Blast markers, rerolls and gets hot!

[Vostroi]

If I have a unit of HSS with Plasma Cannons firing while in sight of a nuncio-vox, does the reroll to my scatter effect my chances to gets hot? 

 

"If a model has the ability to reroll it's rolls To Hit (including because of BS6+ or the Twin Linked special rule) a wound is only suffered if the To Hit reroll is a 1; it may also reroll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit"

 

It seems clear enough if the weapon is Twin-Linked but I am uncertain about the interaction with the nuncio Vox reroll. Thank you

[SkimaskMohawk]

It covers any source of reroll; twinlinked is just an example of a common reroll. So yea, plasma cannons gain a lot of benefit from nuncio.

[General Zodd]

37 minutes ago, SkimaskMohawk said:

It covers any source of reroll; twinlinked is just an example of a common reroll. So yea, plasma cannons gain a lot of benefit from nuncio.

I’m not sure it’s that clean cut, unfortunately. I’ll break down my thinking;

Rulebook page 239; “Gets Hot and Re-rolls” states that a model with the ability to reroll ‘To Hit’ rolls may also reroll their ‘Gets Hot’ roll for weapons where they don’t roll ‘To Hit’.

 

Rulebook page 234; “Blast Weapons and Re-rolls” explains that a model with the ability to reroll ‘To Hit’ rolls instead rerolls the Scatter dice and 2D6 used for the Scatter process outlined on page 152.

 

Liber Astartes/Hereticus page 145; under Nuncio Vox, states that a Blast weapon targeting something the model with the Nuncio Vox has line of sight to may reroll any Scatter rolls made.

 

Now you could argue that the Scatter roll for a Blast weapon is inherently replacing the To Hit roll for all Blast weapons, and therefore everything proceeds as if they were one and the same, in which case yes, you could reroll your Gets Hot rolls as well.

 

However, you could also read it that the Scatter reroll can be gained from one of two sources. Firstly, being able to reroll your To Hit roll, or secondly by having a friendly Nuncio Vox in the correct position. In which case the Gets Hot rule only mentions Scatter rerolls derived from rules affecting ‘To Hit’ rolls, which the Nuncio Vox makes no reference to. If that’s the case, the Gets Hit roll would not be rerolled due to a Nuncio Vox.

 

I’m not particularly wedded to either interpretation, but I thought it was worth mentioning.

[Cactus]

Thank you saving me the effort of looking up the nuncio vox rule.

 

An ability to reroll the scatter dice is not an "ability to reroll 'To Hit' rolls". The nuncio vox doesn't protect against gets hot.

[Vostroi]

To me it seems that nuncio gets you to reroll the scatter roll post gets hot roll.

[SkimaskMohawk]

47 minutes ago, General Zodd said:

I’m not sure it’s that clean cut, unfortunately. I’ll break down my thinking;

Rulebook page 239; “Gets Hot and Re-rolls” states that a model with the ability to reroll ‘To Hit’ rolls may also reroll their ‘Gets Hot’ roll for weapons where they don’t roll ‘To Hit’.

 

Rulebook page 234; “Blast Weapons and Re-rolls” explains that a model with the ability to reroll ‘To Hit’ rolls instead rerolls the Scatter dice and 2D6 used for the Scatter process outlined on page 152.

 

Liber Astartes/Hereticus page 145; under Nuncio Vox, states that a Blast weapon targeting something the model with the Nuncio Vox has line of sight to may reroll any Scatter rolls made.

 

Now you could argue that the Scatter roll for a Blast weapon is inherently replacing the To Hit roll for all Blast weapons, and therefore everything proceeds as if they were one and the same, in which case yes, you could reroll your Gets Hot rolls as well.

 

However, you could also read it that the Scatter reroll can be gained from one of two sources. Firstly, being able to reroll your To Hit roll, or secondly by having a friendly Nuncio Vox in the correct position. In which case the Gets Hot rule only mentions Scatter rerolls derived from rules affecting ‘To Hit’ rolls, which the Nuncio Vox makes no reference to. If that’s the case, the Gets Hit roll would not be rerolled due to a Nuncio Vox.

 

I’m not particularly wedded to either interpretation, but I thought it was worth mentioning.

 

Ya that's definitely a good call out, and something I didn't realize.

 

I think RAW it plays out to not granting rerolls on the gets hot, as it is specifically a reroll on any scatter roll instead of a To Hit.

 

I don't really know if you can even argue intent, since the wording of the nuncio includes deep striking, which is completely outside shooting rerolls.

 

So ya, changing my answer to no, no gets hot rerolls from nuncio. It's still good for the plasmas though.

[Xenith]

It's more simple than that I think - p239 blast weapons and rerolls:

 

"weapons that do not roll to hit (such as blast weapons) must roll a d6 for each shot immediately before firing. On a 2+..."

 

The Gets Hot roll for blast weapons is not part of the normal to hit roll sequence, and occurs in it's own step before the weapon fires (makes a to hit roll) so things that allow rerolls to hit won't affect it. 

[SkimaskMohawk]

10 hours ago, Xenith said:

It's more simple than that I think - p239 blast weapons and rerolls:

 

"weapons that do not roll to hit (such as blast weapons) must roll a d6 for each shot immediately before firing. On a 2+..."

 

The Gets Hot roll for blast weapons is not part of the normal to hit roll sequence, and occurs in it's own step before the weapon fires (makes a to hit roll) so things that allow rerolls to hit won't affect it. 

 

The very next paragraph explicitly says rerolls to hit allow blast weapons (and other weapons that don't roll to hit) to reroll the gets hot 1. Hence, the conversation about nuncios not granting a reroll to hit, but a reroll to any scatter dice. 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2023 by SkimaskMohawk

[Xenith]

That'll teach me! I appreciate the thoroughness of you guys!