Favorite Units in the New Codex

[L30n1d4s]

Lots of reveals/reviews are officially out now (I guess the leaks the Maordian Glory had for weeks were very accurate), so what units are you most excited about in the new Codex?

 

 

The ones that have me the most interested are:

 

-Leman Russes (especially Battle Cannon with the new version of "Gatekeeper," Executioner for sweet S8 AP-4 Dmg3, and Vanquisher, with its ability to ignore Invuls and do MWs)

-Rough Riders (with Lord Solar support for full re-rolls -- I am not sure there is a unit in the game that survive a charge from them with full re-rolls and the "Fix Bayonets" order active)

-Heavy Weapon Teams (with Creed support... +1 to hit, -1AP, +1S, and re-rolls of 1s to hit make them quite tasty)

-Kasrkyn (MW producing machines, plus the option to do dismount, shoot, re-mount shenanigans)

-Deathstrikes (I am in the military in real life and they do what we call "terrain denial" missions very effectively)

-Basilisks (with Master of Ordnance for rerolls of 1s, Vox Caster/Expert Bombadier for +1 to hit, and D6+3 shots at S10 AP-3 Dmg2... take that, Armour of Contempt!)

-Scout Sentinels (with the ability to Infiltrate 9" away from enemy DZs and move block, grab objectives, tie shooty units up in melee turn 1, etc.)

-Command Squads with Ogryn Bodyguard (for T5 2+ saves and -1 Dmg), Astropaths for CP generation, and the Relic Banner (for re-rolls of 1s to Wound, plus ignore any negative modifiers for Shooting and any ways that ignore/cap wounds... here is looking at you Gazghkull, C'Tan, Pheonix Lords, etc.)

 

 

I am also excited about the new Orders (all 3 types), the new Rogal Dorn tank, and the improved Valkyrie stat line/abilities. Overall, it looks like an excellent book, quite competitive and flavorful for the Guard, but not overdone (like, say, Dark Eldar or AdMech or Iron Hands when they first launched).

 

The only thing I am waiting for with baited breath is the rulings on the Balance Dataslate. I am quite certain Hammer of the Emperor will go away (since Born Soldiers replaces it) and I think  it is very likely that AM vehicles will lose Armour of Contempt (since they are all much better and that is really a Power Armour type of thing), but the one that I think has a chance of remaining is their "immunity" to the indirect fire nerfs. If Guard artillery still gets to shoot at full effect, I will be exceptionally happy, since I have 5 Basilisks, a Wyvern, and a Manticore all waiting in the wings.

 

 

How about you, fellow Guard Commanders.... what do you like most about the new codex?

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by L30n1d4s

[Emperor Ming]

Looking forward to cheaper heavy bolter and hvy flamer sponsons

 

Ogryns look decent, along with the manticore being d3. 

 

Kasarkin as well, 100 is a decent cost

 

Personally, I think the lord solar is a trap, 3 orders without vox, you need a decent amount of units to be within 6, otherwise its a waste, also if you play on a board with a decent amount of ruins, hes not infantry so may get impeded by terrain. 

 

Command squads with bodyguards may be important for getting to the middle with the banner for boots on the ground

 

The limit on castellans is funny, would anyone spam them anyway

 

Master vox in a command squad is really useful now, shame the officer is only order 1, It would have been nice to have a cc option for the command squad

Edited November 14, 2022 by Emperor Ming

[INKS]

I am an infantry heavy person, but I like the Cavalry and the new bombard units. I like indirect fire. I don't know that they work so well into an infantry heavy list but we'll see I guess. I'll probably use lord solar as well. 3 order is pretty good. Oh and I have to have one of the new Dorns. I think only 1 but 1 should be enough.

 

I'll probably rock out 120 Infantry. command squad, lord solar. 

heavy bombardment units with creed? 

Kasrkin with the teleport relic. 1 meaty squad 

1 Dorn

2 Leman Russes. 

I feel like that isn't going to fit in 2k and I'll have to make some cuts but we'll see.

Maybe Rough riders if I can fit them.

I am going to literally shove guard down my opponents throat until their army chokes on them. lol

 

 

Edit: What is gatekeeper? a battle cannon or something else? how do I represent it?

Edited November 14, 2022 by INKS

[L30n1d4s]

Relic Battle Cannon:

 

Hvy 6+D3 S9 AP -3 Dmg3

 

It gives more shots (normal BC is Hvy 3+D6), +1S, and -1AP, so a very significant improvement over the base weapon.

 

[duz_]

ROUGH RIDERS! 

[INKS]

Ok so I want one Russ with that battle cannon and one with a Vanq for the ingore inv saves

[Emperor Ming]

I wouldn't be so sure on the vanquisher, 1 shot that's hits on a 3

 

Even with a free reroll and marker lights tau hammerheads are very hitty missy and the vanquisher gets neither a free reroll or marker drones

 

Unless I'm missing something?

[Sawtooth]

I like the Dorn though I'm still reading opinions on it, I hope it lives up to the GW hype and curious how it will slot in between the Baneblade and Leman Russ.

Kasrkin just look really fun :)

[INKS]

30 minutes ago, Emperor Ming said:

I wouldn't be so sure on the vanquisher, 1 shot that's hits on a 3

 

Even with a free reroll and marker lights tau hammerheads are very hitty missy and the vanquisher gets neither a free reroll or marker drones

 

Unless I'm missing something?

There is a start to reroll, but yeah that costs a CP

 

[L30n1d4s]

Well, Vanquishers with the Elite Sharpshooters trait get a free reroll, which is all they need (only one shot). Since the Vanquisher Cannon is a Turret Weapon, it shoots at BS3+ naturally, unlike a Hammerhand, which needs a Markerlight to get up to 3+. If you don't go Elite Sharpshooters, then you can use Tank Orders to reroll 1s to Hit, giving you an average 77% to hit with the Vanquisher Cannon.

 

Also, at only 155 points, T8, and a 2+ save, they are quite tough for their durability vis-a-vis Hammerheads (add in the "Master of Camouflage" Tank Ace Trait and it now has a 1+ save against shooting at over 12" away). Finally, you can cast Nightshroud on it, meaning enemy units can only hit it on a roll of 4-6 (1-3 always fails), so even more durable. Bottom line, unlike a Hammerhand, there is a real chance you can make your LR Vanquisher last through multiple rounds of enemy return fire.

Edited November 14, 2022 by L30n1d4s

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

FOBs, and the dorn probably.

[INKS]

2 hours ago, L30n1d4s said:

Well, Vanquishers with the Elite Sharpshooters trait get a free reroll, which is all they need (only one shot). Since the Vanquisher Cannon is a Turret Weapon, it shoots at BS3+ naturally, unlike a Hammerhand, which needs a Markerlight to get up to 3+. If you don't go Elite Sharpshooters, then you can use Tank Orders to reroll 1s to Hit, giving you an average 77% to hit with the Vanquisher Cannon.

 

Also, at only 155 points, T8, and a 2+ save, they are quite tough for their durability vis-a-vis Hammerheads (add in the "Master of Camouflage" Tank Ace Trait and it now has a 1+ save against shooting at over 12" away). Finally, you can cast Nightshroud on it, meaning enemy units can only hit it on a roll of 4-6 (1-3 always fails), so even more durable. Bottom line, unlike a Hammerhand, there is a real chance you can make your LR Vanquisher last through multiple rounds of enemy return fire.

The enemy will be busy eating my 120 infantry. hehe

[INKS]

Think I have it roughly mapped out

Leontus

Troops 120

Dorn battle tank

2 Russ's 

Kasrkin

Creed

Command Squad

2 Commissars

2 Sentinels

 

something like that. The Sentinel is a new kit isn't it?

 

Normally I love Artillery but I think it's a little weak unless you are going all in on it

Ogryn / Bullgryn - All I keep hearing is how you want to give these guys regimental orders, no room sadly.

Rough riders - I see them as a missile unit. No points sadly and I think the Kasrkin are better if I have the CP to equip them properly. Which, with 120 troops I might not. I may have to sacrifice troops in order to pay for the CP I need. I really don't want to do that. 60 troops isn't enough.

Edited November 14, 2022 by INKS

[War of the Eagle]

-Commisairs are useful again

-Vanquishers are good

-I can make a commisair tank

-sentinals are pretty good + core (buffable)

-Baneblades seam usable

-I'll miss regiment specific WLT and relics but I like that I can take anything from the codex in my army like Sly Marbo, or in my case "Slick Rick".

[sairence]

The age of the Leman Russ has come. Fear our mighty tanks!

[librisrouge]

Anybody who doesn't say rough riders is objectively wrong. Don't get me wrong, I respect their opinion and right to have an opinion. A horrible, objectively incorrect, opinion.

[Karhedron]

12 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

FOBs, and the dorn probably.

 

OK, feeling slightly silly now but what does FOB stand for? I keep seeing people mentioning it but I can't figure out what it stands for. 

 

Agree on the Dorn though. Given the current anti-tank meta is mostly melta weapons, I think there is value in spamming T9. Melta now only wounds on a 5+ and even Lascannons need 4s.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Honestly I’m just happy they made so many viable ways to play the army.

[Sawtooth]

10 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

 

OK, feeling slightly silly now but what does FOB stand for? I keep seeing people mentioning it but I can't figure out what it stands for. 

 

Field Ordnance Battery :)

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I feel like citing legacy units is cheating…

[ppmi]

15 hours ago, Emperor Ming said:

I wouldn't be so sure on the vanquisher, 1 shot that's hits on a 3

 

Even with a free reroll and marker lights tau hammerheads are very hitty missy and the vanquisher gets neither a free reroll or marker drones

 

Unless I'm missing something?

It hits directly on 3s and there are regimental traits for the rerrol

[OldWherewolf]

I can see the Balance Dataslate staying.  CSM kept AoC when their codex came out, and right now, Guard  (IMHO) is about equivalent to CSM with the dataslate, and if our arty takes the indirect penalty you'll never see them in matched play again. 

• Without AoC, LRBT durability goes down (even with the extra wound)
• At a baseline, guard firepower goes down in the new codex, but with HotE and the new orders it gets slightly better.  The real win is that output become far more consistent.
• Manti's & Basilisks are ~25% worse than a similarly priced LRBT.  With the indirect penalty, they'll be ~50% worse, and far worse than they are today (and they are waaayyy overpriced today).  Literally, Manticores would hit on BS5 and be AP0 into AOC.
• I can easily see us keeping HotE, but that becomes a subset of Born Soldiers.  Like we keep HotE (which just auto-wounds on 6s), then Born Solders becomes 6s to hit auto wound and it's other benefits.  Then we can use Born Soldiers in addition to other traits. 
• I do see Kasrkin getting nerfed to 6MW max, rather than 6MW per target unit.  Realistically, this is what it should be for 1CP.
• Vanquishers are ok, but we can take them in volume, as 1 Vanq won't do much, but with 6 of them hitting on 3s re-rolling 1s can wreak havok (but 900 points of anything should wreak havoc)
• It sucks that Hellhounds can't be taken in squadrons, and Sentinels & Rough Riders are smoking hot, which means our already cramped FA slots have no room for hellhounds
• We actually have a TON of kewl strats, but not enough CP to really use them. 

But one of the biggest wins is that we now can have multiple builds, meaning our opponents don't know what's coming, and may not have a pre-set game plan against us, plus our ability to really mess with their game plan (Barbicant's key, 12" zone denial, plus pushing Flamers of Tzeench deep strikes and 1-of-3 BA turn 2 charges until turn 3...)

 

Speaking of messing with game plans...  did I mention the Finial banner?    Now we just have to decide what's near it...

[Tallarn Commander]

I second Duz and say "Rough Riders!"

 

With Tallarn heads from Maxmini: https://maxminishop.com/products/desert-dwellers-heads-10

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

25 minutes ago, OldWherewolf said:

I can see the Balance Dataslate staying.  CSM kept AoC when their codex came out, and right now, Guard  (IMHO) is about equivalent to CSM with the dataslate, and if our arty takes the indirect penalty you'll never see them in matched play again. 

• Without AoC, LRBT durability goes down (even with the extra wound)
• At a baseline, guard firepower goes down in the new codex, but with HotE and the new orders it gets slightly better.  The real win is that output become far more consistent.
• Manti's & Basilisks are ~25% worse than a similarly priced LRBT.  With the indirect penalty, they'll be ~50% worse, and far worse than they are today (and they are waaayyy overpriced today).  Literally, Manticores would hit on BS5 and be AP0 into AOC.
• I can easily see us keeping HotE, but that becomes a subset of Born Soldiers.  Like we keep HotE (which just auto-wounds on 6s), then Born Solders becomes 6s to hit auto wound and it's other benefits.  Then we can use Born Soldiers in addition to other traits. 
• I do see Kasrkin getting nerfed to 6MW max, rather than 6MW per target unit.  Realistically, this is what it should be for 1CP.
• Vanquishers are ok, but we can take them in volume, as 1 Vanq won't do much, but with 6 of them hitting on 3s re-rolling 1s can wreak havok (but 900 points of anything should wreak havoc)
• It sucks that Hellhounds can't be taken in squadrons, and Sentinels & Rough Riders are smoking hot, which means our already cramped FA slots have no room for hellhounds
• We actually have a TON of kewl strats, but not enough CP to really use them. 

But one of the biggest wins is that we now can have multiple builds, meaning our opponents don't know what's coming, and may not have a pre-set game plan against us, plus our ability to really mess with their game plan (Barbicant's key, 12" zone denial, plus pushing Flamers of Tzeench deep strikes and 1-of-3 BA turn 2 charges until turn 3...)

 

Speaking of messing with game plans...  did I mention the Finial banner?    Now we just have to decide what's near it...

Speaking of messing with opponent on their turn.

mech + mount up strat can really sucker some melee armies hard.

after they announce and roll their charge and move their models in, mount up. 
leaves the enemy 3” from the transport and the unit it’s carrying that can unload next turn, and dump fire into the unit that charged.

[sairence]

I'd be surprised if we keep the dataslate. I'm not going to play it until full release and probably the next update, personally. HotE is definitely gone, Born Soldiers is just a straight upgrade for it. AoC might, but we also have multiple ways to hand out invuns to vehicles now + an upgrade against D1 weapons etc. Same with the indirect penalty, we have ways built in to counter it. 

 

So obviously I don't know, but I'd be surprised. :)