Best Primarchs

[Lord_Caerolion]

Who throws the hardest punches.

 

Angron.

Konrad

Russ

 

Who can take the hardest punches.

 

Vulkan

Mortarion

Ferrus

 

Who can lead the best(via different methods)

 

Pertuabo

Guilliman

Dorn

 

Who can lead the leaders via charisma

 

Horus

Fulgrim

The Lion

 

Who are the most special specials

 

Corax

Alpharius

Khârn.

 

Who are the most unique

 

Sanguinius

Magnus

Lorgar

 

Move Ferrus into "Lead the best" as well (again, one of the main leaders of the Great Crusade, frequently put in command of other Primarchs), and you're spot on, in my opinion.

 

Wait, why's Khârn in there?

[Mandragola]

This is an entirely subjective concept but, as as follower of Dorn, subjectivity is a concept I reject. Dorn is clearly the best.

 

The proof for this clear and unambiguous fact is the Horus Heresy books. The more that Rogal Dorn appears in a book, the better that book is. Saturnine has a lot or Dorn in, and is incredible - arguably the best in the series. Praetorian of Dorn is pretty awesome too.

 

He also does some pretty awesome stuff, notably in those two books but in others too. And then afterwards he hardly even tells anyone. So there's no record of whatever happened at the end of Praetorian of Dorn. When he tells Sanguinius about something he did, Sanguinius thinks it must be a joke - which would be somewhat out of character.

 

And finally he's got the Creed-like ability to magically produce stuff right where it's needed. Only instead of a baneblade appearing out of nowhere Dorn has the Phalanx and/or an entire fleet.

[Lord_Caerolion]

This is an entirely subjective concept but, as as follower of Dorn, subjectivity is a concept I reject. Dorn is clearly the best.

 

The proof for this clear and unambiguous fact is the Horus Heresy books. The more that Rogal Dorn appears in a book, the better that book is. Saturnine has a lot or Dorn in, and is incredible - arguably the best in the series. Praetorian of Dorn is pretty awesome too.

 

He also does some pretty awesome stuff, notably in those two books but in others too. And then afterwards he hardly even tells anyone. So there's no record of whatever happened at the end of Praetorian of Dorn. When he tells Sanguinius about something he did, Sanguinius thinks it must be a joke - which would be somewhat out of character.

 

And finally he's got the Creed-like ability to magically produce stuff right where it's needed. Only instead of a baneblade appearing out of nowhere Dorn has the Phalanx and/or an entire fleet.

 

I know, right? He got absolutely mauled in Dark King, and that story was awesome!

 

I kid, I kid...

[Blindhamster]

 

Who throws the hardest punches.

 

Angron.

Konrad

Russ

 

Who can take the hardest punches.

 

Vulkan

Mortarion

Ferrus

 

Who can lead the best(via different methods)

 

Pertuabo

Guilliman

Dorn

 

Who can lead the leaders via charisma

 

Horus

Fulgrim

The Lion

 

Who are the most special specials

 

Corax

Alpharius

Khârn.

 

Who are the most unique

 

Sanguinius

Magnus

Lorgar

 

Move Ferrus into "Lead the best" as well (again, one of the main leaders of the Great Crusade, frequently put in command of other Primarchs), and you're spot on, in my opinion.

 

Wait, why's Khârn in there?

 

Sanguinius should probably be in the throwing the hardest punches and possibly in the charismatic one too.

[Gederas]

-snip-

Wait, why's Khârn in there?

I think it's a typo and Son of Dorn meant The Khan.

 

And regarding the "Who can lead the best(via different methods)", imo, having read the books I'd honestly say Lion would be in the top three. Iirc, wasn't it stated that the only reason why Horus was given Warmaster over the Lion was because, while the Lion inspired loyalty and love in his troops (as per his Primarch novel), he was too reserved and not the right kind of charisma for Warmaster, while Horus was?

[WrathOfTheLion]

Putting Jonson as Warmaster would also go against what the 1st Legion's prime directive is. Their job in the Great Crusade was to eradicate certain things that the Emperor wished nobody to know about, and leave no trace of their existence at all. This would include accolades, etc. We can reason that Jonson could not have ever been Warmaster because that would inhibit their purpose.

Jonson is also mentioned to be quite kingly and regal, being quite charismatic. This would obviously have been his main nature. However, the time on Caliban had forged him into a predator, so it is matched with an unsettling aura of danger.

[Raktra]

I’m pretty sure Corax could wipe the floor with Curze.

Corax ran away from Curze in fear...

[Dhar'Neth]

I always think of Primarchs first and foremost as Psychic Warp-creatures, whoose power is significantly impacted by their emotional state and strenght of their latent warp power that may vary depending on planet, their surroundings, retinue or even fear and awe of nearby troops.

[Ishagu]

I always think of Primarchs first and foremost as Psychic Warp-creatures, whoose power is significantly impacted by their emotional state and strenght of their latent warp power that may vary depending on planet, their surroundings, retinue or even fear and awe of nearby troops.

This is a great theory. Would explain a lot.

 

It's also implied that the Primarchs are only so impressive because if their spirit/essence and not merely their impressive physical bodies.

[Karhedron]

It's also implied that the Primarchs are only so impressive because if their spirit/essence and not merely their impressive physical bodies.

There are a couple of scenes that support this theory and I am inclined to agree.

 

However there is also a section in Clonelord where Bile succeeds in creating a perfect clone of Fulgrim before he was corrupted by the Laer blade. The clone seems to have some of the more ethereal qualities of a Primarch, to the point that the Emperor's Children find it almost impossible to attack him. This suggests he is more than just a de-powered meat copy of the original. However it is also implied that the creation of the Primarchs was a one-off and the Emperor could not replicate them.

 

As with all things in 40K, the fluff on the subject is confusing and contradictory. Personally I lean towards the "bottled warp-essence" explanation.

[Raktra]

Maybe their inability to attack him is a psychological thing rather than the actual "magic" of a Primarch? 

[WrathOfTheLion]

I think this is supported by things I have read as well. There are many descriptions of some of them having an 'aura' to them that is noticeable even without seeing them.

I believe there is a scene in The Lost and the Damned where Dorn enters a room and the crew instinctively know he's there.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

It just makes sense .

[Lord_Caerolion]

Maybe their inability to attack him is a psychological thing rather than the actual "magic" of a Primarch? 

 

It's heavily implied to be far more than just "he looks like Fulgrim", it's a literal compulsion.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Exactly and Fulgrim truly loves his children .

[Whitelion]

Thank you all, I'm starting to get an idea at least of the figure of the primarch in general, even if I am a bit confused about the individual primarchs.

 

Could you recommend some novel to read about the exploits of the primarchs?

 

Appealing to your good heart :), I would also like to ask for some notable quotes from some primarch, no matter who, just a few are enough, so I learn something new.

 

Thanks again everyone for the posts.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Here’s the order in which the Emperor discovered his Primarchs:

 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Note that the majority of the Primarchs that were found towards the end turned traitor with the exception of Corax and the Khan... this is very telling in regards to how everything played out. Also is interesting to note that the Emperor must have known Alpharius had a twin.

[helterskelter]

Note that the majority of the Primarchs that were found towards the end turned traitor with the exception of Corax and the Khan... this is very telling in regards to how everything played out. Also is interesting to note that the Emperor must have known Alpharius had a twin.

How? Only Alpharius supposedly acted like he had something to prove according to old fluff, the rest suffered from someones great act of stupidity i.e. the emperor teleporting Angron away from his gladitorial brothers and sister, Curze was straight up renegade because Dorn/fulgrim (mostly Dorn) couldn't handle an interpersonal situation properly, the emperor could've had a nice sit down chat with lorgar about how worship + the warp = bad but didn't, the emperor could have also told magnus about the dangers of the warp in a more personal setting but again, mysterious space dad. Fulgrim found a sword that spoke to him and made him insecure, and Horus listened to dream Erebus, because apparently having Starscream poke at your ego is enough to get you to do the bad things (also see lorgar) and Mortarion was just sort of there and did it because his friend told him to.

[Lord_Caerolion]

Also, there's the implications that the Alpha Legion were actually the real "first" Legion, and that not all of Alpharius was sent away.

 

...That, and the hints that there may have actually been 3 Alpha Legion Primarchs...

[Inquisitor Eisenhorn]

Didn't read the whole thread but I was just reading about Konrad in the wikis sort of for the first time, and I have to say, he really seems--by almost any metric--one of the least successful primarchs.  Ruled his homeworld by fear and violence, hated his own legion for the murderers and criminals they were, blew up his own homeworld, betrayed the Imperium and got taken out by a human assassin he knew was coming. 

 

Not the most stellar primarch CV. 

[Lord_Caerolion]

He allowed the assassin to kill him because, in his mind, it proved he was right. "Death is nothing compared to vindication". He'd also argue that most of the Primarchs ruled their planets through fear and violence, he just very selectively targeted who he inflicted said fear and violence upon, rather than wiping out whole nations who opposed him. Also, he's not the only Primarch to lose his homeworld. Perturabo had his turn on him, as did the Lion.

 

When it came to compliance rates, again, he was pretty successful. Invade a system, take out one city on one world in his methods, broadcast it to the rest, and say he'll do the same there if they don't fall in line. Unsurprisingly, most took him up on the offer. What he did was unarguably barbaric and sadistic, but again, he'd argue that his methods involved far fewer dying than if he'd undertaken the more common military invasions favoured by his brothers.

[Inquisitor Eisenhorn]

He allowed the assassin to kill him because, in his mind, it proved he was right. "Death is nothing compared to vindication". He'd also argue that most of the Primarchs ruled their planets through fear and violence, he just very selectively targeted who he inflicted said fear and violence upon, rather than wiping out whole nations who opposed him. Also, he's not the only Primarch to lose his homeworld. Perturabo had his turn on him, as did the Lion.

 

When it came to compliance rates, again, he was pretty successful. Invade a system, take out one city on one world in his methods, broadcast it to the rest, and say he'll do the same there if they don't fall in line. Unsurprisingly, most took him up on the offer. What he did was unarguably barbaric and sadistic, but again, he'd argue that his methods involved far fewer dying than if he'd undertaken the more common military invasions favoured by his brothers.

Yeah I haven't read any of his BL material. His CV as summarized in the wiki definitely didn't really capture me compared to some other primarchs in a way that left me feeling like I'd put him in a lower tier than people like Horus or Sanguinius. 

 

I guess I just sort of have two tiers of primarchs in my mind. 

 

top tier:

Horus

Sanguinius

Russ

Guilliman

El'Johnson

Magnus

Alpharius

Mortarion

Dorn

Angron

 

second tier:

Corax

Ferrus

Lorgar

Khan

Vulkan

Perturabo

Fulgrim

Curze

 

Not here to change any minds, that's just how I've mentally sorted them for totally personal subjective reasons.

[Special Officer Doofy]

My vote for best is (was? Haha) Horus, there was a reason he was warmaster. I see alot of people thinking little of the traitor primarchs (which might be why this thread was moved from AA to just the space marine forum). I think they are certainly some of the more interesting ones.

 

Mortarion's story is one of tragedy, he became exactly like what he despised. Typhus also betrayed him and he fell to Nurgle, but he let's Typhus be and do his own thing because he does not want to be like the emperor. He's certainly not the best, but definitely more interesting than a boy scout.

 

Guilliman beat Magnus, had Mortarion running away and defeated Khorne's greatest general in a duel, one v one.

And speaking of Guilliman, he did not send Mortarion running, Nurgle had him retreat. Put it in real world logic. If country A (DG/Morty) invades country B (Ultras/RG), destroys some of their land and permanently occupies another portion of it, and only retreats from the rest of the country because country C (Other Daemons) invades country A, no other country is seeing that as country B winning and country A losing, that's called a draw, or country B getting lucky. Or in the 40k universe, "plot armor".

[Ishagu]

He ran, with Guilliman screaming for him to stand and fight.

 

He was also only willing to battle Guilliman if he was able to trap him with warp magic, not even a clean fight.

 

Mortarion was a hypocrite who advocated strength and endurance ahead of everything, and yet when he was truly tested he gave up and pledged his soul to Chaos.

He also fully embraces warp magic even though he was the biggest opponent of it, and is very petty on top, unable to let go of the past.

 

Overall strong of body but very weak of spirit and character.