GW really doesn’t know how to do bargain boxes.

[Lord_Ikka]

1 minute ago, Xenith said:

Christmas sets are often much more value, about 30 - 40% off models before you get to FLGS discounts. I think my tyranids broodswarm from a couple of years ago was ~£200 of models at rrp for £110. 

Value in money, yes- but they also sometimes suffer the weird confusion of units. The recent Primaris X-mas box (Shieldbreaker?) was stuffed full of Troops with 10 regular and 10 Assault Intercessors, plus a 5-man squad of Heavy Intercessors. With a Storm Speeder, Captain, and 3-man Bladeguard, it was definitely a value at $210 rather than the $330 normally, but it wasn't really a bundle for veteran players and $210 is a high price point for a newbie to get into a game. Now, if you wanted to start a brand-new faction, it was great, but that seems a slightly smaller market than either vets wanting more toys or newbies looking to start a new game. The other three boxes from last year were pretty good, with at least the Necron one being useful for the most part and the Death Guard having a well-rounded set of units (can't say much about the Orks as I don't own/play against them regularly, but from what I remember there wasn't any real internet complaints about that one). 

Totally agree with the HH box set being a good deal- frankly, its the best boxed set I think GW has come out with in a long time, though the other HH boxes were also pretty good. One thing that may influence that is the decision to move HH to one of their primary game lines, rather than it being essentially a "specialist" game like Blood Bowl or Necromunda. Having a really good game launch box helps with getting the game out to the players. 

[Valkyrion]

I do think some things are deliberately overpriced so as to inflate the value of the bargain boxes - e.g, Prosecutors in the Custodes vs Stealers box. There is a world of points difference and efficiency between a box of Prosecutors and a box of Custodes (about 400 points to 70!) and only a £3.50 price difference. I know the idea is to have similarly balanced forces, but Prosecutors should be £21 a box, like Space Marine Scouts, or £26 a box like Death Company. 

But overall, GW's army boxes, starter sets, battle boxes etc represent good savings and good value. That you might not like the contents is one thing, but that doesn't detract from the savings. 

[Marshal Mittens]

56 minutes ago, Lord_Ikka said:

Value in money, yes- but they also sometimes suffer the weird confusion of units. The recent Primaris X-mas box (Shieldbreaker?) was stuffed full of Troops with 10 regular and 10 Assault Intercessors, plus a 5-man squad of Heavy Intercessors. With a Storm Speeder, Captain, and 3-man Bladeguard, it was definitely a value at $210 rather than the $330 normally, but it wasn't really a bundle for veteran players and $210 is a high price point for a newbie to get into a game. Now, if you wanted to start a brand-new faction, it was great, but that seems a slightly smaller market than either vets wanting more toys or newbies looking to start a new game. 

I bought six of those shield breaker boxes for my DA and BT armies...very good value in that almost everything in then is decent. My work on my deathguard and now on my horus heresy forces has delayed the start on my new 40k DA build though. 

The age of darkness box set is an amazing value, in my opinion. Just crazy good, especially with discounts. A couple give you a massively strong core for any legion. 

[Guest]

OK this it purely subjective based on my own bias and personal opinion...

Just going to do a quick rundown on what I consider one of the worse Combat Patrols and one of the best. (Again IMHO)

My prices are based off Element Games (Which has free shipping over £80)(Prices will be rounded up/down to the nearest £1 for ease)

Blood Angels Combat Patrol (For the sake of prices the Infiltrators are the same price as Intercessors)

Primaris Librarian £21
10 Infiltrators/Incursors/Intercessors £31
3 Aggressors £28
1 Impulsor £41
2 Blood Angels Upgrade Sprues £16

Total is £137 from Element (£159 direct from GW) both with free postage... Or £79.50 (£3 postage) vs £90 for the Combat Patrol.
EDIT - For clarity and more info here is the price for Dark Sphere £126.87 (Postage is included),

 

Now 1 of the worse.

Death Guard Combat Patrol

Typhus £22
Biologus Purifier £16
30 Poxwalkers £54
7 Plague Marines £28

Total is £118 from Element (£139.50 direct from GW) both with free postage... Or £79.50 (£3 postage) vs £90 for the Combat Patrol.
EDIT - For clarity and more info here is the price for Dark Sphere £112. 23 (Postage is included),

I do think Lenvoson has some good points but overall the value of the Combat Patrols in this example is very hit and miss, but there is also my bias for Primaris as a whole which I will not hide.

I could break down each one but I think thats maybe too much work and boring? :)

The contents of the boxes is a big factor and we have boxes like the Death Guard, Thousand Sons and maybe the Tyranids one seem very poor offering.

I am also not a fan of the Sisters of Battle and Vanguard Marines ones based on they are from Army box/Box Set stuff.

I AM ALSO AWARE OF BETTER DISCOUNTS.

Edited September 23, 2022 by Brother Captain Arkley

[Emperor Ming]

There are places with a better discount than element

[Guest]

Just now, Emperor Ming said:

There are places with a better discount than element

I know that... But I when for ease of free shipping. Dark Sphere etc etc... But screw Wayland.

[Slave to Darkness]

3 hours ago, Valkia the Bloody said:

What is the deal with these Tzaangors? Never read about them in the old lore. And I do not like the design!

In 1st edition they were just Tzeentch marked Beastmen. We had Khorngor, Slangor, Tzaangors and Pestigor. 

[Karhedron]

The first question is whether GW can shift sufficient stock at the prices they charge. If they can, there is not much incentive for discounts. If they cannot, then cuts might be more helpful than bundles.

The second question is what is the purpose of bundles. Are they to shift excess stock of unit X? Are they to create entry points at particular price levels (birthday and Christmas presents from parents/grandparents etc)? Some mix of the above?

I am sure GW could put together better value bundles more regularly if they wanted but without knowing their rationale for particular sets, we can't really judge if it is in their interests to do so. I am sure it would be in ours but that is not really the question.

[Slave to Darkness]

As for other companies doing better sets than GW, They need the customers more, GW dont need any help, people will buy their products regardless. 

[Guest]

46 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

The first question is whether GW can shift sufficient stock at the prices they charge. If they can, there is not much incentive for discounts. If they cannot, then cuts might be more helpful than bundles.

The second question is what is the purpose of bundles. Are they to shift excess stock of unit X? Are they to create entry points at particular price levels (birthday and Christmas presents from parents/grandparents etc)? Some mix of the above?

I am sure GW could put together better value bundles more regularly if they wanted but without knowing their rationale for particular sets, we can't really judge if it is in their interests to do so. I am sure it would be in ours but that is not really the question.

I think the Combat Patrols that recycle a box set or army box are bad value too.

In my example I was also factoring stock availability... I much prefer Dark Sphere most of the time but they tend to be out of stock for certain things, or limited numbers and don't get me started on their price for shipping rattle cans.

[Special Officer Doofy]

9 hours ago, Brother Captain Arkley said:

 Now 1 of the worse.

Death Guard Combat Patrol

You mean THE worst? You can't even bring the whole box in a combat patrol haha.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

The argument “just cuz you/they/people don’t like /want some of the minis in the box doesn’t make it a bad value.”

I mean it kinda does lol.

a box of 8 guillimans for the price of 5 guillimans might be huge savings over buying 8 individually but guess what no one really wants an extra 7 guillimans so buying a box with 8 is a trash value box.

[Bryan Blaire]

GW may also purposefully make less “optimal” boxes than most want because they have data that shows that people will buy them because they are a “deal,” even if a sub-optimal one - just the fact that they are a savings entices people to pick them up if they want the majority of the contents, etc.  It being a “deal” can even entice people to spend more “because I can afford it now because of the deal.”

[Khornestar]

I would very much love to see some sales statistics, though there are realistically only a few plausible explanations for why they do x or y with their discount/bundle boxes.

Nothing less impressive than the “save you two clicks” bundles, so IMO even if box contents aren’t ideal, getting a discount is still something. 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I am very happy with the Black Templar box set they released to intro the new codex and kit.

[Valkia the Bloody]

7 hours ago, Bryan Blaire said:

GW may also purposefully make less “optimal” boxes than most want because they have data that shows that people will buy them because they are a “deal,” even if a sub-optimal one - just the fact that they are a savings entices people to pick them up if they want the majority of the contents, etc.  It being a “deal” can even entice people to spend more “because I can afford it now because of the deal.”

I actually think this is a valid strategy.

Our local GW does not have too many things in storage...

so when I went to buy 10 Necron Immortals, they only had one box, but offered me the patrol box, which also had the lord and "the other things you can sell on and save money".

So guess what? I bought the patrol box. But kept and painted all the models in it, even if I do not like the design of the tomb blades.

[Xenith]

21 hours ago, Brother Captain Arkley said:

Death Guard Combat Patrol

Typhus £22
Biologus Purifier £16
20 Poxwalkers £36
7 Plague Marines £28

Total is £100 from Element (£118.50 direct from GW)

Just a correction, the DG combat patrol actually has 30 poxwalkers at an RRP of £21 for 10 rrp or £18 (rounded up) for 10 from element. So the DG set is £118 from element separately, or £76.50 as a combat patrol, a saving of 36% off element prices, or a decent 45% off GW RRP. 

 

On 9/21/2022 at 9:42 PM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Maybe I’m misremembering and generally salty at GW’s pricing but it seems like this box is a better value than indomitus was

I think this is what it boils down to really. The two character only frames from Indo retail at (an overinflated) ~£160. The indo box was £125 from GW. The rulebook is £40 so £85 for the models. Youre getting all of the other models in the boxed set, for the price of the necron royal court at RRP +£5

Indomitus characters (2x chaps, erads, bladeguard,  - 90
Captain 24
Lt 18
intercessors 37.50
outriders 37.50

Necron characters - 70
Lord 18
Lt 18 
skorpekhs 35
20 warriors 60 

Rulebook - 42.50

I make that to £450.50.

You got that for £125. I make that to be a 72% saving of £325 over buying separately. 

Coversely the set you describe, $145 with $60 off rrp is a 30% discount, less than half the discount GW was doing. 

 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Xenith said:

Just a correction, the DG combat patrol actually has 30 poxwalkers at an RRP of £21 for 10 rrp or £18 (rounded up) for 10 from element. So the DG set is £118 from element separately, or £76.50 as a combat patrol, a saving of 36% off element prices, or a decent 45% off GW RRP. 

Nice catch - Edited.

[MegaVolt87]

Any combat patrol that includes a vehicle, said vehicle is essentially free. But Indomitus box, those are cheaper bundles vs buying the individual units such as the primaris bikers. The HH box is at least 1500pts of stuff, it's a good buy I think. A lot of extra add ones are out, so it can be expanded out. It's a mixed bag with the box sets, some are good others not. 

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

11 hours ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

You mean THE worst? You can't even bring the whole box in a combat patrol haha.

Why not?

[Halandaar]

Raw savings vs RRP is the only way to objectively rate the boxes, no? I mean it's fairly obvious that whether or not the contents are useful to you will vary wildly from one player to the next. I don't really have a lot of interest in Orks, for example. Doesn't mean every box containing them is bad value just because I personally don't want them.

[Cpt.Danjou]

23 hours ago, Lord Nord said:

Why not?

Because you need at least two core units to bring that many poxwalkers, and you only get one. The largest units of Poxwalkers are 20, so that is two units of them. There is only one legal unit of core in the box, the plague marines.

The Dg box is up here with the 1k sons as the worst box. Why even throw in a named character? Sure you can use Typhus as something else, the 1k boxat least have character that can be used several times in a list, but why the goats and no Rubrics are a bit puzzling. 

Now I am off to get me a Sontara, errr, Vontann  box.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

22 hours ago, Halandaar said:

Raw savings vs RRP is the only way to objectively rate the boxes, no? I mean it's fairly obvious that whether or not the contents are useful to you will vary wildly from one player to the next. I don't really have a lot of interest in Orks, for example. Doesn't mean every box containing them is bad value just because I personally don't want them.

Sure it will vary, but boxes with a clear unified theme is likely to provide a better value than a box with an eclectic choice of units.

a box set that includes a gravis captain, aggressors, HIs, inceptors, and a redemptor dread makes more sense and will likely appeal to more people as a good value than something like the BA CP box, which had units that didn’t really seem to unify bin any way.

i got it, because I’m a BA player and it came out shortly after I came back to the game, but I haven’t even built the Phobos unit, and I’ve only used the impulsor in one game since 8th because vehicles and that one in particular is so bad, that the only real value I’ve gotten out of that box was the aggressors and intercessors.  The Libby was a mixed bag for me.

same goes for a box that’s focused around Phobos. A straight Phobos box set will be a better value to people who want to build a Phobos focused army.

same for a tactitus armor. Captain, intercessors, hellblasters, BGVs, and a dread would likely end up being a great value. 

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

11 hours ago, Cpt.Danjou said:

Because you need at least two core units to bring that many poxwalkers, and you only get one. The largest units of Poxwalkers are 20, so that is two units of them. There is only one legal unit of core in the box, the plague marines.

Ah yes, I blanked on the stupid CORE restriction. I have to assume these Combat Patrol boxes - at least the early ones, which would include the Death Guard box - were initially put together under the 8th-Ed guidelines and when the rules team added on the CORE layer, the product team just couldn't get the approval to pull out ten Poxwalkers and add in another squad of Plague Marines, if there was even time to do so.

Edited September 24, 2022 by Lord Nord

[Halandaar]

6 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Sure it will vary, but boxes with a clear unified theme is likely to provide a better value than a box with an eclectic choice of units.

a box set that includes a gravis captain, aggressors, HIs, inceptors, and a redemptor dread makes more sense and will likely appeal to more people as a good value than something like the BA CP box, which had units that didn’t really seem to unify bin any way.

i got it, because I’m a BA player and it came out shortly after I came back to the game, but I haven’t even built the Phobos unit, and I’ve only used the impulsor in one game since 8th because vehicles and that one in particular is so bad, that the only real value I’ve gotten out of that box was the aggressors and intercessors.  The Libby was a mixed bag for me.

same goes for a box that’s focused around Phobos. A straight Phobos box set will be a better value to people who want to build a Phobos focused army.

same for a tactitus armor. Captain, intercessors, hellblasters, BGVs, and a dread would likely end up being a great value. 

But again, it's subjective. Your proposed all-Gravis box is of limited appeal to me because I don't need more Aggressors or Inceptors or Redemptors. Same for the Tacticus one because I don't need Intercessors or Bladeguard.

Something that you might view as a weird combination of units might be the perfect set of things I'm looking to add to my collection, whereas a "themed" box is no use to me if I only want one of the kits in it.