Space Marine Battle Companies - Do they need revision? Have they already been revised?

[ChapterMasterGodfrey]

Hello brothers,

 

My current hobby project has got me thinking about the composition of Battle Companies in codex compliant chapters. As we all know, in old lore, a Battle Company was composed of:

• x6 10-man Tactical Squads (Battleline in new money)
• x2 10-man Assault Squads (Close Support in new money)
• x2 10-man Devastator Squads (Fire Support in new money)

 

Following Guilliman's return and the advent of the Primaris Marines, we are told Guilliman revised the codex to allow for up to 20 five-man squads. However, the split between battlefield roles, we're led to believe, has remained the same. But should they and, have they?

 

In the 10th Ed. Blood Angels codex, on the chapter organisation page, it no longer reads "6 battleline squads, 2 Close Support and 2 Fire Support squad" (or words to that affect) as it did. It now basically just reads "Battleline squads, Close Support Squads and Fire Support Squads" (again, or words to that affect). Can we take that to mean that from deployment to deployment, there can be divergences from the traditional 60/20/20 split?

 

I think yes and welcome the change. The codex offers balance in war yet was overly weighted one way. Surely splitting a flexible Battle Company 40/30/30 across Battleline, Close Support and Fire Support makes way more sense? Or, can a Captain outfit his battle company literally in any configuration he pleases for a specific engagement or campaign? 

 

Would love to hear your thoughts, brothers.

[jaxom]

I can give a full explanation when I get home from work. This is a special interest of mine.

[firestorm40k]

With my own Ultima Founding Chapter, I'm still working on the 60/20/20 principle of Battle Companies for the miniatures I've been painting. As I paint on squads of 5, 1st-12th Squads are Intercessors or Heavy Intercessors, 13th-16th are Assault Intercessors or Inceptors, and 17th-20th are Hellblasters, Desolation Squads, or Aggressors. 

[jaxom]

4 hours ago, ChapterMasterGodfrey said:

Hello brothers,

 

My current hobby project has got me thinking about the composition of Battle Companies in codex compliant chapters. As we all know, in old lore, a Battle Company was composed of:

• x6 10-man Tactical Squads (Battleline in new money)
• x2 10-man Assault Squads (Close Support in new money)
• x2 10-man Devastator Squads (Fire Support in new money)

 

Following Guilliman's return and the advent of the Primaris Marines, we are told Guilliman revised the codex to allow for up to 20 five-man squads. However, the split between battlefield roles, we're led to believe, has remained the same. But should they and, have they?

 

The 8th edition codex lays out the two big changes to company structures; both stem from a "this is how it should have been read, I'm just clearing things up" explanation from Guilliman to avoid accusations of allowing chapters to be larger than the roughly 1000 battle-brothers everyone understood a Codex chapter to be.

 

1) Squads seconded from reserve companies can be formally attached to a battle company, not just attached to them. For example, a Heavy Support Squad from 9th Company is seconded to the 4th Company; the squad now takes the heraldry of 4th, and is put into the 4th Company's chain of command as Squad 10+n (where n is the number of squads in the 4th Company seconded from reserve companies). These squads are part of their new company, while also not not part of their original reserve company, and .... 

2) .... and reserve companies are meant to be topped off when they fall below 100 battle-brothers to keep a smooth flow of replacements for battle company casualties. Any reserve squad seconded to a battle company should be immediately replaced to keep the reserve company at 100 battle-brothers.

 

See after next quote block for what this means for company structure.

 

At the squad level, there was a similar "this is how it should have been read, I'm just clearing things up." Guilliman (supposedly) never meant to limit battle and reserve companies to only three squad variants (Tactical, Assault, Devastator), but they were (supposedly) the three squad roles he was describing - to be filled as appropriate. The 8th edition codex gives Centurion squad variant as an example of the Devastator role. In this way, a hardliner can point at the Codex Astartes and said, "The 8th Company should be all Assault Squads! Those are Incursor Squads!" and get the answer, "Someone messed up the translation from M31 formal High Gothic to M36 scribe High Gothic! The 8th Company is all Assault role squads! Assault Squads are a squad variant for the Assault role and so are Incursor Squads!"

 

4 hours ago, ChapterMasterGodfrey said:

In the 10th Ed. Blood Angels codex, on the chapter organisation page, it no longer reads "6 battleline squads, 2 Close Support and 2 Fire Support squad" (or words to that affect) as it did. It now basically just reads "Battleline squads, Close Support Squads and Fire Support Squads" (again, or words to that affect). Can we take that to mean that from deployment to deployment, there can be divergences from the traditional 60/20/20 split?
*SNIP*

Surely splitting a flexible Battle Company 40/30/30 across Battleline, Close Support and Fire Support makes way more sense? Or, can a Captain outfit his battle company literally in any configuration he pleases for a specific engagement or campaign? 

 

The formal company structures remain unchanged and provide a minimum distribution for squad types. However, because the battle companies (2-5) theoretically have no upper limit on the squads seconded to them from the reserve companies, they can skew the ratio beyond the minimum. For example, the Ultramarines 2nd Company shortly after Acheran became captain was 7 Battleline/3 Close Support/2 Fire Support (though less than 100 marines, presumably due to casualties).

 

This not to say something like 4/3/3 is not possible. Earlier works about the Codex Astartes state, "some Chapters may organise include more or less Assault and Devastator Squads but never more than the number of Tactical Squads in the Company. It is unclear if that means the total Assault and Devastator squads can never be more, or if any one can never be more.

 

[ChapterMasterGodfrey]

That is very interesting about the seemingly permanent secondment from the reserve companies - even, if I’m understanding correctly, allowing a Battle Company to have 20+ 5 man squads of varying roles.

 

As a Blood Angel though that does leave me with the problem of squad iconography. There are only 20 prescribed squad icons, which are also laid out 12/4/4 in the traditional role split.

 

If I’m understanding correctly though, it sounds like I’d be allowed to do 40/30/30 role split for my Blood Angels second company. After all, any laid out organisation is just for a certain deployment. 
 

Thank you for your help!

[jaxom]

4 hours ago, ChapterMasterGodfrey said:

As a Blood Angel though that does leave me with the problem of squad iconography. There are only 20 prescribed squad icons, which are also laid out 12/4/4 in the traditional role split.

If it were me, I'd use the color combination for squad number and the iconography for type. So if squad 11 is Close Support, I'd use the lightning bolt with black background and yellow icon.

Edited July 4 by jaxom

[Tacitus]

On 7/3/2025 at 1:51 PM, jaxom said:

 

 

At the squad level, there was a similar "this is how it should have been read, I'm just clearing things up." Guilliman (supposedly) never meant to limit battle and reserve companies to only three squad variants (Tactical, Assault, Devastator), but they were (supposedly) the three squad roles he was describing - to be filled as appropriate. The 8th edition codex gives Centurion squad variant as an example of the Devastator role. In this way, a hardliner can point at the Codex Astartes and said, "The 8th Company should be all Assault Squads! Those are Incursor Squads!" and get the answer, "Someone messed up the translation from M31 formal High Gothic to M36 scribe High Gothic! The 8th Company is all Assault role squads! Assault Squads are a squad variant for the Assault role and so are Incursor Squads!"

 

I didn't even realize there were alternate interpretations.  Whenever I make "full company lists" (or try to) I always watched the shoulder pads not the role.  So even though Assault Intercessors are Battle Line in the rules, they've got Close Assault Shoulder markings. Thus they count as "Assault Marines" in the 60/20/20 count. 

[Dr. Clock]

On 7/3/2025 at 6:05 PM, ChapterMasterGodfrey said:

seemingly permanent secondment from the reserve companies

I started my army as 5th Company, but as soon as I maxed out to 20 marines each Close Support and Fire Support, I started painting any extra bits in those roles as Reserve Company secondments.

 

The assumption I've made is just that when a Captain is sent on a mission, he is nominally in command of 1 Battle Company of up to 60 Battleline marines, 20 Close and 20 Fire Support, while being supported by a Captain of Reserve and 20 marines from each reserve company. That's the theory behind my particular Torchbearer Storm Lords force anyway. 

 

At this point my army has a pretty good amount of different colours based on the choice to bring in Reservists in a substantial way... and it does help keep units apart from time to time!

 

The one caveat I've made in terms of the roles is that I don't agree with Assault Intercessors as Close Support. That is clearly a Battleline unit who chose melee weapons that day! To count as Close Support you gotta move fast in my army I guess lol... 

 

The final benefit of having the reserve squads mixed into the army is that it helps play up the inter-unit rivalries... I always liked the way that White Scars units competed between themselves for excellence in various regards, and I like the idea of Storm Lords' codex adherence turning out to actually encourage this in big way because Battle Company squads are paired up with 'competing' reserve squads that just serve to egg each other on to more and more insane maneuvers. 

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

6 hours ago, Dr. Clock said:

I started my army as 5th Company, but as soon as I maxed out to 20 marines each Close Support and Fire Support, I started painting any extra bits in those roles as Reserve Company secondments.

 

The assumption I've made is just that when a Captain is sent on a mission, he is nominally in command of 1 Battle Company of up to 60 Battleline marines, 20 Close and 20 Fire Support, while being supported by a Captain of Reserve and 20 marines from each reserve company. That's the theory behind my particular Torchbearer Storm Lords force anyway. 

 

At this point my army has a pretty good amount of different colours based on the choice to bring in Reservists in a substantial way... and it does help keep units apart from time to time!

 

The one caveat I've made in terms of the roles is that I don't agree with Assault Intercessors as Close Support. That is clearly a Battleline unit who chose melee weapons that day! To count as Close Support you gotta move fast in my army I guess lol... 

 

The final benefit of having the reserve squads mixed into the army is that it helps play up the inter-unit rivalries... I always liked the way that White Scars units competed between themselves for excellence in various regards, and I like the idea of Storm Lords' codex adherence turning out to actually encourage this in big way because Battle Company squads are paired up with 'competing' reserve squads that just serve to egg each other on to more and more insane maneuvers. 

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

That’s a very pre-primaris mindset.

 

close support=/=fast attack, and battle line is just a keyword for the rules.

just like fire support=/=heavy support.

 

i forget which they’re classified as but i believe infernus marines are classified as close support, and aggressors as fire support. Classifications i personally think should be reversed.

[Tacitus]

Assault Centurions are Close Support, and they're slow as molasses.  Aggressors are Heavy Support and they've upjumped Bolt Pistols. 

 

With that said I've gone through something similar to what you are now.  Shoulderpads do not always match Codex Roles.  And that's OK.  I've used that to my "advantage".  Like you I generally try and make something close to Demi or Full Companies, and cheap Assault Intercessors counting as Battleline but wearing Close Support pads makes it "easier" to include Infiltrators with Battleline pads, and Other Roles.   It even adds another level of fun trying to keep both the Role and the Pad balanced. 

[Dr. Clock]

On 11/20/2025 at 5:28 PM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

battle line is just a keyword for the rules

... and also the 'mainline' Intercessor designation within the (Primaris) Codex Astartes? Intercessors are Battleline in both the rules and the 'Codex Astartes'... So why are Assault Intercessors Battleline in the rules, but not in the Codex?

 

As is, there's just not enough happening in the Battleline designation to make them the appropriate center of the army IMO, but once Assault intercessors are added it shifts the center just enough to feel more correct to me.

 

I know my solution is 'technically incorrect', but it makes more sense to me and I am simply not going to go remodel and paint all 20 tactical arrows on those assault intercessors...

 

I do approach this mostly from the perspective of 'what to put on the right shoulder' given trying to keep my collection roundly within a single Battle Company, and on the idea that a 'tactical arrow' probably wouldn't be painted over every time a squad swapped bolters for chainswords. 

 

On 11/20/2025 at 5:28 PM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

infernus marines are classified as close support

 

Though not according to the painting studio - they are still presented with fire support chevrons, and that's what I made mine as my first 9th Co. squad (so far). So basically even GW has no real consistency alot of time, reminding us that these choices are just that - choices. 

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, Dr. Clock said:

... and also the 'mainline' Intercessor designation within the (Primaris) Codex Astartes? Intercessors are Battleline in both the rules and the 'Codex Astartes'... So why are Assault Intercessors Battleline in the rules, but not in the Codex?

 

As is, there's just not enough happening in the Battleline designation to make them the appropriate center of the army IMO, but once Assault intercessors are added it shifts the center just enough to feel more correct to me.

 

I know my solution is 'technically incorrect', but it makes more sense to me and I am simply not going to go remodel and paint all 20 tactical arrows on those assault intercessors...

 

I do approach this mostly from the perspective of 'what to put on the right shoulder' given trying to keep my collection roundly within a single Battle Company, and on the idea that a 'tactical arrow' probably wouldn't be painted over every time a squad swapped bolters for chainswords. 

 

 

Though not according to the painting studio - they are still presented with fire support chevrons, and that's what I made mine as my first 9th Co. squad (so far). So basically even GW has no real consistency alot of time, reminding us that these choices are just that - choices. 

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

Just because assault intercessors also have the word intercessors doesn’t make them the same as regular intercessors.

 

they’re assault troops. I haven’t read a lot of the new novels, so maybe I’m wrong about this, but assault intercessor is a specialization into melee and close combat, while regular intercessors are generalists.

 

assuming things work similarly in BA now since it hasn’t been addressed as far as I’ve seen, but before primaris a blood angel in an assault squad was a senior brother. Blood angels start as devastators, then tacticals, then assault marines due to the thirst BA have to learn how to control it and as they gain experience in that, they are allowed to be in roles that make them more likely to be in melee.

 

markings is a big reason i went with my own successor. Markings are what I want them to be, helmet colors are what I want them to be.

 

Edited November 27 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[ChapterMasterGodfrey]

On 11/27/2025 at 9:19 PM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

but before primaris a blood angel in an assault squad was a senior brother.

Erm I may be wrong but I’m pretty sure Assault Squad was the first squad a Blood Angel brother went to after gaining his black carapace. It's the most instinctive role to a Blood Angel so brothers with the least experience will still perform well in it. As evidenced in Dante, when Assault Squad is the first squad he's assigned to after leaving the 10th company. It's where he has his first brush with the Red Thirst and he and his squad exsanguinate that family of xenos. 

 

Ultramarines and other more codex compliant chapters go to Devastator Squads first though as you say. More specifically, as one of the five brothers without a heavy weapon. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

8 hours ago, ChapterMasterGodfrey said:

Erm I may be wrong but I’m pretty sure Assault Squad was the first squad a Blood Angel brother went to after gaining his black carapace. It's the most instinctive role to a Blood Angel so brothers with the least experience will still perform well in it. As evidenced in Dante, when Assault Squad is the first squad he's assigned to after leaving the 10th company. It's where he has his first brush with the Red Thirst and he and his squad exsanguinate that family of xenos. 

 

Ultramarines and other more codex compliant chapters go to Devastator Squads first though as you say. More specifically, as one of the five brothers without a heavy weapon. 

No, first they went to a devastator squad. 
Brothers of the blood generally need to learn to control the thirst by gaining experience on the battlefield farther from the enemy.

[Tacitus]

I think he was confusing it with Vanguard Vets which started as Veteran Assault Squads.  Way way way back when the concept first came out Blood Angels could field 20 5 man Terminator Squads or 10 10man Veteran Assault Squad - or some mix of both.  Ultramarines had 20 Terminator Squads or 10 Veteran Tactical Squads, Dark Angels had 20 Terminator Squads only, and Space Wolves didn't pay attention to any of that codex stuff. 

[Blindhamster]

On 12/2/2025 at 12:27 AM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

No, first they went to a devastator squad. 
Brothers of the blood generally need to learn to control the thirst by gaining experience on the battlefield farther from the enemy.

Not true

 

Blood Angels do not follow the codex norm here ChapterMasterGodfrey has it correct. 

 

For codex chapters its scout - devastator - assault - tactical

For blood angels its scout - assault - devastator - tactical 

 

It's a minor divergence but it's how its been done for them for many many years. It's been covered in multiple of our codexes as well as in the Dante novel as mentioned.

 

And assault marines are not senior brothers, veteran assault marines (later vanguard) are obviously though. 

[jaxom]

Ditto Imperial Fists. They go Company 10 to Company 8.