What to expect from 9e CSM

[Grand_Master_Alpharius]

 

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

 

 

Not all the evidence.

 

The rumor is Havocs keep their existing datasheet, which allows for 4 of any heavy weapon.

 

The box comes with a single Chaincannon, the datasheet states they can take 4.

 

Will be surprised if the rumor is true, and will be disappointed if it's not true.

 

I mean, as far as I know, these rumours are coming out of the thousand sons and deathguard codices which have very specific arming rules and the reasons to back up the decisions. But, I don't see how this should or does automatically translate to the more generic warbands/legions and why everyone seems to just be falling into line with the idea. 

 

Personally, I think it would be an absolute tragedy for chaos to be restricted in this way. To have a key point of difference from the loyalists that chaos have always had just arbitrarily removed from them for no real reason seems both crazy and a particularly poor business decision on GW's part. 

 

I can't wait to see the new codex, so that we can finally put all this crazyness to bed.

[MegaVolt87]

 

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

 

 

Not all the evidence.

 

The rumor is Havocs keep their existing datasheet, which allows for 4 of any heavy weapon.

 

The box comes with a single Chaincannon, the datasheet states they can take 4.

 

Will be surprised if the rumor is true, and will be disappointed if it's not true.

 

 

Even though fixed loadouts are a rumour, even if it doesn't happen in the end- its shockingly still plausible enough to be true. 

[Grand_Master_Alpharius]

 

 

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

 

 

Not all the evidence.

 

The rumor is Havocs keep their existing datasheet, which allows for 4 of any heavy weapon.

 

The box comes with a single Chaincannon, the datasheet states they can take 4.

 

Will be surprised if the rumor is true, and will be disappointed if it's not true.

 

 

Even though fixed loadouts are a rumour, even if it doesn't happen in the end- its shockingly still plausible enough to be true. 

 

I stand by my opinion that it would be tragically ludicrous, but I like you I also would not be at all surprised.

[Mike8404]

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

If this is the case and Chosen are getting a really limited loadout, along with other units losing options, then we were all wrong when we thought Primaris were the only Marines that would be specialized and CSM would keep the flexibility of First Born.

 

These leaks show us GW is, for lack of a better term, Primarising CSM and limiting them to weaker versions of Primaris with all the unit limitations they have.

 

Which means 6 Troops choices with 12 different bolters instead of the tried and true Tac Marines with flexibility in options.

 

As for what Chosen get as a loadout, I have a feeling GW will go the Sword Brethren route with Chosen loadout where all models come with the same basic loadout but can all exchange their chainsword/axe for a power weapon. But if you want, say, a power sword, only one model in that unit can take that weapon. I have a feeling this is going to be a thing If it isn't already

Edited April 6, 2022 by Mike8404

[MegaVolt87]

 

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

If this is the case and Chosen are getting a really limited loadout, along with other units losing options, then we were all wrong when we thought Primaris were the only Marines that would be specialized and CSM would keep the flexibility of First Born.

 

These leaks show us GW is, for lack of a better term, Primarising CSM and limiting them to weaker versions of Primaris with all the unit limitations they have.

 

Which means 6 Troops choices with 12 different bolters instead of the tried and true Tac Marines with flexibility in options.

 

As for what Chosen get as a loadout, I have a feeling GW will go the Sword Brethren route with Chosen loadout where all models come with the same basic loadout but can all exchange their chainsword/axe for a power weapon. But if you want, say, a power sword, only one model in that unit can take that weapon. I have a feeling this is going to be a thing If it isn't already

 

 

Potential case study for our chosen- Primaris Sword Brethren. 

[Grand_Master_Alpharius]

 

 

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

If this is the case and Chosen are getting a really limited loadout, along with other units losing options, then we were all wrong when we thought Primaris were the only Marines that would be specialized and CSM would keep the flexibility of First Born.

 

These leaks show us GW is, for lack of a better term, Primarising CSM and limiting them to weaker versions of Primaris with all the unit limitations they have.

 

Which means 6 Troops choices with 12 different bolters instead of the tried and true Tac Marines with flexibility in options.

 

As for what Chosen get as a loadout, I have a feeling GW will go the Sword Brethren route with Chosen loadout where all models come with the same basic loadout but can all exchange their chainsword/axe for a power weapon. But if you want, say, a power sword, only one model in that unit can take that weapon. I have a feeling this is going to be a thing If it isn't already

 

 

Potential case study for our chosen- Primaris Sword Brethren. 

 

To be fair, I'm still not overly concerned about the chosen, it's the rumoured limitations on Terminators that are really concerning to me.

[Prophet of the Despoiler]

I think the biggest problem with locked datasheets is that the chosen were released with 8th rules, theoretically you could have bought and then custom built them to have 5 power fists and 5 combi plasmas and that would have been game legal when they were released. If GW had planned to alter datasheets they should have released a new datasheet.

[Warsmith Anarax]

 

 

 

 

 

Also, what comes in the Eldritch Omens box for Chosen doesn't mean they're limited to that loadout.

Well all the evidence and recent codexes indicate otherwise with limiting wargear selections to what comes in the box. I doubt when chosen get stand alone release they will get a heavy weapon sprue added.

Not all the evidence.

 

The rumor is Havocs keep their existing datasheet, which allows for 4 of any heavy weapon.

 

The box comes with a single Chaincannon, the datasheet states they can take 4.

 

Will be surprised if the rumor is true, and will be disappointed if it's not true.

Even though fixed loadouts are a rumour, even if it doesn't happen in the end- its shockingly still plausible enough to be true.

I'm not super worried about havocs losing their versatility. Retributors can take 4 of any heavy weapon but they're only 2 of each per kit

[Lagrath]

News about Black Legion relics and traits pleasE?

I can't wait either. That strat to be another Legion especially. The devil is in the details there.

[Danosborne]

Clockwork Chris has been quiet the last couple of days. An ominous sign?…

[Toldavf]

Clockwork Chris has been quiet the last couple of days. An ominous sign?…

Likely just pacing himself. 

[Klamoor]

Not seen anything in the codex rumours except night lords +1" to charge so melee out of a dreadclaw or drill is dead on arrival.

With no inv save I really can't see chosen having any significant comp relevance.

If you're gearing them for melee you might as well take possessed instead with their 9" move and inv. If you're gearing them for special weapon shooting, how many times do you see sternguard/hellblasters etc in even casual marine lists and they can't even take those levels of shooting output.

The thing they have is a bit of versatility and that is very rarely a bonus in modern 40k

Night Lords retain some of their charge strats, as well, it sounds like. Emperor's Children are keeping Honor the Prince. There are ways, surely.

[Clockworkchris]

An ominous sign indeed.

Big brother is watching.

[Galron]

So apparently every single lord I have for all three of my chaos armies is now null and void. This is utter crap. I was excited for chaos hoping they would keep up the positivity they started during Faith and Fury and instead they said ", long term chaos players."

 

This is pathethic, they screw over HQs, they screw over terminators who are supposed to be THE most customized terminators in the game, they screw over all the NL strats, my IW are now Imperial Fists in all but name complete with almost useless super doctrine. Talk about going power creep codex, power creep codex, power creep codex, and lets crap on chaos at the end.

 

So I will be converting the few parts I need for my IW to go back to 30k. I will play my Night Lords as Space Wolves since they still have a customizable unit selection. Emperors Children I am still on the fence on but since most of my army for them is 3D printed, it isnt such a big deal. Wow, talk about deflating my excitement for chaos.  

 

Lets hope this is just GW screwing with us by leaking rumors of a super sub-par codex. If this is the version that will go live, I see no reason to waste my money on it. Be the first time since the 90s I didnt own the current chaos codex.

[Agrest_IW]

So apparently every single lord I have for all three of my chaos armies is now null and void. This is utter crap. I was excited for chaos hoping they would keep up the positivity they started during Faith and Fury and instead they said ", long term chaos players."

 

This is pathethic, they screw over HQs, they screw over terminators who are supposed to be THE most customized terminators in the game, they screw over all the NL strats, my IW are now Imperial Fists in all but name complete with almost useless super doctrine. Talk about going power creep codex, power creep codex, power creep codex, and lets crap on chaos at the end.

 

So I will be converting the few parts I need for my IW to go back to 30k. I will play my Night Lords as Space Wolves since they still have a customizable unit selection. Emperors Children I am still on the fence on but since most of my army for them is 3D printed, it isnt such a big deal. Wow, talk about deflating my excitement for chaos.  

 

Im still have my 2x Chaos sorcerers on bike , chaos lord on bike, IW basilisk and IW Stormsword :/

[Clockworkchris]

So apparently every single lord I have for all three of my chaos armies is now null and void. This is utter crap. I was excited for chaos hoping they would keep up the positivity they started during Faith and Fury and instead they said ", long term chaos players."

 

This is pathethic, they screw over HQs, they screw over terminators who are supposed to be THE most customized terminators in the game, they screw over all the NL strats, my IW are now Imperial Fists in all but name complete with almost useless super doctrine. Talk about going power creep codex, power creep codex, power creep codex, and lets crap on chaos at the end.

 

So I will be converting the few parts I need for my IW to go back to 30k. I will play my Night Lords as Space Wolves since they still have a customizable unit selection. Emperors Children I am still on the fence on but since most of my army for them is 3D printed, it isnt such a big deal. Wow, talk about deflating my excitement for chaos.

 

Lets hope this is just GW screwing with us by leaking rumors of a super sub-par codex. If this is the version that will go live, I see no reason to waste my money on it. Be the first time since the 90s I didnt own the current chaos codex.

Your overreacting a tad bit there bud.

 

I understand for the the gun and jumpack limitations, but lets just wait and see.

 

For Iron warriors and Night lords content, what are you smoking? Their rules are great and fluffy

[Warsmith sargos]

So apparently every single lord I have for all three of my chaos armies is now null and void. This is utter crap. I was excited for chaos hoping they would keep up the positivity they started during Faith and Fury and instead they said ", long term chaos players."

 

This is pathethic, they screw over HQs, they screw over terminators who are supposed to be THE most customized terminators in the game, they screw over all the NL strats, my IW are now Imperial Fists in all but name complete with almost useless super doctrine. Talk about going power creep codex, power creep codex, power creep codex, and lets crap on chaos at the end.

 

So I will be converting the few parts I need for my IW to go back to 30k. I will play my Night Lords as Space Wolves since they still have a customizable unit selection. Emperors Children I am still on the fence on but since most of my army for them is 3D printed, it isnt such a big deal. Wow, talk about deflating my excitement for chaos.  

With such anger you should play World eaters  

ah they removed them from the codex.... CURSE YOU GW!!! 

Im joking ofc we still miss alot of information, and IW look like a strong army that can easily be A tier or above at scoring points

[Galron]

Im not seeing any positives here. Unless there is more info Night Lords have a nice +1 to charge and advance but they lost ALL the stuff that made them unique including all their good strats. Raptors can now be shot when they charge in. They have no way of getting lords into the mix and have completely lost their Talon Masters and the new Black Talons are a joke since they lose the ability that makes lightning claws useful. Hell, My terminator lord who I have had since he worked his way up from a simple autocannon gunner back in 2E. Well he is out since apparently we no longer have terminator HQs who can travel with their terminator retinues. But thats ok since they trashed terminators into stupidity. 

 

I will have to look closer at IW since most of my anger relates to my oldest army getting nerfed into the stone age but I know my terminators and terminator characters which were a big part of my Grand Assault Battalion are useless.

 

Right now though, especially compared to other new codices, this is looking like a huge middle finger from GW.

[Clockworkchris]

Im not seeing any positives here. Unless there is more info Night Lords have a nice +1 to charge and advance but they lost ALL the stuff that made them unique including all their good strats. Raptors can now be shot when they charge in. They have no way of getting lords into the mix and have completely lost their Talon Masters and the new Black Talons are a joke since they lose the ability that makes lightning claws useful. Hell, My terminator lord who I have had since he worked his way up from a simple autocannon gunner back in 2E. Well he is out since apparently we no longer have terminator HQs who can travel with their terminator retinues. But thats ok since they trashed terminators into stupidity.

 

I will have to look closer at IW since most of my anger relates to my oldest army getting nerfed into the stone age but I know my terminators and terminator characters which were a big part of my Grand Assault Battalion are useless.

 

Right now though, especially compared to other new codices, this is looking like a huge middle finger from GW.

Hold on are you talking about 30k? If so your in the wrong thread pal.

 

You mention raptors can now be shot at, but that was litteraly the case before, raptors have only received a sidegrade.

[Iron Inspirit]

Im not seeing any positives here. Unless there is more info Night Lords have a nice +1 to charge and advance but they lost ALL the stuff that made them unique including all their good strats. Raptors can now be shot when they charge in. They have no way of getting lords into the mix and have completely lost their Talon Masters and the new Black Talons are a joke since they lose the ability that makes lightning claws useful. Hell, My terminator lord who I have had since he worked his way up from a simple autocannon gunner back in 2E. Well he is out since apparently we no longer have terminator HQs who can travel with their terminator retinues. But thats ok since they trashed terminators into stupidity. 

 

I will have to look closer at IW since most of my anger relates to my oldest army getting nerfed into the stone age but I know my terminators and terminator characters which were a big part of my Grand Assault Battalion are useless.

 

Right now though, especially compared to other new codices, this is looking like a huge middle finger from GW.

Army wide -1/2 ap -1 is a massive upgrade from current Iron Warriors, who currently only ignore cover with infantry and characters/bikers/helbrute.

 

Now our vehicles also get those both.

 

Fully half the weapons or more in 40k are 0-2 AP. 

 

All our infantry are getting a wound increase. It took :cussing years but its actually happening.

 

 

Edited April 7, 2022 by Iron Inspirit

[Galron]

No, this is 40k. I had an intact IW Grand Assault Battalion with 3 squads of cataphractii terminator armor led by two guys in terminator armor. Every now and then Daemon Prince Perturabo would show up as well.

 

Raptors when they DS'd in could not be shot plus they rolled 3d6 to charge with a strat to make sure the very squishy units made it into combat. Dont tell me overwatch isnt a thing in 9th when every tau player puts an EWO in at least every suit squad they can or it comes standard. This past week prior to covid I overwatched with a hammerhead and hit my opponent's warlord with both railgun shots with predictable results when he charged. OW is still a thing.  And now they cant even go in with a buffing character or a slashy Talon Master. Then there is the terminator issue. 

[Sandviper]

No, this is 40k. I had an intact IW Grand Assault Battalion with 3 squads of cataphractii terminator armor led by two guys in terminator armor. Every now and then Daemon Prince Perturabo would show up as well.

 

Raptors when they DS'd in could not be shot plus they rolled 3d6 to charge with a strat to make sure the very squishy units made it into combat. Dont tell me overwatch isnt a thing in 9th when every tau player puts an EWO in at least every suit squad they can or it comes standard. This past week prior to covid I overwatched with a hammerhead and hit my opponent's warlord with both railgun shots with predictable results when he charged. OW is still a thing.  And now they cant even go in with a buffing character or a slashy Talon Master. Then there is the terminator issue. 

 

Youre thinking of warp talons. Raptors could absolutely be overwatched. If you played they couldnt, you cheated. The 3D6 charge may still be there. Most recent grouping of info doesnt say yes or no about it. 

[Clockworkchris]

No, this is 40k. I had an intact IW Grand Assault Battalion with 3 squads of cataphractii terminator armor led by two guys in terminator armor. Every now and then Daemon Prince Perturabo would show up as well.

 

Raptors when they DS'd in could not be shot plus they rolled 3d6 to charge with a strat to make sure the very squishy units made it into combat. Dont tell me overwatch isnt a thing in 9th when every tau player puts an EWO in at least every suit squad they can or it comes standard. This past week prior to covid I overwatched with a hammerhead and hit my opponent's warlord with both railgun shots with predictable results when he charged. OW is still a thing. And now they cant even go in with a buffing character or a slashy Talon Master. Then there is the terminator issue.

Raptors could never deepstrike and not be fired upon, your mistaken with warptalons. And apart from tau everyone has to pay to overwatch. Its really not a big issue.

 

Terminators seem to follow the trend of pushing more for melee, they will still be lethal at shooting, just not DS and annihilate a tarfet, which gamewise is better. You want game to play 4 to 5 turns and no insta win.

[Galron]

You are correct, Warp Talons. I Used them and terminators extensively. The warp Talons mostly because they are a PITA to paint and I felt since I put so muc effort into painting them then I need to actually use them. 

[danodan123]

I know having models being made redundant sucks, really does, but if the problem is having minis from 20+ years ago is the bugbear with this, is it really such a bad thing to maybe get some new minis?