WH40k game Indomitus Terminators

[Halandaar]

38 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

This sounds good on paper, but just doesn't end up well in practise. We're not dealing with humans shrunk down. We're dealing with plastic models. Changing the size of some models just make some models look too short. We got different arm options and poses and weapons to glue on. Should some arms and legs and be shorter too? This has never been done (intentionally anyway, im sure some ancient kits could have been wildly varying) in any GW kit ever. All the marines of of 2012 tactical kit are the same height. The very cocurrent assault kit is very much the same scale, as are the vanguard, sternguard kits etc. 

 

18 minutes ago, Orange Knight said:

We can't make a bunch of different sized models like this. If you think about it, a random box of Guardsmen would have more size differences. One will be tall and lanky, another could be short and squat, etc. It will make it even harder to pose/convert the models than it already is.

 

These would be the "very good scale modelling reason" I was referring to in my post. That said now that kits are moving away from complete modularity and towards predetermined poses there's no reason specific models (and their specific optional poses) couldn't have slightly more size variation to them. We have actually already seen a couple of examples on human models where female models are visibly different from males in the same unit, and as such only certain parts work together without looking a bit off (and in Warcry there are even models from entirely different races in the same unit).

 

Yes, in some circumstances it would make kitbashing harder and I hear that. I'm not even particularly saying it's something I would like to see. I guess I just find it odd that we're talking about the size difference between genetically-modified individuals wearing mass produced all-enclosing armour suits that can obscure their natural size/silhouette, but not between any two Orks, or two Kroot, or two Guardsmen wearing essentially some cargo trousers and a t-shirt.

[Frogian]

Agree that a volkite heavy weapon would be cool (or hot, rather) - don't think they need any changes otherwise. Flamer/AC/Cyclone + power fists/chain fists/power sword (possibly a power axe if they are all the same profile anyway in 10th), then lightning claws and TH+SS

 

Imagine we'll get separate normal/assault box after the ETB ones, hopefully the assault ones are a bit more dynamic in pose - or the kit is sufficient to pose them as such if they they do the same sprue for the bodies/legs.  

 

Edited March 30, 2023 by Frogian

[Marshal Reinhard]

15 minutes ago, Halandaar said:

 

 

These would be the "very good scale modelling reason" I was referring to in my post. That said now that kits are moving away from complete modularity and towards predetermined poses there's no reason specific models (and their specific optional poses) couldn't have slightly more size variation to them. We have actually already seen a couple of examples on human models where female models are visibly different from males in the same unit, and as such only certain parts work together without looking a bit off (and in Warcry there are even models from entirely different races in the same unit).

 

Yes, in some circumstances it would make kitbashing harder and I hear that. I'm not even particularly saying it's something I would like to see. I guess I just find it odd that we're talking about the size difference between genetically-modified individuals wearing mass produced all-enclosing armour suits that can obscure their natural size/silhouette, but not between any two Orks, or two Kroot, or two Guardsmen wearing essentially some cargo trousers and a t-shirt.

 

I could stretch it as far as: in a sea of  otherwise identically heighted models having a model every now and then which is notably larger would probably trigger a positive response "oh cool, that guy's a giant". The same would not be true of the opposite. Any noticeably shorter model would just stick out like a sore thumb.

 

Anyway, I clearly feel strongly about this. I just don't want any marinelets among my force of highly engineered, growth curated super soldier monsters. I'm not actually realistically worried that GW will suddenly start introducing wildly inconsistantly sized models within the very same squad. But I'm clearly not convincing anyone who wants it either so I'll just bow out of this particular side discussion with "it won't happen".

Edited March 30, 2023 by Marshal Reinhard

[Petitioner's City]

20 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Just saw this on warhammerofficial instagram

 

 

Yeah the video in yesterday's also features other non-first founding chapters rather prominently :)

[WARMASTER_]

31 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Just saw this on warhammerofficial instagram

 

I know some people don’t like it but to me bare heads with rebreathers look so good on terminators 

[appiah4]

57 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Just saw this on warhammerofficial instagram

 

 

First time I've seen Exorcists feature in any official GW material since 3E codex I think.  This makes me so happy for some reason, I can't really explain it..

[Cyrox]

7 minutes ago, appiah4 said:

 

First time I've seen Exorcists feature in any official GW material since 3E codex I think.  This makes me so happy for some reason, I can't really explain it..

 

They got the full Index Astartes treatment in a White Dwarf 462 not so long back, if you are an Exorcists fan you will like that, was pretty decent

 

EDIT - found it

 

WarCom article

Edited March 30, 2023 by Cyrox
Found info

[Lysimachus]

I don't dislike the Sgt at all... but if I was running a squad and wasn't planning to run a TDA Captain with them, I might be inclined to use the Captain as the Sgt? Same loadout, just a bit more bling?

[Brother Casman]

Mmm, that Exorcist shows that the new Terminators will look good as Blood Ravens.

[Redcomet]

Marks art is just the best. So atmospheric and beautiful. 

1 hour ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Just saw this on warhammerofficial instagram

 

They just look incredibly good fun to paint 

[Captain Idaho]

You know, @tangoalphatwo has brought up a very good point. If Terminator armour is easily utilised by Primaris, why did they cannibalise Calgar's armour to make a lighter, weaker armour?

 

It does make no sense, unless the logical reason was Gravis armour was intended all along to be a replacement of Terminator Armour (not including the rules in game necessarily)?

 

Certainly, this is a new change in direction for GW's IP on the armour, though when they made the decision we can't be sure.

 

I never like Gravis armoured Calgar anyway, but now he seems just wrong and in need of a retcon to a new Terminator clad version. 

 

I do however love the Terminators being faithful to the older ones.

 

(Yes I would have preferred a heavier gothic styling to GW Space Marines long ago, but that's not where we're at and hasn't been like since yonks ago)

 

 

[Mandragola]

It's odd that they've gone for such identical poses on those terminators. The 5 ultramarines are perfect duplicates of the six other schemes they've done, apart from that one bare head. You'd think they might at least swap the occasional storm bolter or power fist arm.

[Cleon]

1 hour ago, WARMASTER_ said:

I know some people don’t like it but to me bare heads with rebreathers look so good on terminators 

You're not wrong, they look cool, but for me the Terminator Bulldog helmet is too iconic to pass up on for me outside characters.

[Marshal Reinhard]

3 minutes ago, Mandragola said:

It's odd that they've gone for such identical poses on those terminators. The 5 ultramarines are perfect duplicates of the six other schemes they've done, apart from that one bare head. You'd think they might at least swap the occasional storm bolter or power fist arm.

Nothing odd about it. This is not a multipart kit. It's ETB style models with identical poses. Start boxes are always like this. Mixed sprues. Keeps costs down. Contributing factor that starter boxes tend to be such good deals comparatively.

[appiah4]

34 minutes ago, Cyrox said:

 

They got the full Index Astartes treatment in a White Dwarf 462 not so long back, if you are an Exorcists fan you will like that, was pretty decent

 

EDIT - found it

 

WarCom article

I like them a lot.  I paint Blood Angels and between 2000-2010 I have at times been torn about repurposing them as Exorcists more than one time.  To this day my whole army lacks decals, just in case LOL.  I would love to get a copy of this copy of White Dwarf indeed..

Edited March 30, 2023 by appiah4

[lansalt]

4 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

It does make no sense, unless the logical reason was Gravis armour was intended all along to be a replacement of Terminator Armour (not including the rules in game necessarily)?

It has to be this. GW clearly intended for Gravis to become the new Terminators, but they've decided to not phase out the old designs. Maybe because of fan backslash, or the rise of nostagia-hammer since Primaris were released, who knows.

In any case, characters like Calgar in Gravis should get compatible keywords and abilities to make them usable with terminators. It's stupid that he or Tor Garadon can't deep strike along terminators, for example.

[Captain Idaho]

11 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

You know, @tangoalphatwo has brought up a very good point. If Terminator armour is easily utilised by Primaris, why did they cannibalise Calgar's armour to make a lighter, weaker armour?

 

It does make no sense, unless the logical reason was Gravis armour was intended all along to be a replacement of Terminator Armour (not including the rules in game necessarily)?

 

Certainly, this is a new change in direction for GW's IP on the armour, though when they made the decision we can't be sure.

 

I never like Gravis armoured Calgar anyway, but now he seems just wrong and in need of a retcon to a new Terminator clad version. 

 

I do however love the Terminators being faithful to the older ones.

 

(Yes I would have preferred a heavier gothic styling to GW Space Marines long ago, but that's not where we're at and hasn't been like since yonks ago)

 

 

 

Adding to my thoughts here, the Terminator aesthetic is so iconic it seems like it might be a little at odds with fitting the Primaris range. I think the MKX stuff works well enough, even the modern Gravis (i.e. Heavy Intercessors, not Aggressors) but many of the Phobos range just seems a little less 40K alongside these classic Terminators?

 

I'd be interested to hear the opinions on this in particular from folk who only got into the hobby with Primaris, as they aren't necessarily "corrupted" by theme from ages past, the art up ahead a prime example.

[Marshal Reinhard]

13 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

but now he seems just wrong and in need of a retcon to a new Terminator clad version. 

Not happening. I assume you're stuck with the current version for at least a couple of decades.

[Captain Idaho]

3 minutes ago, lansalt said:

It has to be this. GW clearly intended for Gravis to become the new Terminators, but they've decided to not phase out the old designs. Maybe because of fan backslash, or the rise of nostagia-hammer since Primaris were released, who knows.

In any case, characters like Calgar in Gravis should get compatible keywords and abilities to make them usable with terminators. It's stupid that he or Tor Garadon can't deep strike along terminators, for example.

 

They'd be too glaringly different I reckon. Calgar went from my favourite character to a mangled fluff and miniature (subjective in my view).

 

I suspect we'll get Sicarius in Terminator armour and Lysander. Both remade, they won't even mention Rubicon, they'll just be bigger as if nothing happened.

[Orange Knight]

Calgar is just an update on the old artificer armour variant. I've seen the model in person and he's pretty great.

 

As for Lysander, I hope they don't keep us waiting too long. They can take this opportunity and finally complete his ark and promotion to Chapter Master of the Imperial Fists.

[mecanojavi99]

26 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

You know, @tangoalphatwo has brought up a very good point. If Terminator armour is easily utilised by Primaris, why did they cannibalise Calgar's armour to make a lighter, weaker armour?

 

It does make no sense, unless the logical reason was Gravis armour was intended all along to be a replacement of Terminator Armour (not including the rules in game necessarily)?

 

Certainly, this is a new change in direction for GW's IP on the armour, though when they made the decision we can't be sure.

 

I never like Gravis armoured Calgar anyway, but now he seems just wrong and in need of a retcon to a new Terminator clad version. 

 

I do however love the Terminators being faithful to the older ones.

 

(Yes I would have preferred a heavier gothic styling to GW Space Marines long ago, but that's not where we're at and hasn't been like since yonks ago)

 

 

Very simple, the same way there are named characters with Phobos, Tacticus and Terminator armor, they needed some named characters to get Gravis armor, hence Calgar and Tor Garadon.

 

They needed to promote the new armor variants, who better than Papa Smurf to wear Gravis? The character known for wearing different armors trough his various incarnations

[Nephaston]

14 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Not happening. I assume you're stuck with the current version for at least a couple of decades.

You say that like Calgar isn't one of the more frequently updated characters. If anything him having 2 minis, one in gravis, one in terminator at once would be perfectly in line with GW current  nostalgia leaning design.

[mecanojavi99]

17 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

 

Adding to my thoughts here, the Terminator aesthetic is so iconic it seems like it might be a little at odds with fitting the Primaris range. I think the MKX stuff works well enough, even the modern Gravis (i.e. Heavy Intercessors, not Aggressors) but many of the Phobos range just seems a little less 40K alongside these classic Terminators?

 

I'd be interested to hear the opinions on this in particular from folk who only got into the hobby with Primaris, as they aren't necessarily "corrupted" by theme from ages past, the art up ahead a prime example.

For me at least Phobos is just a natural evolution of the Scout training all marines take.

[WARMASTER_]

1 hour ago, appiah4 said:

 

First time I've seen Exorcists feature in any official GW material since 3E codex I think.  This makes me so happy for some reason, I can't really explain it..

Don’t forget the Badab War books 

Edited March 30, 2023 by WARMASTER_

[Marshal Reinhard]

3 minutes ago, Nephaston said:

You say that like Calgar isn't one of the more frequently updated characters. If anything him having 2 minis, one in gravis, one in terminator at once would be perfectly in line with GW current  nostalgia leaning design.

I won't hold my breath for it to happen. You're welcome to if you like asphyxiation.