PA6: Saga of the Beast Discussion

[Lexington]

Kinda sad that it's looking more and more like Ghaz and Makari really are the only releases coming out alongside Saga of the Beast. Obviously, Big G himself is a triumph worth celebrating, but I'm really wondering what the hold-up is on getting us normal Meks with KFF.

[TorvaldTheMild]

It's just a cursory look so I'm wrong but give me a little leeway lol

[Dark Legionnare]

Seems the Ghaz leaks are out now.

The 4dmg max per phase mechanic, if true, is a pretty neat idea.

Means until he's getting in melee, or psychic sniped, got at least two turns of survivability in him from heavy Dakka.

No Inf keyword though, so no heals from the docs, and no da' jumping him.  Built in nob banner to his rules is pretty fun too.  As expected, Goff locked, but the Goff features are only 1's in melee, so other lads aren't really missing out by not being Goff with him.

Biggest surprise is that he's M 7". Was really expecting them to keep him 5". Just REALLY expected GW to make him as single-target as he is in these new rules, but keep him slow as hell. Pleasantly surprised they realized that's a bad idea.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Dark Legionnare

[TorvaldTheMild]

Yeah the movement 7 is such a surprised bonus and most of the time Ghaz is a foot-slooger. 

[01RTB01]

Kinda sad that it's looking more and more like Ghaz and Makari really are the only releases coming out alongside Saga of the Beast. Obviously, Big G himself is a triumph worth celebrating, but I'm really wondering what the hold-up is on getting us normal Meks with KFF.

Let's be honest, we have zero idea so far. There's still rumour engine pics that look incredibly orky.

 

That said if we "only" get ghaz and Makari we've done VERY well. The models are outstanding, Makari returns. It's glorious!

 

I don't even care what the fluff is in the book - no hopes getting up based on every other PA book.

 

Some nice new strats would top it off nicely.

 

There's a load of grumblers in the ork Facebook groups about Ghaz's rules but I really don't get what they'd want.

 

Ah well, I'm happy!

[TorvaldTheMild]

 

Kinda sad that it's looking more and more like Ghaz and Makari really are the only releases coming out alongside Saga of the Beast. Obviously, Big G himself is a triumph worth celebrating, but I'm really wondering what the hold-up is on getting us normal Meks with KFF.

Let's be honest, we have zero idea so far. There's still rumour engine pics that look incredibly orky.

 

That said if we "only" get ghaz and Makari we've done VERY well. The models are outstanding, Makari returns. It's glorious!

 

I don't even care what the fluff is in the book - no hopes getting up based on every other PA book.

 

Some nice new strats would top it off nicely.

 

There's a load of grumblers in the ork Facebook groups about Ghaz's rules but I really don't get what they'd want.

 

Ah well, I'm happy!

 

To be honest I think this will be the tip of the ice berg for ork releases with this one, I don't know why; its just a feeling and I'm dancing on the ceiling.   

[01RTB01]

I'm already really pleased.

 

Anything else is a bonus. Our monthly painting league means I'm doing 500 points per month. Month 1 was the spearhead box. Dread mob ahoy. Month 2 gorkanaut. Month 3... Ghaz has put a huge spanner in the works :D if they release other stuff I'm really going to replan!

[Kaldoth]

Let's not forget if you make him your warlord (which, why wouldn't you?! WAAAAGH!) with the Goff WLT he gets 6/7/8 attacks and they're AP -5 on the charge. Das proppa killy dat is :D

 

I'm slightly disappointed he's not an infantry unit, but that isn't the end of the world. Him taking 4 wounds max per turn is a cool mechanic, though with him having only 12 wounds and no way to get them back I wish they would have capped it at 3.

 

Overall I'm still very pleased with him! Methinks I'm gonna have to warm up the tellyporta...

 

Edit: looking at his sheet again, his reroll 1s in melee is worded a bit wonky. Does he not benefit from the aura himself?

Edited March 15, 2020 by Kaldoth

[PiñaColada]

In all honesty I'm really happy with this Ghaz, he's what I wanted basically (fix the advance & charge though GW). He's really scary and probably slightly panic inducing to play against if you don't have an army that's efficient in psychic, shooting & CC but he seems to be costed at a level where you can plonk him down in a FLGS and everyone understands it's not the most competitive choice. 

Also, as a small aside, I was almost convinced he'd be a LoW (like Guilliman) so the fact that he's still just a HQ is so much easier to slot into your army.  Also people here in this thread might've forgotten he gets exploding 6's in melee.  I personally think it's worth putting him in a patrol detachment with some grots even if you don't play Goffs just to get that (if you just want ghaz and not makari as well that is)

[Kaldoth]

Though, I don't know why you wouldn't take Makari. He gives Ghaz a 6+ FNP :D Edited March 15, 2020 by Kaldoth

[TorvaldTheMild]

Yeah I'm happy with him, a tad overcosted but I thought he just had 5 attacks and the high strength wouldn't outweigh the lack of attacks but seeing that he goes up in attacks as he goes down in wounds is so good, because by the time you get yourself in melee most of the times you've already had a few wounds knocked off.  I'm chuffed at his rules, the fact that he's not infantry is the only downside like you said.  Also the lack of FNP sucks but the 'can only lose 4 wounds' rule is amazing for footslogging him as he can't hide behind troops at being +10 wounds, though that rule isn't going to help as much in CC.  I think can't loose more than 3 in a phase would be better though.

Edited March 15, 2020 by TorvaldTheMild

[PiñaColada]

You wouldn't take Makari if you take the tellyporta route with Ghaz since they're functionally incompatible. Makari can only be tellyportad through a transport so he's either have to go T2 to disembark T3 and that's when you bring in Ghaz or they go at they same time and you hope that Ghaz is still around next turn.

[Kaldoth]

Yeah I'm happy with him, a tad overcosted but I thought he just had 5 attacks and the high strength wouldn't outweigh the lack of attacks but seeing that he goes up in attacks as he goes down in wounds is so good, because by the time you get yourself in melee most of the times you've already had a few wounds knocked off. I'm chuffed at his rules, the fact that he's not infantry is the only downside like you said. Also the lack of FNP sucks but the 'can only lose 4 wounds' rule is amazing for footslogging him as he can't hide behind troops at being +10 wounds, though that rule isn't going to help as much in CC. I think can't loose more than 3 in a phase would be better though.

Remember, Makari is a thing! 6+ FNP ^_^

 

You wouldn't take Makari if you take the tellyporta route with Ghaz since they're functionally incompatible. Makari can only be tellyportad through a transport so he's either have to go T2 to disembark T3 and that's when you bring in Ghaz or they go at they same time and you hope that Ghaz is still around next turn.

Not completely true. You could always spend the 4cp to Tellyport them both :P But I get your point. Regardless, I don't think slogging Ghaz up the board will be an issue if he's got Makari tagging along. Between that, the 4++, the 6+ FNP, the 2++ Makari has to eat overwatch, and a max of 4 wounds per turn Ghaz is going to see combat. Edited March 15, 2020 by Kaldoth

[PiñaColada]

Makari is a grot and can't be tellyported on his own since that's an ork stratagem. I understand you sort of said it in jest but "no ork strats on grots" is why killa kanz suck, since they're forced to footslog

[Kaldoth]

Makari is a grot and can't be tellyported on his own since that's an ork stratagem. I understand you sort of said it in jest but "no ork strats on grots" is why killa kanz suck, sincet they're forced to footslog

Ahhh crap, I didn't even think about that >_< Apologies!

[TorvaldTheMild]

 

Yeah I'm happy with him, a tad overcosted but I thought he just had 5 attacks and the high strength wouldn't outweigh the lack of attacks but seeing that he goes up in attacks as he goes down in wounds is so good, because by the time you get yourself in melee most of the times you've already had a few wounds knocked off. I'm chuffed at his rules, the fact that he's not infantry is the only downside like you said. Also the lack of FNP sucks but the 'can only lose 4 wounds' rule is amazing for footslogging him as he can't hide behind troops at being +10 wounds, though that rule isn't going to help as much in CC. I think can't loose more than 3 in a phase would be better though.

Remember, Makari is a thing! 6+ FNP

 

You wouldn't take Makari if you take the tellyporta route with Ghaz since they're functionally incompatible. Makari can only be tellyportad through a transport so he's either have to go T2 to disembark T3 and that's when you bring in Ghaz or they go at they same time and you hope that Ghaz is still around next turn.

Not completely true. You could always spend the 4cp to Tellyport them both But I get your point. Regardless, I don't think slogging Ghaz up the board will be an issue if he's got Makari tagging along. Between that, the 4++, the 6+ FNP, the 2++ Makari has to eat overwatch, and a max of 4 wounds per turn Ghaz is going to see combat.

 

Thing is it all depends on the little dudes points, 300 points is a lot to sink for a warlord so spending extra on Makari even if he is cheap doesn't seem like an option, if he has FNP buffing all units he'll (which I don't see why he wouldn't) probably be worth taking.

Edited March 15, 2020 by TorvaldTheMild

[Kaldoth]

Thing is it all depends on the little dudes points, 300 points is a lot to sink for a warlord so spending extra on Makari even if he is cheap doesn't seem like an option, if he has FNP buffing all units he'll (which I don't see why he wouldn't) probably be worth taking.

His FNP buffs Goff units within 6, so kind of unfortunate for any non Goff players. But, you could always take a patrol or vanguard detachment with some Goff Nobz. I personally wouldn't be taking Ghaz in anything under 1750, more likely 2k+.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Kaldoth

[TorvaldTheMild]

I will but that'll be just for fun.  I love love fielding Ghaz.

[Warhead01]

Having had time to think it over I like Ghaz more than before but still fins him bland.
He can be buffed up another 2 attacks should put him at 8. I am wondering what the number look like with the rerolls and the exploding 6's just how many hits should he have I figure he should new what ever his attack stat is at almost any time and thinking if Ghaz is fresh he should hit 8 to 10 times but haven't rolled that out. I'm not much for mathhammer.

[01RTB01]

Where's the other two attacks coming from?

 

He doesn't get his own buff currently and fists of gork can't target him. so it's only exploding 6s that'll do anything?

[Warhead01]

The weirdboy power that buffs characters, Ghaz has the Character keyword. 

I rolled it out a few times and 6 attacks seems to amlmost always net 6. Can net 8 often.   8 attacks has brought in as many as 12 hits, 12 being the most. I hit a string of at least 2, 6's in there and a few 1's often those just balance things out, your rolls may vary. I think I hit 10 several times. Only one or two weird roll in both lots where I hit exactly 6 or exactly 8. Obviously my methods are completely scientific and beyond refute.  
 

What are his prime targets? ...He could one shot a Stompa? This is new territory for me, I've never had something like this in my normal lists. 
 

Edited March 15, 2020 by Warhead01

[PiñaColada]

Fists of Gork (+2S & +2Attacks) is great on him. His prime target is centurions since he's AP-5 on the charge if he's your warlord, always at least S10 attacks and flat D4. That means hits on 2's rerolling 1's, wounds on 2's, straight through their 2+ save and deals exactly 4 damage per attack. Those are perfect stats

[Kaldoth]

Now that the official rules preview is up on Facebook, all the griping is flowing in hard :lol:

 

Foetunately, the community team did say in one of the comments that medi-squig being usable on him isn't an oversight ^_^ So yay for being able to put D3 back on him for a CP. Honestly with all of his survivability as it is I'm not complaining about a 1cp tax to heal him.

[PiñaColada]

I mean it's one of those rare cases where whatever you roll on that d3 it's still insanely good (assuming your opponent managed to max out those 4 wounds in whatever phase/phases). If you use it more than once then getting 5 wounds back from 2 heals is bonkers good, but just that one wound is a whole 'nother phase

[TorvaldTheMild]

I thought characters could be effected by their own aura unless otherwise stated?