Just played my 46th draigo wing game

[Crynn]

Crynnwing. :)

 

G

 

QFT :D

 

I use 1 squad of 5 and 1 squad of 10, as I own 15 paladins thats all I'm gonna use :D

 

The 10 man squad often attracts the most fire (as 900+ points in an 11 model unit will do :devil: ), though I do generally run it down the middle towards the enemy, while the 5 man will either flank or follow along side. I have found that combat squading the 10man rarely works, the loss of survivability outweighs the flexibility of having 3x5 pallies, as draigo can only be with one of them, which means 1 of the 2 remaining squads will often get targeted and destroyed/crippled.

 

As we all know I'm sure, I use 2 PT DK's at 1750 points.

 

It must be to difficult for them to use the only unit in their codex who isn't an undercosted 100% point and click unit. In most cases, ingorance is my opponents greatest weakness and it is prevalent in 40k snip The problem with most people is they can't see the big picture on the battlefield. Most people miss how units interact with each other to become greater than their sum unless the unit specifically has a rule that effects other units such as a sang priest. Anyway enough of that.

 

This is quite interesting, and not meaning to sound like a personal attack Crynn, but you were very much pro psyrifle dread and anti DK. This point above sums up why I feel DK's are better for my army then psyrifle dread's, apart from fitting my theme. DK is expensive, and yes sometimes it dies quickly (being less survivable then paladins, as soon as people realise this they try and kill it), yet my DK's provide so much more then it would seem on paper. Shame I had to quote you but you summed it up so much better then I could have :D

 

Not taken as a personal attack at all mate and a fair point you make. I am definately pro psyfleman and anti dreadknight, I am pretty out-spoken about it but if you are finding success (which clearly you have been) with the dread knight then I can't say it's not working for you. I can believe that you are finding people do not know how to deal with a dreadknight correctly and thus it is performing well for you however I personally believe that if people know how to deal with a dreadknight then it is not a great unit however again that is just my opinion. I also try to never take a unit under the assumption that it will work because others don't know how to to tackle it or how I will use it, I always build my army lists presuming my opponent will always know what I know and more, that way when people just make mistakes and don't understand your play style or unit choices it is a bonus. I try to build my lists to win by raw numbers and the flexibilty to be able to deal with all different types of lists not to do well from forcing them to make difficult decisions which I hope the will make incorrectly. (I'm not saying you do that however it is a common tactic I hear people frequently talk about) It's not beating the people who amke mistakes that is hard it is beting the people who don't make them, yes they do exist, at least on a game by game basis.

Thanks for using my quote though, it means you understand what I'm on about, and you clearly you do. You are obviously a good player and have found success with the dreadknights.

 

Regards,

Crynn

[nurglez]

Well I would like to think I am a good player, however, Draigo wing does have some advantages, and some negatives.

 

My main point over DK's is that people underestimate them on paper. On the battlefield when used properly they can be very useful, and my main use for them is to ignore cover saves ^_^

 

I would still rate psyrifle dread's higher then them, but I really can't be bothered getting 2 more of them, and as I love anime the looks of the DK have really grown on me :)

 

I am still interested in trying out Coteaz though, sanctuary and reserve defence, I like. Especially considering how well he has done for you ^_^

[Commander Sasha]

Speaking as the person on the receiving end of those Dreadknights, my Tyranids get truly messed up by them. Psyflemen wouldn't present nearly as much of a problem for me, as I rely on cover from terrain and unit layering. The TP, 12" throw of the template and high strength of the incinerator means that I am pretty much guaranteed to lose a unit on the turn that the NDK turns up, but...and here's the kicker...I never know which unit that will be, because of the 30" + 12" threat radius.

 

A buried backline Tervigon, and all of it's little children hiding behind the wall, have nothing to fear from even the most powerful long range guns over in the distance, but a chip pan fire in your own kitchen? Game over!

[nurglez]

I'll give you a hint Mr Sasha, the unit I choose often goes "squeek!"

[Commander Sasha]

I'll give you a hint Mr Sasha, the unit I choose often goes "squeek!"

Or more to the point, "Squelch".

[Zagman]

Took 2nd at Ard Boyz SemiFinals with my DriagoWing. Had a small lead until I played a very good opponent in my third game who turned my potential Massacre into a Draw allowing another player to take the 1st. Out of the three players in our car, we had a 2nd, a 3rd, and a 7th. Not too shabby at all.

 

Off to Chicago for a real test for Driago and friends.

[Crynn]

Took 2nd at Ard Boyz SemiFinals with my DriagoWing. Had a small lead until I played a very good opponent in my third game who turned my potential Massacre into a Draw allowing another player to take the 1st. Out of the three players in our car, we had a 2nd, a 3rd, and a 7th. Not too shabby at all.

 

Off to Chicago for a real test for Driago and friends.

 

Congrats man, Good luck with the next round.

[nurglez]

aye congrats, and good luck with the next round. what is your list for Ard boys? Would be interesting to see :)

[Zagman]

Driago

Librarian(MC Sword, MoT, Sanctuary, Shrouding, Warp Rift)

 

2x10 Paladins

2x DH Psycannon

2x F Psycannon

2x F

2x Sw

2x H

 

DreadKnight(GS, HI, PT)

DreadKnight(GS, HI, PT)

DreadKnight(GS, PT)

 

25 models. 2.5k

 

Hasn't really changed at all since the first time I proxied it prior to the models being released.

 

You may notice some similarities...:)

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I came in 3rd place so I'll probably be going to Chicago as well. :)

 

G :)

[Zagman]

I came in 3rd place so I'll probably be going to Chicago as well. ;)

 

G ;)

Glad to hear it. Maybe we'll get to slap each other around a bit.

 

Just read your mini batreps, and am curious as to why you didn't combat squad. And only 12 players at your semifinals. I thought our field was small at 28!

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I felt like the units would get blown off the table if I combat squadded. As it was they (GKT and Pallies) were able to suck up a lot of damage each game. I was just playing to win since I knew I couldn't really massacre.

 

G ;)

[Zagman]

I combat squaded my units in every game, except the first where only one split. I figured Driago, Libby, and 10 paladins were enough escort for the messenger.

 

I lost 8 paladins on the day in total! 0 the first game. 6 the second game. And 2 the final game. I earned 6850 in VPs on the day! Over a 1000 more than the next killy army.

[thade]

It's really encouraging how you each are doing respectably well with your D.W. variants.

[nurglez]

Thats cos, as we said, Draigo wing is damn powerful vs most builds :RTBBB:

 

Each time I have lost or drawn, I've combat squaded. for me, keeping the 10 man together helps me win, as I just throw that at the hardest part of the enemy. Not to say that combat squading is bad, it just isn't for my style :P

[thade]

There are a lot of factors involved that make it hard to discern why it is some have done well with combat squads while others have not. Could be play style, the play styles and armies that opponents have local to you, and/or your own lists (DKs, Storm Ravens, PA support infantry, Librarian, GM, etc.).

 

More battle reports, please. :RTBBB:

[Zagman]

Combat squadding is crucial in some missions or versus some opponents. For example, if you are facing a DE list with lost of Lances or blasters you will likely need to combat squad. With so many threats and the relative ease of their destruction you can nearly double your per turn damage dealt.

 

In all three of my losses to date I was wiped off of the table by firepower, primarily the ID variety. It had nothing to do with combat squadding. Combat squadding is also critical in multiple objective missions as it can double your objective holding ability even before TGS.

 

Combat squadding is very powerful in seize ground types of missions and less important in capture and control. The only time you combat squad in annihilation is against a MSU army with tons of ID firepower(ie DE).

 

There is my 2cents for what it is worth.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

The eldar player I faced had two prisms so while they were active there was no way I was going to stick my Paladins directly in the line of fire. The dark eldar player had lots and lots of blast weapons - by the end of that game all he had left was half a squad of Warriors... I literally wiped him off the table over the course of seven turns.

 

G :RTBBB:

[Sir Clausel]

I used my Draigo wingish army against my brothers chaos army. 2000 points.

I fielded:

Draigo

Lbby with 4 powers WS and TH

10 Termies with psybolts and 2 psycannons

6 palas with 2 psycannons and full would allocation shenanigans stuff

2 PT dreads with sword

1 dread with HI and Gatling

 

He used:

Abbadon

10 termie champs with MoT

2 x 10 marines with 2 plasmas and champ with PW

10 Havocs with 4 lascannons

2 x 3 oblitrators

 

Annihilation mission and Pitched battle deployment.

 

I thourgt I was gonna get shot to pieces but I only felt I was loosing until he have had his first turn of shooting. I simply just CRUSHED him. I thourgt by all those lascannons and plasma guns he was gonna smash me.

 

How would you feel about that army?

[thade]

I keep reading on the chaos boards that the pervading feeling is their codex can't stand up to modern shooting...which is an issue as their codex is a shooty codex. They're at the bottom of the pile now; any game they have against GK right now is at best an uphill battle. If both players are equal, I believe the GK player will very often win by landslides due to codex imbalance alone.

 

Here's hoping they get their update sooner than later.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Not much at all can stand up to GK shooting. Mech has finally been solved.

 

G :)

[Sir Clausel]

But its still 10 lascannons a turn? Thats still alot if you think about it.

[thade]

But its still 10 lascannons a turn? Thats still alot if you think about it.

It's not purely the total number of lascannons that's really a concern. It's the number of S8 (or better) AP2 (or better) shots per shooting unit that is the concern. If you have ten lascannons but no more than two per squad then Draigo can soak a lascannon round each time, meaning only one Paladin is at risk. You really need to have three or four per unit so that more than one Paladin is put at risk: Draigo can only take one for the team. So things like the Demolisher (a template), Tri-las Predators, and LC/MM Devastator teams are the things that are really scary to Draigowing.

[Sir Clausel]

But you didnt see the list I posted?

4 in one havoc squad and 2 x 3 in the obliterators.

 

potentially 3 dead paladins on the havoc squad and 2 from each the obli squads. plus the fact that all the would kill a dread in one turn.

 

I know the chaos dex is not the worst against a Draigo wing. But I still think thats was a tough list there.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Ten lascannons is not all that great IMO. The psycannon offers a greater rate of fire and rends plus it's more spammable and can shoot on the move. Here is a batrep vs a CSM army with 10 lascannons:

 

http://40kwreckingcrew.aceboard.com/331128-602-8386-0-.htm

 

Anyways let's get back to discussing the Ard Boyz results from this weekend. :)

 

G :D