Legions Imperialis Legions Imperialis

[Cleon]

So are we supposed to infer from the AoD rules which weapons a Kratos has or are we expecting further details off the cards to say 'you have one of the battlecannon or the melta cannon, and if we can choose freely or if they are restricted to one in 'x'? Can anyone think of a good reason that's not clear on the cards?

[01RTB01]

30 minutes ago, Marshal Rohr said:

Yeah, the writing was really confusing. Is it a max of 8 bases of 5 or just 8 terminators? 

Logically it has to be bases otherwise it simply wouldn't work. 

 

Same as the wounds being one per base.

[nilsh]

I honestly don't think this is any more difficult than Epic ever was before. Give it a couple of games and it shouldn't be a problem even if you're bad at rules like I am.

 

I like that they're releasing cards for it, just hope one will be able to get some at the release.

[Rik Lightstar]

31 minutes ago, Marshal Rohr said:

Yeah, the writing was really confusing. Is it a max of 8 bases of 5 or just 8 terminators? 

 

Based on all the previous editions, the phrasing and the general game concepts I'd say it's 99.9% certain that infantry are ALWAYS referred to by the base not by individuals 

[nilsh]

Just now, Rik Lightstar said:

 

Based on all the previous editions, the phrasing and the general game concepts I'd say it's 99.9% certain that infantry are ALWAYS referred to by the base not by individuals 

 

I would even dare to say it's 100% certainty that they're talking about bases of miniatures.

[Rik Lightstar]

13 minutes ago, Brother Captain Arkley said:

The way I read it for the Kratos 

 

2 Kratos is 150pts - increase to 6 is another 200pts so you get a discount on having 4 more from 75pts to 50 pts a tank.

 

But I do feel this is over confusing and I can't think of a reason why,

 

The formation will be tied to a single order for them per turn and likely have coherency rules to follow. 

 

There's also a good chance that splitting fire is either not allowed or penalised. 

 

Plus you're losing "activations" in an alternating (within the phase) activations game, which is often a bit of a penalty in itself. 

[Cactus]

9 minutes ago, Cleon said:

So are we supposed to infer from the AoD rules which weapons a Kratos has or are we expecting further details off the cards to say 'you have one of the battlecannon or the melta cannon, and if we can choose freely or if they are restricted to one in 'x'? Can anyone think of a good reason that's not clear on the cards?

 

I think the answer is "look at the model". WYSIWYG for life!

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Rik Lightstar said:

 

The formation will be tied to a single order for them per turn and likely have coherency rules to follow. 

 

There's also a good chance that splitting fire is either not allowed or penalised. 

 

Plus you're losing "activations" in an alternating (within the phase) activations game, which is often a bit of a penalty in itself. 

 

It was more the way they have written this. Maybe I am so out of touch with actually playing and understanding game rules.

[01RTB01]

Personally I love what I'm seeing.

 

Cards, brilliant.

 

Loads of weapon options, brilliant.

 

The fact there's loads of generic keyworded special rules will make things easier too.

 

I'd like to know costings (money) for this as I'd really like to crack on with this. My only grumble is no land raiders so the only heavy transports available at launch, will be thunderhawks.

[Doctor Perils]

So detachments can be seen as equivalent to multiple units in 40k/30k, and can combine different kinds? A bit like WFB empire greatswords mixed in with spearman?

 

Separate question: what's the number in brackets after infantry/vehicle/walker?

[DuskRaider]

12 minutes ago, 01RTB01 said:

Logically it has to be bases otherwise it simply wouldn't work. 

 

Same as the wounds being one per base.

That being said, it allows you to add +2 or +4 depending on points. How does that translate to wounds if 4 = 1? Does it not add more wounds to a squad? If it does and 4 more would give you an extra wound (if we go by the base 4 having 1), what would adding 2 give you? 
 

This is where it gets a little weird, unless you’re stuck at 1 wound no matter how many Terminators you have… which would also be odd considering you’re investing more points for what I see as minimal reward. 

[Rik Lightstar]

2 minutes ago, Doctor Perils said:

So detachments can be seen as equivalent to multiple units in 40k/30k, and can combine different kinds? A bit like WFB empire greatswords mixed in with spearman?

 

Separate question: what's the number in brackets after infantry/vehicle/walker?

 

I'm almost certain that the number is a size value, the leaked points costs had similar numbers with infantry starting at 1 and Titans being higher than anything else. 

 

Hopefully this is for scenery and LoS mechanics, because TLoS at Epic scale is daft. 

[Rik Lightstar]

2 minutes ago, DuskRaider said:

That being said, it allows you to add +2 or +4 depending on points. How does that translate to wounds if 4 = 1? Does it not add more wounds to a squad? If it does and 4 more would give you an extra wound (if we go by the base 4 having 1), what would adding 2 give you? 
 

This is where it gets a little weird, unless you’re stuck at 1 wound no matter how many Terminators you have… which would also be odd considering you’re investing more points for what I see as minimal reward. 

 

It's going to be 1 Wound per base for most if not all infantry and light vehicles

 

So 4 bases equals 4 wounds, adding 2 or 4 bases adds 2 or 4 wounds respectively. 

[Marshal Rohr]

They clarified on Facebook unit names refer to a base of minis and has 1 wound, and individual weapons don’t have a point upgrade, it’s what is modeled on the tank 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Marshal Rohr

[Valkyrion]

Yeah, don't be overthinking the number of individual minis to wounds ratio.

One plastic disc of dudes is one model. One vehicle is one model. 

 

 

[Cleon]

12 minutes ago, Marshal Rohr said:

They clarified on Facebook unit names refer to a base of minis and has 1 wound, and individual weapons don’t have a point upgrade, it’s what is modeled on the tank 

Did they confirm this just in the context of tanks, or does it sound like it applies to Titans too?

[Marshal Rohr]

Terminators for unit size and wounds, Tanks for different weapons. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Marshal Rohr

[DuskRaider]

35 minutes ago, Rik Lightstar said:

 

It's going to be 1 Wound per base for most if not all infantry and light vehicles

 

So 4 bases equals 4 wounds, adding 2 or 4 bases adds 2 or 4 wounds respectively. 

I think that’s what’s getting me… I’m thinking 2 Terminators as in the little individual models and not 2 as in 2 bases of 4 individual models.  

[01RTB01]

5 minutes ago, DuskRaider said:

I think that’s what’s getting me… I’m thinking 2 Terminators as in the little individual models and not 2 as in 2 bases of 4 individual models.  

Each base or stand is referred to as a "thing". Not per individual mini marine/ term/ guardsmen/ whatever. That'd be bonkers if it were the case. 

 

Each stand has one wound. 4 stands, 4 wounds, 6 stands, 6 wounds.

 

I think some are overthinking or overcomplicating things.

 

I genuinely don't mean this patronisingly when I say, it's simpler than you think x

Edited August 2, 2023 by 01RTB01

[Redcomet]

1 hour ago, Marshal Rohr said:

Yeah, the writing was really confusing. Is it a max of 8 bases of 5 or just 8 terminators? 

When they say “model” they mean either a stand of infantry or a tank. 

[Captain Idaho]

Man I enjoyed this preview more than the last! It gives a really good idea, combined with the last preview about the core rules, just how the game will play.

 

I'm excited to see it.

 

A Thunderhawk only has 2 wounds mind... so the leak with Warlords only having 6 wounds is likely accurate on that basis. Void Shields notwithstanding of course.

[jaxom]

Yep, a detachment of Terminators ranges from 20 to 40 individual Astartes (4 to 8 stands each with 5 terminators on each stand). 

[DuskRaider]

1 hour ago, 01RTB01 said:

Each base or stand is referred to as a "thing". Not per individual mini marine/ term/ guardsmen/ whatever. That'd be bonkers if it were the case. 

 

Each stand has one wound. 4 stands, 4 wounds, 6 stands, 6 wounds.

 

I think some are overthinking or overcomplicating things.

 

I genuinely don't mean this patronisingly when I say, it's simpler than you think x

I absolutely am overthinking it and I think it’s just because literally every game I’ve played before this has been models on an individual basis. It’s messing with my mind. 

[SkimaskMohawk]

Not sure how the various epic editions worked, but they're saying it's basically power level for units?

 

The differences need to be realllly pronounced with no overlap to make it work. I think titans will really showcase any issues. 

[Valkyrion]

I know in isolation you can't really judge, but 1 wound seems very removable based on the profiles we've seen.

Like, 8 Tactical Squad bases hitting on 5's (so, 3), saving on 4's removes 1 (.5) terminators. 

Would 40 tactical marines kill 5 cataphractii in 30k without rapid firing or furying?