Battle of the Boyfriends! SM -vs- ORKS

[mes]

A note on terminators vs orcs: I played a game aginst the oner of my LGS recently, and By far my standout unit in the game was a terminator squad with an assault cannon, and a librarian with Gate. Orc shooting couldn't touch them (lost about 1 model every two turns to lootas) and I bounced out of assault range with the libby when they got close. I think a CML would have been better than the assault cannon, but I need to get a hold of the bits for that.

[Snozz]

Sternguard are always a good choice against orks. They have some fantastic ammo for taking them down and combi flamers to boot. Here's some math hammer stuff for sternguard ammo types against ork bikers.

 

Non turbo boost - Hellfire or Kraken

 

Hellfire 2.77 kills out of 10 shots

 

Kraken 2.22 kills out of 10 shots

 

Turbo boost - Hellfire or Dragonfire

 

Hellfire 1.85 kills out of 10 shots

 

Dragonfire 1.1 kills out of 10 shots

 

So hellfire all the way here.

 

Against regular ork boyz not in cover

 

Hellfire (duh :rolleyes:)

 

Against regular ork boyz in 5+ cover

 

Hellfire 3.70 kills out of 10 shots

 

Dragonfire 3.33 kills out of 10 shots

 

Against regular ork boyz in 4+ cover

 

Hellfire 2.77 kills out of 10 shots

 

Dragonfire 3.33 kills out of 10 shots

 

So Hellfire rounds all the way except against boyz in 4+ cover.

 

A Sternguard Squad with combi flamers (don't be shy take at least 5 :lol:) can easily decimate an ork mob in a turn, and against bikers their hellfire rounds can do some damage.

 

However the magic weapon against orks... The Dakka Pred. Armour 13 at the front. 8 Ap 4 shots a turn. Math hammered it looks like this:

 

3.11 kills per turn per Dakka Pred. That's against bikers. Take 3 of these and you can decimate 9 bikers a turn. All for just 255 points for 3. In 1000 points this will own. :);)

 

Against ork boyz it gets better.

 

3.77 kills per turn per Dakka Pred.

 

Still pretty decent but it's really points earning ability is against bikers. It can kill 77.75 points per turn, nearly what it's worth. Not only that but it could almost knock out Wazdakka in a single turn. I seriously suggest taking 3 of these things. Especially if he's taking bikes. Then a solid core of troops, with flamers and missile launchers / plasma cannons and you're in business. :)

 

Hope this helps, sorry for all the numbers. :P

[RandomGuy]

Okay, well it would appear I have only signed up here so I can tell you how to win... Hope you're happy.

Well your opponent couldn't have been much crueler than to pick Orks. They have so much diversity that it's very difficult to tailor a list to fight them. Although as an Ork player (unbeaten in 5th ed with them) I now know roughly what works and what doesn't.

 

Firstly I've put my current ork list up for 1500 points so you know what you COULD be facing. (I've left off the upgrades out so that any snooping Ork players can't work my list out...)

 

Big Mek with KFF

10 Tankbustas

20 Shoota Boyz

20 Shoota Boyz

10 Grots

10 Grots

10 Shoota Boyz with Trukk

Deff Dread

5 Bikers

3 Koptas

3 Lobbas

3 Kanz

3 Kanz

 

The main way of beating the Orks is concentrate firepower. They are fearless most of the time, but when they get below 10 they will be off like guardsmen and not rallying. If when you deploy you refuse flank the ork player then you will by default be able to do that. Pick a side of the table where you have a decent fire arc and stick there. If you use the terrain properly then it will slow the orks down and channel them right into your concentrated firepower. The ork player will also more than likely have a large army forcing him to deploy over a wider section of the table taking some of his units out of the game. If he can squeeze his forces opposite you then you will get far more hits with your whirlwinds. I would recommend you find 2 for your list as they will pay for their points many times over. Keep them well out of the way and don't worry about line of sight there will be enough orks that you won't really be able to miss.

 

I would also recommend a unit of sniper scouts. I know that this doesn't sound like the best unit ever against orks, but they will prove invaluable against the smaller ork squads, being pinning they can keep the smaller ork trukk mobs in order. If you blow a trukk up the last thing you really want is the unit inside to get to your battle lines and start choppin'. Used properly they can manage to give you another turn to shoot those boys as you pin them. Don't also underestimate the ability to infiltrate against an ork army. When you are refuse flanking a bunch of orks in can either force a unit of boyz to split off and take on your scouts or for the army to deploy across the whole of his deployment zone in anticipation of your scouts going on the other side of the table again taking them out of the game. If you take tellion with the unit as well you can assign the wounds that tellion causes, very useful for taking out painboys from nobs squads and nobs from boyz squads. The 10+ wound power fist is the bane of marine.

 

Ork shooting is very much underrated. Don't make the mistake of ignoring the feeble shoota boy. Yes BS2 means they are more likely to miss than anything, but don't let that fool you. The main thing that makes orks powerful is the fact that they have no heavy weapons and their main guns are assault 2 rng 18". This means that they can outshoot marines in a lot of situations. Just remember this, if they are within 18" in their turn then you can rapid fire them next turn. For this reason I would recommend not hugging terrain. I have played many games when my boyz have been out in the open, when my opponent has stuffed up his difficult terrain roll and only managed to get within 13" or so. That is both unnecessary and annoying for the marine player because nothing in my army is really AP3.

 

There is no need to be inside the terrain playing against the orks unless he has taken battle wagons or looted wagons with the big boom gunz on them. Without them the most potent threat lies with the rokkit launcher which any less than 3 are a joke. Even with a unit of 8 I am surprised when they actually do something.

 

A further note on terrain is that the orks tend to take their own with them in the shape of a kustom force field. If there are vehicles within 6 of it then just ignore them unless you have nothing else to shoot at or you would give him a cover save anyway. There will come a point where the force field mek can't keep up with them, because the vehicle is fast, in assault range or the mek has some real difficult terrain to negotiate. If the ork player is happy for his vehicles to be slowed down like that then be happy because he won't be delivering death to your army quite as quickly.

 

A note on flamers. I don't really know what the fuss is over flamers really, they aren't all they're talked up to be. Yes you will cause a number of hits with them that ignore cover, but they still have to roll to wound. If you can get 10 orks under the template (and i haven't seen people get much more than that) then that is on average 5 dead orks. Now in return next turn that's a dead squad. Not a particularly great trade off if you ask me. Flamers are good en mass, but marines can't get them without paying over the odds for them. Sure you can have 5 sternguard with combi-flamers but it will cost you 150 points. For that you can nearly get 10 tactical marines. Okay they only have one flamer but then again they can also have a missile launcher. I'd much rather shoot the orks at range than worry about flaming them and then losing the squad in the next turn.

Just to confuse you some more though if you are taking vulcan or sisters then flamers do become useful. Sisters can take 2 to a 10 man squad and vulcan makes the flamers twin-linked. This makes then far more effective and worth the obvious risk in using them.

 

Okay so back to my army, I know that your girlfriend's sister's boyfriend probably won't be using that exact list but with a bit of tweaking I'm sure you can come up with something...

 

Chapter Master w/Storm Bolter, Lightning Claw and Axillary Grenade Launcher (158/158)

 

Tactical Squad w/Flamer and Missile Launcher (170/328)

 

Tactical Squad w/Flamer and Missile Launcher (170/498)

 

Tactical Squad w/Flamer and Missile Launcher (170/668)

 

Scout Squad w/8 Snipers, Heavy Bolter and Telion (200/868)

 

Ironclad Dreadnought w/2x Flamer in Drop Pod w/Deathwind Missile Launcher (205/1073)

 

Scout Bikers x5 w/3 Grenade Launchers and Cluster Mines (150/1223)

 

Thunderfire Cannon (100/1323)

 

Whirlwind (85/1408)

 

Whirlwind (85/1593)

 

Now I know what you are probably thinking, how on earth do you take dreadnoughts with that lot. The answer is you don't have to. With most of the missions being about capturing objectives killing his troops choices is top priority and with all those templates you won't be able to miss. The thunderfire cannon has the ability to slow the army down, very important and the whirlwinds will ensure that he is hugging the terrain. Remember that with barrage weapons the shot is assumed to come from the hole in the middle for the purposes of cover so if he's hiding behind the terrain make him pay. The ironclad will turn up in turn 1 garanteed and provide your opponent with something to think about. How do I stop this amour 13 monster from toasting me? And the Drop pod will provide another pie plate to add to the collection.

 

I hope you have found my rambling useful and it helps you win. For the record my main army is a DIY chapter, I just like to WAAAGH! from time to time...

 

Random Guy

[I am Legion]

Randomguy is right, but i would recommend taking a CC army. Firstly as marines, not many of you will be dieing. Don't get me wrong though, you will be hurt by the end. I have a list that has conquered two foes fighting against me at the same time. It's an all-rounder list, but in your case I would make a few adjustments. Firstly Take out the DEVs alltogether and replace with 2-3 Whirlwinds. Put 2 flamers in each of the assault squads, and maybe a third meltagun in one of the tactical squads. Now this is a 2000 point army, but removing an assault squad and a tac should bring you down where you need to be. I know you want to use bikes and termies, but they will get dragged down very quickly. a bunch of drop podding tacticals surrounding a couple units and unleashing hell will wipe out most of his army in turn one. Think about it.

 

115 Chaplain JP

 

185 10xTAC MM, Flamer, PW

185 10xTAC MM, Flamer, PW

185 10xTAC MM, Flamer, PW

190 10xTAC MM, Meltagun, PW

175 10xTAC MM, Meltagun

175 5xDrop Pod

 

215 10xRAS PF

215 10xRAS PF

 

186 6xDEV 3xML, 1xLAS

170 5xDEV 3xML, 1xLAS

 

1996

 

This is a revised list that would deal with them fairly easily. The strategies are quite simple and visible. Orbital goes on killa kans, same with the attack bikes. tacks deeps strike infront of the masses and halt them where they stand. You can even take out the PWs for some more poaints as orks have a 6+ armour save. If you put one or two locater beacons on your pods then that assault squad with flamers can land right where you need them and BURN everything. This is a powerful unit by the way. So yeah I hope this helped a little. Let us know how it goes! Keep in mind that beacuase he is fearless he will be losing extra models in CC very quickly. Especially once the unit is whittled down a little. SO CHARGE!!!!!

125 Chapter Master ORBITAL

 

185 10xTAC MM, Flamer, PW

185 10xTAC MM, Flamer, PW

175 10xTAC MM, Meltagun

175 10xTAC MM, Meltagun

140 4xDrop Pod

 

235 10xRAS 2xFlamer

100 2xAttack bike MM

 

85 Whirlwind

85 Whirlwind

 

1490

[HotSoup]

I think, personally, that loads of dakka is the way to go. Three Whirlwinds, three typhoon Speeders, and as many Razorback squads as possible should do him in. Heres a list Iw ould use, for 1k points:

 

HQ-Master of the Forge

Conversion Beamer

Total-120p

 

Troops-6 Tactical Marines

Sargent- Storm Bolter

Razorback, Extra Armor, Storm Bolter

Total-181

 

Troops-5 Tactical Marines

Sargent- Storm Bolter

Razorback, Extra Armor, Storm Bolter

Total-165

 

Fast Attack-Land Speeder

Typhoon Missile Launcher

Total-90p

 

Fast Attack-Land Speeder

Typhoon Missile Launcher

Total-90p

 

Fast Attack-Land Speeder

Typhoon Missile Launcher

Total-90p

 

Heavy Support- Whirlwind

Total-85p

 

Heavy Support- Whirlwind

Total-85p

 

Heavy Support- Whirlwind

Total-85p

 

Total-991p

 

3 Pie plates, 6 missile launchers, five heavy bolters, a conversion beamer, and 4 storm bolters. Go in a corner with you're objective(s), force him to come to you under your fire of win, and have a squad take a 2nd objective, if needed, at the end. This should deal effectively with whatever kind of orks your new rival plays. The missiles will eat transports and orks alike, and everything else can rip apart the hordes that will come, in whatever form. The whirlwinds can deny cover and armor saves against all types of orks, and everything else denies their armor. You shouldn't lose, if you don't try to do anythign aggressive, just sit back and shoot him to pieces.

[RandomGuy]

3 Pie plates, 6 missile launchers, five heavy bolters, a conversion beamer, and 4 storm bolters. Go in a corner with you're objective(s), force him to come to you under your fire of win, and have a squad take a 2nd objective, if needed, at the end. This should deal effectively with whatever kind of orks your new rival plays. The missiles will eat transports and orks alike, and everything else can rip apart the hordes that will come, in whatever form. The whirlwinds can deny cover and armor saves against all types of orks, and everything else denies their armor. You shouldn't lose, if you don't try to do anythign aggressive, just sit back and shoot him to pieces.

 

I'm sorry buy your tactics there are way off. You have nothing to take down amour. Even at 1000 points Orks still may have a fair few trukks or dreads. Your heavy bolters will have a job taking down even kans, and when they get to combat and tie you up, that will be pretty much game over. The other thing you underestimate is the range of an orks gun. Assault 2 rng18" will outshoot most things. I myself have done it and outshot marines. The fact that my big shootas outrange bolters makes it even more of an issue. Any shooty ork army will make light work of your Land Speeders and will stick to the terrain so your whirlwinds are still giving up a cover save. When it comes to capturing objectives you have 2 troops choices, which sure fit inside razorbacks but if the orks get to even one of those you have pretty much lost.

 

I think if you try to go too shooty your plan will backfire. You need some form of assault unit if only for counter attack. Also the guy wants to win the game not be forever more branded a powergamer. Try to come up with a list that doesn't look like you are blatently trying to beat up orks, because 1) I know it will probably lose and 2) it won't be much fun for either player.

 

Random Guy

[HotSoup]

See blue for comments.

 

I'm sorry buy your tactics there are way off. You have nothing to take down amour. Even at 1000 points Orks still may have a fair few trukks or dreads. Your heavy bolters will have a job taking down even kans, and when they get to combat and tie you up, that will be pretty much game over. The other thing you underestimate is the range of an orks gun. Assault 2 rng18" will outshoot most things. I myself have done it and outshot marines. The fact that my big shootas outrange bolters makes it even more of an issue. Any shooty ork army will make light work of your Land Speeders and will stick to the terrain so your whirlwinds are still giving up a cover save. When it comes to capturing objectives you have 2 troops choices, which sure fit inside razorbacks but if the orks get to even one of those you have pretty much lost.

 

It have 6 Str 8 missiles and a S8-10(Mostly) conversion beamer, doesn't that take down armor? Whirlwinds have ignore cover shots. There should be enough shooty to take any ork army at 1000p down. Lootas and like can be outranged by Whirlwinds/Speeders, so shooty orks isn't an issue.

 

I think if you try to go too shooty your plan will backfire. You need some form of assault unit if only for counter attack. Also the guy wants to win the game not be forever more branded a powergamer. Try to come up with a list that doesn't look like you are blatently trying to beat up orks, because 1) I know it will probably lose and 2) it won't be much fun for either player.

 

Random Guy

Ork's will probably eat him in assault, and it costs too much for a good unit at 1000p. Also, he wants to win, at all costs, or he loses important things for a couple of weeks. Being a dick power gamer is worth it for that, I would imagine.

 

There is enough shooty of all kinds to take down whatever vehicles orks field, and however many models they feild. I can see about ~120 model horde going into 1000p, or about 4-5 trukks, depending on how cheap he runs his units.

 

He could go LRC spam, and rely on the fact that orks have nothing that can effectively kill them. Rokkits hit rarely and can only glance, and they have no dependable S9+ weapons. And with hitting on 4-6 in combat, you can deny him effective Claw use.

[Sternguard sergeant McColl]

Don't rule out terminators, 24" relentless storm bolters, power fists and heavy weapons can do a number on any ork unit without AV. Or more specifically assault terminators, with the correct weapons, covering fire can make full boys squads run for cover. A LRC with 8 assault terminators (6 LC, 2 TH&SS) can take down most any ork and will demand attention from his already spread thin high strength and AP.

[HotSoup]

Don't rule out terminators, 24" relentless storm bolters, power fists and heavy weapons can do a number on any ork unit without AV. Or more specifically assault terminators, with the correct weapons, covering fire can make full boys squads run for cover. A LRC with 8 assault terminators (6 LC, 2 TH&SS) can take down most any ork and will demand attention from his already spread thin high strength and AP.

And cost 650p. In 1000p. That's insane, and you must know it. Too massively of an all your eggs in one basket.

[Spurs]

Two main points to raise at this junction guys... sorry to be quick but I’m at work. He has his list now so I’ll post that up by the end of the week with my list.

 

1.) As much as I want to win this... I'm not going to cheddar this game up. Terminators jumping out of land raiders in a 1000 points game is cheesy to me... My mate had a list with two redeemers and sternguard... I told him to take a flying leap. My opponent is a very good general and despises cheese as much as any good general so I’d like to show him the same respect he's shown... even if I do want to mop his orkish blood up with his face!

 

2.) Templates are great but 6 is too many... I'd be happy with two typhoons or one whirlwind at max. Two whirlwinds screams cheese at 1000 points and anything more than two typhoons screams GORGANZOLLA!

 

We want this to be an interesting fight... Although I want to obliterate him... I don't want the bat rep to be... he moved forward... I shot at him... he moved forward... I shot at him... he tried to charge... I made him run with 6 templates... he regrouped... I shot at him... Get the point???

 

Crusaders are definitely out... I would consider terminators as there have been some very good points put forward as to their usefulness against orcs but at the moment I’m not completely sold on them. A whirlwind or demolisher is quite acceptable and so are two typhoons. I will be taking at least one full bike squad and the telion led scouts. Would love to take a thunderfire cannon but at present can't be arsed buying one... $85 for a techmarine and small turret is a little too high for my liking. Probably wait till the next big maelstrom order goes through.

 

I really have to thank you all for the input you've all been so willing to give me. It's been fantastic the amount of buzz this game is getting and the spectator list has grown to a point were we've had to start turning people away. We've even got a friend of ours bringing his super camera to take game pics so you will all get a front row seat.

 

On a particular note I want to thank randomguy for his exceptionally detailed tactica on orcs... I think we can all appreciate the need for such a deep inside look into the orcs.

 

And thanks everyone once again for your input... Like Morte said, "I think this high-stakes gaming business is good for the hobby! "

 

Cheers boys and i'll post the info ASAP! :P

[Spurs]

Quick update... Played pool against him last night and totally kicked him to the curb three times over!

 

He's starting to take on a green and red tinge in his face every time i beat him at something so the advanced psychological warfare is coming along brilliantly. We have 10 games of paintballing coming up in a week from this Saturday so after i bruise him up good with paint balls flying at 300 feet per second we've decided it's time to fight.

 

In a breif lapse of concentration last night he let slip that he'll be feilding a single tank or wagon, a squad of tankhunters or something, a few mecks and infantry. He doesn't want to swap lists beforehand so this is about as much information i will be able to obtain.

 

Running through previous posts i've come up with a couple of conclusions.

 

• 
  
• He has tank hunters so the pred might be in for a fight. Not sure whether it's still viable taking it. If i do then i'm going to have to take out those tank boys quickly.
  
• He has a single tank as he called it and i remember one of you mentioning it should have negligable armour the two melta guns on my bike squad and a multi melta should be enough to take care of this. If not the missile launchers will.
  
• meks i'm a little worried about... if anyone has had a fair bit of experience with these let me know.
  
• Also need to know if it's still worth taking telion and the scouts. I think it is and for so cheap having the wound allocation will be invaluble.
  

 

The list i'm thinking so far is as follows:

 

Captain on a bike with power fist

Bike Squad (8man) 2x melta with MM attack bike

Scout Bike Squad (5man) 3xgrenade launchers, cluster mines

Scout Squad (5man) 4 sniper, 1 ML with telion and camo cloaks

Tac Squad (10man) flamer/ML

2 Landspeeder Typhoons

 

What do you guys think? Near enough to 1k points with a tweak.

 

I've taken the advice to cut back on pure tank killing power, included the uber template approach and selective killing power of telion. I've got 4-6 objective taking units, a scouting party and infiltrating squad as well as a nice surprise in a piece or terrain near him.

 

Your ongoing support is madly appreciated.

 

Cheers boys!

[I am Legion]

you're going to get hurt with that army. you've got very few units, and he's going to outnumber and outweapon you by about 3 times. Your army sounds like a fun army to use in a friendly game. But this isn't the place. even if you are just kidding about losing the important thing in life, you sounded like there was some pride involved here. I still recomend my list. It's not cheap and It's highly effective. There is alot of psychological warfare already. Wait till you see his face when he gives up on turn 4..... -_- I love that list.............

 

also keep in mind that what he tells you he'll be using is also part of the psychological warfare. never trust your enemy!!!!!

 

keep in mind that he can have 3 MLs in each ork mob. those will easily take out those bikes and speeders...........including your commander.....

[Spurs]

What would you cut out of your 1500 points list to make it 1k?

[greatcrusade08]

Take Telion for his ability to kill squad leaders (nobs with claws), and dont be afraid to take 2 or 3 dreads.

At 125 points you can get one with assault cannon and ML, if he has huge mobs with no power claws even a dread with no ccw can hold them off.

 

Stick Telion in with a few snipers and you can pin the smaller units too.

 

Against orks id be tempted to take basic tac squads (ML and flamer) at 170 points, you can give them P. fists if you want, but orks only have a 6+ save so you dont always need power weapons.

 

Paying the few extra points for the chapter master would give you a nice pie plate for the first turn at strength 10 AP1, with massed orks that should do some hurty death!!

 

Orks if i recall dont have huge armour values on thier vehicles, so ML's should do the trick most of the time.

 

Id do this (sorry dont have codex this is from top of my head)

 

Tac 1: basic ML, flamer.....170 points

Tac 2: basic ML, flamer.....170 points

Chapter master with meltabombs and power sword......160ish points???

5 sniper scouts with Telion.....125 points

Dread ML, assault cannon.....125 points

Dread ML, assault cannon.....125 points

Vindicator with storm bolter.....125 points

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

GC08

[Jackelope King]

As far as the big mek is concerned, my buddy likes to stick him in with his Lootaz and give him a Shokk Attack Gun, which can be extremely nasty for MEQs. Pie plates with AP 3 are bad news no matter how you slice it, and unless he rolls doubles, he's still going to have an easy time wounding even bikers (especially if he sticks them with lootaz). If he mounted his mek on a bike, he'd be relentless. This wouldn't matter much for a big mek (since his range is something like 5' with a shokk attack gun), but would let him maneuver well to get line of sight. If this is what comes out, cover matters, and turbo-charging (if you decide to run bikes) will be helpful.

 

If the Big Mek breaks out a Kustom Force Field (more likely in my mind), his boyz get that much harder to hurt. This one I don't have any experience with, however. If you can get creative and slow down the mek or another valuable unit a KFF Big Mek is protecting (pinning a smaller unit with sniper fire, for instance), you can essentially kick one of the legs of his advance out from under him, as he'll either need to slow his advance to account for the loss of coverage on the KFF or he'll leave part of his advance exposed to your attacks.

 

Rokkit boyz have to shoot at the biggest model they can target, I believe. If you're flexible, you can use this to send bait their way and let a more important model go untouched. Spend a rhino, spare the dread. You can also do something like this to block line of sight to a vindicator or other tank to cover while the more valuable tank gets into range.

 

Especially if you run dreads, Telion's ability to pick of Power Klaw-wielding Nobs can essentially let you shred hordes of boyz with big, tough walkers at your leisure. S4 doesn't mean anything when your front armor is 12.

 

The only other thing I'd add would be that flamers are good. Very good. While it's not hard to space orks 2" apart to minimize damage from blast weapons, it's very hard to keep them staggered well enough that you can't find a line of them to hit with a flamer. And since it ignores cover and burns right through their pitiful armor save, you basically get to place your flamer template and remove half of the models you hit on average.

[RandomGuy]

Now I know what you're faced with this shouldn't be too much of an issue. I respect your hatred for cheese and I despise it also. A few tips for the list...

 

Why are you taking bikes? I know I advocate counter attacking orks, I don't think that bikes can hack it against them. Although assault marines are not scoring for you I would have them over bikes any day against orks. Keep them standard and give the sergeant twin lightning claws. Re-rolls to wound against orks is great. With a jump packing chaplain they will be near unstoppable.

 

I would drop the commander all together but if you feel that you need him please get rid of that fist. Going last against an army that you would normally going first against isn't clever really. And as you have told he only has 1 tank, something krak grenades can deal with anyway. Everything in the ork army have rear armour 10 and most is open topped so hell you can take them down with strength 4 of your normal guys. I think you will find either a pair of claws or a relic blade more useful because that's less attacks back.

 

Drop pods are your friends against tankbustas. They have to shoot tanks before anything else so if you drop one next to the tankbustas then they'll be forever blowing it up. They have 1/9 chance of causing a penetrating hit. If they get lucky and blow it up it's not as if you'll miss a storm bolter either eh? Until they do make sure you kill a few with it though. If you feel like a deathwind launcher then it's not going to break the bank either.

 

So models permitting this is what I'd tweak (or rip your list up and throw it away and replace it with) list to:

 

Chaplain w/Jump Pack

Scout Bikes (as below)

Tactical Squad (as below)

Scouts x10 w/Tellion, Missile Launcher and 8 Snipers

Assault Marines x10 w/ sergeant with twin lightning claws

Tactical Marines x5 in Drop pod with deathwind launcher

 

I know that a lot of people swear by the typhoons but I had to lose them for 2 reasons, they are too many points and by taking them they make the tankbustas useful again. If you're going to drop the tactical squad then go for them. I felt I had to boost up the troops count having lost the bikes.

 

Glad you liked my original tactica. If other people liked it then let me know and I'll expand it to a more general how to beat orks one rather than a random rant. Hope that's helped...

 

Random Guy

[greatcrusade08]

Chaplain w/Jump Pack

Scout Bikes (as below)

Tactical Squad (as below)

Scouts x10 w/Tellion, Missile Launcher and 8 Snipers

Assault Marines x10 w/ sergeant with twin lightning claws

Tactical Marines x5 in Drop pod with deathwind launcher

 

Random Guy

 

Random Guy makes alot of sense here, assault marines with a chappy would mince up orks quite bad (reroll with 34 attacks on the charge), if anything i would reiterate the points made above about Dreads, these bad boys at 105-125 points each will negate big units of S4 boys all day! Worth a thought!

 

As for cheese im another to jump on your band wagon! I hate seeing it.

I had a game against orks once where in 700 points my opponent took 2 units of 30 boys each with a warphead (upg weirdboy) and 3 coptas.

 

He set them up like this:

 

O O O O O O O O O

O O O O O O O O

O O O O O O O O O

 

O

 

W

 

O= Ork

W= Warphead

 

So when the warphead blew his brain up the template only covered him and 1 other ork as he kept them 4 and 2 inches from the main group respectively.

So he could use the mob rule to get Ld10 on his warphead roles and not have any kills to his men when something bad happened, Also something i still have to check, when a warpheads brain blows up can he pass on the wound to another model?

Anyway he lost about 4 orks to warphead and on the turns he rolled a zzap, took out every one of my tanks, the git.

I was playing with my Tau at the time, but decided if this was his idea of a 'friendly game' to try out my new army i really didnt want to play his orks again.

 

Also for Ork players can you call a Waaagh without a warboss?

 

GC08

(sorry for the hijack on the questions)

[RandomGuy]

Also for Ork players can you call a Waaagh without a warboss?

 

Yes you can, The rules say you can do it once per game. It makes no more requirements. You can a Waaagh! from the wierdboy and gazgul has his own waaagh! as well. I think it's possibly a bit cheesy to do it without one but perfectly legal.

 

Random Guy

[Jackelope King]

Random Guy makes alot of sense here, assault marines with a chappy would mince up orks quite bad (reroll with 34 attacks on the charge), if anything i would reiterate the points made above about Dreads, these bad boys at 105-125 points each will negate big units of S4 boys all day! Worth a thought!

Indeed. Especially if you can have Telion gun down any Power Klaw nobs before they can try smacking your dreads. A mob with a power klaw-wielding nob is a threat; a mob made up entirely of S4 boyz are there to be gobbled up like salted peanuts.

[Sternguard sergeant McColl]

If he's taking tankbustas you should have a quick unit to harass them, tankbustaz really do, well, bust tanks quite well. If he takes them in a trukk he can run the truck straight to you an the tank bustaz can use tank hammers (S10 AP1 I1) and those will brutalize any armor, but they are a points sink and the Trukk is very fragile. If Instead he takes a lootes tank as his transport well that could be more of a problem. Just watch out for the tankbustaz. Also I have to throw this out there, that Telion killing the PK nobs and then have dreads with assault cannons+HF or ML HF is bloody brilliant, without the PK he can't do anything to the dread and you can have the boys squad occupied the whole game.

[Spurs]

Date had been sent for the first weekend in December pending a birthday party. If not it'll be the second weekend.

 

I've taken a lot into account and reconsidered a few points that have been re-iterated passionately.

 

The list i've decided to accept is similar to yours RandomGuy but i've decided to take a dread with it instead of the combat squad.

 

Chaplain (Jump Pack)

Assault Marines (10, Serg with Twin Claws)

Tactical Squad (10, ML and Flamer)

Scouts (5, Telion, ML and 4 snipers)

Scout Bikes (5, 3 Grenade Launchers and cluster mines)

Ironclad Dread (twin heavy flamers in drop pod with deathwind launcher)

 

So... I'll be submitting my list this weekend to him to lock it all in and will post a bat rep in this thread after the game.

 

Thankyou to every one who has contributed to the build up of this game and given such a fantastic insight into the in's and out's of the green mob.

 

This campaign will escalate into 1500pts then 2000pts and then higher battles as this rivalry takes shape so i'll be sure to post again once the next battle is decided upon to explain the differing tactics/army compositions that arise from larger games against the green horde.

 

I'll keep you all posted!

[Inquisitor Fox]

I'm curious as to how this battle went.. should be right around now that it was scheduled :lol:

[jokester120]

with my army of sm i always go with a couple of tactical marine squads in rionos(lead by the prediter) whit close combat weapons lead by a char. with another 3 squads with bolthers and other weapions cover the rionos with 2 assault squads provide added support if needed and the speeders and bikes hit a single flank and crush it the move down thier lines the dread should be used as a close up weapon to knock out there bikes/tanks i never fails :D good luck with the battle

[General Retreat]

So when the warphead blew his brain up the template only covered him and 1 other ork as he kept them 4 and 2 inches from the main group respectively.

So he could use the mob rule to get Ld10 on his warphead roles and not have any kills to his men when something bad happened, Also something i still have to check, when a warpheads brain blows up can he pass on the wound to another model?

Anyway he lost about 4 orks to warphead and on the turns he rolled a zzap, took out every one of my tanks, the git.

I was playing with my Tau at the time, but decided if this was his idea of a 'friendly game' to try out my new army i really didnt want to play his orks again.

 

Also for Ork players can you call a Waaagh without a warboss?

 

GC08

(sorry for the hijack on the questions)

 

I think you got taken for a ride there, brother. When a model has to take a save from wargear or Perils of the warp, and it fails, you must assign the wound to that model, not another one in the squad, or even retinue.

 

I wish that when my plasmaguns overheated and I fail a Gets Hot! save, I could sacrifice a 16 point bolter-marine and keep the plasma on the field. I wish that when my Librarian rolls a 12 and takes a Perils attack, that he could throw a 16 point marine at the demon instead. But according to the rules, when that happens, I loose my 100+ point librarian because he is the one who used the power that caused the wound to himself.

 

I'm not up on Ork rules (rulez?) but I don't think he can sacrifice boys to keep his Warphead's brain from melting.

 

Anybody with the Ork codex, is there some special rule on the WH that would change this?

[Iron_Chaos_Brute]

No.

Perils=Hurt Ork.