Hate on Erebus thread

[Gv0zD]

Erebus is indeed a great villain. Too evil, one might say. Unlike other villains, like Horus, Magnus, Ahriman, etc.. even Darth Vader, there is no "humanity" left in Erebus. There is no chance anyone would say "if he didn't do that and that, he'd remain the loyal one". Erebus is the ultimate villain, even disgusting in his evilness. When I read the paragraphs related to him I feel utter hatred towards this character. No compassion or understanding. And this is what makes him great. He totally lacks the "evil attractiveness" most fiction villains have. The concentration of pure evil :lol:

[Midgard]

Personally, I'd like to see a book (or a short story) told from Erebus' POV. If I have one complaint with him, it is that I don't really understand his motivations, as the whole "evil for evil's sake" schtick would be far too simplistic of an explanation, and I think there is something more to it. I just wish BL would address that and give Erebus more depth, explaining perhaps his reasons for turning to Chaos, and perhaps even working on the theme I saw in ADB's Word Bearers novel - they truly believe themselves to be doing the right thing. In their own minds, they are (possibly tragic) heroes, not moustache-twirling villains (I choose to disregard "Battle for the Abyss" portrayal of Zadkiel and focus on more fleshed out Word Bearers characters in "The First Heretic"). Erebus could be the epitome of that theme (although as the time passes, he DOES transform into essentially a creature of full-on Chaos, as seen in "Dark Creed").

[Aurelius Rex]

In addition to the other places Erebus has turned up in the 'present day' 40K, he was also pivotal in Abaddon's 13th Black Crusade, summoning warp storms to impede Imperial reinforcements and messing with the Ultramarine Honour Company in the Malin's Reach system. This was from the world-wide 40K campaign, and later in the 13th Black Crusade sourcebook from the Black Library in 2004, which as far as I know was his first appearance in print.

 

I'm only on the first chapter of TFH, so can't say anything about Erebus in that book yet. ;)

[Clewz]

In the first heretic there came across to me a moment of softness when he met up with Argel Tel again. Sort of like a paternal vibe.

 

Could possibly be something to do with with Argel tel carrying the daemon inside him though.

 

Kor Phaeron on the other hand seemed like the one that deserves all the hate. Seemed very cruel, manipulative and just generally evil through and through

[Brother Captain Kezef]

Erebus is boring as hell, he seems to be a conveniant deaus ex machina for the HH series. Need a bad guy to set up a plot? Just break out Erebus and slide him in! He's the copy/paste villain and it's kinda frustrating.

[Captain Juan Juarez]

I'm only on the first chapter of TFH, so can't say anything about Erebus in that book yet. :ph34r:

 

I was dubious, as for me it didn't really enthrall me to begin with - neither did Nemesis which is actually enjoyable if you concentrate on the characters - but as you get to better know the characters and especially the interaction with the Custodes.. It becomes another example of great character-driven fiction.

[Frater Uriah]

What's to hate about a guy who is such a clandestine power behind the throne that neither his own Primarch nor the Warmaster can notice that someone is pulling their strings?

[Brother Captain Kezef]

What's to hate about a guy who is such a clandestine power behind the throne that neither his own Primarch nor the Warmaster can notice that someone is pulling their strings?

 

Because everytime you see him he's not portrayed as a spiders pinning a web of plot and intrigue, he's written like a cheap pantomine villain. Everytime he appears I have to resist the urge to shout "He's behind you!"

[Frater Uriah]

What's to hate about a guy who is such a clandestine power behind the throne that neither his own Primarch nor the Warmaster can notice that someone is pulling their strings?

 

Because everytime you see him he's not portrayed as a spiders pinning a web of plot and intrigue, he's written like a cheap pantomine villain. Everytime he appears I have to resist the urge to shout "He's behind you!"

I do not disagree... I've always been a bit disappointed that he is depicted with a beard, instead of a handlebar moustache.

 

'Of course you want to turn on your daddy, O Mighty Warmaster! Muh-hu ha ha haaaaaaa... <cough!> I'm sorry, what...?'

[Gunslinger87]

I've always sort of thought of him in a less literal way. Whenever he appears in the series, I have a feeling the chaos gods are doing their share of manipulation and psychics. I always squint and imagine there is a reason why nobody ever calls him upon his decisions and offered solutions. (perhaps except Horus in Nemesis) Just imagine the chaos gods are using him as their puppet and some kind of mojo is in play :D Its better than having all this hate about a fictional character :-D relaaaaax :-D

[wasted]

Erebus is boring as hell, he seems to be a conveniant deaus ex machina for the HH series. Need a bad guy to set up a plot? Just break out Erebus and slide him in! He's the copy/paste villain and it's kinda frustrating.

 

I believe Erebus character has real potential for following novels. He was breifly touched in most of the books. Even First Heretic (which was awesome) gently puts him aside from the main plot.

 

I guess that this role of mostly unseen evil genius takes heavy toll on Erebus actually. As we know he belives in his cause wholeheartly and the burden of such responsibility (when Gods are watching!) cannot be rightly represented by simple ever-evil-smiling villain. Struggling to control and manipulate beigns of incredible stature (like primarchs) is quite emormous task.

 

It could be cool to see something from his perspective, to see him fighting hard against the odds or doubting his own actions and his superiors.

[Lagbenektelse]

I get the sense that Erebus weaves most of the plots he does because they obviously work out for him but also he genuinely enjoys them. The guy is a manipulator for no other reason than he can. Erebus is not a deus ex machina especially as the reins get pretty much taken from him once Horus fully embraces Chaos( the end of nemesis comes to mind not to give too much away) and then when he voices his opinion of the whole situation regarding Kor Phaeron in Dark Creed. Erebus plays games and there are probably numerous people just like him but their 'pawns' do not retaliate unless the manipulator isnt very good.

[chriscrowing]

Erebus is easily one of the most unlikeable guys in the HH series - but he's meant to be and fills the role of sneaky-heel pretty well.

 

I liked how there was more depth given to the Word Bearers in The First Heretic, and how their pride and faith paved the way to their fall. Indeed I liked the way how the common soldier (Argel Tal) differed from the devoted Chaplains (Xaphen), and the fact that it took the Legion 40 years to truly fall once the Word had changed - it's more believable than the quite sudden rebellion of the Luna Wolves etc.

 

Most impressively was how Argel Tal was still a likeable, supportable character even after... what happened to him (I don;t want to spoil too much.) Shades of gray, making the suppoosedly evil protagonists relatable. I like that.

 

Lorgar comes across as the most snivelling worm though...

[GrumpyJester]

I loved Lorgar as a character. Faith is such a powerful theme, the desire to find a truth or meaning to it all (even if it's mostly to vindicate yourself). The First Heretic made me a devout Word Bearer fan.

 

Erebus, Typhon, etc. I don't like because I don't see any tragedy there. Without tragedy they're fit to become goons, not movers and shakers. Selfish ambition is just too petty.

[The_son_of_Dorn]

still makes me laugh that cataliyst of the imperiums civil war was a chaplian...........preacher oft he imperial creed and supposedley 'elite amongst loyalists' . if anything Erebus symoblises the faltering force of hummanity and its instant conversion to a 'superior power' void of its intent, a primarch fell because of the follies of a human gifted with his own powers, if anything Erebus symbolises that preeching a 'divine power' will only lay waste to the logic bound thinkers of humanity rarther than the weak amongst us who would sell their soul to gain control in a mortal realm.

 

So over all if i met Erebus...............id kick him in the crotch :(

[Bulwyf]

I think a story telling why Erebus is what he is would essentially read as follows: he is visited by a vision from Chaos, he is shown the pattern of choices he must make for a desired end (he's a true believer in Chaos) and the only question is if he's "man enough" to become an outright villain in order to accomplish the desired end. He decides the end is worth the means and hey presto you have one of the most underhanded behind the door with a loaded pistol in hand characters in 40k lore.

[Aegnor]

Well, I'm still hoping that in books to come, we see him speak out of turn in front of Horus, who in response picks Erebus up and bodily hurls him through the nearest bulkhead before anyone can blink, for his temerity, before reminding him who is the actual champion of the Chaos gods. :)