervin40k Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 (edited) I was thinking of an interesting idea: 1-Rubric Risen 20 bolter blob into terrain within 24" of target with a A.S. with time flux (just in case of seize) 2-Infernal Fusillade with any buffs you can get off, also since the blob is mid board it is easier to get other caster into range to buff. 3-Profit also it is 160pts cheaper (based on CA2019) warpflamer blob and safer. Edited January 18, 2020 by Kervin40k Sawtooth 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463662 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomWolf Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 So, this is on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ff_oZ0qhtjE Does not outright show the book, but talks about stuff. There are apperantly only 7 stratagems, but they appear to be quite darn good TBH. 1CP ignore perils, 1CP +1 to invul saves to rubric/scarab, 1CP when a spell is cast at 9+ to regain D3 wounds/revive a model, etc. And it appears having a cult gives the cult spell as a bonus spell to every psyker in the detachment, not a replacement. this makes our dudes actually quite versatile in our casts. (and makes the "cast an extra spell" stratagem mean somehting) Cults do NOT effect cultists/tzaangors/named chars. Will start writing down a summery. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel of Solitude Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 I think I’m slightly disappointed. I think the warlord traits / relics / psychic powers have really helped to match Rubrics and SOT to marine levels, but we’re still missing decent assault and heavy support options. Don’t think anything here helps daemon engines a great deal :( Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463791 Share on other sites More sharing options...
deTox Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Soooo Cult of Magic is the seriously good one, you can expect to still see the usual supreme command with Ahriman and 2 DPoT, one high magistero one with the relic that give +1 to cast and the warlord trait that increases mortal wounds by one. That's likely the only things that will be seen competitively with TS. Other then that Duplicity looks good, wouldn't take the trait but the power is just good. Disappointed by Cult of Time really power is cool trait and relic suck sadly. Also sad Ahriman and Magnus don't get anything at all, guess magnus can now heal himself by D3 a turn for 1CP Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463799 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyzariel Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Oh my goodness. The full reveals are so so so much more than I expected. I'm not ready for this. Need time to digest. Skerr 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463802 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomWolf Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 No, nothing really helps daemon engines. technically they have the cult keyword, but I dont see a spell/trait/relic that combos well with them. And yes, we still lack heavy options (in the assault factor we are actually doing fine. spawn and enlightened are darn good for their low cost) A quick rundown of the cults: Cult of prophecy Spell-WC6, roll d6, set aside, use to replace a hit/wound/advance/charge/psychic test/deny/moral for cult unit. basically miracle dice used AFTER the cast. stays until start of next psychic phase. WLT-after overwatch move 6 inch Relic-reroll one hit/wound/damage for a unit within 6" Overall-seems nice. generating a fate dice with your backward is great, but the rest isn't amazing. not useful as a "backup detachment" and you can only use the fate dice thingy for prophecy units. Cult of time Spell-known rez spell WLT-when getting a 9+ on a spell, you can cast another spell (once per turn) Relic-first time you die, return to life with d3 wounds at end of phase (no roll, guaranteed rez) Overall-holy bats, cult of time is amazing, will probably be the go-to cult (im so happy my original fluff of the army is a cult of time sect, as Im going to use time non-stop) Cult of mutation Spell-WC6 chose terrain within 18", choose unit within 3" of that, half their movement, reduce 1 from advance and charge. WLT-6+ on melee attack causes mortal wound Relic-exalted sorc only, +1S, T and A Overall-seems to be funny, but not impressed. the slowing spell only matters against assault armie, the WLT is meh, and the relic is nice, but if you want a beatstick you might as well go prince. Cult of scheming Spell-WC6 unit within 24" can shoot/charge after falling back WLT-cult within 3" gain "disciples of tzeentch" (objsec) Relic-one time use, the wearer uses a stratagem for 0CP (eeer, what?) Overall-seems like a cool cult for a bunch of scarabs, as they would enjoy the spell, and the WLT, rubrics however won't care much. the relic is...interesting? don't really see a use beyond firing a cheaper coruscating beam (to be fair, its a GREAT stratagem when it only costs a relic slot and not 3CP-but having to stay immobile with the warlord who has a trait that makes him want to go with the scarabs forward?) Cult of magic Spell-WC6 closest enemy in 9" takes d3 MW, and each unit within 3" of them takes 1MW (basically mini infernal gateway) WLT-when causing a MW with a spell, increase by 1 Relic-+1 to psychic tests Overall- ok, the three combos REALLY well. if you need a psychic bombardment HQ, you can't get much better than a magic sorcerer the the relic and trait-and we now got a strat to give a non warlord a trait. (except ahriman I guess?) Cult of knowledge Spell-WC6 target enemy unit with 18", reroll wounds of 1 against it with cult units. WLT-reroll 1s in psychic tests Relic-super warpflame pistol Overall-the spell is pretty good, the warlord trait is good (not sure if it beats high magistar, need to run the numbers) but the relic is basically a waste-never take a pistol relic. knowledge is decent, but I don't see it as a top pick. seems like it was supposed to be the warpflamer cult? Cult of change Spell-WC6 select enemy within 12", -1to Ld and A WLT-reroll charge rolls, can shoot and charge when falls back Relic-known Overall-odd cult, the relic is really good, but the WLT is meaningless for us (as it effects the HQ alone, and not many of our HQs care for it.) and the spell is only good in too specific situations. Cult of duplicity Spell-known WLT-known Relic-known Overall-basically the cult of mobility. it really helps use get all over the place, but I personally don't like the warlod trait much, nor the relic-and the spell alone (despite being great) does not sell me on it. Cult of manipulation Spell-WC6 enemy char within 18" takes MW and gets -2 to psychic test until your next turn. WLT-enemy models within 1" get -1 A Relic-use the melee weapon of an emeying within 1" and Ld 9 or less against them Overall-really unimpressive. relic is useless, you could just get a good weapon. the spell is too spesific and the trait is outright wasteful. TL;DR- Cult of time is bonkers, cult of duplicity seems popular but I don't like it, a tiny patrol for a cult of magic sorcerer and some fodder could be cool for a MW bombardment. Many cults suffer from not being TAC useful and are only good when you know what you are going to face. Grendaxe, Skerr, Prot and 3 others 6 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463807 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grendaxe Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Thanks for the summery Boomwolf. I like that all units in the cult know the spell as a bonus and i don't have to swap. Overall they really tried to boost Rubric/Scarab units but not directly but with spells and stratagems. Which really is a bit of a poor mans solution in my opinion. I like that they tried to make rubrics/scarabs better but i don't like the death-stars i'm kinda forced into to run to capitalize on this rubric/scarab "boost". Competitively, i'm thinking a battalion with cult of duplicity to infiltrate one max size squad of rubrics on the mid-field and super buff them: + 1 to hit,1+ to wound + double tap , +1 invul (spell) , +1 invul (strat),-1 to get hit and dump them in the mid-field. If people get too close i redeploy with the spell. Then make sure that nothing else on the board is even remotely interesting to shoot/assault at. So minimal size units, no daemon engines, only characters. And behind that brick i put a cult of magic supreme command detachment to do as much damage as possible with mortal wounds. I really would have preferred passive rubric/scarab boosts because it helps the way i want to bring my army to the table much more (3 squads of 10-man rubrics, 2x5 scarabs) but i guess passive boosts are "loyalist only" for some reason. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463820 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrystalSeer Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 basically everything I wanted out of PA with enough balancing factors to keep it interesting. Rubrics teleporting all over the table raining massive numbers of VotLW shots will be excellent. I'm wondering if the double shot strat will be enough to do credible anti-tank via shot volume? If not, cult of magic SCD will likely be able to nuke stuff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463821 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Stellar! About what I guessed. 7 strats instead of 8, but out of the 7 we got 5 of them are *incredible* and useful. the other 2 are situational use (yoked and the 9+ to cast strat for healing) but not bad by any stretch but definitely situational. Out of the 9 cults we got 3 that are very solid (Duplicity, Magic, and Time) and a few that are.... pretty bad, but also some that will definitely see situational use on occasion. Overall: not to shabby! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463831 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomWolf Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 (edited) As the double-tap strata requires you not to move, it is unlikely you will find yourself with a decent number of models in a well-primed position to make it matter enough for AT. Overall, despite getting a few nifty toys-we are going to fall further behind. The issue is the "best" things here, and mostly supporting a single unit of scarabs/rubrics, and then a whole bunch of HQs. Ergo, not improving a TS army at all, just SCDs. Our rank-and-file, who were always our weakest point, got no real support. and not ever going to by the looks of it. (heck, our cultists/tzaangors are literally excluded from getting anything from the book!) Its just that everything our "army" part of the army can do, plain old CSM do better. The majority of our army is still unaffected by being in a TS detachment, even moreso than other CSM, as even our dreadnauts and our own unique tzaangors, enlightened and vortex beasts being identical in a TS detachment and a chaos mashup detachment. Even rubrics are mostly better done with AL/IH as they don't need quite as much support, and have similar levels of support if desired. We got some cool toys and options for what are already our "good" areas, but zero support for the areas who are falling apart. Edited January 18, 2020 by BoomWolf Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/360231-psychic-awakening-the-ritual-of-the-damned/page/19/#findComment-5463838 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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