Morollan Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 If POTMS worked that way, it'd be so incredibly powerful and give SM chapters a pretty distinct advantage over other codices. It's not like GW has ever done anything like that before... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3260409 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 If POTMS worked that way, it'd be so incredibly powerful and give SM chapters a pretty distinct advantage over other codices. And if it doesn't, it's basically useless. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3260501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raeven Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 The rulebooks FAQ is somewhat relevant. First it states that the BS of a snapshot can never be modified. PotMS doesn't modify BS, it removes modifiers so it can be considered to 'slip though' this clarification. Secondly, the next question on the FAQ tells us that only snap shots hit flyers. So I say that PotMS does overrule snap shots and uses normal BS, unless you fire at a flyer... In which case you still have to snap shot because that's what the FAQ says. You don't snap shot against flyers becaue they are flyers. You snap shot against flyers because you don't have skyfire. POTMS overrides the snap shot restriction from movement. It does not override the restriction from not having skyfire. The Stormraven is a flyer, so it automatically has Skyfire....therefore it has no such restriction when shooting other flyers using the skyfire rule. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262360 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raeven Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 I'm sure this has been discussed before, but I can't seem to find where. If my Stormraven uses evade (gains jink but only fires snapshots), can it use POTMS to fire a non-snapshot, for instance its TL Plasma cannon? And for that matter, if it uses skyfire can it use POTMS to fire at a ground target with a non-shapshot? I think the answer is no to this one. Yes, POTMS gives you one shot at full ballistic when you evade. No, unless you also have Interceptor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262367 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 POTMS overrides the snap shot restriction from movement. It does not override the restriction from not having skyfire.No, it always overrides Snap Shot, period. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262623 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 POTMS overrides the snap shot restriction from movement. It does not override the restriction from not having skyfire.No, it always overrides Snap Shot, period. Or not, thus the conundrum. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262630 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 Good point! I meant to say something useful like that... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262701 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hymirl Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 POTMS overrides the snap shot restriction from movement. It does not override the restriction from not having skyfire.No, it always overrides Snap Shot, period. But the FAQ states nothing overrides lack of skyfire causing snap shot... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262898 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 No, it only says BS modifiers don't override it. We already went over this the last two pages :D. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262967 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raeven Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Land Raider has 2 Lascannon Sponsons. It moves, but not flat out. It can fire it's two lascannon sponsons at full BS, if it so chooses. It cannot fire either of those lascannons at zooming flyers at full BS. It does not have skyfire. POTMS simpy overrides the restriction that sets how many weapons can be fired at full BS from a movement. You still have to have skyfire to fire at full ballistic at zooming flyers. Same with signums. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3262992 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 It says absolutely nothing at all specifying it's only for movement, making your argument fall flat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3263285 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raeven Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I wasn't being exclusive. Sorry if I came across that way. POTMS - "vehicle can fire one more weapon at its full Ballistic Skill than normally permitted." What is normally permitted? Normally, you can shoot all weapons at full Ballistic skill without moving. Combat Speed, Cruising Speed, and firing Ordinance weapons are immediate examples that restrict the normal Ballistic skill. In all of these cases, you still cannot shoot flyers at full ballistic skill without Skyfire. Otherwise, by the way you are reading the rule, any vehicle moves at Combat Speed or less can fire at full Ballistic Skill at flyers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3263958 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raeven Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Chew on this.. I just noticed this wording. Hard To Hit "Zooming Flyers are incredibly difficult targets for troops without suitably calibrated weapons and scopes..." It's technically "fluff", but it's specific fluff that uses a ruleset definition. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3263967 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Chew on this.. I just noticed this wording. Hard To Hit "Zooming Flyers are incredibly difficult targets for troops without suitably calibrated weapons and scopes..." It's technically "fluff", but it's specific fluff that uses a ruleset definition. Dude, that definitely deserves its own thread over in the +OR+. :o Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3263972 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven of the Wing Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 my 2 cents would throw in the fact that you can buy specific Landraider models with skyfire rules (forgeworld Hyperion, i think) basically a AA missile mount, why would you buy that if your potms can shoot flyers out the sky with lascannons for fun. personally if some one tried "the potms means i can skyfire without skyfire" with me i'd tell them to go play with someone else. rules are rules but common sense should always prevail. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3264011 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Becuase Frogeworld writes just as good rules as GW! Aracnthrites (spelling?) /sigh Skyfire in the Hyperious, would I assume, allow you to fire *all* it's wepaons with the Skyfire rule. And not the single one that PotMS would allow. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3264012 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Skyfire in the Hyperious, would I assume, allow you to fire *all* it's wepaons with the Skyfire rule. And not the single one that PotMS would allow. Nah, the Land Raider Helios (the AA version with the Hyperios Launcher) doesn't have Skyfire, only the Hyperios Launcher has the rule. So only that weapon could fire using it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3264023 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Well, it would let you fire that with Skyfire *and* PotMS a second weapon. :D So it's not useless. (Unless the Helios doesn't have any other wepaons, I'm not too interested in FW units to really know what it's got!) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/267483-potms-and-evade/page/2/#findComment-3264089 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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