It's just me...

[Brother Delias]

which in a sense, as Tyrak has stated, will kill INQ. They seem to be doing a complete restructure of the IG codex if all rumors are to be beleived, with all the stuff they are wanting to shove in there, an Inquisitor with retinue will more than likely be lost to (honestly) a better Lord Commander or some such general type unit for the IG... Kinda sad really... I really like my INQ army the way it is...

[ripath]

I agree with the Dark Heresy thing (I use it to create my Inquisitors' backstories), but what I'm worried about is the Inquisitors being moved out of the codicies (leaving them as C: GK and C: SoB) and then not having the masses of love and fluff from Dark Heresy put in. They'll just have a token entry next to the unit, and be lost in the rest of the stuff they are attached to - like the IG codex.

 

Dark heresy isn't going anyywhere. Trust me their back to making new stuff for it now. Also if it does then there is still the Inquisitor game! Not only about Inquisitors but named after them! Inquisitor is also one of the reasons that the design team got carried away with the INQ in both codexi. Now I'm not trying to say that Inquisitors caused all the problems for gk and they kicked my dog. I play with an inquisitor too, And you have seen stanislaus make appearences in another thread along with wade both of which are usually in my army. So I'm not just electing those darn fallible inquisitors to get purged from my codex because I don't use them.

 

While some think that inquisitors will be getting less options they are wrong! let me ask you this: Who in the Imperium of man uses valkyries the most? can anyone say inquisitorial skimmer army? How about having infiltrated your opponents army with your stormtroopers with the skilled planing of your inquisitor? The possibilities are endless. Which is why I may be picking up imperial guard. because I want to see an inquisitor infiltrate a heretical stronghold every game like a skilled and thinking person they should be. screw the tanks I'm not going to take them. Also you can still use your old minis this way. I'm going to be giving my IST medals or some such for making the 15 years without GW love.

 

Also worth mentioning is the fact that Inquisitors really aren't meant for stand up fighting so its kind of hard to represent out of game events in game. With being in the imperial guard codex it makes it so that you can have both! Just because its out of print doesn't mean that its going to be forgotten. honestly look at squats everyon......... No.. Everyone knows about them, Everyone! mmmfff *krack*

 

Inquisitor Stanislaus: Alright everyone repeat after me: Short bearded men don't exist, the emperor's golden throne is fine. and the star child theory is not true. Also Ripath is a heretic for consorting with xenos and traitors. You are to consider all of his posts extra heretical for he had evaded us for a long time. Now carry on with your wargaming to crush the enemies of man. Remember you didn't hear anything *drags body off*

 

 

Thought for the day: The squat is a lie

[Brother Delias]

ok now THAT was funny

 

Now don't get me wrong, I am not in any way saying that INQ will get worse if put into the IG codex, however, more to the point, I beleive most will simply look them over in favor of a officer or heroic officer...

 

Most people play IG for the tanks... I know I do.

[ripath]

ok now THAT was funny

 

Now don't get me wrong, I am not in any way saying that INQ will get worse if put into the IG codex, however, more to the point, I beleive most will simply look them over in favor of a officer or heroic officer...

 

Most people play IG for the tanks... I know I do.

 

Stanislaus: Must I remind you Imperial citizen that whichever Glorious Imperial army a citizen of the Imperium chooses is their own choice? Did you start along the lonely path of the Inquisitor because it was popular? ARE WE THE SMURFS? NO! We are supposed to not exist to normal citizens, so if most people don't see us we are doing are job. Also the most irritated Commisar Fuklaw is waiting outside this room, you will consult him about these heretical thoughts of the press covering the Inquisition.

[Brother Delias]

heh... already shot him for having the nerve to call me a heretic... Anyway, point being that while INQ will more than likely have a codex shift over to the IG, I beleive that it is a bad move, as in a sense the IG is an army(much like the smurfs) that is an army that gramma will buy for her 8 year old under the beleif that they are little toy soldiers(the fact that they are is moot mind you). Many of of those will end up playing the side of the heroic officer, leaving the INQ to gather dust. That said, flip to the other spectrum, where you have the old battleaxe vets of the IG, that have their tactics, and won't bother with using INQs in their list because it is a wasted expenditure. That leaves those that actually play INQ(the few of us that there are), that will more than likely have to be forced to not only play the IG as an ally, but more than likely not have the choice to choose other armies of the imperium to further their goals. It really makes no sense at all to slap them into the IG codex, as it will limit how you play the INQ. personally? I rather like that my Inquisitor lord wears Terminator armor, I have an entire SM battle company painted to match the color scheme of my INQ, as well as storm troopers to match the overall scheme to boot... I've worked very hard on my army, the list for my army, and the fluff to match it. Knowing the way GW does things, limiting the INQ to simply have the choice of IG will kill the entire set-up for my army... and I know I am not the only one in this matter as well. even for those that use IG instead of SMs... it is not the point that they do use them, it is the point that the choice is there. Are we garunteed choice if we lose INQ to the IG codex? Probably not...

[Melissia]

I beleive most will simply look them over in favor of a officer or heroic officer...

As opposed to now, where most people look them over in favor of an Adepta Sororitas Heroine or Grey Knight Hero?

 

 

Let's face it, Inquisitors aren't popular commanders. Which is kinda why I was suggesting some kind of "Inquisition Mini-Dex", that lets them have the three Inquisition units (Inquisitors+retinue, assassins, and inquisitorial stormies) and then ally in any amount of any one Imperium of Man army after filling the minimum requirements of 1 HQ and two troops of the Inquisition side. Those who like the Inquisition will be able to play them with any IoM army that they want, while those that don't will still not play them anyway.

[boreas]

I beleive most will simply look them over in favor of a officer or heroic officer...

As opposed to now, where most people look them over in favor of an Adepta Sororitas Heroine or Grey Knight Hero?

 

 

Let's face it, Inquisitors aren't popular commanders. Which is kinda why I was suggesting some kind of "Inquisition Mini-Dex", that lets them have the three Inquisition units (Inquisitors+retinue, assassins, and inquisitorial stormies) and then ally in any amount of any one Imperium of Man army after filling the minimum requirements of 1 HQ and two troops of the Inquisition side. Those who like the Inquisition will be able to play them with any IoM army that they want, while those that don't will still not play them anyway.

 

Maybe so in competitive lists. But many casual players like their inquisitors. Also, in the DH list, the psycannon-toting firbase inquisitor is quite popular. Also, if you look at how many players use assassins, I'd guess more than a few DH/WH use inquisitors (if only to unlock). Still, the inquisitors add a lot of flavor to a list, much more than a SoB/GK hero. With the different models, conversions and retinues, the are more varied than your run-of-the-mill FNoD or GKGM.

 

Phil

[ripath]

Stanislaus: Well now someone's lacking a little bit of confidence with the imperial guard players. Lets look at Wade he has the mind capabilities of a teenager so this will work. Wade has just bought the IG codex and after getting pumped up about it from the Game store clerk he begins to look through his codex avidly reading everything so that he can crush me in the next game we play. Warp travel takes a long time.

 

Anyway he knows that the Imperial guard's main weakness is morale and survivability. Now he comes across a unit that is better then fearless, can be a heavy weapons team with bs 4 that can re roll failed rolls to hit, has 4+ armor saves, can take free shots at deep striking units, Can take decent and reliable psykic powers and deal with enemies that have them, and can be put into a transport and moved about as needed. If Wade could read he would be jumping up and down. oh wait it looks like he set off the match I hid inside of that book a few days ago. You know that look is considered heresy. I just don't want Wade to be able to do to me what I do to my superiors when I game. Overall when IG players realize what an ace in the hole an Inquisitor and retinue can be, I am going to start being afraid.

 

That is just inquisitors, think about an IG player being able to take an eversore to hide next to their heavy weapon team that your hoping to charge. or how about a Calidus assassin popping in front of your last scoring unit and stopping the assault marine squad that is going to charge it next turn. Or the vindicare assassin taking out those nasty CC units with his marksmen rule. And here you are saying that the Inquisition isn't even going to make the IG players think when its added to their codex. pfft some people thought that sterngaurd weren't either. oh wait they were called the deathwatch I do believe. got themselves a right and proper place in a mainstream codex and look at how often you see them now.

 

This is a big what if, but what if a special Inquisitor made assassins, or inq retinues scoring units?

[Melissia]

Maybe so in competitive lists. But many casual players like their inquisitors. Also, in the DH list, the psycannon-toting firbase inquisitor is quite popular. Also, if you look at how many players use assassins, I'd guess more than a few DH/WH use inquisitors (if only to unlock). Still, the inquisitors add a lot of flavor to a list, much more than a SoB/GK hero. With the different models, conversions and retinues, the are more varied than your run-of-the-mill FNoD or GKGM.

And I find that the Canoness has a lot more character and flavor than the Inquisitor. But then, I don't run the typical "FNoD" canoness more often than not, and that's the background that interests me, not the Inquisition-- so I suppose I mean to say that it's subjective.

[Grand Master Tyrak]

I can't help thinking that the IG codex is going to be about the IG, not the Inquisition. Personally I don't want them becoming a variation on Commissars, who have a similar amount of fluff in the current IG codex as Iron Hands do in C:SM - barely any.

[Inquisitor Fox]

My personal choice is to leave the Codices as is.. update the wargear and unit options and points costs.. I suppose there's an inevitable elimination of a proper armoury and a slew of options for the Inquisitors.. fix the rules issues and redundancies, and simply add say, 1 to 4 units total to the Chamber Militant forces (say 1 of each "unit type" choice.. Elites, FA, Troops, HS). Leave the Inquisition options in the book, they don't really need updating or removal. It will shift the focus to the Chamber Militants, leave the Inquisitors where they belong (with the Inquisition) and generally be nice and nifty. I wouldn't cry about adding an Elites or HQ Inquisitor to the Guard, but I would be very miffed if they were axed from the updated Inquisition Codices.

[ripath]

What Inquisitorial units besides assassins and inquisitors are not merely souped up IG? It makes sense to just add them to what they fit the best in. And as for fluff I don't think that Inquisitors will ever be forgotten. How many people here have read Ravenor and Eisenhorn? Those are some of the best sellers just like gaunt's ghosts! Don't forget about the Black library, because while tanks may be effective, Inquisitors and commisars tend to make much better stories.

 

Overall, I'm just trying to say give it a chance, yes its different but none of us have actually seen that codex yet, So to go off of rumors as fact is kind of ridiculous and just shows how angsty we are about needing new codexi.

[Grand Master Tyrak]

And as for fluff I don't think that Inquisitors will ever be forgotten.

 

*Gloomily* Judging by the way GW treats its veterans in comparison to new beginners, it will be forgotten very soon even by GW themselves, even if the codex stays. :P

 

How many people here have read Ravenor and Eisenhorn? Those are some of the best sellers just like gaunt's ghosts! Don't forget about the Black library, because while tanks may be effective, Inquisitors and commisars tend to make much better stories.

 

It would be great if everyone was like Dan Abnett (who wrote all the examples you listed) and bothered to research their work properly before writing their stories. But they aren't.

[ripath]

*Gloomily* Judging by the way GW treats its veterans in comparison to new beginners, it will be forgotten very soon even by GW themselves, even if the codex stays. sad.gif

Okay Tyrak if the SM codex is anything to go by then each unit is going to have at least a page of fluff! ONE PAGE! that means for any assassins, IST, Inquisitor lords, Inquisitors, and special characters ALL get their own page! how much room do they have in our current codex? About a paragraph next to the unit entry. And even if they only add Inquisitor lords and assassins thats still 6 pages. In the DH codex you could probably fit all the unit fluff into that much space.

 

You know I would love to have a page of fluff on each GK unit type. If the inquisitors aren't going to take that and dark heresy then screw them I think GK should take it instead.

[Grand Master Tyrak]

Okay Tyrak if the SM codex is anything to go by then each unit is going to have at least a page of fluff! ONE PAGE! that means for any assassins, IST, Inquisitor lords, Inquisitors, and special characters ALL get their own page! how much room do they have in our current codex?

 

That is the Space Marine codex though, GW's poster boys. However, if IG get the same treatment then my optimism levels will skyrocket.

[Grand Master Iapetus]

I know we all have preferences, but realistically we also have to consider in all this is the recent trends in GW codices:

 

• They are BIG - so the idea of having an "all in one" codex would not be our of the realm with all the units of the inquisition under one book. 100+ pages of inquisitional goodness with any combination of WH/DH/=][= ? Yummy..
  

• Recent codicies have units which "unlock" other units. Certainly right in line with our current codexes - hopefully they expand this out where we could unlock units from other imperial codices with more flexibility than the current "induction" rules.
  

• Homogeny - more than likely, our vehicles and wargear will work in line with 5e (rather than having 3 separate "variants" of Godhammer Pattern Land Raiders). Wouldn't be surprised to see a single inquisitor with unified wargear and psychic powers either.
  

• Final point is not directly related to the inqusitional forces, but just a general question on the layout of the 5e codecies. Does anybody else find them incredibly frustrating with each unit being split between 2 places? Wargear spread out all over the place...this drives me up the wall and just seems like a huge step backwards. Is this what we have to look forward to?
  

[jeffersonian000]

I agree with on some of your points.

 

While the books may be bigger than past codices, we should still see at least one each for Knights and Sister, per the GW statement that all current armies will remain separate with their own codex.

 

Those of us that have played 'Hunter are already use to taking specific units in order to unlock other units (i.e., Priests), so in that trend our codices were some of the first.

 

Homogeny? No. There are three different types of Techmarine in the new Marine 'dex, three Land Raiders, three Dreadnoughts, more different HQ's than they have units, etc. The Daemonhunter 'dex is homogenous, the new Marine 'dex is not.

 

And yes, I truly detest the new layout of 5e 'dexes, if all the new ones will be like the current Marine 'dex.

 

SJ

[jakehunter52]

Seems to be a lot of concern about the dropping of Inquisitors out from our dex, much more than I expected. Personally, I never really had a lot of love for them, I was too wrapped up in the Grey Knight/SoB side of things that they always were over-looked....except for IST's cheap special weapon squads. There are legitimate points to both sides of the arguments.

 

Pros:

- Inquisitors create a unique feel with psyker powers, specialized wargear, customizable retinues and unique units (daemonhosts anyone?)

- They are foundational part of the Imperium, capable of leading armies when needed (as per Eisenhorn against Quixos)

- The Inquisition offers an alternative to the SM style of both Grey Knights and SoB (I hate to say it but both armies can really relate to marines)

- They are part of a book that is supposed to be supported

 

Cons:

- No regular standing force, thus nothing to make the army as a whole different from IG or SM

- Main functions of Inquisitors are investigatory, sometimes leading to engagements but these are more like gang skirmishes, not small battles

- A significant part of the WH codex is not even Inquisitorial forces or SoB forces but Ecclesiastic forces, which is a 3rd party not even addressed

- As per Jervis Johnson, only reason they were included so prominently was because of the specialist game

 

So before you burn me with promethium, let me share a bit that I found over at Warseer from Mkoll (thankfully my new job allows me a fair amount of paid down time) :

 

2) The Arbite Riot Teams have no rules in the IG codex, as such I cannot comment on what they will entail sorry. All I am told is there will a boxset for them. I think it will be the Storm Trooper box with extra bits but as I posted in my release I am not for sure on it, they could be separate.... Please note the Planet Strike will give all armies a few new toys and thus be a full out release not a guard wave.

 

....Huh. Who are the only ones that can take Arbites? Oh and something for each codex? Well, maybe a little love for the =I= is coming after all. I wouldn't want to bite on this so much but the hints are in good favor, much more for those who are the more Inquisitor side of the Ordos. Heck, maybe this is a good thing. Right now actual =I= units are limited to assassins, storm troopers, daemonhosts and the retinues themselves, not really something to base an army off of (orbital bombardments...yes and no). Maybe with the IG codex or Planet Strike they will create a flavorful codex or army supplement that will satisfy your desires. Heck, maybe they will come out with an Eisenhorn model....which would be insane and amazing. But really I don't want to see people so concerned about trying keep their share of the spotlight it means holding back a Codex:Grey Knights or Codex:Sisters of Battle. It is dumb. Militant arms are just that, for the battlefield. Inquistors are fine but not necessary. I would like them to still be there as an elites or maybe a HQ choice but in a more supportive role if they crafted them like a librarian/tech marine. Make Grey Knights more than just the two type of models they are now and express their diversity they have (3000 of them and being scattered around the galaxy, it should be sure to make some interesting innovation on their part). Build upon the ultra-religious Sisters, make them more than just girls in power armour and extend their faith. I see a lot of potential in these armies and Inquisitors could complement them greatly, but only if they are going to make sacrifices.

[Melissia]

They are BIG

But not big enough to provide enough fluff for four whole armies (Sisters, Grey Knights, Deathwatch, Inquisition, nevermind the different varieties of Inquisition and the various subsections such as the assassins). I simply cannot see an amalgam codex as viable when the various armies therein are so varied as these four are. Also, Jervis has promised to stay away from that trainwreck waiting to happen, and instead stated that GW intends to do what they should have done all along for the third edition codices as well, focus on the Sisters and Grey Knights (which is unfortunate for the Deathwatch, but better overall IMO).

[Grand Master Tyrak]

Who are the only ones that can take Arbites?

 

Witch Hunters can upgrade their ISTs to be Arbites.

 

And yes, I truly detest the new layout of 5e 'dexes, if all the new ones will be like the current Marine 'dex.

 

Agreed. What happened to the Armoury? Was the idea of being able to find out what was available and what it did in one place so bad?

[jakehunter52]

Who are the only ones that can take Arbites?

 

Witch Hunters can upgrade their ISTs to be Arbites.

 

 

This was a rhetorical question. Made me :D though.

[Gentlemanloser]

Interesting observation from the JJ Replies thread.

 

In the Leaked French summary sheet of the new IG Codex, there's no Inquisitor...

[ripath]

there is also no gaunt. and since gaunts ghosts are some of the most popular books, I doubt that they would just can the tanith first and only's commander

[Grand Master Tyrak]

ripath Posted Today, 03:30 AM

there is also no gaunt. and since gaunts ghosts are some of the most popular books, I doubt that they would just can the tanith first and only's commander

 

Hasn't Abnett killed Gaunt off in the books though?

[ripath]

Hasn't Abnett killed Gaunt off in the books though?

AAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! I haven't gotten that far yet..... :D you really mean that he......*sniffle sniffle* _dies

Well I suppose they all have to go sometime..