WIP- Daughters of the Emperor. Lost Female Chapter

[Lord Humongous]

I think its OK that these "ladies" aren't slender. After all the bone growth and hormones, they probably won't have female figures any more.

 

In fact, given all the surgery they get, it would make sense to just remove the breasts, or use drugs that suppress breast tissue growth while the rest of the body grows. Is a marine going to nurse? Either way, the current "male" power armor has room for a male marines ribcage and pectorals; females (even with breasts tissue) tend to be more petite in the same area.

 

Of course, going by that logic, there would be no visible difference between the models for male and female marines. And obviously you do want a visible difference....

 

My advice is to "slenderize" them by using some of the "truesize" tricks to make the torso, legs, and (lower) arms longer (hence altering proportions) and also use the previously mentioned "file the torso sides a bit" idea. If you must have them, figure out some way to make the breasts lower on the chest and (as another poster mentioned) more centralized. Your breast sculpts suffer from the common (male) error of making the breast to high- I got lectured several times in art school for this same error! Unless a woman has fairly small (or very firm, as in fake) breasts, the largest circumference is roughly level with the solar plexus. There is no significant breast tissue above the armpit level. Obviously, a "push up bra" changes that a bit, but I think armor would be designed for a more natural fit. In fact, it would probably "squash flat" like a sports bra does, to allow maximum arm mobility. The girls you've got sculpted probably can clap their hands at chest level!

 

On the other hand, they look fun. All I can say is- Death by Snu Snu!

http://www.futurama-madhouse.com.ar/grabs/3acv01/301-63.jpg

[Terrible_Trygon]

That female scout is very nice looking.

 

Actually it is not a scout. It is a prototype Battle Sister redesign I did a while back, since I didn't like the Battle Sister models. I am planning to take it further in the future as a proper army.

[NemFX]

If I say naysayer enough, would you gouge your way out the back of your head? Cause I kinda like the word naysayer. Indeed, naysayers of the word naysayer tend not to have a better word to replace naysayer.. I mean, detractor is neat, but it doesn't have the same impact as naysayer, because people can confuse that word for being a tractor.

 

 

Anyway. Something to remember is; the marines are all different sizes. The armour itself doesn't really change. It did back in heresy times, specficially in the book Legion a few taller marines are mentioned. But I imagine they would just change the insides to fit the marine. You wouldn't technically need boob armour, but you manage to make it look realistic enough.

 

Perhaps as a fluff reasoning, the extra testosterone accidently jumpstarts the process of making estrogen, so that's why they are stacked?

[Terrible_Trygon]

Well this is less a question of how they have big breasts and more a question of why they have big breasts. And this is one that can only really be answered by the modeller.

[sgtNACHO]

Terrible Trygon, glad you got in on this topic. Your Sisters still look more realistic then any sister of battle model! You have any painted yet?

 

(sorry for the OT... Snu Snu!!)

 

All in all you probably need to do 1 of a few things.

 

A) Work off of scout torsos, some GS could make them look a little less male marine

 

<_< Use Eldar bits, they have some good looking power armor, and you could say your ladies enjoy art (like Blood angels) so make their armor a little differently, and you could probably justify a little breast enlargement. But not much because thats a no-no

 

C) shave down marine torsos. All you really need is shorten the sides a little maybe make the greaves shaped more like women legs.

 

D) Ignore us and never post here again!!

 

From what I see nobody would ever take you seriously with that army. If your trying to make it stupidly disproportional and have an army based off male lust, well You might get a laugh but most guys at a gaming club will think you like to stare at your marines in the night.

 

If your trying to make a serious army than work a little less off of fantasy and such and base them on real women and use a more realistic tone with them. Look up pictures of women soldiers in full gear, does their kevlar have big breast cups? No. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you sculpted these girls while looking at anime didn't you?

 

Anyway, good luck with it, and hope you accomplish whatever your trying to accomplish.

[whitebeardixon]

manly women! just kiddin dude. hey why dont you try working off of the slannesh champion model? ( the one riding on a giant boob snake.) propotionally she is perfect (in a modeling sense). although their something to be said abouot trygon's sister, you could always use darkangel robed legs and shave em down a bit and combined it with the scout torso so they look like thier in power armour. But if you want to keep up with the current setup you should take a look at dr. thunders stuff very cool quadrouple d marines

[Terrible_Trygon]

Actually the Dark Angel robed legs are too big for the scout torso. I used some bretonnian Men at Arms legs, extended the robes slightly, then added Cadian feet, though Scout feet would also work.

[whitebeardixon]

oh my bad, makes more sense though. still a good looking sister though who needs to be painted up

[Chaplain Kharn]

well i think what you've done so far is good but i agree making them thiner would be more realistic but they might look more like SOB i'm not sure

[whitebeardixon]

hell dude just keep em the way they are, no one thinks your in your room staring at them, and their painted pretty good so thier obviously not intended to be a joke, so keep them the way they are

[War Angel]

you cant argue that a female space marine would be the same size as a male space marine just because of all the stuff going into them to make them space marines...remember, male marines get bigger too, so a female would still be slightly smaller.

 

putting extra equipment into the armor to make the marine fit in is kinda silly, i think thats just GW's way of being lazy and explaning all the marines being the same size. even if you could justify that, Why would they then add breast to armor for more equipment? it really creates a weakness in the armor.

[Capt. Jack]

Trygon, what head did you use for the sister? I love the idea and will probably steal it for a future project! Kudos!

[Terrible_Trygon]

The head came off the Witch Hunters Tank Accessory Sprue. I just shaved the hair off and did the greens.

[azgodeth]

hoo-boy, i knew i'd get some resistance, but im shocked at the type! breasts too big?? is that possible?? XD

seriously though, anyone here who complains about the scale, needs to take a good hard look at his marines. how many people do you know have hands and feet twice the size of theyre heads? and technically, once those arms have been put on, the breasts wont stick out nearly as far ive found. i think some of the people here have the right idea. some on the other hand seem to be confusing female chemistry with male... females dont make a hell of alot of testosterone, and thanks to the fluff page S'Jet showed us, i have a good fluff based excuse for why they arnt pumped full of it. on the contrary, some of those implant it mentions would increase the estrogen production by a good level, and leaves the women in a lengthened pubecent state. as we all know, puberty is when those breasts start to fill out. not to mention all that estrogen flowing tends to stimulate them further, tricking the body into thinking maybie she'll need to nurse someone sometime soon.

secondly, with advanced musculature and bone systems, they wouldent be so slender and fragile anymore. no need to sand the whole model down to a toothpick (and besides, some of us perfer our women with some meat on em! supermodels be damned!) the best way i could think of to enlarge the hips was to make the butt plate bigger, so its not just my love of t&a that inspired that ether ;p

as for the armor, ive been talking to alot of women about this before i started in earnest. i considered smothing out the breastplates like alot of you suggested, but alot of women kept brining up the confort factor.. one of my freinds is a security guard, and she has to wear one of those vests to work everyday. and every evening she whines about how it crushes her breasts, and adds to the chest and backpains she feels after work. i felt that by giving eveyone room to grow and move, they would be less likely to be caught ajusting theyre "equipment" in the heat of battle. also: why wouldent they all have around the same bustline? this is ARMOR, not a second skin. someone manufacured this armor for the women, and had to come up with a "one size fits all" scheme. not all the gals may fill the armor out all the way, but some of them may well need more room!

 

keep in mind, im not trying to make real-scale or remotly realistic female marines. im trying to make warhammer 40k marines!

 

S'Jet: a million thanks to you , that fluff page was EXACTLY what i needed!

 

Trygon: thats fantastic work! even though i went with a totally diffrent direction, i still think thats a great peice of art. if i had the bits around, i would likely have done something similar to some degree. at the very least i would have had to scult far fewer heads XD

 

Humongous: i think you nearly read my mind with the futurama refrence! those amazons are exactly what i first thought of when i started to conceive my army proper. although i figured "Death by Snu-Snu!" would look silly on a banner XD

 

all that being said, i have some updates to add later tonight or tomorrow. ive got a squad of assualt termies started, and the predator tank has had some more work done (mostly adding detail bits and the like), ive also made up a ton of bases for the vets and termis, all resemling slate or granite, and ill post those too. just thought id keep everyone updated firsthand though ;)

like i said, ill do a proper update before the weekend :confused:

 

much more to come...

[War Angel]

you think space marines would care about comfort over survivablity?

 

im not sure what the explination is for how they avoided adding testosterone in that fluff you read, but you seem to be useing it as an excuse rather then to make youre own fluff.

 

making females into spacemarines would be trying to make the females up to par with male's, why would you stop half way just to weaken there armor by not giving them the testosterone that would inhance there combat, and reduce there breast size, allowing them to be more manly...because face it, if youre wanting them to do what the guys have been doing sence HH, you are wanting them to be men.

 

 

i recomend making youre own fluff about this, because if you had the tech to make women as strong as men, then what could you do with men? you need to find a reason for this.

 

also, the breast armor seems to be what every one is critiqueing on, and youre ussing some one eles's writen fluff to say "nope, thats not true, thanks to whatever, this is now acceptable" what more do you want to be said?

[NemFX]

I don't mind the resculpted chest pieces, because honestly, even though the armour is supposed to be like 4 inches thick minimum, the space marine models are caricatures of the actual thing. This is a female space marine of mine with no special treatment at all:

(Second from the left)

If I hadn't said which one, you'd have had to take a second look to make sure.

Resculpting the breastplate is one of the easiest ways to change your army and make it distinct without having to do alot.

[Slayer le Boucher]

Don't forget that women that are athletics and are warriors have no breast at all...,just look an athlet female or bodybuilding females.

 

If they have breasts biggers that it should...there fakes...

 

But for the breasts thing you could pass on it by mainly reduce a inche there cup size.

 

But for the self sculpted heads...ho god please put helmets on them !! :x

[Grimtooth]

I don't see a problem with female space marines. In-game you have one army that pretty much exclusively has the very blessing of the God-Emperor manifesting itself each turn via faith points; Sisters of Battle.

 

So the God-Emperor himself chooses females as conduits of his spiritual power but not use them as conduits of his physical power?

 

On another note in regard to gene seed. Pre-heresy we had vast legions of "clones". However, all chapters now pull their recruits from different homeworlds or planets. The gene seed is obviously therefore highly compatible to work with a vastly deep gene pool. So why would it not be just as compatible to work with the female genome?

[Berzerker Pezz]

Big breasts means big body fat ratio, under normal circumstances.

 

hoo-boy, i knew i'd get some resistance, but im shocked at the type! breasts too big?? is that possible?? XD

 

It is indeed. I own a pair of breasts, and having them that big would just be... no. I lost 2 cup sizes just working out a little bit, imagine a space marine who trains for many many many hours a day!

[azgodeth]

i sometimes wonder if people truly read what is posted before commenting.. -.-

you think space marines would care about comfort over survivablity?

to a degree.. how well do you think the men would fight if theyre codpeice was a few sizes too small? if was being fitted for a suit that i was planning on wearing for the next thousand years, i'd try and make it at least livable..

 

im not sure what the explination is for how they avoided adding testosterone in that fluff you read, but you seem to be useing it as an excuse rather then to make youre own fluff.

REAL genetics are an excuse? women dont use testosterone the way men do. they dont have the same sexual organs or mental patterms. the fluff im using simply points to alternative organs for the production of female hormones, instead of male hormones.. you make it sound like if i made a normal male marine chapter, id be in trouble for going along with the list of organ implants the codex itself lists. "GASP! i better make up my own fluff to replace all those organs!"

 

making females into spacemarines would be trying to make the females up to par with male's, why would you stop half way just to weaken there armor by not giving them the testosterone that would inhance there combat, and reduce there breast size, allowing them to be more manly...because face it, if youre wanting them to do what the guys have been doing sence HH, you are wanting them to be men.

you mean like modern armies do? you dont think thousands of years in the future we'll get over these sorts of sexist preconceptions? and who ever said i was weakening the armor? and i REALLY wanna know how testosterone is supposed to enhance theyre skill in combat? enchane theyre sex drive sure, but battle prowess? im wanting my women to do what women have been doing since the dawn of time. defending themselves, theyre families, and theyre people. your saying i should ignore the prevoius 30,000 years of history just cause the tail end of the story?

 

i recomend making youre own fluff about this, because if you had the tech to make women as strong as men, then what could you do with men? you need to find a reason for this.

uhh.. what do we do with men now?? again, i point to modern armies. men and women working together as equals to acomplish a similar goal!

 

also, the breast armor seems to be what every one is critiqueing on, and youre ussing some one eles's writen fluff to say "nope, thats not true, thanks to whatever, this is now acceptable" what more do you want to be said?

how am i using someone elses flyuff to justify this? using someone else's list of genetic organ replacements has nothing to do with the armor they are wearing, last i checked...

 

 

Berzerker Pezz: i see where your coming from there, and have been told this by a few women now, but again i have to point out the scale.. these minis are nwhere near true scale... if they were, i would gladly reduce the cup size approraiatly ;)

[NemFX]

Women have about 40-60% less testosterone, but they are more sensitive to it. Testosterone reduces osteoporosis (ladies, please remember that for when your growing older) and increases the size of various organs.

 

In effect, scientifically speaking, if they were to be given routine doses of testosterone throughout their lives (as male space marines would) their bodies would react to it as though it were natural.

 

Granted that steroids have testosterone which reduces fat, but there's other chemicals there too. Also, people who take steroids also work out alot. If it was included in women as a natural element, I imagine that the body would regulate itself and more or less continue as normal. This is mere supposition, however, as I don't believe it's ever been tried.

 

I'll grant that the chances are a woman who exercises the same as a male space marine wouldn't be likely to have as much fat as the standard woman, and that testosterone might burn off even more, but you also have to remember; as a counterbalance, space marines eat alot. I mean, seriously alot. High protein foods also tend to have alot of fat in them, which would mean they would have some degree of fat.

 

I am perfectly able to admit they would probably only just scrape a b-cup at best guess, but even so. Everyone is complaining that these marines have breasts. Hopefully I've concluded for most of you that it's at least physically possible, even though the modelling is exaggerated a bit.

 

 

Also, the whole "Women shouldn't be marines" thing.. People.. Grow up. I hate to be a cause of controversy here, but really think about it, in your life there's at least one woman who could kick your ass. It's not hard to imagine that women can be stronger than men, or at very least equal.

 

Anyway. I think I've hijacked enough space here. More models please ;)

[Rogue Trooper]

I don't think the issue is the female vs male Space Marine debate, I believe it's the characterised breasts. As has been mentioned the argument is never ending and if you want female Space Marines then by jove tuck it in and go for it.

 

The 'issue' might, rather, be the slightly over the top breasts. Not so much over the top as massively out to the front, eh? They're your models though and if you're happy putting up with this in the long term then go for it; your cash, your models and ultimately your choice.

 

A breast reduction would probably help their aim though.

 

RT

[War Angel]

to a degree.. how well do you think the men would fight if theyre codpeice was a few sizes too small? if was being fitted for a suit that i was planning on wearing for the next thousand years, i'd try and make it at least livable..

but men DONT wear a cod peice to small, and women DO wear the brest plate that causes discomfort... and it wouldnt cause them discomfort if there brest where smaller, which youve said you wanted them to be bigger

 

 

REAL genetics are an excuse?

i told you i didnt read it, if it use's genetics whatever, then it doesnt effect this, but the fluff effects other area's

 

you mean like modern armies do? you dont think thousands of years in the future we'll get over these sorts of sexist preconceptions? and who ever said i was weakening the armor?

as GW fluff goes, women cant be marines because of many differnt reasons, aside from tradition, and the fact that the emperor says so, gene's are the only reason why women cant be marines.... yet there are people who want to have female marines, and the only way they can have there army with out having fluff nazi's get on them about it, is to get around these things. if youre going to use nano bots to reinforce the female body further, or a specail injection that makes them 50 times stronger, and say that this is making them as strong as a male space marine, thus meaning there a female space marine....what could thoes same things have done, had they been used on a male space marine...

 

i had hoped that didnt need to be spelled out.

 

a few people have said youve weakened the armor, its the main issue people are having with the boobs, youve just chosen to ignor it.

 

i turn now to the post that stated how it weakens youre armor

 

2: The cups would deflect bullets off into the center chest and helmet/face.

 

3: If crumbled, the cups would fragment into the chest cavity. Their domes basically and due to their position on the surface of the chest plate would be prone to fracturing under great force.

 

 

 

uhh.. what do we do with men now?? again, i point to modern armies. men and women working together as equals to acomplish a similar goal!

 

i dont know about TWC, and im not includeing hadji, But women often work together as an equal to acomplish a similar goal, in the rear, with the gear. They may see combat because there the crew cheif of a Phrog, and they fire the fifty cal. at a few people, but theres no female's in the infantry. I could tell you why, but you woulnt care, so i'll leave that there.

[azgodeth]

NemFX: thank you, thats more or less what i wanted to point out, in my own badly spelt grammatically incorrect way. XD testosterone itself isnt gonna butch out a woman completly, although im not entirly positive what a good strong dose of estrogen would do. from expeince with ex-GFs who took estrogen suppliments though, they had a noticable size increase, but then i suppose it could have just been me? XD feel free to elborate there as well if you care to :D lol

 

Rogue: i see this now. and here i thought the whole female thing was controversy enough. perhaps its time to drop the whole breast issue, and move onto the rest of the models XD

again, i feel the need to point out, these arnt true-scale models. nobodys asking me to sand down the size of the weapons or the shoes i notice.. just the exagerated chestplates -.-

 

War: 1; i think you missed the point again my friend -.- im trying to point out that the armor is a one-size-fits-all deal, and although protection is paramount with good armor, so is the fit! your right, men dont wear codpeices a few sizes too small, because they know it will hamper them in battle! just as women dont wear bras a few sizes too small, cause it would ruin the back damn quick. and i dont recall saying i wanted them bigger, just to scale with the model itself, if the proper hormonal balances were met. i admit i may be a little off though.. lol

 

2; fair enough. i dont think alot of people using genetic arguments read the female organ fluff ether XD i may have to post some recaps of the parts i intend to use later, to avoid further unnessisary arguments XD

 

3; actually, nowhere in any fluff i have ever seen does it say that the emperor said "no women!" and as i have been trying to point out, genes are NOT the problem here, realistically. there is very little diffrence between men and women genetically, and half of the marine transplants would take just as well in a female recipiant as a male.. i had hoped i hadent needed to be spelt out again.. ;p

 

4; i see what some of them are saying about the armor, but i hadnt chose to ignore it.. i sidestepped the issue because its really a non-issue. the armor is just as thick, if not thicker in the chest area, and the only way they'd deflect a bullet into the marine's face, was if the guy was underneath her, shooting right up her cleavage. nobody mentions how well those winged skulls and malteese crosses deflect bullets around i notice..

 

5; lastly, i cant say as i know what country your from, or how your army sets things up, but here in Canada, we have female infantry that are out there on the front lines just like the men. out of our casualties in the overseas contingent operation, or whatever the hell theyre calling the current war thesedays, around 1/3 of our dead have been female soldiers. and as far as i know, the same goes for the US.. i know a few women who serve for both counties. i'd love to hear why your country has no women on the front lines though..

 

 

 

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anyways, enough of the debate XD lets get to the updates :P

http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs060.snc1/4534_1096864514583_1615731252_232776_1484498_n.jpg

here's the back of the tank so far.. just adding the basecoated details before i do the inking and highlights.

http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v4534/125/35/1615731252/n1615731252_232777_4306965.jpg

and the front got a bit of a sprucing up as well.

 

havent done much with the first squad of marines yet, other then the rocks. sanded the chests down a bit, rounded off some parts, and ajusted the slots to fit the rocks.

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs060.snc1/4534_1096864594585_1615731252_232778_8268949_n.jpg

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs060.snc1/4534_1096864634586_1615731252_232779_2128502_n.jpg

 

and here's the termis i started. havent done much other then the basic chestplate, and the terrain. added the usual buttplates too, and started clipping weapons, but otherwise havent done much else. this weekend is a nice long weekend, so i should be able to get quite a bit done hopefully. at the very least im gonna try and assemble them! -.- lol

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs020.snc1/4534_1096864354579_1615731252_232772_8033885_n.jpg

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs060.snc1/4534_1096864394580_1615731252_232773_3690049_n.jpg

http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs020.snc1/4534_1096864434581_1615731252_232774_6332166_n.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs020.snc1/4534_1096864474582_1615731252_232775_8050630_n.jpg

other then replacing a seal and a pair of wings, these parts are pretty much ready. just gotta decide on armaments, and how to fancy them up a bit. likely will add a few more bits of gilded rope, purity seals and possibly even a bit of chain here and there. i like the papers and cloth attached to the veteran shoulders and such too, so i might add some of that.

[NemFX]

Your tank needs a banner.. I suggest "My other car is a unicorn!"