Has anyone used the Van Saar as a unique Guard regiment?

[Orange Knight]

I've never comes across the kit in person. I am wondering if the Van Saar box comes with all the parts, and can be used to build 10 soldiers with Las guns?

I've long considered building a Guard regiment from an advanced world, and I'm torn between that idea or simply going down the road of a Krieg army, as those new models are fantastic also.

 

Thanks!

[Lord_Ikka]

Without converting some of the models, you're going to have an interesting time filling out a guard squad of 10. The problem is that there are 5 bodies (2 of each) and each body is specifically paired with a set of 2 different weapon options. 3 of the bodies have a lasgun, so that's 6 regular troops down, but the last two are different. One, labeled body 2 by GW, can be equipped with either a radcannon (heavy weapon) or plasmagun/shockstave combo and the other, body 5, is a pistoleer with either two plasma or las pistols. So it looks like, without conversion, you'd have 6 regular troopers, one heavy weapon that could be a counts-as lascannon (1st body 2), one plasmagun (2nd body 2), one sergeant with pistols(1st body 5), and one other guy with pistols (2nd body 5). 

 

Unfortunately, Van Saar aren't one of the Necromunda gangs I own, so I don't know how difficult a conversion would be required to make another one or two regular troopers out of the four weird bodies. Hopefully it wouldn't be too hard- it looks like the weapons upgrade for the Van Saar won't help out if you are looking for more lasguns, it seems stacked with special weapons though, so that is nice. Actually, now that I think about it if you took the second pistol guy and put him with the heavy weapon guy you could just have a regular heavy weapon base, so it would work out decently. The only real issue would be with heavy weapons- there aren't any heavy bolters/missile launchers/autocannons/mortars sort of weapons that really fit the look of Van Saar, so you might be stuck with counts-as lascannons and then need to convert heavily to make the more ballistic-style heavy weaponry of the IG. 

 

Overall, I think the look of Van Saar would be great for a high-tech Imperial world and would like to see someone do this. The price might be fairly high, but they would look great.

[Orange Knight]

Thank you for the detailed response, I really appreciate it!

 

Based on what you've said, I think I will simply pursue the Krieg idea instead. I was afraid that a single kit wouldn't provide me with all the required options, and the price to amass 50 - 70 bodies would be too high for me. Unfortunately I'm at a stage in life where my available funds can't all be spent on selfish pursuits.

[Gamiel]

Overall, I think the look of Van Saar would be great for a high-tech Imperial world and would like to see someone do this. The price might be fairly high, but they would look great.

It's already established that one of Necromundas regimetns are Van Saar based

from Codex: Imperial Guard (3rd Edition, 1st Codex)

Edited May 12, 2022 by Gamiel

[apologist]

As Lord_Ikka says, the kit doesn't readily lend itself to being used as a Guard squad out-of-the box. Using just the Van Saar sprues, you'll quickly end up with a preponderance of special and heavy weapons – but if you're going for a high-tech army, then that might work – multiple special weapon squads, or heavily-laden command squads, for example, will help to free up 'spare' lasgunners for your infantry squads. You might alternatively use the Scions rules, which would help.

 

The good news is that (unlike Cawdor and Escher, for example) all the Van Saar bodies have flat connections at the shoulders (i.e. they don't have some with partial arms 'built in'), so they're fairly easy to kit-bash if you can find some other suitable arms. The shoulder pads are also separate, helping to disguise any awkward little gaps.

 

The main drawback, I think, is that the Van Saar poses are quite distinctive and limited in number, so you're going to end up either with a lot of very similar poses, or having to put in quite a lot of more involved conversion work.

 

Love the idea, however – would be really interested to see what you come up with.

 

+EDIT+

Sorry, saw you replied in the time it took me to write! If budget's a concern, it's worth noting that – as all the special, heavy and combat weapons  are included – you can probably make a cheaper high-tech Guard army using Van Saar models than using Cadian ones. 

 

e.g. Five boxes of Van Saar will give you fifty bodies. Out of the box, you can make a maximum of 30 lasgun troopers (L) and the rest have to be specialists (S).

 

Command squad troopers can all swap their lasguns for close combat weapons and pistols, allowing you to use those:

 

Elites

One Command Squad (4S)

One Command Squad (4S)

Special Weapon Squad (3L, 3S)

 

Troops

Infantry Squad (7L, 3S)

Infantry Squad (7L, 3S)

Infantry Squad (7L, 3S)

 

Heavy Support

Heavy Weapon Squad (3L, 3S)

 

That's 23 specialists and 27 lasgunners, so you've actually got a bit of playing room with having more lasguns in your command squads. You're lacking any commanders, so you could add another box of Van Saar Archeoteks and Cutters.

 

To buy the equivalents in Cadians, you'd need something like: four Infantry Squads (£30 x 3 = £120), a Heavy Weapon Squad (£26) and one Command Squad (£24), for a total of £190.

 

Five boxes of Van Saar is £140 (28 x 5 = 140), plus the Archeoteks (£28) is £168. Even chucking in the Van Saar Weapons and Upgrades kit (£16) for a bit of variety leaves you at £186, with a few spare Cutters to be used as (say) bodyguards or Rough Rider equivalents.

Edited May 12, 2022 by apologist

[Orange Knight]

OK that might be worth pursuing. I'll take a look of of what specialists I can fit-in using the models that will be left over. I guess a more elite Guard army would also thematically support the idea of these high-tech soldiers.

[Son of Sacrifice]

I think the Van Saar poses are too restrictive. I couldn't even build a 10 man gang from one box, because I didn't want two standing on ammo crates, too hopping on one leg etc etc. I really don't think they'd work as a guard regiment.

 

Better to go to Anvil Industry or the 3D printing route to find something with a similar aesthetic IMO.

[Bryan Blaire]

I was considering running my Van Saar gang also as a Tempestus Scions unit instead of a straight Imperial Guard set up all around, but haven’t looked too deeply into it.  Really good topic, Orange Knight, and everyone, thanks for the extensive responses!  A lot to consider as I build them.

[apologist]

The poses are definitely a sticking point, but as they're plastic, slim and armoured, it's relatively simple to adjust them. Cutting off one leg at the hip and replacing it with another is a quick and simple operation with this sort of figure.

 

The Cutters and Archeotek box also adds some options on poses – the former being more dyamic (great if you build them into scenic bases) and the latter more staid: ideal for officers. It also gives you some plasma pistols, while the spider rig might make a nice addition to a techpriest. 

 

The more I think about this idea, that more ideas it throws up! :)

[Xenith]

Krieg wont be better for poses, and cadians...well, you get to rotate the waist, right? But you end up with the same problem as marines, you get as many poses as you hae arm combos. The real dynamically posed models are conversions.

 

I reckon you could do it easily with van saars - Apologist gives an awesome breakdown of how this could be done, and neoteks/cutters as rough riders is icing on the cake! 

 

If you dont like leg poses, cut them in half and stick the pistol guys in the top hatch of a tank, otherwise 2 running people in a unit wont look odd, and you can swap crates for rocks, skulls or whatever. Nothing marine players havent dealt with for 20+ years - I think the normal tac marine box has maybe 8 unique leg sculpts? That's the modern kit, the original mpk had maybe 4. 

 

Addendum: Don't forget the van Saar upgrade frames also, that gives you way more weapon options like lascannons, etc. You'll get more shields (refractor fields?) with the neotek kit. 

Edited May 12, 2022 by Xenith

[MrKoolPants]

Just perused the models. This project sounds awesome, and would probably cost about the same as collecting any other army, including Cadians.

 

Having hover-board dudes as Rough Riders would also be super cool. Overall, this would be a rad way to make a characterful guard army.

[GreenScorpion]

This idea has appeared before and although it took me some time to find the relevant thread, I think this could be a starting point on how it could be done:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364898-astra-militarum-van-saar-regiment/?hl=saar&do=findComment&comment=5568303

[Lord_Ikka]

This idea has appeared before and although it took me some time to find the relevant thread, I think this could be a starting point on how it could be done:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364898-astra-militarum-van-saar-regiment/?hl=saar&do=findComment&comment=5568303

Nice find! Even if there are a lot of repeat poses, the army itself looks really good and there are some nice subtle kitbashes that make the Van Saar codex compliant (chainswords, etc..). 

 

The idea of a mechanized Van Saar regiment might work well- less infantry bodies needed and fits in with the high-tech theme of the army. The idea of the Neoteks as Rough Riders is interesting, though I think having them as Sentinels would work just as well if you give them the appropriate heavy weapon slung under the grav-board's chassis. With Necromunda Ash Wastes coming out, maybe the Van Saar will get something similar to the Orlock's little quads, so an additional mechanized element would be there. I'm going to definitely keep an eye on this, though I am personally leaning towards using Wargames Atlantic Les Grognads for a "noble" regiment for my next big project, I really like this Van Saar concept. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I personally love the orlocks. I use them for veterans and just to help add variation to the otherwise boringly repetitive regular kits

[Xenith]

 

  With Necromunda Ash Wastes coming out, maybe the Van Saar will get something similar to the Orlock's little quads, so an additional mechanized element would be there. 

 

I think it's an inevitability that each warband will get some form of mechanised buggy!