Horus Heresy New Edition, or Just Horus Hearsay?

[Gorgoff]

Apart from dense jungle can anyone give me an example for terrain which could be considered heavy? 

Nithing comes to my mind apart from just devlaring something as that which doesn't look the part.

 

[Mogger351]

15 minutes ago, Gorgoff said:

Apart from dense jungle can anyone give me an example for terrain which could be considered heavy? 

Nithing comes to my mind apart from just devlaring something as that which doesn't look the part.

 

Typically it's been fortified areas historically as well, although I think some people simply lumped those under ruins and considered those medium

[Nephaston]

14 hours ago, Gorgoff said:

https://imgur.com/a/dcKhPGI

 

The last bit the leaker shows is the line of sight rules and those for terrain and shooting and jerzuz do they suck.

True line of sight is gone.

A small Rhino completely blocks line of sight to the Saturnine Dreadnought behind it. 

A little piece of terrain  locks everything as well. Granted we can always declare that as light terrain in which case it doesn't block anything but that vehicles block line of sight no matter what is beyond stupid.

That we can kill models now outside line of sight is also beyond terrible. 

"Well well well,I can see one dude of your unit. I can kill now the whole squad."

Am I missing an earlier rule about using tape or models having endless vertical obstruction? Because to me it doesn't read as tiny vehicles blocking line of sight regardless of where the line is drawn, only if the Line were to be drawn through it. So a infantry model can target a saturnine dread as a line of sight can be drawn going above the rhino.

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

57 minutes ago, TheArtilleryman said:

The “kill whole unit if you can see one guy peeking round the corner” mechanic is something I always hated. Utterly dumb rule

It worked in the Aliens movie when the bugs rounded a corner while running like hell to catch up with their prey. Only problem was that there waited a sentry gun for them. In all other cases where non-Fearless units are involved it makes no sense.

[Wibbling]

1 hour ago, Mogger351 said:

Typically it's been fortified areas historically as well, although I think some people simply lumped those under ruins and considered those medium

 

Urban areas, I'd suggest. Special forces units train in mock villages and fake airports. The bigger issue is visibility rather than - necessarily - the destructibility of cover.

[Vardus]

2 hours ago, Deus_Ex_Machina said:

It worked in the Aliens movie when the bugs rounded a corner while running like hell to catch up with their prey. Only problem was that there waited a sentry gun for them. In all other cases where non-Fearless units are involved it makes no sense.

 

Just blame the warp.......

 

Bob dies and his body mysteriously disappears....

Phil goes where's Bob? Goes to see, gets one the head and his body mysteriously disappears.....

Vlad goes where are my two squad mates? Goes to see and gets minced by gun fire, his body mysteriously disappears!

etc,etc...

 

Nice lore fit to the game mechanics!

 

But joking aside, wiping a hidden model without an in game mechanic such as ignores cover or blast (be that template or keyword) is silly.

[SkimaskMohawk]

I had great fun playing 4th with its area terrain blocking LOS in the same way. You could get stuff like assault Marines leapfrogging large chunks to charge tanks and the like, or holing a unit up in the rear of a ruin to hide them and get the drop on enemies trying to go around the ruin. Though, that latter part only really worked with how barrage couldn't core an entire building, so we'll see. 

 

 

[Dudley Nightshade]

6 hours ago, TheArtilleryman said:

The “kill whole unit if you can see one guy peeking round the corner” mechanic is something I always hated. Utterly dumb rule

It doesn't seem like there is any consensus, but it seems reasonable that each half of a game turn might represent 60 seconds or so of "real" time on the battlefield. Then the UGOIGO mechanic further obscures the representation of what is actually "happening" in the field. Two minutes of soldiers moving around, firing pot shots at each other, jockeying for position, trying to get to a vantage point. … *shrug* I've never been in that position, but 10 seconds in hide-and-seek feels like an eternity. Then imagine how much anxiety it would cause to know that if you can't keep eyes on the seeker, they might lob a grenade on your position.

 

editing to add: I know there is not going to be any one rule that makes everyone happy. For me, true line of sight, which was intended to simplify and make the game more immersive, effectively removed an entire class of rules that I basically liked. It also coincided with the rise of Hero-Hammer, which did not sit well with me either. I don't begrudge anyone who feels differently, though. 

Edited 8 hours ago by Dudley Nightshade

[01RTB01]

New Proteus variant or resin kit?

[Lord Marshal]

47 minutes ago, 01RTB01 said:

New Proteus variant or resin kit?

 

That's just the resin Armoured Proteus I believe, probably an older photo due to the presence of the MkIV SoH in the older upgrades.

 

[Marshal Rohr]

1 hour ago, 01RTB01 said:

New Proteus variant or resin kit?

I think that photo is from Retribution or Conquest

[Gorgoff]

4 hours ago, Dudley Nightshade said:

I know there is not going to be any one rule that makes everyone happy. For me, true line of sight, which was intended to simplify and make the game more immersive, effectively removed an entire class of rules that I basically liked. It also coincided with the rise of Hero-Hammer, which did not sit well with me either. I don't begrudge anyone who feels differently, though. 

Which rules disappeared and how did it make hero hammer happen though?

The Old World has abstract line of sight and is very much Hero Hammer but I am interested in what you mean. 

[Laurence]

The last paragraph of that line of sight rules page reads:  "When determining if a Model has Line of Sight to a Unit, it only needs Line of Sight to one Model that is part of that Unit.  That does not grant that Model Line of Sight to any other Models that are in that Unit that are otherwise hidden and does not affect how or to which Models wounds or Hits can be assigned."  That bolded part, to me, implies that Line of Sight does not also grant Line of Effect, and that unseen models in a visible unit can't be gunned down.

[Marshal Rohr]

35 minutes ago, Laurence said:

The last paragraph of that line of sight rules page reads:  "When determining if a Model has Line of Sight to a Unit, it only needs Line of Sight to one Model that is part of that Unit.  That does not grant that Model Line of Sight to any other Models that are in that Unit that are otherwise hidden and does not affect how or to which Models wounds or Hits can be assigned."  That bolded part, to me, implies that Line of Sight does not also grant Line of Effect, and that unseen models in a visible unit can't be gunned down.

The player receiving the shooting chooses the target models and assigns wounds to models, this is covered by the cut out directly below the target models sections. Five guys are in the road, five around the corner, three die to failed saves and get removed from around the corner. 

[Dudley Nightshade]

2 hours ago, Gorgoff said:

Which rules disappeared and how did it make hero hammer happen though?

The Old World has abstract line of sight and is very much Hero Hammer but I am interested in what you mean. 

Ah sorry. I didn't mean to imply that one caused the other. In doing some research on what order things happened in, it also looks like I am greatly misremembering the timeline. 

 

In my mind, the big changes to terrain rules (including the introduction of TLoS) happened around the same time as needing to take a named character to alter the force org chart. However, when I dig into it, it seems like those changes were not even close together in terms of rules editions. Derp.