What to expect from 9e CSM

[Sersi]

Currently asking is illusionory supplication prayer is still a thing and of so if its going up to 4++. If so helbrutes with a dank apostle and a rapsmith with a trio of tzeentch or nurgle helbrutes is going to be nasty

 

Hi, was there anymore info on Noise Marine weapons?

[Marshal Loss]

Chosen are shaping up to be a lot of fun. Great to see some life injected into what has been an extremely boring ruleset since they took 3.5's sandbox away.

[Lagrath]

Illusory Supplication is amazing, hope they keep it. Though sounds like Abbadon doesn't make Cultists fearless anymore (and they probably lose ObSec) so it won't be good for that anymore. But yeah, helbrutes with it would be great. 

[Balthamal]

Chosen look like they're going to be very adept at a number of roles. About time imo

[Voodoom]

Hello Clockworkchris, thanks a lot for the leaks !

I have two small questions :

- Are Icons mark locked ? For example if you want Icon of Wrath do you have to take Mark of Khorne ?

- If you play as Creations of Bile, do you have to take Fabius Bile as your Warlord ?

[Toldavf]

Tzeentch core Vehicles actually have the potential to shrug a decent amount of firepower. 

[Bulwyf]

 

 

Terminators

• Base loadout combi-bolters, accursed weapons (S+1 ap3 d1; +1a)
• 1 per 5 can replace combibolter with autocannon or heavy flamer
• 1 per 5 can replace combi bolter with an extra accursed weapon
• 3 per 5 can replace accursed weapon with a powerfist
• 1 per 5 can replace accursed weapon with a chainfist
• 2 per 5 can replace combi bolters with up to 2 combi flamers
• 2 per 5 can replace combi bolter with 2 combi melta
• 1 per 5 can replace combibolters with 1 combi plasma

 

The following weapon options are included in the kit.

 

- 1 chain axe

- 1 chainfist

- 1 power sword

- 1 power axe

- 1 power maul

- 2 power fists

- 2 lightning claws

- 1 heavy flamer

- 1 reaper autocannon

- 5 combi-weapons

 

So why 3 per 5 get power fists? LC losing re-rolls wound removes the weapon identity, why even have chain axes if it's going to be the same as the power weapons.

 

There is some serious design flaws in GW's production pipeline.

 

Anyway thanks Chris for sharing

 

 

I am still praying that termies still can do dual LC and lords can still have jump packs. I am not breaking arms off my NL models.

[TheGodOfHammers]

 

 

 

I am still praying that termies still can do dual LC and lords can still have jump packs. I am not breaking arms off my NL models.

 

According to the earlier leaks, no HQs can take jump packs, but the Daemon Prince can still take wings

[techsoldaten]

Processing the Abaddon rumors.

 

8 S10 AP4 D3 attacks is 24 potential wounds, plus mortals along with the Legion trait.

 

With the -1 to wound, ignore first failed save and max damage modifier, he could solo an Imperial Knight over a couple turns. He destroys most tanks in a single turn.

 

16 S7 AP4 D1 attacks is 16 potential wounds, plus mortals along with the Legion trait.

 

With the -1 to wound and always fights first, average rolling means he destroys ~6 Intercessors per turn while taking ~1 wound in response. He wrecks anything less than Heavy Infantry.

 

While his stats come close to those of a Daemon Primarch, he has advantages in that 1) he can deep strike and 2) there's not a way to just throw everything at him because of the max damage modifier. If he's less than 10 wounds, he can get Look Our Sir when he deep strikes for extra protection.

 

That's a lot of versatility wrapped up in a single model.

 

If he can still buff any unit with Heretic Astartes (not just Black Legion,) Abaddon will have a place in a lot of lists. He'd actually make Death Guard better as a force multiplier in a separate detachment, forget about Contagions.

Edited March 12, 2022 by techsoldaten

[Silas7]

 

 

 

 

So why 3 per 5 get power fists? LC losing re-rolls wound removes the weapon identity, why even have chain axes if it's going to be the same as the power weapons.

 

There is some serious design flaws in GW's production pipeline.

 

Anyway thanks Chris for sharing

You are incorrect. You get three power fists in the kit.

No, they're right. it's 2 power fists and a chainfist in the kit.

 

 

*sigh*

 

The new CSM Terminator kit comes with 3 power fists and 1 chainfist. You can see the sprues on the GW webstore.

 

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Chaos-Space-Marine-Terminators-2019

 

The old CSM Terminator kit comes with 2 power fists and 1 chainfist. You can see the sprues in this thread.

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/190710-chaos-sprue-compendium/

 

Clear?

 

This is funny, considering I copy/pasted from the U.S GW webstore terminator description.

 

Tip of the hat to those that had the actual sets on hand to check.

[Bulwyf]

 

 

 

 

I am still praying that termies still can do dual LC and lords can still have jump packs. I am not breaking arms off my NL models.

 

According to the earlier leaks, no HQs can take jump packs, but the Daemon Prince can still take wings

 

 

I am hoping that is going to be wrong. It is literally as fluffy as you can get to have Chaos lord with jump packs for NL armies plus having dual LC on terminators.

[Prophet of the Despoiler]

It’s important to remember that that the only big confirmed rumours have been the contents of kill team nachmund. None of the table top rules or load outs have been verified and even the source is saying they’re early play test rules.

[techsoldaten]

It’s important to remember that that the only big confirmed rumours have been the contents of kill team nachmund. None of the table top rules or load outs have been verified and even the source is saying they’re early play test rules.

 

Good point.

 

For that reason, I've been trying to use the word "rumors" instead of "rules." Important to remember the actual Codex may differ from the rumors discussed here.

 

List of rumors that would surprise me if they are accurate:

 

- Actually getting accursed weapons instead of power weapons.

 

- Actually limiting units to what's in the box, even if that's happening with other factions. 

 

- Actually prohibiting Chaos Lords / Sorcerers from using Jump Packs, given how long this option has been available.

 

- Not having a Summoning rule.

 

- Cult units not being able to take a Legion Trait.

[Waaagh?]

 

 

It’s important to remember that that the only big confirmed rumours have been the contents of kill team nachmund. None of the table top rules or load outs have been verified and even the source is saying they’re early play test rules.

Good point.

 

For that reason, I've been trying to use the word "rumors" instead of "rules." Important to remember the actual Codex may differ from the rumors discussed here.

 

List of rumors that would surprise me if they are accurate:

 

- Actually getting accursed weapons instead of power weapons.

 

- Actually limiting units to what's in the box, even if that's happening with other factions.

 

- Actually prohibiting Chaos Lords / Sorcerers from using Jump Packs, given how long this option has been available.

 

- Not having a Summoning rule.

 

- Cult units not being able to take a Legion Trait.

I dunno I think most of these are likely and tbh welcomed in my opinion. No more nonsense trying to find extra bits to do squads the way that's good and they can now look varied on the table whilst having the same attack profile (which given the leaked stats is the one everyone would pick anyway) unless they're going PF or CF.

 

Im unsure about the no Jump Pack on lords as GW do sell a Jump Pack Lord model and its usually the case its the stuff that doesn't have a model that gets scrapped (meaning the Sorc with jump pack will likely go)

 

Summoning is pointless and if you want to go down the mixed route then there are better ways of doing it without losing all your traits. I fully expect to see a Daemonkin style thing in the futur given that's a new keyword.

 

Finally, there's only supposed to be one cult unit in the book right? It does suck if they don't benefit from legion traits (or at the least if you take an EC force they get it). But likely they will have their own special rules on the profile to make up for it.

[techsoldaten]

 

 

List of rumors that would surprise me if they are accurate:

 

- Actually getting accursed weapons instead of power weapons.

 

- Actually limiting units to what's in the box, even if that's happening with other factions.

 

- Actually prohibiting Chaos Lords / Sorcerers from using Jump Packs, given how long this option has been available.

 

- Not having a Summoning rule.

 

- Cult units not being able to take a Legion Trait.

I dunno I think most of these are likely and tbh welcomed in my opinion. No more nonsense trying to find extra bits to do squads the way that's good and they can now look varied on the table whilst having the same attack profile (which given the leaked stats is the one everyone would pick anyway) unless they're going PF or CF.

 

Im unsure about the no Jump Pack on lords as GW do sell a Jump Pack Lord model and its usually the case its the stuff that doesn't have a model that gets scrapped (meaning the Sorc with jump pack will likely go)

 

Summoning is pointless and if you want to go down the mixed route then there are better ways of doing it without losing all your traits. I fully expect to see a Daemonkin style thing in the futur given that's a new keyword.

 

Finally, there's only supposed to be one cult unit in the book right? It does suck if they don't benefit from legion traits (or at the least if you take an EC force they get it). But likely they will have their own special rules on the profile to make up for it.

 

All that remains is to wait and see.

 

"Nonsense trying to find extra bits" - sad to hear such words. There was a time tracking down bits was half the joy of modelling.

[Waaagh?]

 

 

List of rumors that would surprise me if they are accurate:

- Actually getting accursed weapons instead of power weapons.

- Actually limiting units to what's in the box, even if that's happening with other factions.

- Actually prohibiting Chaos Lords / Sorcerers from using Jump Packs, given how long this option has been available.

- Not having a Summoning rule.

- Cult units not being able to take a Legion Trait.

I dunno I think most of these are likely and tbh welcomed in my opinion. No more nonsense trying to find extra bits to do squads the way that's good and they can now look varied on the table whilst having the same attack profile (which given the leaked stats is the one everyone would pick anyway) unless they're going PF or CF.

Im unsure about the no Jump Pack on lords as GW do sell a Jump Pack Lord model and its usually the case its the stuff that doesn't have a model that gets scrapped (meaning the Sorc with jump pack will likely go)

Summoning is pointless and if you want to go down the mixed route then there are better ways of doing it without losing all your traits. I fully expect to see a Daemonkin style thing in the futur given that's a new keyword.

Finally, there's only supposed to be one cult unit in the book right? It does suck if they don't benefit from legion traits (or at the least if you take an EC force they get it). But likely they will have their own special rules on the profile to make up for it.

 

All that remains is to wait and see.

 

"Nonsense trying to find extra bits" - sad to hear such words. There was a time tracking down bits was half the joy of modelling.

Yes but sometimes it smacks of pay to win when there's a clear choice weapon that ends up being the big thing. It's not good for the people who can't afford or struggle with conversion. You should be able to build every loadout from the box.......and whilst the problem really lies with the lack of options in the box to begin with I do think it's better this way.

[Marshal Mittens]

Accursed weapons seems simular to the Sister Novices box where all the various weapons are the same, or new storm guardians. Harlequin weapons too. Maybe also for game quickness where you don't have to role the various weapons individually in a squad? Not saying I like it, just likely a option.

[Kaiju Soze]

Accursed weapons seems simular to the Sister Novices box where all the various weapons are the same, or new storm guardians. Harlequin weapons too. Maybe also for game quickness where you don't have to role the various weapons individually in a squad? Not saying I like it, just likely a option.

Given you can have 6 or 7 different melee profiles in a Chosen unit currently I can see the advantage of a unified profile for trying to speed up play. Personally I would prefer if they also had some kind of heavy melee option, like power fist or thunder hammer.

[Clockworkchris]

 

Accursed weapons seems simular to the Sister Novices box where all the various weapons are the same, or new storm guardians. Harlequin weapons too. Maybe also for game quickness where you don't have to role the various weapons individually in a squad? Not saying I like it, just likely a option.

Given you can have 6 or 7 different melee profiles in a Chosen unit currently I can see the advantage of a unified profile for trying to speed up play. Personally I would prefer if they also had some kind of heavy melee option, like power fist or thunder hammer.

Power fist will still be an option, sadly thunder hammers are chaos lord only.

[Prophet of the Despoiler]

I totally see the logic in rolling mauls, swords and axes into 1 profile. But lightening claws have always been a separate weapon even back when there was only power firsts and power weapons.

[Marshal Mittens]

Yeah, would like claws to be separate as well.

[BrainFireBob]

Which just rolls back to the 3rd-6th paradigm.

 

In those years, many clamored to return to 2nd Ed's differentiated CC weapons as "better". Some of us thought it was rose tinted glasses. Nice to have opinion validation

[techsoldaten]

How do the following rumor engine items line up with actual rumors? 

 

Item 1: claws and melta.

 

 

Item 2: Khorne Thing

 

 

Item 3: Head on Fur

 

 

Item 4: Tentacles

 

 

Item 5: Hammer

 

 

[TheGodOfHammers]

How do the following rumor engine items line up with actual rumors? 

 

Item 1: claws and melta.

 

 

 

Item 2: Khorne Thing

 

 

 

Item 3: Head on Fur

 

 

 

Item 4: Tentacles

 

 

 

Item 5: Hammer

 

 

 

 

Item 1: Nothing from these rumours really lines up with this. Many suspect it's a new Huron model, or a type of War Dog for Chaos Knights. Nothing confirmed

 

Item 2: Again, nothing from the CSM rumours lines up with this. Either this is something for AoS, or it's a World Eater model, which we've heard nothing about.

 

Item 3: This was part of the Christmas REs, and is one of the new Chosen models (The one with 2 LCs in the Eldritch Omens box)

 

Item 4: Also nothing confirmed or lining up with the other rumours in this thread. If I had to hazard a guess, I would say it's the new Chaos Knight model that is coming, which is supposed to have power tendrils similar to this.

 

Item 5: While not lining up with the model rumours I've heard for CSM, I'm hoping this is either a new Chaos Lord model, and if not that then it's most likely a WE model

[Khornestar]

Would love to know more about the mutant cultist unit, loadout/special rules.

 

Was thinking that hammer could potentially belong to that unit/cultist hq as well.

 

Could totally see them giving hammers to our WS 4+ units.