Legions Imperialis Legions Imperialis - Solar Auxilia Support Box (and LI delay).

[Matrindur]

49 minutes ago, Xanthous said:

 

See I'd disagree with both of these from a hobby standpoint, and I'd argue that miniature is a hobby term first. There's nothing stopping you from taking each individual figure and putting them on their own base. When I painted the Field Ordnance Batteries, I did the four crewmen separately, so it was much more like 6 miniatures than 2. Furthermore, each crewman could have gone on either base, they weren't prescribed parts of the kit, they were actually entirely optional.

 

Ultimately, I think these are the two qualities that define a miniature from a hobby standpoint: the capacity to stand alone, and interchangeability on bases. I'd say this really comes down to a problem of synonymity; the word 'model' has come to have an entirely separate meaning purely related to the wargame. A wargame model does not have to be a hobby model, you could use cardboard cut outs, or even empty bases if you're desperate. GW might frown upon it but the rules do not cease entirely to work if you do this, with the exception of line of sight rules perhaps.

 

If, in the oh so distant future of 'later this year', I am buying a box of Legions Imperialis miniatures, and for whatever reason I haven't actually bothered finding out exactly what is inside the box, I'd rather be told the hobby miniature count than the game piece count as that reflects the imminent qualities of what I will do with the box. If I buy a box with 50 little legionaries, I'd rather the box say 50 than 10, as that is a more accurate reflection, in my opinion, of what is physically contained within that box.

 

I can see where you are coming from but there is rarely a situation where you wouldn't even look at an image of what you buy. Which in turn should tell you how many bodies you are getting most of the time. So you already get your hobby infos from the pictures. When I look at the Lion I can see there is him and two other little guys, when I look at the Field Guns I can see there is the gun and three guys per base. So its not necessary to have that written on the box again.

On the other hand how it will function in the game isn't something you can see just from an image. For example the Imperial Knight kit does have a pilot outside the Knight that even has its own base but since in the game he isn't running around with the Knight but only dismounts after the knight is destroyed (so a single model that just changes from the big knight to the pilot) it only says 1 miniature on the box.

In the same way I can see its Operator+Gun and a second guy per base on the images but when i read 40 miniatures on the box I expect 40 usable game pieces for playing.

In the same way The Triumph of Saint Katherine shouldn't say 11 Miniatures on the box just because its 6 Sisters, 4 Cherubs and a sarcophagus inside.

Its a single base and functions as a single model in the game so it says 1 miniature in the box

 

Edited August 5, 2023 by Matrindur

[Xanthous]

40 minutes ago, Matrindur said:

I can see where you are coming from but there is rarely a situation where you wouldn't even look at an image of what you buy. Which in turn should tell you how many bodies you are getting most of the time. So you already get your hobby infos from the pictures. When I look at the Lion I can see there is him and two other little guys, when I look at the Field Guns I can see there is the gun and three guys per base. So its not necessary to have that written on the box again.

On the other hand how it will function in the game isn't something you can see just from an image. For example the Imperial Knight kit does have a pilot outside the Knight that even has its own base but since in the game he isn't running around with the Knight but only dismounts after the knight is destroyed (so a single model that just changes from the big knight to the pilot) it only says 1 miniature on the box.

In the same way I can see its Operator+Gun and a second guy per base on the images but when i read 40 miniatures on the box I expect 40 usable game pieces for playing.

In the same way The Triumph of Saint Katherine shouldn't say 11 Miniatures on the box just because its 6 Sisters, 4 Cherubs and a sarcophagus inside.

Its a single base and functions as a single model in the game so it says 1 miniature in the box

 

 

While I will stand by the distinction I made, and I think the terminology could do with greater clarity, I think I agree with you. From what we've seen of the Legions Imperialis boxes, they don't have images of the models on the front, but I'd assume they'd have some better pictures on the back, like Kill Team boxes. It might be worth noting that some boxes count things that don't count as models for rules purposes in the miniature count, like the cherubs in battle sister squads, but I'm not particularly willing to die on any hills today.

 

Getting back on topic, is it just me, or do the Auxilia rapiers look a lot more detailed than the Astartes ones? Especially the guns, the Marine rapiers look a bit gloopy in the details but the Auxilia look much better, same with the Tarantulas. That could just be a difference in aesthetics between the two factions, but I'm not entirely convinced by that.

[Matrindur]

11 hours ago, Xanthous said:

Getting back on topic, is it just me, or do the Auxilia rapiers look a lot more detailed than the Astartes ones? Especially the guns, the Marine rapiers look a bit gloopy in the details but the Auxilia look much better, same with the Tarantulas. That could just be a difference in aesthetics between the two factions, but I'm not entirely convinced by that.

They kinda do and a part is for sure the design differences, the marines have nearly flat side panels on the rapiers with just a few rivets, while the auxilia has stuff going on there. The auxilia is pretty much exactly how it looks in 28mm but for some reason they changed the design for marines. (in 28mm the both look the same) Probably so they are easier to differentiate in epic scale but with the drawback that the Marine version now looks like it has less detail.

 

That by itself is fine as Marines should look sleeker than guard but it adds up with other things

Just look at this gun. These basically are the same gun but for some reason Auxilia get separated barrels while the marine version is just a single piece with less detail. Probably because the Marine version has less space on the sprue but still.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Matrindur

[Cactus]

It could be a deliberate design choice to reflect the marines' better armour save. That doesn't explain the slightly naff barrels but the mini-vindicator appearance definitely looks tougher to me.

[Matrindur]

1 hour ago, Cactus said:

It could be a deliberate design choice to reflect the marines' better armour save. That doesn't explain the slightly naff barrels but the mini-vindicator appearance definitely looks tougher to me.

Yea I also don't think that is bad on its own but it adds up with other things.

Another one is the tracks. The SM version has different tracks so its in line with their other stuff but that also means its flatter than the SA version.

For a bigger comparison look at the Baneblade vs Kratos tracks:

 

That is how they are supposed to look like so its fine but it explains why the marine version looks less detailed at a glance 

[WrathOfTheLion]

I think the Solar Auxilia vehicles will look more detailed simply because they have trim breaking up the model, whereas the 30k Space Marine vehicles have just panels to break it up.

[Beaky Brigade]

You can still drill barrels at this scale, I've done it with AI aircraft :D. Just get a load of 0.5mm bits...

The flat surfaces on the Astartes stuff gives you more space for transfers and markings :)

[Redcomet]

11 hours ago, Matrindur said:

Yea I also don't think that is bad on its own but it adds up with other things.

Another one is the tracks. The SM version has different tracks so its in line with their other stuff but that also means its flatter than the SA version.

For a bigger comparison look at the Baneblade vs Kratos tracks:

 

That is how they are supposed to look like so its fine but it explains why the marine version looks less detailed at a glance 

The DG scheme also looks very flat in this scale. I think pushing the contrast would be a good idea