10th ed BA Metawatch

[Jolemai]

Similar to last edition, this thread focuses on the discussion of BA lists that are being successful across the world in various tournaments. I'm pulling the majority of the info from Blood of Kittens - The Blood of Kittens Network, but feel free to add from elsewhere provided it's relevant to us and adheres to forum rules.

[Jolemai]

The following list came first in a tournament over the weekend. A few of the tricks on show:

• Tycho + Command Squad + Lasback = so you use the Lasback to get into position, hop out, and rapid fire the unit's lascannons
• Librarian Dreadnought teleport trick for secondaries, or for porting the Captain + Eradicators into position
• Imagine that's a Strategic Reserves option for the DCD too
• Phobos Libby with Eliminators, RI on the Death Company + Lemartes perhaps, Inceptors doing the 3" thingy, etc, etc.

Bit of a last hurrah list for some too, but cool to see it being successful all the same

[Karhedron]

Tycho plus a Command Squad with 2 Lascannons costs more than a Devastator Squad with 4 Lascannons. It's a neat trick and the Tycho option has a bit more melee power but it seems a lot of faff for what it delivers.

 

The Libby Dread on the other hand looks like solid gold. Redeploying Gravis squads around the table looks like a really nice option. Throwing any spare infantry squad onto Objectives late game also looks like a good option.

[Jolemai]

It may cost more, but technically has more staying power with the revives and the shields. 

[Blindhamster]

it also loses firepower more slowly as the two guys with lascannons are shooting twice, instead of 4 guys each shooting once

[Jolemai]

Seems there was BA force that placed third over the week. This list went 6-0 and looks fairly interesting:

 

Ruben-Zhao-3rd-Place-SoCal-Open-2023-–-Blood-Angels.pdf (bloodofkittens.com)

 

Picking apart this list:

• Gladius which is more shooting focused than charging
• Thunderstrike is combining well with Librarian Dreadnought and Eradicator (for example) shenanigans
• Landraider with Assault Centurions plus Repulsor (with Techmarine) are a large threat that will take a lot of firepower away from Troops doing Troop stuff
• Biologis with Fire Discipline and Aggressors doing what you'd expect
• Scouts for Secondaries and a token Whirlwind.

It seems that a lot of BA lists are performing better this way than the ABC style lists we saw during 9th.

[Blindhamster]

honestly to me, that's not a blood angel list (would be interesting to know where GW would put it for their metawatch stuff).

 

It has one blood angel unique unit (the librarian dread) and doesn't use our detachment. It looks like a pretty standard space marine list thats just cheesing the librarian dread (which I honestly think we might lose access to when our actual supplement comes)

[Jolemai]

I believe GW still classes divergent Chapters using a GTF as the faction in question.

[Blindhamster]

I think from other discussions, people seemed to think that may not be the case with "blood angels" that used gladius potentially falling under "space marines" instead.

 

Would actually be really good if GW were to clarify how exactly they work that out under 10th, it was pretty cut and dry when we had chapter tactics.

 

I suppose it's a case of "if you use any rule from the divergent supplement, you get logged as that" - which I think is a problem this edition, just like it was in 8th. There were a lot of "blood angels" lists in 8th that did well because of our (at the time unique) smash captain, but most of the list would actually be some other imperium force. The above list is another good example. It uses the librarian dread but otherwise is just a space marine list, and the librarian dreads soul purpose to being in the list is shenanigans.

[Paladin777]

@Jolemai I would contend that rules for the gladius detachment itself are pretty well balanced between shooting and melee and that it's the datasheets themselves that make shooting more powerful. 

Edited October 25, 2023 by Paladin777

[Jolemai]

Well yeah, there is that. My line of of thought thought was compared to the bonus from SoS and when you have things like Fire Discipline.

Edited October 25, 2023 by Jolemai

[Jolemai]

Almost missed this, but the following won an event late 2023:

 

Atal-Walia-1st-Place-Ontario-40k-League-Halton-Hamilton-Division-A-Season-5-2023-–-Blood-Angels.pdf (bloodofkittens.com)

• Lemartes
• 10 DC
• 3 Baals
• 2 Lancers
• 3 Inceptors
• Vindicator
• Whirlwind

Gladius, focusing on fast moving and board control with an anvil in the form of the Lancers and Vindicator. Seems fun tbh...

[Jolemai]

Review of a list that went 6-0 at the LVO (and then dropped out of the day three bonus round)

 

 

 

Gladius

Lemartes

Sanguinor

1x10 jump DC

2x3 Inceptors

1x5 Terminators

2 Lancers

2 Vindicators

Redeemer

Callidus

 

 

Edited February 9 by Jolemai

[Karhedron]

How were they running 5-man Inceptor squads? I thought the squad size was fixed at 3/6. Or does the LVO have special rules for irregular sized squads?

 

Definitely interesting. Lemartes and the DC are a mobile melee hammer. The Sanguinor is entertaining for Leeroy Jenkinsing his way onto the battlefield but a a bit pricey at 140 points.

 

The rest is just fairly solid tanks.

[Jolemai]

That's me doing a typo 

[Jolemai]

An interesting BA list using Gladius went 5-1 recently:

 

Don-Belec-3rd-Place-Battle-To-End-Alzheimers-2024-–-Blood-Angels-Allies.pdf (bloodofkittens.com)

• Sanguinor
• Apothecary Biologist
• Chaplain
• Lemartes
• 1x10 Jump DC
• 2x5 Jump DC
• 1x10 DC & Rhino
• 2 Flamerbaals
• 2x3 Inceptors
• 1x6 Eradicators
• 2x4 Inquisitorial Henchmen

Pretty obvious which Leader goes where and who does the "action work". Imagine the DC and Rhino is played similar to how CSM use Chosen?

 

 *** *** *** *** ***

 

A more standard BA Gladius list also went 5-1:

 

Stephan-Pfenni-3rd-Place-Kassel-GT-Alpine-Cup-2024-–-Blood-Angels.pdf (bloodofkittens.com)

• Sanguinor
• Apothecary Biologist
• Captain
• Lemartes
• 1x6 Aggressors
• 1x10 JDC
• Company Heroes & Impulsor
• 2x3 Eradicators
• 1x5 JAI
• Land Raider Redeemer
• 1x5 Infiltrators
• 2 Trilas Predators

Again, this is fairly obvious who goes where and who watches the backfield. I presume perhaps the Eradicators go into Stratagic Reserve perhaps? Also, the Captain has the Honour Vehement Enhancement, so that coupled with Finest hour, a power fist, and Assault Doctrine is nuts.

 

 *** *** *** *** ***

 

This list went 4-1 using SoS:

 

Matt-Charles-2nd-Place-The-36-Chambers-3-2024-–-Blood-Angels.pdf (bloodofkittens.com)

• Lemartes
• Chaplain
• Chaplain with jump pack
• Lieutenant with combi weapon
• 2x5 JAI
• 2x5 DC & Rhino
• 2x10 JDC
• 1x5 JDC
• 1x5 Infiltrators
• 2x5 Scout Squad
• 2 DCD

This list is a proper ABC DC list and I love it! Just the three squads and the Lieutenant for secondaries. It's nuts and simply has to be dealt with - great to see something like this doing well.

 

[Xenith]

4 hours ago, Jolemai said:

• Lemartes
• Chaplain
• Chaplain with jump pack
• Lieutenant with combi weapon
• 2x5 JAI
• 2x5 DC & Rhino
• 2x10 JDC
• 1x5 JDC
• 1x5 Infiltrators
• 2x5 Scout Squad
• 2 DCD

 

Love that list, wish I had more DC! 

[DemonGSides]

The only thing I'm missing is scouts from that list. I wonder how it plays into Hypercrypt, which is my main opponent right now. 

[Karhedron]

OK so apart from Lemartes and the DC, there is a lot of flexibility. I remember people trying to convince me Lemartes was not worth the points over a regular chaplain at the start of 10th. 

 

Only downside is that I suspect Firstborn DC with all their tasty wargear options will be going to Legends when our Codex drops. I suspect we will just have DC equivalents of Intercessors (regular, Assault and Jump) with just the upgrades that those can take (1 pistol and 1 melee weapon per 5).

[Goranged]

so, black jump intercessors with reroll to hit anf FNP6. things you can get with Oath of the moment and a SP anyways. Sad, that would take out the flavor. I mean if you got the Black Rage and I want to use you as a tool too, I'd give you the best weapons so that you can smash big time. 

Edited February 22 by Goranged

[Karhedron]

I could be wrong about the DC but after seeing Dark Angels lose a lot of their toys, I am keeping my expectations low.

[Tokugawa]

Wulfen get weapon upgraded to dmg2, since the previous version is too weak. Rules wise DC possibly also get unified "rage weapon" which is obviously better than a chainsword, but weaker than current power fist.

[Brother Raul]

I really like those lists for a number of reasons. The pure DC multi chaplain list is very 5th edition and nostalgic, just not sure it's a genuine 10th list and would need to roll well and get good match ups.

 

I think the first list is probably the best. That 6 man eradicator squad with an Apocathery Biologist is genius. Could take down a titan in a turn (had to check if it was legal and is probably the best use of that HQ- high value lethal hits on a oath target).

 

The 2 Baal FS is a bit overkill but for 250 points you are getting one of the best overwatches in the game, where you want it and denying 48" between them. Plus is gives you the shooting we need along with the inceptors.

 

Each time an edition changes I try to figure out the ratio of shooting to melee we need and those 2 Baal + inceptors will leverage enough dice at range to cover that need.

 

One big stand out for me is the Sanguinor in the 2 more 10th edition lists. Strongly believe he's a must have this edition and that might be the common theme.

 

Has the best 2 rules in the game as well as his insane 'Angelic Intervention'. Also has a lite version of precision as you can place him in base contact with a HQ in the unit that charged. I'll never not take him.

[DemonGSides]

I think the aggressor bomb is a slightly better use of the biogis in a vacuum, but I do also like the idea of sustained lethal hits on a 5+ (because of Fire Discipline) with a melta gun rerolling everything (I probably wouldn't bother aiming Oath at something these guys are targeting, considering their ability to reroll everything as long as you're firing it at an appropriate target).

 

Aggressor bomb is still probably my more likely go to, but that list has enough other things that do what the aggressor bomb is doing I am pleased to see the Biologis anywhere else; he doesn't have many options for squads to lead.

[Karhedron]

Best squad for the Biologis depends on the Detachment. If you are running Gladius then Boltstorm Aggressors for Fire Discipline is great. I have tried running Flamestorm detachment and is does pretty well. In this case, the Aggressors have flamers and are led by a Gravis Captain for free Immolation Protocols. I this case the Biologis is redundant and so I put hm with the Eradicators for Lethal Hits goodness and I add Forged in Battle for a Guaranteed 6 to-Hit every turn.

 

In an SoS detachment I would probably run him with Eradicators too. Lethal Hits are nice although there are no obvious enhancements that synergise.