Horus Heresy New Edition, or Just Horus Hearsay?

[Jarl of Wulfen]

Interesting that the grav pulverizer is considered plasma not grav.  Typo?

Edited 4 hours ago by Jarl of Wulfen
Typo

[Marshal Rohr]

100% Typo, it will have the Graviton trait. 

Edited 4 hours ago by Marshal Rohr

[Vassakov]

 

29th June is a Sunday. If announced for pre-order that day, then release is 12th 19th July.

 

I think they just stealth-announced when it drops. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Vassakov
I can't read a calendar apparently.

[The boater]

All those weapons will do some work. Honestly the only one I don’t think I care for is the big disintegrator and it’s only because of the overload 2 on it. Points will make it a rotational choice rather than something I take regularly. 

[Gorgoff]

15 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

I enjoy that Dreadnoughts are less intelligent now.

In germany we call someone like them Stupid, strong and watertight 

I love it.

They won't have much situations where they need it anyways but it is funny to read.

Dreadnoughts all WS and BS 4 now is great news. Like I always said the WS table isn't the problem. The distribution of WS5 in 2ed was. 

If it becomes rare now again the balancing shifts back and every unit is better. 

 

[Misterduch]

I am not the fan of the plasma option, but all others have a role I think.

 

Disintegrator for anti dread/light tank/automata duty out to 24", arguably most mobile option.

Grav, middle of the road with range, will struggle into sv2+ but crack tanks open if still, anything with sv3+ should be worried

Inversion is the best pick for anti TEQ duty with the 14,9" mode, will still do well against tanks and dreads. the 30" mode is competing with Grav, which becomes a matter of having a chance at AP2 and *alot* of pinning vs range and consistency of the beamer

[Nephaston]

Oh nice, called it on the Thermal diffraction field. And lots to consider with those weapons, though I personally would probably stick with disintegrators for the double *PHWOOOMP*

[Mogger351]

I figured it out, the intelligence thing bothers me, because the stat is a "use item" stat that in reality isn't tied to intelligence in a direct sense, nor is it a leadership stat

[Waaagh?]

32 minutes ago, Vassakov said:

 

29th June is a Sunday. If announced for pre-order that day, then release is 12th July.

 

I think they just stealth-announced when it drops. 

 

I think you mean the 19th. If it's announced that Sunday it won't go up for preorder until the 5th.

[Irate Khornate]

I don't know how I feel about the Deredeo going to BS 4. 

 

That is a hefty points cost for a singular dreadnought with no upgrades. I'm starting to wonder if models got more expensive across the board.

[Lord Marshal]

13 minutes ago, Waaagh? said:

 

If it's announced that Sunday it won't go up for preorder until the 5th.

 

That also aligns with the TGA date-leaker saying it would be on the 5th.

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Lord Marshal

[Vassakov]

12 minutes ago, Waaagh? said:

 

I think you mean the 19th. If it's announced that Sunday it won't go up for preorder until the 5th.

 

Derp. You are quite right.

 

In my defence, it's very warm in my office today.

[Captain Idaho]

Wow the weapons are totally unbalanced against each other for the Saturnine Dreadnought.

 

Why use the heavy plasma bombard when you could just take the Inversion Beamer and have AP3 and benefits for remaining stationary or getting up close?

 

Same as the Heavy Disintegrators... 2 shots that are 33% chance of hitting yourself and wounding on a 3+ EVERY TURN at damage 3! If you take 2 of these weapons you'll lose the model most games!l to itself!

 

Why take that when you can have the Graviton Pulveriser? More damage and blast to boost it against infantry, plus other benefits like suppression. 

 

All for 10pts per weapon.

 

Colour me a dissatisfied panda. It's like a regular panda but the white is a pale blue.

[BitsHammer]

58 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

I enjoy that Dreadnoughts are less intelligent now.

Since intelligence is your ability to operate tech I assumed it's because having fingers the size of a man's head makes you a poor typist.

[BitsHammer]

16 minutes ago, Irate Khornate said:

I don't know how I feel about the Deredeo going to BS 4. 

 

That is a hefty points cost for a singular dreadnought with no upgrades. I'm starting to wonder if models got more expensive across the board.

It may have gotten cheaper. Alternatively this may be how they decided to balance dreads so they can still hit like a truck, they just hit a bit less often.

 

7 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

Wow the weapons are totally unbalanced against each other for the Saturnine Dreadnought.

 

Why use the heavy plasma bombard when you could just take the Inversion Beamer and have AP3 and benefits for remaining stationary or getting up close?

 

Same as the Heavy Disintegrators... 2 shots that are 33% chance of hitting yourself and wounding on a 3+ EVERY TURN at damage 3! If you take 2 of these weapons you'll lose the model most games!l to itself!

 

Why take that when you can have the Graviton Pulveriser? More damage and blast to boost it against infantry, plus other benefits like suppression. 

 

All for 10pts per weapon.

 

Colour me a dissatisfied panda. It's like a regular panda but the white is a pale blue.

Honestly I'm just sad there isn't a new Volkite thing for it. And I don't think you're wrong about the points spread but honestly I look at it and think less "which is the strongest option for points" and more "what would Night Lords be most likely to equip one of these with?" Sure we can chase the meta but I'm constantly being told that 30k is supposed to be the narrative driven game and I personally would like to lean into that.

[HeadlessCross]

On 6/6/2025 at 7:24 AM, SkimaskMohawk said:

Sad to see confirmation that the  instant death mechanic thrown out for traditional damage. 8th doing that, and their new wound chart and their lack of AV basically made a ton of STR ranges useless. I'm hoping we're only getting the damage part and various STR remain valuable. 

That's absolutely NOT what happened in practice for the old system. It made any T3 character without Eternal Warrior useless since a simple Plasma Gun knocked them out with just 1 unsaved wound, on top of making certain upgrades absolutely worthless. You couldn't go for Tzeentch Obliterators, for example, because the 4++ was less valuable than avoiding Instant Death. 

[Dudley Nightshade]

5 hours ago, Stitch5000 said:

As reluctant as I am to lift up this particular slab... Are you proposing a situation where 2 people just bash into each other and use the same army every time without adapting to what their opponent takes or even trying to take an unpredictable new unit to counter the prevailing threat?

If you are, how do you even enjoy playing warhammer?!

Destabilisation of the predictable outcome is fundamental to how the game works (it's why we use dice and not a mathematical equation).

Also, I appreciate that some people build and paint things faster than the others, but taking YEARS to get a new unit on the board is surely an exaggeration? You get out what you put in to these things... If you can't find the enthusiasm to turn a new unit round in less than the span of a year, are you really going to take that much from a game anyway?

When I said I had no horse in this race, it's because I do not enjoy playing Warhammer. I keep checking in with every new rule to change to see if it seems like this might be the one where I might. Lurking and waiting has become most of my hobby experience  I have been following this thread quite closely, and even come out of lurker mode occasionally, because it shows some promise. As a setting, I find myself much more drawn to the 30K aesthetic and "historical" feel. I always thought that the Forge World additions to 40K were some of the best parts ... just maybe not on the tabletop.

 

Zeroing in too much on my hastily-composed example, though, ignores what was actually being discussed at the time. Namely, is it overly "competitive" to expect a unit that was built for one purpose to be able to fulfill that purpose? Perhaps the example was not fantastic. Happy to concede that.

 

The one-two punch of edition churn and power creep is a large part of what has prevented me from wanting to get back into any GW game as a player. I felt the pain of the Frater who was accused, in my opinion unfairly, of being a power gamer. From my experience it is more likely he was actually just trying to stay in a place where he *was* enjoying the game, and having to change a bunch of models to keep enjoying it, seems like a bummer.

Edited 3 hours ago by Dudley Nightshade
turned text into emoji

[Mogger351]

29 minutes ago, BitsHammer said:

Since intelligence is your ability to operate tech I assumed it's because having fingers the size of a man's head makes you a poor typist.

I've met some incredibly intelligent people who cant use some tech.

[Mogger351]

6 minutes ago, Dudley Nightshade said:

When I said I had no horse in this race, it's because I do not enjoy playing Warhammer. I keep checking in with every new rule to change to see if it seems like this might be the one where I might. Lurking and waiting has become most of my hobby experience  I have been following this thread quite closely, and even come out of lurker mode occasionally, because it shows some promise. As a setting, I find myself much more drawn to the 30K aesthetic and "historical" feel. I always thought that the Forge World additions to 40K were some of the best parts ... just maybe not on the tabletop.

 

Zeroing in too much on my hastily-composed example, though, ignores what was actually being discussed at the time. Namely, is it overly "competitive" to expect a unit that was built for one purpose to be able to fulfill that purpose? Perhaps the example was not fantastic. Happy to concede that.

 

The one-two punch of edition churn and power creep is a large part of what has prevented me from wanting to get back into any GW game as a player. I felt the pain of the Frater who was accused, in my opinion unfairly, of being a power gamer. From my experience it is more likely he was actually just trying to stay in a place where he *was* enjoying the game, and having to change a bunch of models to keep enjoying it, seems like a bummer.

You're conflating power gamer with competitive mindset.

 

If someone's fun is defined by their ability to win the game, if a unit is unfun because it is less likely to win games, or if it needs to literally be broken apart and rebuilt into a different unit to be "usable". Those are all trademarks of someone chasing a competitive mindset to keep efficiency and desire to win above emotional attachment, fluff or narrative.

 

That is the competitive drive, the same one that keeps the money and wheels turning on the 40k scene, the same one they complained about.

[Bradeh]

42 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

Wow the weapons are totally unbalanced against each other for the Saturnine Dreadnought.

 

Why use the heavy plasma bombard when you could just take the Inversion Beamer and have AP3 and benefits for remaining stationary or getting up close?

 

Same as the Heavy Disintegrators... 2 shots that are 33% chance of hitting yourself and wounding on a 3+ EVERY TURN at damage 3! If you take 2 of these weapons you'll lose the model most games!l to itself!

 

Why take that when you can have the Graviton Pulveriser? More damage and blast to boost it against infantry, plus other benefits like suppression. 

 

All for 10pts per weapon.

 

Colour me a dissatisfied panda. It's like a regular panda but the white is a pale blue.

 

They said the Thermal Field mitigates Overload damage, just have to find out in what way. 

[Fire Golem]

7 minutes ago, Bradeh said:

 

They said the Thermal Field mitigates Overload damage, just have to find out in what way. 

Not for the disintegrators though I don’t think, because it says Plasma, Melta, Flamer and Las weapons. 

[Stitch5000]

24 minutes ago, Dudley Nightshade said:

When I said I had no horse in this race, it's because I do not enjoy playing Warhammer. I keep checking in with every new rule to change to see if it seems like this might be the one where I might. Lurking and waiting has become most of my hobby experience  I have been following this thread quite closely, and even come out of lurker mode occasionally, because it shows some promise. As a setting, I find myself much more drawn to the 30K aesthetic and "historical" feel. I always thought that the Forge World additions to 40K were some of the best parts ... just maybe not on the tabletop.

 

Zeroing in too much on my hastily-composed example, though, ignores what was actually being discussed at the time. Namely, is it overly "competitive" to expect a unit that was built for one purpose to be able to fulfill that purpose? Perhaps the example was not fantastic. Happy to concede that.

 

The one-two punch of edition churn and power creep is a large part of what has prevented me from wanting to get back into any GW game as a player. I felt the pain of the Frater who was accused, in my opinion unfairly, of being a power gamer. From my experience it is more likely he was actually just trying to stay in a place where he *was* enjoying the game, and having to change a bunch of models to keep enjoying it, seems like a bummer.

It seems to me that what you are describing is a desire to play a "finished" game in which nothing ever changes and you can return to it with your friends in a casual and predictable fashion. There's nothing wrong with this at all. I would suggest picking up nearly any edition of any GW game and playing at "index" level... (Tabletop games are fantatstic for this. The servers never turn off, the operating system never gets incompatible with the installation etc... Literally all you need is gravity and a light source and you can play it exactly as it ever was.) 

The problem there is you are playing what a lot of people would describe as a "dead" game... That is one that gets no further development or changes.

People tend to get bored of playing "dead" games quite quickly, usually because one person figures out the best options and sticks with them. It doesn't take many times through the cycle for people to tire of the repetition and begin to want some sort of change. The interesting thing is how much you are FORCED to adopt change, if the choice is there. The answre is that you really aren't. There is no miniature police, there is no WYSIWYG gestapo. You aren't playing at a GT event... It's just you and your mate doing what you want to do for the afternoon and Games Workshop have nothing to do with that. 

edit: I am aware that this only tangentially applies to being a "Power gamer" and is more directed towards your apprehensions towards getting into a game. 

Edited 2 hours ago by Stitch5000

[Bradeh]

10 minutes ago, Fire Golem said:

Not for the disintegrators though I don’t think, because it says Plasma, Melta, Flamer and Las weapons. 

 

Pretty sure it's two completely different rules. The strength of a hit has nothing to do with Gets Hot, maybe the rule has changed completely. 

 

Edited 2 hours ago by Bradeh

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

1 hour ago, Mogger351 said:

I enjoy that Dreadnoughts are less intelligent now.

Retcon:

Dreadnought pilots are no longer selected from badly wounded veterans but from a program dubbed McNamara´s Morons. Either they are incapable of doing Calculus or they excel in Calculus although in the latter case they no longer are able to put their trousers on without help. 

 

Space Marine Bob: "This piece of junk is too stupid for war. It will never find it´s way back to base. So what is it doing all day?!"

Space Marine Joe: "The Saturnine Dreadnought can´t get lost as it patrols the base in circles. Hence it´s name."

Space Marine Bob: "!*$&%!

 

[Bradeh]

Another cheeky note is that the AP3 template Particle Shredder that comes with the Termies isn't included in the box for the Dread.