9th Edition codex for Raven Guard. What do you like?

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I like this new codex a lot.  It got rid of all the gross OP stuff (except eradicators lol) and added a lot of quality of life stuff. 

 

 

1.  Heavy Intercessors.

Dirt cheap imo at 28.  An all gravis raven guard list is possible and would be pretty fun.  They can use a new stratagem called Unyielding in the Face of the Foe which gives them +1 sv vs 1 dmg shooting.  With raven guard this will be a 1+ sv in cover and with -1 to hit.  A really obnoxious unit that can use transhuman physiology for extra table flipping goodness. 

 

2.  Assault/Veteran Assault intercessors.

 

Really spicy with 4-5 attacks on the charge with powerfists.  You can have these guys deep strike or just run.  Really points efficient and they hit hard.  

 

3.  Chaplains

Chaplains got the best new stratagem imo... Commanding Oratory.  It costs 2cp but you can use a litany whenever you want provided no one else used the same litany and your chaplain did not use a litany earlier in the turn.  This means you can use canticle of hate after you arrive from deepstrike.  Furthermore, the Vox Espiritum now buffs the range of auras from litanies to 9".  This is spectacular utility that will allow you to get stuck in very easily.   

 

4.  Any unit with high volume in shooting AND/OR combat.

We got a strat that costs 2cp that lets us count as being in all doctrines at the same time.  So on turn 1 big characters can be danger immediately.  I'm thinking vanguard vets with some sort of anti tank/monster loadout would become very efficient.  Maybe 8 vanguard vets with chainsword+stormshield and 2 with TH+SS.  That mathes out to a dead leman russ commander most of the time and is fairly durable.  

 

5.  Eradicators.

Point at something.  It dies.

 

 

6.  Chief Librarians.

I like these guys a lot now because Psychic fortress is now good.  It gives a 6" bubble where all units gain a 5++ invuln save.  Combine this with heavy intercessors or some other big baddies and your units become a lot more durable to high ap firepower.  It even works on vehicles. 

 

7.  Apothecaries. 

Father of the Future is back.. and it costs 0 cp and you can have it on more than 1 model.  Those heavy intercessors with a 1+ armour save, -1 to hit, and 5++ invuln now also ignore wounds on a 6. 

 

Raven Guard still got it!    

 

[Espresso]

From what I have gathered from the various reviews of the new codex we are in for a treat. 

 

Let's begin with the obvious. A Primaris Land Speeder. All three setups are interesting and I think that this model should be in every Raven Guard list. It is thematic, solid in its role and has enough of a footprint to be a unit that the adversary has to deal with. 

 

Next are the Heavy Intercessors or as should we call them Drop Zone Clearance Squad. They are exactly what we need. A tough, shooty unit, that has ObSec and that can reliably defend our half of the board from the would be enemy deep strikes, all the while their range allows them to participate in the battle from turn one. 

 

Definitely I like the upgraded characters. A Chief Librarian and a Chief Apothecary are a great addition to any list. 

 

Melee. Yup, just melee. Be it Bladeguard, Assault Intercessors, the Reiver Lieutenant, Outriders, you name it and the astartes have it. I can see this units work very well with our usually infantry heavy armies. 

 

Smoke Screen stratagem and the Phobos redeployment. If we are not mobile we can protect our key troops and if we have to move them we have this trick available to us. In general anything with the Phobos keyword is good for us and with the new codex it is even better

 

Then many little nuances like better weapons, therefore more damage per unit and an overall increase in the flexibility that a space marine army offers. Add in that our supplement still works with this codex I can see the Raven Guard a viable army for a long time. 

 

I only wonder what happened with our Chapter Litany from PA...

[Jacques Corbin]

I heard a rumor that Thunderfire Cannons are now S4. Is that true??

 

Also, I want at least one new Primaris Land Speeder. Not sure which build yet, but I see them as a Quick Reaction Force to back up my forward guys in the midfield. Hide it behind terrain, zip it up to reinforce a beleaguered squad, and let 'er rip on the enemy.

 

It would be nice to pair a Chaplain with a squad of Assault Intercessors in a QRF role too. Hunker them down on terrain or ruins, and if one of my midfield guys gets charged, they (likely Infiltrators, but maybe Incursors) will catch the charge like a good speed bump, and the Assault Intercessors can run up with Chappy and join the melee.

 

I love the idea of Drop Zone Clearance! For me it has been Thunderfire Cannons raining on an enemy, with Incursors mopping up. Next turn, drop in Phobos Lt w/ Ex Tenebris and either Grav Chute Reivers, or Bolter Inceptors, and try to open that hole a little wider. Hell, I am tempted to add an Impulsor to zip over, scoop them up, and taxi them to where the Lt can threaten the next character.

 

Can't wait to get my hands on my own Codex!!! I am scheming up all kinds of ways to disrupt my opponent's strategy and wreak havoc among his army, forcing them to make difficult decisions when choosing targets, all while I play the objectives, hard.

 

Love the Heavy Intercessors too! I think we get more mileage out of the stock rifles than any of their upgrades. Is the strat that lets you combat squad still in the new codex? These guys are prime candidates for its use. The enemy can focus down 1 squad, if they throw a lot, maybe everything at them, but with 2 squads, now they have to make some choices about exactly how much to throw at the first squad of five to remove 15 T5 wounds that will either be in cover or count as being in cover, and still have enough firepower left to dislodge the other squad of five right there with them.

 

Also, on a fun note, which of our 2 "goth" heads from our upgrade kit would go best on the new Chaplain?

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I heard a rumor that Thunderfire Cannons are now S4. Is that true??

 

 

 

Not a rumour.  They are s4 ap -.  

[GreyCrow]

Well, since my Raven Guard force is Old Marines, I love the 2W base on all Marines :D

 

I've been playing mostly my Primaris Ultramarines which are in for a treat now, but I'll definitely finish a 2000 points list for the Raven Guard :D

[Jacques Corbin]

 

 

I heard a rumor that Thunderfire Cannons are now S4. Is that true??

 

 

Not a rumour. They are s4 ap -.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! :cuss :cuss-ity :cuss :cuss-ing :cuss

 

Well, hopefully this means we are getting a Primaris artillery unit in the future.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Jacques Corbin

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

 

 

I heard a rumor that Thunderfire Cannons are now S4. Is that true??

 

Not a rumour. They are s4 ap -.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! -ity -ing

 

Well, hopefully this means we are getting a Primaris artillery unit in the future.

 

Tremor shells is still in the codex and whirlwinds got a new strat that is pretty tasty.  You just cant have 3 thunderfires and delete the entire enemy backfield on turn 1 anymore.

[Jacques Corbin]

 

 

 

 

I heard a rumor that Thunderfire Cannons are now S4. Is that true??

 

Not a rumour. They are s4 ap -.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! -ity -ing

 

Well, hopefully this means we are getting a Primaris artillery unit in the future.

Tremor shells is still in the codex and whirlwinds got a new strat that is pretty tasty. You just cant have 3 thunderfires and delete the entire enemy backfield on turn 1 anymore.

Ok, I run two. I can see new blast rules being brutal, but not enough to delete a whole backline. But that is how artillery is supposed to work. Rain death on the enemy and thin them out, then march in (or air drop) your boots on the ground to mop up and hold the area.

 

Yeah, I know, TFCs have been an auto include for quite a while, and a new edition will shift away from that. Also, it is an old kit, and hopefully there will be a Primaris alternative soon.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Jacques Corbin

[Saadjor]

Anyone else notice that our chapter tattics have been changed? our light cover bonus now only aplies from 18 inches away instead of 12..... 

Anyway I plan on getting one of the new speeders, maybe also finally an Apothacary since the Chief Apoth. upgrade apears to be bonkers good.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

Anyone else notice that our chapter tattics have been changed? our light cover bonus now only aplies from 18 inches away instead of 12..... 

Anyway I plan on getting one of the new speeders, maybe also finally an Apothacary since the Chief Apoth. upgrade apears to be bonkers good.

I wouldnt get too excited about the apothecary... that looks a lot like nerf fodder.  

[GreyCrow]

Anyone else notice that our chapter tattics have been changed? our light cover bonus now only aplies from 18 inches away instead of 12..... 

Anyway I plan on getting one of the new speeders, maybe also finally an Apothacary since the Chief Apoth. upgrade apears to be bonkers good.

 

Yes, overall I think the Marines are being more and more designed to be played at a little bit longer range in the early part of the battle.

 

It's also not a stupid tactical move as it reduces the power of incoming fire.

[Alcyon]

I think the Apothecary is only going to get nerfed in that it won't be able to res the ATV, that's a dumb interaction they clearly just didn't consider. They had the ability to grant a 6+++ before through Father of the Future and it was hardly broken, the only people that used it were IH because it stacked with their CT down to a 5+++ and it doesn't now. Still a strong option but not busted I don't think.

 

New codex, I don't think I'm especially stoked on any new units, especially with the Eradicators outshining most of the other anti-tank options (ATV, Speeder, Gladiators.) I feel like Eliminators got nerfed and now there's even less utility in Surgical Strikes, which leaves me a bit disappointed. The strongest Raven Guard abilities are still SftS and Master of Ambush and I think our options for maximizing those are largely the same. The new Chaplain rules are very exciting as noted, in that it makes combat units arriving from reserves much more likely to get a successful charge, and I think the Bike Chaplain is a good option for us because of the Swift & Deadly Warlord Trait. 

 

I agree Heavy Intercessors will be strong and I'm also excited about the Librarians granting a 5++ now with the Librarius Discipline (though it's frustrating that Phobos Librarians are shut out of it.) I also don't want to contribute any salt and I'm glad this subforum is almost always such a haven of positivity vs. Amicus and News & Rumours. That said, I may be looking at running my custom chapter as Imperial Fists or even Salamanders successors in the meantime until we see what the new Super Doctrines look like. 

[Dracos]

Anyone else notice that our chapter tattics have been changed? our light cover bonus now only aplies from 18 inches away instead of 12..... 

 

Yes but the -1 to be hit doesn't require you to be in terrain anymore. The light cover bonuses stack so they must have felt it needed a nerf.

[Jaipii]

The -1 to hit doesn't require to be in terrain anymore? That's great news!

[superwill]

I wouldn’t be so sure about that sadly. I know a lot of the reviews and recaps have left that detail out, but you can clearly see it says that they need to be entirely on or within a terrain feature to benefit from the -1. So basically it’s a straight up nerf.

 

Which is weird because I thought most people playing RG were already running successors anyway but there you go.

[Dracos]

I think they switched it up because terrain can now innately give -1.

[GreyCrow]

To open up with old marines a bit more, the big winners for me are Vanguard Veterans and Assault Marines with the 2 Wounds now! One can afford to be a bit more aggressive with them!

 

I know I won't be able to field this with the upgrade in points cost, but I'm thinking of something along the lines of :

 

Captain - Jetpack with the Relic Claws / Master of Ambush

Lieutenant - Jetpack with Power Sword

 

30 Tacticals - combi plasma, plasma, missile launher

10 Devastators - 4 missile launchers + Cherub

10 Assault Marines - 2 Plasma pistols, Fist on the Sergeant, Flamer

 

10 Vanguard Veterans - 6 double claws, 4 TH/SS

Dread - Assault Cannon/Fist

 

Flyer - Stormraven Double Las, Typhoon, Hurricane Bolters

 

Will be adjusted with the final point costs!

 

Idea being to deploy a big gunlne meant to thin down the heard from a comfortable rannge, use the MOA warlord trait to position the Vanguard Vets properly with the Captain then use the Infiltrators stratagems on all jump packs for a big push Turn 1, pumping supporting shots from the long range units.

 

Compared to the Ultramarines list where I tend to go for a Turn 1 gank of the big units, the idea is to thin down the herd using the Devastator doctrine, blast weapons and T1 charge from the Marines so that turns 2-3 can be spent hunting down characters. Stormraven beginning the game empty (!) as a gunship, but ready to pick up the Dreadnought and a Tactical squad for a mid game push following the initial onslaught.

 

Old Marines still got it!

[Lukoi]

I came to the RG section to ask about our CT and revisited this thread.

 

Watched a couple of batreps, including one by MWG where they read it word for word.

 

For the first part its 18" giving the benefit of cover to the saving throw. They don't mention it stacking if you are already in light cover, so dont think it does more than +1 to save.

 

The -1HR specifically still includes the phrase on or within terrain which is the part I came to ask about. Terrain triggers effects for infantry units if they are within 3". If all models are within 3" of a terrain feature, does that mean our -1HR activates?

 

Just curious as to what the word is on this as I seriously consider going from a successor to RG pure with my all infantry army here.

Edited October 6, 2020 by Lukoi

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I came to the RG section to ask about our CT and revisited this thread.

 

Watched a couple of batreps, including one by MWG where they read it word for word.

 

For the first part its 18" giving the benefit of cover to the saving throw. They don't mention it stacking if you are already in light cover, so dont think it does more than +1 to save.

 

The -1HR specifically still includes the phrase on or within terrain which is the part I came to ask about. Terrain triggers effects for infantry units if they are within 3". If all models are within 3" of a terrain feature, does that mean our -1HR activates?

 

Just curious as to what the word is on this as I seriously consider going from a successor to RG pure with my all infantry army here.

The new CT basically just means any terrain item gives the benefits of dense cover for infantry.  So if you are standing on top of some crates that are scalable, breachable, but exposed... you get dense cover outside of 12" and light cover outside of 18" where any other chapter of marines would get nothing.  

[Lukoi]

 

I came to the RG section to ask about our CT and revisited this thread.

Watched a couple of batreps, including one by MWG where they read it word for word.

For the first part its 18" giving the benefit of cover to the saving throw. They don't mention it stacking if you are already in light cover, so dont think it does more than +1 to save.

The -1HR specifically still includes the phrase on or within terrain which is the part I came to ask about. Terrain triggers effects for infantry units if they are within 3". If all models are within 3" of a terrain feature, does that mean our -1HR activates?

Just curious as to what the word is on this as I seriously consider going from a successor to RG pure with my all infantry army here.

 

The new CT basically just means any terrain item gives the benefits of dense cover for infantry.  So if you are standing on top of some crates that are scalable, breachable, but exposed... you get dense cover outside of 12" and light cover outside of 18" where any other chapter of marines would get nothing.

Yes but I'm asking regarding the other types of terrain you interact with but dont sit on top of. Fuel pipes, barricades, sand bag walls etc. If you are within 3" of them (and where necessary the terrain is between and the enemy shooting), you gain their effects. Does that apply to the RG CT or do I physically need to be on top of them?

[Alcyon]

It's my understanding that since you cannot be on top of those pieces of terrain, they're obstacles and not area terrain, and thus if you are within 3" and the terrain is between you and the firing model, you get the benefit of that terrain - which would then grant -1 to hit under the CT. But I'm not a TO.

[Lukoi]

Decisions, decisions.

 

With LRM no longer affecting assault weapons (nearly all of my weapons are assault), MA only applying to one wound roll...I find myself truly torn on deciding what will best work with my playstyle.

 

If I could combine Rapid Advance with our -1 to hit, I think I'd be in hog heaven, but that's the hallmark of a good game I suppose. It forces ya to choose.

[Jacques Corbin]

It's my understanding that since you cannot be on top of those pieces of terrain, they're obstacles and not area terrain, and thus if you are within 3" and the terrain is between you and the firing model, you get the benefit of that terrain - which would then grant -1 to hit under the CT. But I'm not a TO.

But do not the fuel pipes and the plasma conduits come with rules that say you can use them for cover, but you take a mortal wound on certain rolls when you save? Cannot remember if it is a 1 or 6. Or, maybe they are just obstacles, and the rest (MW on certain save rolls, boosted flamers, plasma core grenade, etc) will be a thing in Tactical Deployment.

[Dracos]

I refuse to buy Impulsors, so Raven Guard are my no-brainer choice now that the Successor Traits got nerfed. I even finally got around to assembling Kestrel <Shrike> to drop down with my Inceptors and/or Eradicators.

[War of the Eagle]

Lightning claws being +1 attack per claw is pretty sweet. So I turned a trash unit into the new hotness.

 

 

-Im happy with the new dreadnought rules. Being core and getting alittle damage mitigation is nice.

 

-Supressors going up to 3 shots each is also great. Will have to bring mine more.

 

-Plasmaceptors are slightly more afordable.

 

-all anti flyer weapons don't get - to hit ground targets anymore so allot more weapons are now viable, including the stormhawk.

 

-New primaris tanks and speeders are a tad pricy but Ill likely get one of each.

 

Impulsors are dead to me. Tho may use my ine to fery the buffed assault hellblasters.

 

-As already stated reivers are still garbo and scouts have joined them.

 

-Vangaurds benifit allot from 2 wounds and improved lightning claws.

 

Over all im happy with the new codex.

Edited October 7, 2020 by War of the Eagle