40k First Founding Champions + Combat Patrols

[Sir Clausel]

If they release grav bikes i hope they make them different from outriders. Like make the grav bikes ranged focus and the outriders melee focused. I dont want the gravbikes to just be better outriders.

[Karhedron]

On 8/4/2025 at 11:33 AM, Orange Knight said:

I wonder if 11th edition will have yet another launch box that features Marines, I imagine that it will.

 

Almost guaranteed. Marines are by far the most popular faction in 40K and their sales help subsidise the kits for other factions. Current rumour is that it will be Marines vs Orks. I am calling it now and betting that 11th edition will be called...

 

Armageddon! 

 

 

[redmapa]

I hope they dont bring grav bikes if they look like the disgusting block of turd that is the white scar bike, if it was bigger then maybe but it just looks bland! Its like that old chair speeder that FW was selling for 30k sometime ago but without all the nostalgia.

 

Primaris infantry just needs a bit cleaning imo, its a bunch of redundant options that were designed out of a need to not step into firstborn shoes but also not taken far enough to be truly different. Like do Intercessors need 3 types of bolters? Do Phobos units need 3 types of Bolters? Devastators are probably gonna stop existing sooner than later, why not collapse every Tacticus special weapon squad into one kit or unit? Tacticals will also become obsolete, why not recreate them in a new Intercessor box with actual options and not just ammo pouches, Reivers need an actual role and all the Phobos units need something other than slightly different bolters imo.

 

The whole paradigm with  which Primaris were designed at first is no longer valid imo and GW have been bringing back old units and straight up updating them sort of proves that so why not go all the way and pull the band aid off and just condense a lot of the unnecessarily redundant Primaris range to make it more like an actual update to the Astartes range instead of the weird half measure with which every model has been designed so far, just get it over with and remove all the firstborn stuff already, we all knew it was coming but GW was too hung up on not pissing off their base while wanting to do something completely different with the range.

[Orange Knight]

56 minutes ago, redmapa said:

I hope they dont bring grav bikes if they look like the disgusting block of turd that is the white scar bike, if it was bigger then maybe but it just looks bland! Its like that old chair speeder that FW was selling for 30k sometime ago but without all the nostalgia.

 

I couldn't disagree more. The new Grav Bike is the best looking Grav bike I've seen on any Astartes model. I much prefer it to the Grav bikes of 30k, or Sammael. And it's a massive bonus that the new bike doesn't have a clear flight stand, which I consider to be the bane of many models.

 

56 minutes ago, redmapa said:

The whole paradigm with  which Primaris were designed at first is no longer valid imo and GW have been bringing back old units and straight up updating them sort of proves that so why not go all the way and pull the band aid off and just condense a lot of the unnecessarily redundant Primaris range to make it more like an actual update to the Astartes range instead of the weird half measure with which every model has been designed so far, just get it over with and remove all the firstborn stuff already, we all knew it was coming but GW was too hung up on not pissing off their base while wanting to do something completely different with the range.

 

I don't believe the paradigm has shifted at all, even with the return of classic units like Sternguard and Terminators. Why? These returning units are all 1st company veterans. Alongside these releases we also had Infernus marines which resemble the typical Primaris specialist-type units.

 

Veterans of the 1st company can have more varied or traditional wargear - even if that doesn't actually make the units better in practice.

Edited Tuesday at 12:31 PM by Orange Knight

[Robbienw]

I think the white scar characters repulsor bike is intentionally ugly, its meant to contrast against the sleekness and refined look of earlier era of imperial grav technology.  

 

Brutalism for jetbikes.

[Orange Knight]

Astartes SHOULD be brutal. Every other vehicle they have is.

I don't want their jetbikes to be sleek, I want them to crush you under the force of their crude gravitic fields.

 

Horus Heresy is kind of the same, with the exception of some curves on the Land Speeders, and the phallic-like Jetbikes. It's not like the Spartans and Sicarans have many smooth edges lol.

[Robbienw]

Its a general theme, but not necessarily applied to everything.  Some 40k astartes stuff is blocky but still pleasing to look at, rather than brutal.

 

The 30k legion grav stuff is sleek and advanced looking because its clearly been developed from the Custodes grav vehcile technology.

 

Late great crusade marines were generally sleeker looking and less brutal than 40k marines (with some exceptions), understandable because the imperium had reached a high point.  Its not just jet bikes where you see this, but also things like dreadnoughts.  The more brutal look developed over time as a result of the heresy curtailing production of more advanced resource heavy units, and led to the creation of good enough/compromise/easier to maintain armour and weapons.

Edited Tuesday at 12:58 PM by Robbienw

[Orange Knight]

I know the lore reasons for it, I have read the entire Horus Heresy series and many of the big black books. 

 

But I simply don't prefer that style or philosophy over the more established 40k aesthetic when it comes to Marines in particular. I think that the Redemptor Dread is overall the best looking Dreadnought (despite not being perfect), and I also like how consistent the Primaris design has been in general when it comes to the vehicles, despite some of the infantry being hit and miss.

[Robbienw]

Well we all have differing aesthetic preferences don't we.  

 

I was just sharing why i think they intentionally went for an ugly/brutal looking Repulsor bike as a contrast.

[mecanojavi99]

I can see GW keeping grav bikes for the higher echelons of a Chapter, like Captains, so we'll most likely see a new Captain on (Grav)Bike but won't see a whole unit using them.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

As far as the grav-bikes, I think the important thing is that we can all agree that when they ARE released as a generic squad unit, it's incontestable that they must be wearing Phobos armor.

 

Whew. For a second there, I thought some people might actually want to argue about that.

[mecanojavi99]

9 minutes ago, Lord Nord in Gravis Armour said:

As far as the grav-bikes, I think the important thing is that we can all agree that when they ARE released as a generic squad unit, it's incontestable that they must be wearing Phobos armor.

 

Whew. For a second there, I thought some people might actually want to argue about that.

I don't expect grav bikes to be used by whole units to begin with, I would much rather they be kept for Captains and similarly ranked individuals.

 

Even if they were to be added as a whole unit, why would Phobos units ride them when they clearly meant to be heavy duty vehicles, hence the in built Gatling cannon? If anything I could imagine Gravis marines riding them as a short of heavy cav with power lances like in that one Star Wars Animated episode.

 

Edited Tuesday at 02:34 PM by mecanojavi99

[jaxom]

2 hours ago, Orange Knight said:

I don't believe the paradigm has shifted at all, even with the return of classic units like Sternguard and Terminators. Why? These returning units are all 1st company veterans. Alongside these releases we also had Infernus marines which resemble the typical Primaris specialist-type units.

Hard disagree, but I don’t think because of Firstborn/Primaris stuff. I think the real paradigm shift is weapons and gubbinz for the early Primaris units; because they were spread over more than one role in a way that is now unnecessary. The most bandied around example is Intercessors or Hellblasters. They went from three weapon options to one; freeing up a lot of space for a sprue redesign including more aesthetic gubbinz. Or Hellblasters, what if they used the free’d up space to add actually distinct weapon options?

[Orange Knight]

7 minutes ago, jaxom said:

Hard disagree, but I don’t think because of Firstborn/Primaris stuff. I think the real paradigm shift is weapons and gubbinz for the early Primaris units; because they were spread over more than one role in a way that is now unnecessary. The most bandied around example is Intercessors or Hellblasters. They went from three weapon options to one; freeing up a lot of space for a sprue redesign including more aesthetic gubbinz. Or Hellblasters, what if they used the free’d up space to add actually distinct weapon options?

 

Oh yeah, the rules of the units were streamlined, but their roles weren't changed.

 

The point I was making was that each of the Primaris units that isn't a veteran is still acting as a specialist - A particular weapon type or ability that excels at a particular function.

 

I'm totally in favour of streamlining units. When you have 100 unit options, the units themselves don't need a massive bunch of internal options as well, especially when GW have never been able to balance the internal wargear selections in the first place.

Edited Tuesday at 03:04 PM by Orange Knight

[LemartesTheLost]

50 minutes ago, Lord Nord in Gravis Armour said:

As far as the grav-bikes, I think the important thing is that we can all agree that when they ARE released as a generic squad unit, it's incontestable that they must be wearing Phobos armor.

 

Whew. For a second there, I thought some people might actually want to argue about that.

How much time do we have, Lord Nord? I’ll argue for Tacticus until the cows home come 

[SvenIronhand]

3 hours ago, redmapa said:

Primaris infantry just needs a bit cleaning imo, its a bunch of redundant options that were designed out of a need to not step into firstborn shoes but also not taken far enough to be truly different. Like do Intercessors need 3 types of bolters? Do Phobos units need 3 types of Bolters? Devastators are probably gonna stop existing sooner than later, why not collapse every Tacticus special weapon squad into one kit or unit? Tacticals will also become obsolete, why not recreate them in a new Intercessor box with actual options and not just ammo pouches, Reivers need an actual role and all the Phobos units need something other than slightly different bolters imo.

This shows how out of date your information is. Intercessors have had 1 “bolt rifle” option on their datasheet since the beginning of 10th.

[redmapa]

4 minutes ago, SvenIronhand said:

This shows how out of date your information is. Intercessors have had 1 “bolt rifle” option on their datasheet since the beginning of 10th.

 

Which was exactly my point, the sprues and units need a second pass not only because of the Primaris vs Firstborn issue will soon go away but also because their sprues have too many redundant things that need to change that were part of an obsolete design paradigm, you can easily remove all the superfluous options from the hellblaster kit and add other gun options, hell give them autocannons and erase Suppressors from existence.

[Orange Knight]

I hate to be cynical but when GW eventually do create new sprues for units like Hellblasters, they will indeed remove the redundant plasma variants - but they'll likely just sell less plastic for the same price or greater.

[Nephaston]

1 hour ago, Lord Nord in Gravis Armour said:

As far as the grav-bikes, I think the important thing is that we can all agree that when they ARE released as a generic squad unit, it's incontestable that they must be wearing Phobos armor.

 

50 minutes ago, LemartesTheLost said:

How much time do we have, Lord Nord? I’ll argue for Tacticus until the cows home come 

Insanity, the grav bikes simply must be steered by Gravis-clad marines, if only for the pun, even if the scars character is in Tacticus. 

 

Phobos bikers should be on dirt bikes.

[Orange Knight]

On a slight tangent, I actually feel pretty disappointed that the Outriders are just regular bikes instead of Grav bikes like the one used by Suboden Khan.

 

Now that I've seen the new model, love it or hate it, in terms of design it fits perfectly with the other Primaris vehicles and it would have complimented the range perfectly. 

 

Does anyone actually hate it? I think all grav bike variants have supporters and detractors, but I really feel this new type is pretty successful as a model. 

[Nephaston]

I personally would've kept the repulsor style assemblies to be a variant of the tracked vehicles (Land Raider>Repulsor, Rhino>Impulsor) especially since those will most likely stick around as long as possible. Though this is mostly due to me thinking regular bikes being cooler conceptually than floating bike.

 

That said, I do like that this new bike style seemingly comes with a heavy weapon slot instead of just another twin bolter to add to the already 3 gorillion bolters you get across the marine units.

[jaxom]

I can just imagine a group of White Scar tech marines going, “ Hold my fermented mare’s milk,” putting an Impulsor up on cinder blocks, and yanking the grave plates to make a custom jet bike.

[Marshal Reinhard]

52 minutes ago, Nephaston said:

 

Insanity, the grav bikes simply must be steered by Gravis-clad marines, if only for the pun,

You jest, but if gravis can fly then gravis can ride.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

14 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

You jest, but if gravis can fly then gravis can ride.

 

But only in style.

 

Outside of a Repulsor chassis, I think the only Gravis-armored vehicle occupants should be characters ensconced in thrones on the upper deck of an up-armored Storm Speeder piloted by lowly Tacticus wearers. They can handle the driving and firing while the regal Gravis marine looks for an interesting opportunity to knock some heads together, at which point he can give the order "Pull over and leave the motor running. This won't take long."

 

 

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 hour ago, Orange Knight said:

On a slight tangent, I actually feel pretty disappointed that the Outriders are just regular bikes instead of Grav bikes like the one used by Suboden Khan.

 

Now that I've seen the new model, love it or hate it, in terms of design it fits perfectly with the other Primaris vehicles and it would have complimented the range perfectly. 

 

Does anyone actually hate it? I think all grav bike variants have supporters and detractors, but I really feel this new type is pretty successful as a model. 

I think many people just wanted to ensure we still had standard wheeled bikes, at least that is my opinion on the matter. If there's both the grav bikes and wheeled bikes, that's perfectly fine.