Death Guard Tactica

[shaun03]

two dp in 1500 that dose sound bit power house. Has any taken part in the ard boyz turnys. I am thinking about trying it out. From what I hear the point list is 2250. And there nothing but powerlist. So I thinking of a few list types that might hold there own. It was toss up between DG or blood angels but with there codex is d*** up there seting this one out.

[Evil Homer]

I run 2 demon princes at 1500 points. It is tough to deal with them. I played 2 games at that level against blood angels last friday. Both games were over before the 4th turn. Mostly due to my warptime princes draining the blood out of the angels..

 

EH

[Vomikron Noxis]

Out of interest, what is the rest of your list? I have been considering using two DPs at 1500pts, but I always find the rest of my list suffers!

[Almighty1]

2 Winged Princes

2 Lascannon Predators

3 Plague Marine Squads

2 Obliterators / 3 Rhinos

5 Chaos space Marines / 1 Obliterator

 

That is my usual force, 1498 points or something like that, hope it helps.

[Evil Homer]

Out of interest, what is the rest of your list? I have been considering using two DPs at 1500pts, but I always find the rest of my list suffers!

2x DP w/ Wings, MoN, Warptime

2x 7 Plague Marine Squad 2x Melta, PF, Rhino

1x 7 Plague Marine Squad 2x Flamer, PF

Land Raider

Vindicator

 

Have been having some issue with the landraider, more a play style thing than an effectiveness thing. I think if I ran it more aggressively I would get more out of it. What I ma thinking of doing is dropping the Landraider for a 2nd Vindi, a rhino for the flamer PM squad, and then adding Havoc Launcher to all the rhinos in the list. Either that or dropping the Landraider for a Rhino and 2 oblits...

 

EH

[Slaphappy]

Hiya Demetriitz,

 

I've been a frustrated Plague marine for a while. I was all set to build an old codex death guard, complete with sacred sevens and nurglings etc. Quite the expenditure, lots of metal. Was all ready to go 'til the "nerf" of the new blanderific codex. It is now so much better just mixing and matching to get uber armies. But I missed my nurgly fluff. Thank you for an extremely well written and thought provoking tactica. I have begun to paint my death guard as a result! Constructed with a view towards tournaments. I love the idea of the twin raider attack. My list will only have one for the time being. I will also include my dreadnought, who was my first project for this army and was to have been possessed (he certainly looks the part) 'til they took away that option in the latest codex. (briefly rails at the codex writers!!!) anyway I have but recently found two things of interest, I'm not a complete fanatic, so forgive me if this is old news etc etc.

 

Firstly Rhino's according to our errata can fire two troops out of the back hatch (1 firepoint used by two models.) how does that effect your view of the twin plasma asp chmpless squad as fire support, like a dodgy plague ridden razorback? Have you tried it?

 

Secondly I picked up somewhere that a sorceror with a force weapon and warptime MUST choose which to use as apparently the force weapon uses a psychic power to activate. I dunno about this, but I'd love some confirmation one way or the other. My local GW's are staffed by people who seem incapable of telling my definite rules, with such things as "roll a dice to decide" being the order of the day. As a potential tournament player and a social gamer I crave consistency (why take up 40k I hear you ask!lol) so any help will be greatfully accepted on this front as it seems to nerf my lovely sorceror if this is true.

 

Anyhoo please keep up the extremely high standard of your thread. I look forward to reading about how to combat the techno arrogance of the Tau. One of my most consistent enemies hereabouts. - Slappy

[Zhukov]

You cannot use both warptime and you force weapons ability in the same turn. Its both uses a psysich test and you can only make 1 per turn.

[Almighty1]

only a Tzeentch scorcerer can cos they can use up to 2 psychic powers per turn.

[AkiraCho]

honestly... using a chaos sorceror kinda is useless.

 

if you are playing eldar 3D6 kinda kicks you in the gonads, against loyalist they can block it out within 24 inches (half the table). so that right there are two very popular armies. and being canceled out in general kinda sucks. lash princes i suppose work because at least against loyalists you tend to be far enough since its a ranged attack its viable. not so much with wind of chaos which is a template.

[AkiraCho]

oh and as far as units sitting in the rhino and popping plasma shots, yeah you could do that but why would you? you have an entire squad of seven marines there. if you are shooting out of a rhino obviously you are in bolter range. why would you have a squad about 220 points waste 5 of thier shots? FNP and T5 makes you about as tough as a terminator if not more so. get out there, dont be scared and shootem up. so that is my answer for Demii since he is always away.

 

oh and btw Demii im almost dont with your vindicators, so ill ship them out for you when im done. =) they look pretty good.

[Almighty1]

What about just a small squad of 5 marines in a Rhino with two special weapons of any kind, if you gave the Rhino a combi-weapon as well then they dould dish out 3 flame templates, 3 melta shots or potentially 6 plasma shots in a single turn, this is less than 200 points all told anyway.

[Democratus]

Sitting in a Rhino is excellent for holding an Objective. Your enemy must first shoot and destroy the transport before they can even try to shoot at the troops inside. This can render them much more difficult to kill than if they were standing around outside.

[DemetriiTZ]

What about just a small squad of 5 marines in a Rhino with two special weapons of any kind, if you gave the Rhino a combi-weapon as well then they dould dish out 3 flame templates, 3 melta shots or potentially 6 plasma shots in a single turn, this is less than 200 points all told anyway.

 

8, actually.. 2 from a Champion's combi-plasma, 4 from the plasma in the squad, and another 2 from the Rhino's combi.

[AkiraCho]

if you just want to maximize plasma this is a good way to do it. but as usual plasma is a double edged sword. but iono it definately has its uses. FNP definately takes away some of that risk.

[Almighty1]

What about just a small squad of 5 marines in a Rhino with two special weapons of any kind, if you gave the Rhino a combi-weapon as well then they dould dish out 3 flame templates, 3 melta shots or potentially 6 plasma shots in a single turn, this is less than 200 points all told anyway.

 

8, actually.. 2 from a Champion's combi-plasma, 4 from the plasma in the squad, and another 2 from the Rhino's combi.

 

I said sit them inside a Rhino, only two people can use the top hatch, if you wanted to use potentially all four weapons then you would have to hop out in which case you'd need a bigger squad than just 5 marines which would make it a lot more expensive.

[DemetriiTZ]

Really depends, actually. Even 5 Plague Marines are hardly easy to kill. You could use the squad as a variation on " Termicide ", by keeping the Rhino in reserve, and rolling it up with 4 Melta Shots, or 4 rapid-fire plasma blasts on the turn it arrives ( or the turn after, if you move 12. ) As you said, the squad would be reasonably cheap ( although not nearly as cheap and effective as a 3-man Terminator squad with no Mark ), but the benefit is, the squad could still have the ability to score, which can be useful. To be quite honest, though, cover saves and Stormshields have really removed a lot of the benefits from plasma weapons in WH40K, and a Rhino is too easy to blow up if you try to use it as a gun platform.

 

Probably best to avoid trying this in a game you're really aiming to win.

[AkiraCho]

like i said, its better to just pop out of the rhino. also be careful of that trick in kill point games. thats a garenteed kill point for the enemy.

[Ðrakus]

This is my first time posting. So would like to start with saying “HI” to my brothers of Nurgle

 

 

Been reading the tread, and GREAT job, very useful info here.

 

Got a couple question about the Twin Raiders… do you ever have problems deciding between firing all weapons or moving as a transport? This is the reason I have not tried it yet, I tend to lean more to the defiler as it has more range then the Vendi, and unlike the vendi or single turret pred if they get a weapon destroyed and take my cannon then it is all fleet and close combat with the all cc build. Kinda gives me something to fall back on just in case.

 

Another question I have is my group I play with cant seem to decide do the side mount weapons of the Pred and Raider count as separate weapon or 1 weapon? U check los for each, range for each, and they are modeled as separate guns; however, you are paying for 1 upgrade. Can someone please direct me to where it may point this out or clarify for me.

 

also what are your opinions on Extra Armor and Dozer Blades. I am thinking with all the cover we will/should be moving through that the Blades would help.

 

Thanks and keep up the great work, looking forward to reading the army tactics.

 

Ð

[DemetriiTZ]

You pay for the sponsons together because it would be retarded to have a single lascannon on one side of the vehicle. Aside from that, they fire separately, and even at separate targets.. So, yes, you have to kill each one individually.

 

As for Defilers.. I hate them, simply because they're easier to kill and harder to give a coversave to. Also, they're not even that amazing in close combat.. They inflict less than 3 wounds on the charge, usually. The Vindicator is easier to hide, hits harder, pops 2+ saves, and generally survives a lot better. Just my experience.

 

As for Raiders, I consider them primarily transport vehicles, with secondary offensive capacity. The Plague Marines inside, carrying meltas or flamers, whichever, can handle the more specialized issues of hordes / vehicles. The Raider deposits them, and then provides support firepower, and shields them from small arms.

[Skell]

You pay for the sponsons together because it would be retarded to have a single lascannon on one side of the vehicle. Aside from that, they fire separately, and even at separate targets.. So, yes, you have to kill each one individually.

What? they do not fire at separate targets.

[Ðrakus]

Ok… let me rephrase, I know your have to destroy each weapon separately and I know why you pay for a set.

 

If you have a pred with all las and you do a combat move then you can only fire 1 main weapon… so I know the turret is 1 weapon, but is each sponson a separate weapon or would both sides count as one weapon? So in this case would you have the choice of 2 las shots from the sponsons, or 1 twin linked from the turret?

[nurglez]

Each sponson is a seperate weapon.

 

the all las predator has 3 weapons, a twin linked las, and 2 side sponson lascannon's.

 

you buy them as a pair, but they are still seperate weapons, thus letting the predator take 3 weapon destroyed before it loses all its weapons.

 

I consider the landraider as an expensive transport, as the assault ramp is designed for, well, assaulting out of a landraider, of course, this is subjective on the situation, if there is no one in it, and a tempting target in front of it, then i will use mine to shoot. Theres easier ways of getting 2 lascannons and a heavy bolter then spending 220 points on 1 vehicle, same cant be said about an armor 14 transport that you can assault out of after it moves.

[DemetriiTZ]

They -can- fire separately, and at separate enemies, as per special rules like Power of the Machine Spirit. However, being Chaos, we decided supercomputers should be ripped out of our Land Raiders, to make 'em 30 points cheaper. As for how to classify a weapon as a single thing versus a pair.. aside from common sense..

 

A "main weapon" is -a- weapon with a Strength higher than 4. A pair of identical weapons, unless otherwise stated, are counted as Twin-Linked, rather than firing a pair of shots. You can see an example of this in comparison with a Land Raider's side sponsons. You do not fire them both if you move 6'', and you do not count each sponson as 2 lascannons. Each sponson is a twin-linked lascannon, fires independently of the other sponson, and must be destroyed individually.

[AkiraCho]

two laz cannons that are glued together are TWIN LINKED. twin linked means you RE-ROLL MISSES. but its essentially ONE laz cannon that is more accurate. chaos doesnt have the ability to split fire. if the tank fires at one thing. ALL GUNS MAY ONLY FIRE AT ONE TARGET.

 

if you move you may fire one main weapon IE something over Str 4 (5 +). if you sit still all may fire AT ONE THING

[DemetriiTZ]

What he said. :lol: