Making an effort for 11th after skipping 10th

[Valkyrion]

I didn't play a single game or buy a single codex of 10th and only had the Leviathan box and its contents, so I missed the nuance of this reset, but I'm turning back to 40k for 11th and I want to do it properly from the beginning. No skirting around rules I don't like or find unintuitive, no conflating lore with rules, no shaking my head ruefully at enemy super heavies etc. I want to be part of the ship, part of the crew.

 

So, I have a few questions/statements that I'd like clarifying if I may;

 

List building:

There's no such thing as elites or fast attack or heavy support - there's Leader, Support, Battleline and then everything else, right?

There's a limit of 3 of any given datasheet - is there anything stopping me from fielding an army full of leaders, or vehicles, or just battleline?

I presume I need a Leader and a Battleline, but one never knows. 

 

Detachments and Dispositions:

How do I know which disposition is unlocked by a detachment?

How do I know how many Enhancements or Upgrades I can take, and are they free in terms of list building points? (e.g, is it a 50 point charge on top of the 2 detachment point cost or something?)

Are detachments and enhancements designed to be tailored, or is that frowned upon? For instance, am I free to choose which enhancement at the start of the game, or is it declared upon list creation? 

 

No doubt there'll be more, but once I understand these I think my 40k muscle memory will kick in and the wargame switches in my brain will align. 

 

[Tawnis]

List Building:
- Yes, that's essentially correct. You only need one character in your army and can take anything else. If that datasheet is marked unique (usually just named characters) you can only take 1. 3 for most units. 6 for Battleline In a 2k game. (IIRC correctly they officially said 2/4 respectively for 1k game, but I don't recall where I read that off the top of my head.)

- You can make an army of all tanks so long as at least 1 is a character. You don't need Battleline like you used to need Troops choices. 

 

D&D XD:

- Each Detachment will have their disposition listed next to them. 
- 3 Per army was last edition, I don't recall if they've 100% clarified it for 11th, but the assumption is it's still 3 for the army overall regardless of number of detachments taken. 

- It is designed for enhancements to be taken on list creation and should be submitted with your army list. 

 

Fell free to hit me up if you have any more questions. Always glad to help out new or returning players. 

[DemonGSides]

The one thing to add; all enhancements WILL have a points cost, so it will limit what you can bring.  In 10th I think most Enhancements (Which were non-epic character only except for a few specific cases) were between 10-50 points.

Edited June 12 by DemonGSides

[Valkyrion]

1 hour ago, Tawnis said:

D&D XD:

- Each Detachment will have their disposition listed next to them. 
- 3 Per army was last edition, I don't recall if they've 100% clarified it for 11th, but the assumption is it's still 3 for the army overall regardless of number of detachments taken. 

- It is designed for enhancements to be taken on list creation and should be submitted with your army list. 

 

Fell free to hit me up if you have any more questions. Always glad to help out new or returning players. 

 

Thank you @Tawnis really helpful, but where will this be listed? Has it not happened yet (which explains why I can't find it!)

[Tawnis]

I skimmed through the new Core Rules looking for it, but didn't see anything. It will likely come in the mission deck when that's released. (Unless I missed something.)

 

Edited June 12 by Tawnis

[Karhedron]

12 hours ago, Valkyrion said:

Thank you @Tawnis really helpful, but where will this be listed? Has it not happened yet (which explains why I can't find it!)

 

They have been published on Warcom. Check out the faction pack download article for each faction. E.g. Space Marines

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/2ekfivpk/new40k-download-new-space-marine-faction-packs-today/

 

 

[W.A.Rorie]

So at 1k the max unit is 2 unless battleline, then it is double so 4

 

at 2k it becomes units is 3 unless battleline, then it is double so 6

 

from this WarComm Article

 

[Valkyrion]

So if a detachment makes something a Character that isn't normally then I could potentially field <UNIT TYPE> exclusively.

For example, if a detachment made a Land Raider a Character then I could field an army entirely of vehicles provided no 3 datasheets were the same. 

Or I could field an entire army of space marine command staff. 

Not sure why I would, but I find it equal parts liberating, daunting and against every fibre of my wargaming being! I'm used to the traditional FOC so straight away this will be new (and fun). 

 

[DemonGSides]

20 minutes ago, Valkyrion said:

So if a detachment makes something a Character that isn't normally then I could potentially field <UNIT TYPE> exclusively.

For example, if a detachment made a Land Raider a Character then I could field an army entirely of vehicles provided no 3 datasheets were the same. 

Or I could field an entire army of space marine command staff. 

Not sure why I would, but I find it equal parts liberating, daunting and against every fibre of my wargaming being! I'm used to the traditional FOC so straight away this will be new (and fun). 

 

 

Yeah pretty much.  As long as at least one unit in the army is a character, the rest of the make-up is whatever you want.  It's simultaneously liberating and also annoying, because it does reinforce the idea of "Just spam the best thing".  11th edition will be combating this with increased points per copy of certain datasheets, meaning things like the new Defiler that is the big hotness for damage in CSM armies, is going to increase in cost between 1 and 2, and probably also between 2 and 3.

 

It does let you make MUCH more thematic lists though.  I played an IG game where the only non vehicle models were 2 enginseers.  Everything else was tracked or wheeled and it was a lot of fun, since they have two datasheets that are just "Tank but character".

Edited June 13 by DemonGSides

[Valkyrion]

By my way of thinking, 11th should be a better version of 10th, which means 12th will jump the shark, so 13th will be a hard reset, so my aim here is to play 11th for the next 6 years by ignoring 12th. I only get to play once a month on average and the first 6 of those are learning to play the new rules, and everything changes again upon codex release. Ain't nobody got time for that, casually at least. 

 

So I was thinking of making a 2000 point army of each disposition - I have 10k+ of space marines (mostly HH, but an intercessor is a space marine with a bolter to all intents and purposes!) and 5k+ of orks, so I know I could cover Purge or Take and Hold. I'm interested in building a recon and disruption list with something I've never used before, like Tau or Eldar (no such word as Aeldari in my house!).

 

 

 

[Valkyrion]

Going back to the detachments;

 

If I pick 2 (or 3) detachments, do I gain everything?  The detachment rule, availability of enhancements and all stratagems? 

 

Using Chaos Knights as that's the PDF I have open;

If I picked all 3 1DP detachments, my Tyrant would have +1 to hit battleshocked units, my War Dogs would have +6" spotting range and I could take a unit of cultists.

I could then pick one enhancement from each, and gain access to all 9 stratagems.

 

[Karhedron]

Yes, that's right. If you pick all 3 1-point Detachments, you would get access to everything they contain.

[Valkyrion]

Okay, so I think I'm seeing a pattern.

1DP gives a benefit to a unit type - could be Psyker, could be Walker, could be Character

2DP gives a benefit to the army with an exception - e.g all Infantry but not Vehicles, or all vehicles but not infantry

3DP gives a benefit to the whole army.

 

Is that basically it? 

 

Edited June 16 by Valkyrion

[Karhedron]

24 minutes ago, Valkyrion said:

Okay, so I think I'm seeing a pattern.

1DP gives a benefit to a unit type - could be Psyker, could be Walker, could be Character

2DP gives a benefit to the army with an exception - e.g all Infantry but not Vehicles, or all vehicles but not infantry

3DP gives a benefit to the whole army.

 

Is that basically it?

 

Close but not entirely Sage of the Beastslayer (Space Wolves) gives the entire army Lethal Hits vs Monsters and Vehicles (with the ability to have it vs everything) but is only 2DPs. I think GW have done it based on how successful the Detachments were in competitive play over the last year or so.

[Valkyrion]

Okay, last (for now) question - you linked me to WarCom showing DP values, so are these DP values listed in the codexes or something? 

Surely it's not solely a vague link on WarCom that tells us DP values?  

The only 10th ed codex I have is Tyranids, and I can't recall seeing anything in their detachments that tells me how many points they are, but I could easily be wrong. 

 

[Karhedron]

Not in the codices yet since they were printed before the idea existed. Most likely they will be listed in the MFM alongside points values for units. I believe a new one is due to be released tomorrow.

[Heraclite]

They just released it : https://mfm.warhammer-community.com/en