New codex info

[Mobius0288]

 

That's about it. Of special interest though is a Crusade relic that is Vortex Bolts - one shot with a bolt weapon to deal D3+3MW on a hit. It's available to all chapters but of course, we do like our extra ammo types

 

 

Could it be my primaris captain with stalker bolt rifle has a purpose now? :)

 

Hearing rumors of primaris specific transports potentially losing the primaris restrictions... is that a thing?

 

Hoping we still get SIA and mixed squads in the supplement still but for the moment, feels like a slight downgrade in order to get more access to different options. Definitely getting some old school apothecaries, techmarines together... need a few units of phobos and an impulsor. Sending some hell blasters forward with an ancient and a Captain will be fun (despite the dome shield change). And if we lose the sniping strat, we could also grab an eliminator unit (w/ phobos libby?) for some shenanigans. Or bring an assassin.

 

Lots of fun fluffy stuff to try.

[Prot]

 

 

Xenophase blade is +1S/-4AP/1D, ignores invul, so that's a nice little boost, though I would have liked 2D to match all the master crafted pswords out there now.

 

We can't take: Assault, Attack Bike, Bike, Devastator, Sternguard, Tactical, or Scout units.

 

Wording is clear DW can't have a successor chapter (just incase anyone thought to get sneaky there)

 

Cant upgrade a DW captain to chapter master but the other character upgrades are fine.

 

Our one chapter WT is just basically Ectoclades, so special relics.

 

 

 

Thanks for the update! I was hoping you might clear a few things up for me based on what you said:

 

- No Chapter Master, but can I assume we still get a "Watchmaster"? (CM with a cool red cape?)

 

- Big question here: You mention what we can't take. Does that mean -everything- else in the codex can be taken by DW? (IE: Impulsors, ATV's, Turrets, Gladiator tanks?)

 

- The Xenophase blade is cool. Quite frankly even though I play a fairly competitive environment, I always used the Xenophase blade in a unit or two for fluff reasons. I'm glad to see it may sting a bit more now.

 

- Do you see any DW specific Strats? Can we use our existing ones?

 

- Stupid question time, but is there no change to our Chapter traits? 

 

- Can we now take a chief Apothecary? Chaplain upgrades, etc?

 

- How does the Corvus look?

 

 

Thanks for the info.

[Irbis]

Besides not being able to upgrade to chapter master (here: https://i.imgur.com/Fq7IsPC.jpg?1), yes those are the only restrictions besides some of the chapter specific stuff on datasheets.

See, this 'chapter specific stuff' is the problem. My friend shown me some more leaks and what I feared, comically stupid chapter restrictions, is in (say, primaris captain only being able to take bolter and power fist if DA, because that's the miniature GW sells, or lieutenants only having plasma pistols if DA or axes if SW). This is especially sad seeing these miniatures have easily detachable pads, so they could have written 'DA/DW' or 'SW/DW' and the fact they didn't is yet another red flag for DW rules quality...

 

I think you need to chill a little with the doom and gloom.

 

Or maybe you should chill with rose glasses and pumping the hype balloon based purely on wishlisting and stop acting like people having reasonable doubts after being burned SIX times in a row (especially after vanguard debacle took stupid rules to new levels) somehow rains on your parade.

 

GW rule writing is terrible with even regular primaris, but DW ones having doubled down on 'no model no rule' dumb is doubly atrocious, and no, I am not bitter about having a mountain of unused DW left arms with power swords while being banned from using it on every single primaris unit or character save for one particular sergeant of ONE squad

[Boyadventurer]

All the chapter specific stuff on datasheets aren't restrictions though, but just adding the unique stuff in addition. Like allowing SW dreadnoughts to take the Axe or Hellfrost cannon. It's not taking away any options that already were available.

 

All the transport restrictions are the same as they've been.

Prot: We can take everything in the codex except for the units I listed. Don't make me say it again :P

There's no chapter-unique units in the book (just unique loadout options for generic units, like the SW dreadnought example above). Also no chapter specific strats.

 

Our CT is the same as what was in the preview image from a while back, basically Mission Tactics, plus reroll 1s to hit in melee vs xenos units.

The only character upgrade with a restriction is Chapter Master, so yes there's nothing saying we can't take the rest.

If we can still get the +1D trait in the supplement, the Xenophase blade will be pretty sweet indeed.

[angrom]

Tabletop titan preview on youtube seem to indicate that as it stands the new SM codex fully stack with each specific ones. So we can still use everything from new SM unit and our SIA, strat, and all from our book until FAQ or supplement drop

[Debauchery101]

I can't believe thunder hammers went to ap-2. I really want to take all my thunder hammer marines and crush them...nerfing hammers in a game called Warhammer...go figure...FMRITA

Here's a picture of about half my sgts/characters with Foam-hammers i had in arms reach...

Edited October 3, 2020 by Debauchery101

[Mobius0288]

Speaking of hammers, I saw a tempest hammer available for the regular tech marine? Not sure if I'm just out of touch or if it's legit new. Wonder what the difference is..

 

Appreciate all the information!

[Boyadventurer]

Only for Space Wolf ones

[Prot]

Points will be a big issue too. I am seeing a lot of disappointment with unit turn downs but for me I am just hoping this is a temporary loss of uniqueness I’m seeing. Some staples I used to enjoy are dead on arrival for me in this book. So I am really hoping there are some good point values in something I like to use with Deathwatch. For example, the contemptor looks really good. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Prot

[MeatGrinder]

Was very surprised with the nerf to aggressors tbh, will be interesting to see if theyre still worth taking to buff our kill teams to T5, but if we can take the new heavy intercessors instead I dont see why we would.

[Debauchery101]

Was very surprised with the nerf to aggressors tbh, will be interesting to see if theyre still worth taking to buff our kill teams to T5, but if we can take the new heavy intercessors instead I dont see why we would.

I personally feel that it was kind of needed. Although the issues with the aggressors is that certain chapters make them exponentially stronger. I play salamanders and I love being able to roast anything I want to. I was kind of hoping for a range extension or hit bonus for not moving

[Prot]

Was very surprised with the nerf to aggressors tbh, will be interesting to see if theyre still worth taking to buff our kill teams to T5, but if we can take the new heavy intercessors instead I dont see why we would.

 

Well to be flat out honest, it appears (to me at least) that a lot of older units took a hit, while the odd piece got a great boost.

 

Aggressors got hit incredibly hard in my opinion. This reminds me of GW old school over reaction where something goes from too good, to unplayed. I would be surprised to see these on the table again as I understand them today.

 

A lot of non-core units fit this same category to me. Even Impulsors got turned down, but all grav vehicles take a hit losing fly/-2 to charge (natively). The invlun slip up in an article turned out to be true (5++ instead of 4++). Tanks... tanks ouch. The Repulsor Executioner is really hit hard.

 

Meanwhile the Contemptor looks great. And Dreads in general. The cool thing is the way I play my Deathwatch, a lot of the infantry I liked using appears better. With the new Apothecary rules, it's very interesting as well. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Prot

[Debauchery101]

I think Aggressors are still good because they have melee threat and for DW they can be combat squaded from the kill teams and have obsec.

Even though I did think aggressors were a bit too strong I think they needed tuning vs the kneecap they got...like we could have gotten a hit bonus? Range bonus or allow flamers get the frag storms.

 

But I really thought they were going to nerf Eradicators and they didn't so yeah instead 2 intercessor squads of 5 ints/5 aggros ill take just 1 and now ill take 3 squads of eradicators with 2 rifles+ 1 multimelta..8 shots for 3 dudes

 

I keep hearing hype about the hvy intercessors...they are not going to be that much cheaper than Eradicators. But 5 or 6 Eradicators could easily melta a whole unit in a turn. I think it may be more efficient to keep using OG marines with storm bolters and storm shields which are relatively cheap and exponentially tougher with 2 wounds. Save them points to spend on maxing eradicators.

 

The other thing that's starting to look good is the veteran intercessors that can have melee or range...no one has told me or shown me if its a 1 or the other or if you can take rifle marines with pistol/sword marines in the same squad.

[Boyadventurer]

Honestly, if they wanted to tone down Aggressors, fine that's one thing. But taking away their shoot twice, but keeping it on Eradicators with the other buffs they got its crazy. Yes, GW is always going to make the new shiny stuff extra good, but damn they would have been fine without the bump up to 6 man squads.

The most pressing for me now is whether they still confer the bonus to kill teams, I assume not since they lost the rule on their own datasheet, but I'd still totally take them to boost the mobility/accuracy of my auto and stalker rifle squads.

[Debauchery101]

Honestly, if they wanted to tone down Aggressors, fine that's one thing. But taking away their shoot twice, but keeping it on Eradicators with the other buffs they got its crazy. Yes, GW is always going to make the new shiny stuff extra good, but damn they would have been fine without the bump up to 6 man squads.

 

The most pressing for me now is whether they still confer the bonus to kill teams, I assume not since they lost the rule on their own datasheet, but I'd still totally take them to boost the mobility/accuracy of my auto and stalker rifle squads.

the shoot twice bonus to the rest of the kill team was removed a while back. Maybe we can add in some Eradicators to the kill teams.

[ValourousHeart]

Any chance that the Blackstar will be able to transport Primaris, or at least phobos.

[Prot]

Aggressors are still excellent. Not okay, excellent. 

 

I'll be the first to admit I thought they over nerfed them, but after playing about... 20+ games with them, they are very much worth it. I rarely give advice/opinion based on theory hammer and prefer to play out scenarios and units. My initial reaction is a perfect example of why I hold on to that belief. 

 

Fists going to a flat 2 damage, and the new Gravis Strat + the change to flamers are just a few of the reasons that this has turned out to be a unit that many marine armies can still count on to do serious damage while bullying the middle of the table. 

 

I know first hand, because I've done it dozens of time against many different opponents. In fact I've pulled them out of many of my lists because it's becoming a bit repetitive. 

 

Imbedding them in Deathwatch Indomitus kill teams is something I often did for different reasons, but it's still going to be a useful unit. Making the unit essentially ObSec is incredible.

 

Add in the Chief Apothecary and the combo gets pretty silly. I hate to do this but I have to assume that people saying there's something wrong with Aggressors really had very little experience with them and the above combo's. 

 

The ceiling with Aggressors may very likely be a bit higher when using them with Deathwatch for a few reasons. 

[leth]

I think the non-flamer versions are what people are talking about since most of us probably built ours like that.  If I had flamer ones I would work them in. 

[Lemondish]

Any chance that the Blackstar will be able to transport Primaris, or at least phobos.

 

Probably a really slim chance, so I'd bet on Primaris still being excluded. 

[ValourousHeart]

Well the Blackstar is no longer of the website.  Reboxing most likely, since it is still available in the Strike Force bundle.

[WrathOfTheLion]

Should be reboxing, there's things like the SW venerable dreadnought, the BA tactical squad, etc. that are also in and out.

[Lemondish]

Well the Blackstar is no longer of the website.  Reboxing most likely, since it is still available in the Strike Force bundle.

 

I'd say reboxing is most likely, since we got the new datasheet in the Index. The move characteristic for the wound brackets changed, they consolidated the weapon profile for the Blackstar launcher by dropping the warhead options, and there were changes made to both the Auspex Array and Infernum Halo-launcher. Some of those items will need to be reflected on the condensed datasheet, I imagine. 

 

The updated full datasheet in the Index release still maintained the Primaris exclusion, so I honestly would not be surprised if this is the exact same sheet we'll see in the Codex.   

 

Still, the more I look at this new datasheet, the more I like what I see for a 180-200 point flying transport. 

[Qui-Gon]

 

Well the Blackstar is no longer of the website.  Reboxing most likely, since it is still available in the Strike Force bundle.

 

I'd say reboxing is most likely, since we got the new datasheet in the Index. The move characteristic for the wound brackets changed, they consolidated the weapon profile for the Blackstar launcher by dropping the warhead options, and there were changes made to both the Auspex Array and Infernum Halo-launcher. Some of those items will need to be reflected on the condensed datasheet, I imagine. 

 

The updated full datasheet in the Index release still maintained the Primaris exclusion, so I honestly would not be surprised if this is the exact same sheet we'll see in the Codex.   

 

Still, the more I look at this new datasheet, the more I like what I see for a 180-200 point flying transport. 

 

 

Having done the comparison for rough equivalent firepower per point for the corvus vs the talon, hawk, and raven, its better and can transport dudes and has a bomb and has built in ignore cover? Yes best flyer imo.

[Lemondish]

It is also the sexiest

[INKS]

Just came to ask about Corvus Blackstar

You guys never disappoint. Not a new model but just a new boxing is likely right?